Nissan: Murano News
02-07-2003, 10:15 PM
#1
Moderator Alumnus
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes
on
8 Posts
Nissan: Murano News
The 2002 Car and Driver New-Car Guide helped welcome six new sport-utility vehicles into an already crowded market. This year's guide features more than double that number of new kids on the trendiest block in Truckville, U.S.A. Most of them are trying desperately to conform to the latest mode of fashion: the car/truck-hybrid vehicle-for-all-seasons-and-all-reasons "crossover ute." Like all the car/boat and car/plane concepts that have been attempted in the past century, car/trucks tend to be rather unconvincing as either cars or trucks, at least from the standpoint of car enthusiasts.
THE VERDICT
Nissan Murano SL AWD
Highs: V-8 verve on a V-6 budget, BMW handling, daring styling that works.
Lows: Ride tiptoes the line between firm and harsh.
The Verdict: A great truck for the car nut who needs an 82-cubic-foot trunk.
And so it is with increasing ennui and eye rolling that we, your faithful reporters on all things automotive, accept the assignment to cover the optimistic launch of yet another of these omni-use active-lifestyle beasts. But occasionally an automaker surprises us by straying from the everything-for-everybody formula and builds a genuine individual. Isuzu's VehiCROSS was a perfect example — as unique and freakish as Edward Scissorhands, and a hoot to drive. Hummer's extroverted H2 is another, perhaps too obvious, case in point. A much subtler but equally exceptional exemplar is the new Murano from Nissan.
A clear message is being sent by the edgy yet rounded styling themes of this SUV, with its vaguely shoelike profile and a tail end reminiscent of the funky fannies Renault is appending to its cars these days: This ain't no me-too truck. Measuring 187.6 inches long by 74.0 inches wide, it's big. Conformist competitors of this size accommodate three rows of seats, but Nissan chose instead to package first-class seating for five adults (reclining backrests and stretch-out legroom) under a lower, more stylish roofline than one finds on those suburban family buses. Even the interior styling goes its own way with real aluminum trim and various pods and modules that appear to float in space. It's kind of an '80s look — too recent to be retro, but reinterpreted just enough to look cool.
And if you think the body looks unique, wait till you put on your David Kimble X-ray glasses and feast your peepers on the Murano's drivetrain. Sandwiched between Nissan's increasingly ubiquitous 3.5-liter VQ V-6 and our test car's full-time all-wheel-drive system is a high-capacity, belt-driven Xtronic continuously variable transmission (see sidebar).
Why should the enthusiast care?
First and foremost because the infinite gear ratios of the transmission behave like two more cylinders when the hammer's down. In the unlikely event you haven't peeked already, check out the test results and the bar graph: 60 mph flashes by in 7.5 seconds, the quarter in 15.9 at 88 mph. Most sport-utes with scoot like that run V-8s. Brake-torque the Murano (its torque converter can handle this abuse as easily as a conventional tranny's can), then sidestep the brake, and off you go. At about 44 mph you reach the top of the 2.37:1 "first gear," after which the pulleys start changing diameter to maintain an engine speed of about 6250 rpm all the way to a 116-mph governed top speed.
There are other performance benefits, too, such as no hunting for gears when climbing long grades and ideally tailored engine braking for the downhill runs. Drop the hammer to overtake someone from a cruising speed, and you instantly get a step change to the ideal gear ratio for peak passing performance. Note that the Murano's 50-to-70-mph passing time of 5.1 seconds is 0.3 second quicker than that of our recent Lincoln Aviator (V-8 mated to a five-speed auto), which has a similar power-to-weight ratio.
Under all conditions short of wide-open throttle, the CVT increases the ratio to keep the engine operating at peak efficiency so that the Murano's V-6 turns 3 to 11 percent fewer engine revolutions per mile on the EPA fuel-economy test cycles than it would with a conventional four- or five-speed automatic. This results in an EPA rating of 20 mpg city and 24 or 25 mpg highway for AWD or front-drive — not bad for a two-ton truck. We averaged 18 mpg overall, 19 during the 900 miles before our test-track session. Our long-term Jeep Grand Cherokee and Mercury Mountaineer V-8s managed 16 and 17 mpg over 40,000 miles.
