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Old 03-20-2018, 01:30 PM
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Well, that gives me a bit of pause. I was starting to lean Accord Touring over Stinger Premium, but will wait for the 6T to hit dealers for a drive to decide. Will also have to see the signature interior, depends on how the Deep Chestnut looks; would much prefer black leather. Will have to compare the 6T Signature & 6T GTR.
Old 03-21-2018, 03:24 PM
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Called a few local Mazda dealers today after giving a 6MT Accord Touring a spin.

From 4 different dealers was given timelines between 3 weeks & 90 days for 6Ts to start hitting dealer lots.
Old 05-11-2018, 08:52 AM
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2018 Mazda6 Signature 2.5T First Drive: Champagne Living on a Working-Class Budget - Motor Trend

2018 MAZDA6 SIGNATURE 2.5T FIRST DRIVE: CHAMPAGNE LIVING ON A WORKING-CLASS BUDGET

Mazda goes premium, again


It’s not the first time they’ve tried this. Seems like once a decade or so a new executive comes along and decides the solution to all Mazda’s problems is to go premium. Although this strategy has given us some great cars along the way, it’s never had staying power. This time, though, feels different. As different as the quality of materials in the new 2018 Mazda6.

The Mazda6 is a perennial favorite around this office. We almost take for granted at this point that Mazdas will be more fun to drive than any of their direct competition (though that competition is closing the gap in places), and the sixth-generation flagship sedan has always been a looker. Sure, it never had as many bells or whistles as the other guys, but as enthusiasts, we appreciated Mazda’s relentless focus on handling and involvement over gizmos. Thankfully, we don’t have to make that excuse anymore.

For 2018, the automaker has given the Mazda6 such a thorough refresh that it nearly qualifies as a new model. From the outside, the uninitiated will need a sharp eye to pick out all the little changes that make a handsome sedan handsomer. The new grille and “wing” motif will jump out, but you won’t realize Mazda has integrated the foglights into the headlights and ditched the lower body black trim unless someone points it out. The new taillights and tailpipe will be even harder to spot at a glance, but put it all together with a fresh set of optional 19-inch wheels, and you have a subtle metamorphosis from butterfly into prettier butterfly.

Inside, though, you won’t need a spotter’s guide. The interior is significantly updated, save for a few discreet buttons, the infotainment controller, and a steering wheel and standard instrument cluster borrowed from the CX-9. The design is sleek, modern, and sophisticated, with an emphasis on placing soft-touch materials where you’ll actually feel them. Even the base models get leather on the steering wheel and shifter to go with an optional two-tone color scheme. Dual-zone automatic climate control is standard, as is the 8.0-inch infotainment screen. Even better, Mazda doesn’t short-change the rear-seat passengers like some automakers (looking at you, Volkswagen). All the trim, soft materials, and accent stitching make it to the rear doors and seats, too. All for less than $23,000 with a manual transmission (bonus!) or under $24,000 with an automatic. What you don’t get, on any model: a CD player. Get with the times.

Naturally, it only gets better the more money you spend. By the time you max it out with the new Signature top-shelf trim, which starts at all of $35,640, you’ve got yourself a luxury car for Camry money. Even better, the only way to make a Signature more expensive is to add a fancy paint color and accessories such as cargo nets and whatnot. Included from lower trims are things such as heated and ventilated power seats, navigation, a head-up display, auto-dimming mirrors, a heated steering wheel, rear-seat USB ports and AC vents, heated rear seats, an 11-speaker Bose sound system, 19-inch wheels, auto high-beams and wipers, adaptive cruise control with stop-and-go traffic capability, collision warning, lane keeping, a rearview camera, and blind-spot monitoring. On top of all that, you get premium leather, suede trim, Sen wood trim from a Japanese guitarmaker, a black headliner, a special grille, a 7.0-inch configurable LCD instrument cluster display, a 360-degree camera system, and of course the turbo engine.

Is it any good? Absolutely. The leather is buttery soft and seems to be everywhere, the rich-looking suede trim is widely applied and a refreshing surprise, and it’s all set off by real metal trim and fine accent stitching. Mazda has added a ton of sound-deadening material, and it’s paid off. Although it’s not quite class-leading in that regard, the cabin is much quieter. The Sen wood, as neat as its backstory is, has a finish that provides an unfortunate plasticky sheen and undersells its provenance. Another nitpick: The graphics on the big new infotainment display show their age and don’t look as hip or modern as the rest of the interior. The shockingly blurry low-res camera system is a solid miss.

A particular high point: the new front seats, which feature some kind of space-age foam and a design intended to orient your pelvis and spine as if you were standing. Mazda says this is not only more comfortable but also helps you balance yourself in the seat better, reducing the need for big side bolsters to hold you up in turns. I was pretty skeptical, but damn if the seats don’t work as advertised. I was equally doubtful of Mazda’s explanation of its all-new seat coolers, which suck hot air off your body rather than blow cold air out. Those suckers work, and the more uncomfortably hot your back and butt are, the faster they work.

Like I said earlier, we tend to take for granted that a Mazda will drive well, and this updated Mazda6 is no exception. The suspension has received a surprisingly thorough rethink, including new shocks with internal rebound springs, new geometry to eliminate roll understeer and sharpen up the front end, and a hard-mounted steering rack. The result is ride and handling qualities I can best describe as Germanic. That is, there’s a grace and sophistication in the way this car moves that’s most commonly found in German luxury sedans.

It starts with the ride. Bumps big and small are soaked up and smoothly deflected by the suspension, which never seems to register a harsh impact either by vibration or noise. The body moves fluidly and deliberately, never flopping over to the side or porpoising forward and back. It’s calm, collected, and impossible to catch out.

The Mazda6 handles the same way. The body rolls a bit more than a German sport sedan, but it’s a smooth, controlled motion that ends softly rather than crashing down on the bump stops. The weight shifts quickly to the outside, and the car takes its set with no fuss. The steering is quick and precise, though managing 310 lb-ft of torque introduces some heavy spots in the wheel as you exit a corner and wipes out any road feel.

Despite that, you can hustle this car down a road very, very quickly. The limiting factor is the tires; the somewhat skinny all-season meats don’t have the grip to keep up with the car. Being nose heavy, understeer is your penalty for asking too much of them, and they’ll protest audibly just before it happens. Mazda is looking into a dealer-installed summer tire option. It’s a good idea. Braking is consistently strong when abused, but with a light pedal effort that takes a little getting used to.

Did I say 310 lb-ft of torque back there? I did. You’ll recognize this powertrain from the much larger and heavier CX-9 crossover, and here it gets to stretch its legs. The optional turbocharged four-cylinder (base is a carryover naturally aspirated four with cylinder deactivation, 187 hp, and 186 lb-ft) makes all that torque right down low and finishes with 2 horsepower ratings higher up: 227 hp on 87 octane and 250 hp on 93. Don’t worry too much about it, though. The horsepower peak is at 5,000 rpm, so unless you’re planning to send it, you won’t notice a difference.

In everyday driving, the six-speed auto cruises on that turbo torque and is plenty potent for getting off the line and passing a poky driver on the freeway. Mazda claims it stopped at six gears in the name of engine response and driveability. Keeping the revs up and the turbo spooled means the engine doesn’t have to downshift from ninth to fifth to find power. Not having a super-tall overdrive gear might have fuel economy implications, but at 23/31/26 mpg city/highway/combined, the Mazda6 is still dead-competitive with an Accord or Camry. The base engine is rated at 26/35/29 if frugality is your priority.

Graphically, the power delivery looks like a smile. There’s a lot going on at the bottom and top ends of the chart but not so much in the middle. When cruising, there’s plenty of oomph as soon as you touch the pedal; when caning it, there’s good pull at the top end. Between 3,000 and 4,000 rpm, though, the delivery flattens out, so best to pick one end of the spectrum and stick to it.

The transmission is happy to help you with that. It’s got paddle shifters and a race-orientation manual shifter slot, which all respond quickly, as well as a darn good Sport mode. It’s not Porsche PDK good, but it holds gears and downshifts aggressively under braking. It’s good enough to keep you off the paddles most of the time, but if you want the last tenth, do it yourself. The shifts themselves are smooth and uneventful except under wide-open throttle.