But the Murano's straight-line performance isn't its best attribute. What got us enthusing about this truck was its handling and braking. Based on a hugely modified Altima unit-body suspended by struts in front and multiple links in back and riding on standard 18-inch wheels shod in 235/65TR-18 Goodyear Eagle LS rubber, our test car grabbed the skidpad with 0.81 g of resolve and snaked through twists and turns (transmission selector in "S" for higher revs and more engine braking) with remarkable accuracy and minimal body roll or tire squeal. Its steering heft feels natural and predictable at all speeds and under varying corner loads. A well-placed dead pedal and a comfortably bolstered seat heighten the driver's feeling of control and encourage spirited driving. So do the brakes, 12-plus-inch manhole covers that can dissipate 70-mph momentum in 170 feet. Put simply, the Murano behaves like a BMW X5 that's been deeply discounted to just $30,339 ($1600 less with front-wheel drive).
All these stats are impressive for a truck, but they're generated at some cost. Ride quality on our base SL AWD model verged on flinty, raising concerns about the sport-tuned SE model ($800 more). Bumps and potholes set the interior furnishings to banging around in this prototype vehicle. These problems we expect will be rectified in production cars, but if the ride quality is representative, rattles and clangs are sure to develop over the long run. The Murano is rated to tow just 3500 pounds — impressive for a CVT but only entry level at best among mid-size SUVs.
And with just 7.0 inches of ground clearance, this is no gully runner. Despite a claimed approach angle of 28 degrees (equal to the Acura MDX's), our Murano was the only sport-ute on hand for our 5Best Trucks competition (see next month's issue) to grind its chin on our modest hill-climb event. The four-wheel-drive system works like the Volvo XC90's: The front wheels get all the twist until they slip, at which time up to 50 percent of the torque is routed aft to an electronically controlled clutch pack mounted to the rear differential. The driver can also lock this clutch manually below 19 mph via a switch on the center console, although mild tire crabbing occurs on hard pavement when it's locked.
Whatever the Murano lacks in do-everything capability, we don't miss at all. Heaven knows there are enough Jeeps, Hummers, and Rovers in the world to choke every rural rocky road with beltway-grade congestion. What the SUV landscape is short on is $30,000 BMW X5s — or was until now.
TECH STUFF
Behold the first belt-drive truck.
By now we're amply convinced that continuously variable transmissions (CVTs) can improve acceleration and fuel economy by optimally adjusting engine speeds and loads to driving conditions, permitting maximum acceleration at or near the power peak while cruising at higher load (lower rpm) for peak efficiency. But this is the first CVT with the torque capacity to work in a big SUV, at least in the U.S. Nissan does build a toroidal roller-type CVT in Japan called the Extroid, which can withstand 286 pound-feet. Unfortunately, this device can't tolerate the ultra-low temperatures encountered in America.
So how does the traditional Van Doorne-type push-belt Xtronic CVT, identical in concept to the tiny Subaru Justy's CVT that first arrived here in 1989, come by its newfound strength? The pulleys clamp the belt much more tightly, and they're hardened to withstand the added stress. A beefier belt uses individual steel plates that are 30 millimeters wide and are held together by twelve 0.2mm steel bands on each side instead of the nine used in Nissan's smaller CVT. The new belt's minimal running diameter is also increased, but the overall ratio spread is an impressive 5.40. That is considerably wider than the spreads offered by the Altima V-6's four-speed automatic and five-speed manual (4.04 and 4.09, respectively), although it trails the 6.04 ratio spread offered by the Audi CVT and the new ZF six-speed automatic.
A torque converter couples the CVT to the engine, but because of the high inertia of the belt and pulleys, it isn't needed to absorb drivetrain shock, so it can lock up at about 12 mph to further improve efficiency (most converters lock up at 30 mph), and its ultra-slim design is 23mm narrower than other Nissan converters of similar capacity.
Bottom line, the engineers at Jatco who developed Xtronic with Nissan claim a 14-percent improvement in acceleration and a 12-percent boost in EPA combined fuel economy relative to typical four- and five-speed automatics.
THE VERDICT
Nissan Murano SL AWD
Highs: V-8 verve on a V-6 budget, BMW handling, daring styling that works.
Lows: Ride tiptoes the line between firm and harsh.
The Verdict: A great truck for the car nut who needs an 82-cubic-foot trunk.