Last month, we published a special series of comparison tests pitting loaded mainstream cars and crossovers against similarly priced base-model luxury cars of the same size. In that comparison, the Mazda CX-5 edged out a Lexus NX 300, and the Honda Accord bumped off an Audi A4 as easily as it beat the Toyota Camry last year. Now, though, the Accord faces its biggest challenge not from another luxury automaker but from the cheeky underdogs at Mazda (and Honda should be glad Mazda doesn’t have anywhere near the same R&D budget). We’ve been skeptical of Mazda’s latest attempt to go upmarket, but the company reports the top half of its trim levels are accounting for more than 50 percent of its sales these days, and the new Mazda6 will surely follow suit. Living well while saving money never goes out of style.
Old 05-22-2018, 12:11 PM
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https://jalopnik.com/the-turbocharge...our-1826095689


The 2018 Mazda 6 is prettier than ever, and its top-trim interior is downright elegant. It also finally has the thing we’ve been craving from this sporty midsize sedan for years now—more power. But despite improvements to the suspension and an extra 60-plus horses from a new turbocharger, this 6 feels like a move toward affordable luxury and away from practical performance.



When your butt hits the seat, you’re plunged into a soft cushion of validation. “This is nice,” you’ll realize, patting yourself on the shoulder for achieving modestly-priced luxury.

There are a few stages of emotion you’ll feel as you grab the reins of a $35,000 Mazda 6 Signature. First comes skeptical optimism as the door whips open with the same light cheapness it’s always had, but reveals a marvelously appointed and dare-I-say zen shrine of an interior.

Then you hit the gas. And while you’ll briefly be treated to a satisfying surge of the 310 lb-ft of torque, it won’t take weeks of driving to realize the car is just fine on the road but does not have the thrust to induce some kind of automotive spiritual awakening as Mazda’s brochures might suggest.

That hardly means it’s a bad car. On the contrary, the new 6 is a beautiful place to be and a good way to get around.

[...]

Old 05-22-2018, 01:17 PM
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Can agree with that. The 310ft/lb doesn't give the rush you'd expect. More of a solid wave of power, without the headrest pinning feel.
Had the same feeling the first time I drove my mom's 2011 EB F150, it hit 90mph on the freeway pretty quickly, but never felt like it was accelerating at such a rate.
Old 05-22-2018, 04:12 PM
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Just buy the damn GTI already.
Old 05-22-2018, 04:21 PM
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The car looks great! but i am not sure if it will translate to sales #s tho.
Old 05-24-2018, 09:08 AM
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https://www.autoblog.com/2018/05/23/...el-spy-photos/

We get it – we're a little sick of getting a few years of assurances that Mazda's much-anticipated diesel engine is just around the corner. First, it was going to go in the 2014 Mazda6, then it was delayed. More recently, Mazda told us it'd first land in the CX-5 – and in fact, there's a part of the Mazda USA website devoted to the diesel crossover, which makes it seem more legitimate than previous pronouncements. But the fact of the matter is, there's some unforeseen hiccup in the government approval process for this engine, likely centered around emissions standards, and it seems to be dragging on. But this Mazda6 was spotted at an EPAfacility in Michigan, which gives us some hope that perhaps the company is rounding the final base on the approval process.

It looks very much like an American-spec Mazda6 to our eyes ... except for the strange, possibly temporary exhaust outlets, which might be required for EPA testing. The rear looks like a current-look car, rather than the revised 2018 styling that will get the 2.5-liter turbocharged gas engine. Since the Mazda6 was originally supposed to get the Skyactiv-D engine, we can only assume that if it's at an EPA facility, Mazda is hoping to bring it to market here – likely sometime after the CX-5 goes on sale.

If Mazda can get approval, it'll be another point of differentiation between the Mazda6 and its competitors – there's no currently-approved diesel sedan that's a direct match. The smaller Cruze and larger, more expensive offerings from BMW and Jaguar are about it.

The fuel economy guide (PDF) produced by the EPA back in late 2017 lists both the CX-5 and the Mazda6 as having diesel engines, but neither are rated, and as we know at this point, neither are on sale or have an official timeline for doing so. We can assume anything with an application in progress made it on the list, whether approval would be granted or not.

It seems unlikely at this point that Mazda would abandon the Skyactiv-D in America. It's a solid part of their strategy, although a product roadmap released a few months ago shows that Mazda expects diesel sales globally to taper off after 2020, to be supplanted by plug-in gas hybrid, EV, and fuel cell vehicles. But between now and about 2030, pure diesel cars are expected to be a small but significant portion of Mazda's product mix.