And so it is with increasing ennui and eye rolling that we, your faithful reporters on all things automotive, accept the assignment to cover the optimistic launch of yet another of these omni-use active-lifestyle beasts. But occasionally an automaker surprises us by straying from the everything-for-everybody formula and builds a genuine individual. Isuzu's VehiCROSS was a perfect example — as unique and freakish as Edward Scissorhands, and a hoot to drive. Hummer's extroverted H2 is another, perhaps too obvious, case in point. A much subtler but equally exceptional exemplar is the new Murano from Nissan.
A clear message is being sent by the edgy yet rounded styling themes of this SUV, with its vaguely shoelike profile and a tail end reminiscent of the funky fannies Renault is appending to its cars these days: This ain't no me-too truck. Measuring 187.6 inches long by 74.0 inches wide, it's big. Conformist competitors of this size accommodate three rows of seats, but Nissan chose instead to package first-class seating for five adults (reclining backrests and stretch-out legroom) under a lower, more stylish roofline than one finds on those suburban family buses. Even the interior styling goes its own way with real aluminum trim and various pods and modules that appear to float in space. It's kind of an '80s look — too recent to be retro, but reinterpreted just enough to look cool.
And if you think the body looks unique, wait till you put on your David Kimble X-ray glasses and feast your peepers on the Murano's drivetrain. Sandwiched between Nissan's increasingly ubiquitous 3.5-liter VQ V-6 and our test car's full-time all-wheel-drive system is a high-capacity, belt-driven Xtronic continuously variable transmission (see sidebar).
Why should the enthusiast care?
First and foremost because the infinite gear ratios of the transmission behave like two more cylinders when the hammer's down. In the unlikely event you haven't peeked already, check out the test results and the bar graph: 60 mph flashes by in 7.5 seconds, the quarter in 15.9 at 88 mph. Most sport-utes with scoot like that run V-8s. Brake-torque the Murano (its torque converter can handle this abuse as easily as a conventional tranny's can), then sidestep the brake, and off you go. At about 44 mph you reach the top of the 2.37:1 "first gear," after which the pulleys start changing diameter to maintain an engine speed of about 6250 rpm all the way to a 116-mph governed top speed.
There are other performance benefits, too, such as no hunting for gears when climbing long grades and ideally tailored engine braking for the downhill runs. Drop the hammer to overtake someone from a cruising speed, and you instantly get a step change to the ideal gear ratio for peak passing performance. Note that the Murano's 50-to-70-mph passing time of 5.1 seconds is 0.3 second quicker than that of our recent Lincoln Aviator (V-8 mated to a five-speed auto), which has a similar power-to-weight ratio.
Under all conditions short of wide-open throttle, the CVT increases the ratio to keep the engine operating at peak efficiency so that the Murano's V-6 turns 3 to 11 percent fewer engine revolutions per mile on the EPA fuel-economy test cycles than it would with a conventional four- or five-speed automatic. This results in an EPA rating of 20 mpg city and 24 or 25 mpg highway for AWD or front-drive — not bad for a two-ton truck. We averaged 18 mpg overall, 19 during the 900 miles before our test-track session. Our long-term Jeep Grand Cherokee and Mercury Mountaineer V-8s managed 16 and 17 mpg over 40,000 miles.
But the Murano's straight-line performance isn't its best attribute. What got us enthusing about this truck was its handling and braking. Based on a hugely modified Altima unit-body suspended by struts in front and multiple links in back and riding on standard 18-inch wheels shod in 235/65TR-18 Goodyear Eagle LS rubber, our test car grabbed the skidpad with 0.81 g of resolve and snaked through twists and turns (transmission selector in "S" for higher revs and more engine braking) with remarkable accuracy and minimal body roll or tire squeal. Its steering heft feels natural and predictable at all speeds and under varying corner loads. A well-placed dead pedal and a comfortably bolstered seat heighten the driver's feeling of control and encourage spirited driving. So do the brakes, 12-plus-inch manhole covers that can dissipate 70-mph momentum in 170 feet. Put simply, the Murano behaves like a BMW X5 that's been deeply discounted to just $30,339 ($1600 less with front-wheel drive).
All these stats are impressive for a truck, but they're generated at some cost. Ride quality on our base SL AWD model verged on flinty, raising concerns about the sport-tuned SE model ($800 more). Bumps and potholes set the interior furnishings to banging around in this prototype vehicle. These problems we expect will be rectified in production cars, but if the ride quality is representative, rattles and clangs are sure to develop over the long run. The Murano is rated to tow just 3500 pounds — impressive for a CVT but only entry level at best among mid-size SUVs.