We hope this means we'll see the CX-5 emerge from the approval process and hit dealer lots soon, to be followed by the 6. If we hear anything else, we'll keep you posted.


Old 05-24-2018, 11:26 AM
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I dunno. They tried to bring in a diesel 6 from the start but that thing was plagued with oil consumption. I think Mazda claimed a quart every 1,000 miles was normal, last time I read.

Plus with all the emissions crap likely to choke this thing, the low take rate on diesels, and with Mazda not even being known for them here...

You can get mid-high 30s with the four cyl with lower operating costs too. Maybe once gas prices become insane enough.
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:39 AM
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Diesels have been sold well in rest of the world. How come when they are shipped to the US, there are all these kind of BS problems? Is it the car or is it us?
Old 05-24-2018, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
Diesels have been sold well in rest of the world. How come when they are shipped to the US, there are all these kind of BS problems? Is it the car or is it us?
It's us. Our gas prices are super cheap compared to everywhere else. The rest of the world also pays less for diesel than gas and the cost of the diesel engine itself is not any more expensive (sometimes cheaper) than the gas model so the take rate is much higher as a result.

Over here, it doesn't make financial sense to buy the diesel with the higher cost of fuel and the extra cost of the optional engine unless you need it to tow like with a super duty truck. When we were shopping for our Jeep I did the math on a GC diesel vs gas and the payoff period was somewhere in the 95k mile area when you factor in cost of fuel and engine vs the better fuel economy.
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Old 05-24-2018, 01:12 PM
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Thoughts regarding fuel prices and supply:
  • Fact: roughly a half barrel of gasoline and a quarter barrel of diesel fuel is produced from each barrel of crude oil.
  • I've seen estimates of over half of the vehicles in parts of Europe are Diesel.
  • Let's assume the European market is 50/50 Gas/Diesel for easy figuring; for every liter of diesel fuel produced, two liters of gasoline are produced but there is only a market for one of those liters of gasoline; the surplus is sent North American markets (Canada and the U.S. for sure, maybe not Mexico).
  • If the European communities were to change their taxation laws which artificially makes diesel cheaper than gasoline, and suddenly see a spike in popularity of gasoline powered cars over there, we may end up with an enormous spike in our gasoline costs over here.
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:48 AM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
how come when they are shipped to the us, there are all these kind of bs problems?
Tree huggers at CARB.
Old 06-04-2018, 09:27 AM
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2018 Mazda6 Signature 2.5T First Test Review - Motor Trend

It’s not what you’ve got—it’s how you use it

You’ve heard this one before. It doesn’t matter how good or bad your equipment is. It’s how well you can use it. Alternatively, it’s a poor craftsman who blames his tools. Tires are tools of a type, and the heavily updated 2018 Mazda6 uses them as best it can.

Admittedly, Mazda is asking a lot of the 225/45R19 Falken Ziex ZE001 all-seasons it’s fitted to all four corners of the latest Mazda6. This one tire has to live up to Mazda’s acclaimed handling brand value while also returning competitive fuel economy and good wet- and cold-weather performance. Nearly all of those requirements are in direct opposition to one another when it comes to the chemistry and physics of tire design and engineering. For automotive product planners, balancing these priorities and realities is a full-time job.
Given all that, it’s remarkable what the Mazda6 can do with what it has to work with. In our First Drive of the new model, I compared its handling to that of a German luxury sport sedan. It’s got the same feeling of solidity and graceful body control that companies like BMW and Mercedes-Benz are famous for—but at an as-tested price of just $36,140, which would barely get you in the door of a luxury dealer.

You can see it in the data, too. Our loaded Signature 2.5T tester pulled 0.84 average g on the skidpad and ran our figure-eight test in 26.7 seconds at 0.68 average g. Compare those numbers to the class leader, a similarly loaded Honda Accord Touring 2.0T we tested last year. The Honda, which is more than 100 pounds lighter, pulled 0.85 average g on the skidpad and needed 26.9 seconds to lap the figure eight, pulling 0.67 average g along the way. It’s equipped with wider 235/40R19 Michelin Primacy MXM4 all-season grand touring car tires. The Mazda6’s performance is particularly impressive when you consider the Ziex ZE001 is a crossover/SUV tire.