And with just 7.0 inches of ground clearance, this is no gully runner. Despite a claimed approach angle of 28 degrees (equal to the Acura MDX's), our Murano was the only sport-ute on hand for our 5Best Trucks competition (see next month's issue) to grind its chin on our modest hill-climb event. The four-wheel-drive system works like the Volvo XC90's: The front wheels get all the twist until they slip, at which time up to 50 percent of the torque is routed aft to an electronically controlled clutch pack mounted to the rear differential. The driver can also lock this clutch manually below 19 mph via a switch on the center console, although mild tire crabbing occurs on hard pavement when it's locked.
Whatever the Murano lacks in do-everything capability, we don't miss at all. Heaven knows there are enough Jeeps, Hummers, and Rovers in the world to choke every rural rocky road with beltway-grade congestion. What the SUV landscape is short on is $30,000 BMW X5s — or was until now.
TECH STUFF
Behold the first belt-drive truck.
By now we're amply convinced that continuously variable transmissions (CVTs) can improve acceleration and fuel economy by optimally adjusting engine speeds and loads to driving conditions, permitting maximum acceleration at or near the power peak while cruising at higher load (lower rpm) for peak efficiency. But this is the first CVT with the torque capacity to work in a big SUV, at least in the U.S. Nissan does build a toroidal roller-type CVT in Japan called the Extroid, which can withstand 286 pound-feet. Unfortunately, this device can't tolerate the ultra-low temperatures encountered in America.
So how does the traditional Van Doorne-type push-belt Xtronic CVT, identical in concept to the tiny Subaru Justy's CVT that first arrived here in 1989, come by its newfound strength? The pulleys clamp the belt much more tightly, and they're hardened to withstand the added stress. A beefier belt uses individual steel plates that are 30 millimeters wide and are held together by twelve 0.2mm steel bands on each side instead of the nine used in Nissan's smaller CVT. The new belt's minimal running diameter is also increased, but the overall ratio spread is an impressive 5.40. That is considerably wider than the spreads offered by the Altima V-6's four-speed automatic and five-speed manual (4.04 and 4.09, respectively), although it trails the 6.04 ratio spread offered by the Audi CVT and the new ZF six-speed automatic.
A torque converter couples the CVT to the engine, but because of the high inertia of the belt and pulleys, it isn't needed to absorb drivetrain shock, so it can lock up at about 12 mph to further improve efficiency (most converters lock up at 30 mph), and its ultra-slim design is 23mm narrower than other Nissan converters of similar capacity.
Bottom line, the engineers at Jatco who developed Xtronic with Nissan claim a 14-percent improvement in acceleration and a 12-percent boost in EPA combined fuel economy relative to typical four- and five-speed automatics.
02-07-2003, 10:24 PM
#2
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Communist, NY
Posts: 9,574
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My bro just picked up a loaded SE today actually in the snow, went with that above color (Sunlit Copper or whatever the hell its called) with a black interior- not that funky orange gut.
I like it, its been getting great reviews....look forward to driving it at some point.
I like it, its been getting great reviews....look forward to driving it at some point.
02-07-2003, 10:25 PM
#3
What, me drive fast?
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: North Andover, MA
Posts: 1,943
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hate the color of the interior. I love the outside. Coming from an imprending marriage where neither of us would buy a station wagon, minivan, or Subaru...I like the Murano.
02-12-2003, 10:34 AM
#5
Suzuka Master
I went to the dealership to take a look at a Murano the other day. If I were to buy and SUV, that would be at the top of my list. I always like them in the pics I saw, but they look even better in person. The reddish interior isn't even that bad, especially on a black one.
07-18-2005, 05:48 PM
#6
Moderator Alumnus
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes
on
8 Posts
Nissan recalls more than 125,000 Murano SUVs - - Reuters / July 18, 2005 - - Source: Automotive News
DETROIT -- Nissan Motor Co. Ltd. is recalling 125,466 of its Murano sport-utility vehicles because of a wiring problem that could potentially cause engine failure and result in a crash, federal safety regulators said on Monday.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said the problem, affecting SUVs from the 2003 through 2005 model years, stemmed from a wire in the vehicles' alternators.
The wire may break inside the alternators, causing the battery to stop charging and the engine to stop running, NHTSA said in an advisory on its Web site.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said the problem, affecting SUVs from the 2003 through 2005 model years, stemmed from a wire in the vehicles' alternators.
The wire may break inside the alternators, causing the battery to stop charging and the engine to stop running, NHTSA said in an advisory on its Web site.
08-16-2006, 02:51 PM
#7
Moderator Alumnus
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes
on
8 Posts
Next Gen. Nissan Murano News
Future Products — Nissan - - By AUTOMOTIVE NEWS - - Source: Autoweek
Murano: The Murano is due for a redesign for the 2008 model year.
Trending Topics
10-19-2006, 09:38 AM
#8
Moderator Alumnus
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes
on
8 Posts
TheCarConnection Drives: Nissan Murano GT-C - - Source: The Car Connection
Road-testing a one-off concept car is always tricky. You don't want to push its expensive hand-built mechanicals too hard in case something breaks, but you do want to explore its potential while the manufacturer in question decides whether to actually put it into production.
Things didn't go well in the Nissan Murano GT-C. Half an hour into my drive the engine management warning light came on. I was barely doing the speed limit on a straight road so feel blameless, but when the company told me to drive slowly home part of me wished I hadn't phoned them.
Thankfully we don't have to speculate about whether Nissan's performance SUV will make it to showrooms. Insiders at September's Paris Motor Show confirmed it will, so only two questions remain unanswered - in what form will it be, and will it get to America?
Unveiled this summer, the GT-C is the work of experts at firm's European Technical Centre. Due on sale in 2007, at the very least the production car will get the GT-C's bodykit. That includes redesigned front and rear ends, four exhaust pipes, a rear wing, and 22-inch alloy wheels. But what enthusiasts really want is the turbocharger that's been fitted to the 3.5-liter engine, boosting output from 234 hp and 235 lb-ft to 340 hp and 265 lb-ft.
But that's the problem bit of this car. Bolting on a Garrett-supplied turbo sounds easy enough, but the nature of the job meant a special bespoke solution was required. To physically get the blower under the hood the battery has been moved to the rear of the car, and is hidden in the spare wheel well. The cost of the modification - which obviously has to be passed on to the customer - is the reason why it might not happen, but a working party has been set up within Nissan to see if it's possible. Rebadged as the GT (the C stands for concept so will be ditched), the car will initially be for the U.K. only and only a few hundred will be made. However, Nissan sources have confirmed it will go pan-European and global if the business case for it makes sense.
From my short test drive I can tell you what was already a quick car has been made even faster. The standard Murano's performance figures are 8.9 seconds and 124 mph, but in the GT-C they're 7.0 seconds and 144 mph. And that's with 44 pounds of extra weight to haul. The bespoke AP Racing brakes scrub off the speed quickly when required and the car is still just as nimble through the corners.
The revamped interior is black and tan leather and there's a laptop bag hidden in the deep central storage bin. But the gearknob is the standout feature of the cabin; made from glass crafted on the island of Murano in Italy it's nice enough but the natural greeny-blue color doesn't really work with rest of the upholstery.
Perhaps the best bit about the GT-C is the noise it makes. Even if Nissan's working party decides the turbocharged 3.5 isn't cost-effective, a bodykitted Murano GT should still get the same cracking soundtrack. -Richard Yarrow
Things didn't go well in the Nissan Murano GT-C. Half an hour into my drive the engine management warning light came on. I was barely doing the speed limit on a straight road so feel blameless, but when the company told me to drive slowly home part of me wished I hadn't phoned them.
Thankfully we don't have to speculate about whether Nissan's performance SUV will make it to showrooms. Insiders at September's Paris Motor Show confirmed it will, so only two questions remain unanswered - in what form will it be, and will it get to America?
Unveiled this summer, the GT-C is the work of experts at firm's European Technical Centre. Due on sale in 2007, at the very least the production car will get the GT-C's bodykit. That includes redesigned front and rear ends, four exhaust pipes, a rear wing, and 22-inch alloy wheels. But what enthusiasts really want is the turbocharger that's been fitted to the 3.5-liter engine, boosting output from 234 hp and 235 lb-ft to 340 hp and 265 lb-ft.