Wait, hold the phone. The Mazda6 comes with an SUV tire? Same tire as the Nissan Rogue and Subaru Ascent? What on earth for? We asked Mazda, and a spokesperson told us, “The Falken Ziex ZE001 A/S was chosen as the OE 19-inch tire for the 2018 Mazda6 for a variety of reasons, including stable controllability, refinement, quietness, lower fuel consumption, and braking characteristics. While there are off-the-rack versions of the Falken Ziex ZE001 A/S available, the tires equipped on the 2018 Mazda6 were specifically designed in collaboration with Falken, engineered to specification with the program objectives in mind to deliver a refined experience that complements Mazda’s capable chassis dynamics.”

The heavier Mazda6 2.5T wearing SUV tires may outrun the Honda Accord 2.0T in a handling test, but it’s a different story in a drag race. The Mazda out-torques the Honda 310 lb-ft to 273 lb-ft and just about matches it in terms of horsepower, at 250 to the Honda’s 252. (Note: Mazda rates the 2.5T engine at 227 hp on 87 octane and 250 hp on 93 octane. Our tests of both the Mazda and Honda were performed on California’s best: 91 octane.) Yet the Accord needs just 5.7 seconds to hit 60 mph to the Mazda’s 6.4.

Simply put, the Honda puts the power down, and the Mazda doesn’t. Launching the Mazda6 takes practice and a careful foot, as you can easily spin the tires off the line. Even if you get the launch right, it’ll spin the tires again at the top of first gear when the engine hits peak horsepower. As such, the Mazda is 0.2 second slower to 30 mph and never catches up.

You can feel it in the power delivery any time you wind out the engine. There’s a lot of low-end torque, but acceleration flattens out in the midrange only to surge again as you pass 4,000 rpm. Most customers won’t notice, though, because they’ll never rev the engine that high. Per Mazda, that’s also how customers can save a little money at the pump: The difference in peak horsepower ratings only matters above 4,000 rpm, so there’s no sense buying premium gas if you don’t plan to flog the car.

You also don’t need to buy premium to get good fuel economy. Per the EPA, the Mazda6 will get 23/31/26 mpg city/highway/combined. We filled it up with 87 octane and strapped on our EQUA Real MPG equipment, and the car over-delivered with 22.9/33.9/26.8 mpg city/highway/combined. Stack it against the Accord, and it looks even better. Although the EPA rates the Accord Touring 2.0T at 22/32/27 mpg city/highway/combined, in our testing it returned 20.7/35.1/25.4 mpg.

Of course, the Accord is working with a brand-new 10-speed automatic transmission, whereas the Mazda employs an older but highly refined six-speed. Mazda says an extra half liter of displacement and fewer gears mean quicker throttle response than a smaller engine and more gears to shuffle, and that might be more than just an excuse for using an older transmission. The Mazda6 cruises at a higher engine speed than the Accord on the freeway, closer to its torque peak and with the turbo spooled up, so when you press the throttle, there’s no turbo lag or downshifting. Despite this, fuel economy is dead-on competitive. On the other hand, the Accord’s 45–65-mph passing acceleration is 0.4 second quicker, throttle response be damned.

The tire disparity rears its head one last time in 60–0 braking. The lighter Honda with its sedan tires needs just 116 feet to come to a halt; the Mazda with SUV tires will be 11 feet further down the road, having traveled 127 feet total.

Grippier tires could reduce the stopping distance, not to mention improve acceleration and handling, but at the cost of fuel economy. When you ask a midsize sedan buyer which they put a higher priority on, fuel economy is likely to win, and Mazda product planners know this. However, they also know Mazda customers appreciate the brand’s sportiness, so they and the engineers are investigating potential summer tire options for the Mazda6, which could be offered at the dealer before the car is sold. If Japan signs off on the plan, the Accord–Mazda6 dynamic could shift considerably.