But that's the problem bit of this car. Bolting on a Garrett-supplied turbo sounds easy enough, but the nature of the job meant a special bespoke solution was required. To physically get the blower under the hood the battery has been moved to the rear of the car, and is hidden in the spare wheel well. The cost of the modification - which obviously has to be passed on to the customer - is the reason why it might not happen, but a working party has been set up within Nissan to see if it's possible. Rebadged as the GT (the C stands for concept so will be ditched), the car will initially be for the U.K. only and only a few hundred will be made. However, Nissan sources have confirmed it will go pan-European and global if the business case for it makes sense.
From my short test drive I can tell you what was already a quick car has been made even faster. The standard Murano's performance figures are 8.9 seconds and 124 mph, but in the GT-C they're 7.0 seconds and 144 mph. And that's with 44 pounds of extra weight to haul. The bespoke AP Racing brakes scrub off the speed quickly when required and the car is still just as nimble through the corners.
The revamped interior is black and tan leather and there's a laptop bag hidden in the deep central storage bin. But the gearknob is the standout feature of the cabin; made from glass crafted on the island of Murano in Italy it's nice enough but the natural greeny-blue color doesn't really work with rest of the upholstery.
Perhaps the best bit about the GT-C is the noise it makes. Even if Nissan's working party decides the turbocharged 3.5 isn't cost-effective, a bodykitted Murano GT should still get the same cracking soundtrack. -Richard Yarrow
10-24-2006, 05:49 PM
#9
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Anaheim Hills, CA
Posts: 1,400
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fifth Gear's test drive: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sajyXow86Yw
11-09-2007, 10:23 AM
#11
Senior Moderator
Looks cleaned up on the outside. Aside from the sunroof, that interior looks pretty much like my 05 Murano.
11-09-2007, 02:03 PM
#13
The sizzle in the Steak
More like an evolution than a redesign.
11-09-2007, 02:19 PM
#14
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
More like an evolution than a redesign.
...which was all it needed, given how well the 1G sold. Other than going from vertical to horizonal taillamps, the change represents a smooth evolution.I hope a FULL leather interior is available as, the current version only has leather seating surfaces.
11-09-2007, 02:32 PM
#15
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Communist, NY
Posts: 9,574
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by F23A4
...which was all it needed, given how well the 1G sold. Other than going from vertical to horizonal taillamps, the change represents a smooth evolution.I hope a FULL leather interior is available as, the current version only has leather seating surfaces.
The Murano's biggest problem is the interior as I'm sure the 09 will be improved.
11-09-2007, 03:11 PM
#16
Chloe @ 17mo
Originally Posted by sho_nuff1997
i'm not a big fan of the rear side window coming to a point. all the mid size suvs have that, and they all kinda look similar
11-09-2007, 04:07 PM
#17
The sizzle in the Steak
Originally Posted by F23A4
...which was all it needed, given how well the 1G sold. Other than going from vertical to horizonal taillamps, the change represents a smooth evolution.I hope a FULL leather interior is available as, the current version only has leather seating surfaces.
11-09-2007, 07:09 PM
#21
^ i think the pics are down. I saw red X's before.
11-09-2007, 07:34 PM
#23
Originally Posted by AsianRage
Yeah, except the Murano was the originator of that design element.
11-09-2007, 09:39 PM
#26
Senior Moderator
As a child growing up in the 70s, EVERYTHING AMC produced was butt ugly: Gremlin, Matador, Pacer, etc,... 
and 
and
11-10-2007, 09:36 AM
#28
Originally Posted by AsianRage
I didn't know the gremlin was classified as a crossover utility vehicle.
11-10-2007, 09:37 AM
#29
Originally Posted by F23A4
As a child growing up in the 70s, EVERYTHING AMC produced was butt ugly: Gremlin, Matador, Pacer, etc,... and
and
11-10-2007, 07:00 PM
#30
Race Director
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Illinois
Age: 44
Posts: 10,741
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i can see the pics now, wow looks sharp, but i see they didn't fix that small back window it looks like there is going to be another blind spot.
hmm makes me wonder how the 09 Fx will look like.
hmm makes me wonder how the 09 Fx will look like.
11-10-2007, 08:28 PM
#31
GEEZER
Originally Posted by F23A4
As a child growing up in the 70s, EVERYTHING AMC produced was butt ugly: Gremlin, Matador, Pacer, etc,... and
and 
11-10-2007, 10:15 PM
#34
Am I the only sees a lot of the euro Civic hatchback in the front?
11-12-2007, 02:32 PM
#36
The sizzle in the Steak
Interior is MUCH better.