For now, though, we’re left with two highly competitive midsize sedans both pursuing the same two-pronged strategy of segment-busting luxury and sportiness. They’re even priced within a few hundred dollars of each other. I could spend another several paragraphs going over their lush interiors, laundry lists of tech features, comparisons of ride quality, and on and on, but instead I’ll save it for a future comparison test, which might just include the all-new Nissan Altima for good measure. Stay tuned.
Old 06-04-2018, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2
2018 Mazda6 Signature 2.5T First Test Review - Motor Trend

"Simply put, the Honda puts the power down, and the Mazda doesn’t."
Old 06-04-2018, 11:05 AM
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Old 06-04-2018, 01:30 PM
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So just swap out the tires.
Old 06-04-2018, 01:38 PM
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Then again, if I am not mistaken, the Mazda6 has the SkyActiv 6-Speed automatic transmission and the Honda has the new 10-Speed autobox. That in and of itself may account for the differences in acceleration.
Old 06-04-2018, 01:39 PM
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I'm kind of surprised... the 10at would obviously have much shorter gears than the Mazda 6at... I'd think Mazda could get better traction with the taller gears. They are running on garbage tires, though, that's forsure. The braking is indicative of how shitty they are, also.

Otherwise, I think the Mazda would be closer in competition. One thing to also remember is more gears = shorter gears = faster acceleration (and lower top end, though that's curable with more gears ). The Accord, though making less torque, might still have a wee bit on the Mazda.
Old 06-04-2018, 03:22 PM
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The tire disparity rears its head one last time in 60–0 braking. The lighter Honda with its sedan tires needs just 116 feet to come to a halt; the Mazda with SUV tires will be 11 feet further down the road, having traveled 127 feet total.

Grippier tires could reduce the stopping distance, not to mention improve acceleration and handling, but at the cost of fuel economy. When you ask a midsize sedan buyer which they put a higher priority on, fuel economy is likely to win, and Mazda product planners know this.
An extra 11 feet is bad.

Shorter stopping distance > fuel economy
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Old 06-04-2018, 05:07 PM
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This is the part i dont understand. At 35k+ level, why can't they just offer a $500 or even $700 summer tire option with some decent tires? Because not everyone wants POS all season tires.
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Old 06-05-2018, 09:20 AM
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^ Sounds like that's in the works, pending approval from Mazda Japan.
Would be interested to see how a turbo 6 with some stickier/better tires fares in comparison.
Old 06-05-2018, 10:09 AM
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I think it'll still be slower than the accord... those extra gears...

but... I think the gap between the accord and 6, assuming the 6 had better tires, would likely be very small.

Have you decided on going with a 6, or are you still going back and forth on the idea? What's holding you back?
Old 06-05-2018, 10:15 AM
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Between the 6 GTR & the GTI Autobahn (apples & oranges). Partly waiting on my insurance, they haven't been able to give me a for sure rate on either, don't exist in their system for some reason.
Need to follow up with him, as it's been about 2 weeks since I last checked.
Old 06-05-2018, 11:26 AM
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^ I think GTI is a better all around car... more fun. more practical, and not 1st year model.
Unless you really like the G...T....R name
Old 06-05-2018, 01:13 PM
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The GTI is definitely more fun to drive, practicality is a bit of a wash IMO, the 6 has a larger back seat & trunk, but GTI = hatch, so a lot of usable space.
The 6 is also a MMC redesign, not a full clean slate. The 2.5T has been in the CX-9 for a few years.
The financial numbers will play a part in it at the end of the day. The GTI is a couple grand more than the 6 & could end up more $$ on insurance.
Old 06-05-2018, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
This is the part i dont understand. At 35k+ level, why can't they just offer a $500 or even $700 summer tire option with some decent tires? Because not everyone wants POS all season tires.
I'm sure there's some stupid regulatory hurdles for selling the car from the factory with a different tire. Probably have to prove to the EPA that the numbers don't significantly change, prove to the DOT that the tires aren't going to kill people, prove to whoever else that some other obscure regulation is still compliant, etc...

Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2
The GTI is definitely more fun to drive, practicality is a bit of a wash IMO, the 6 has a larger back seat & trunk, but GTI = hatch, so a lot of usable space.
The 6 is also a MMC redesign, not a full clean slate. The 2.5T has been in the CX-9 for a few years.
The financial numbers will play a part in it at the end of the day. The GTI is a couple grand more than the 6 & could end up more $$ on insurance.
I'm sure it'll be close but even if it's more expensive, I'd still get the GTI. It's more fun on a day to day basis than the Mazda and it'll probably hold its value better too.
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Old 06-05-2018, 01:38 PM
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Agreed, my basic goal is to keep my monthly outflow (note + ins) the same or better as we have in the F150.
Old 06-05-2018, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1
I'm sure there's some stupid regulatory hurdles for selling the car from the factory with a different tire. Probably have to prove to the EPA that the numbers don't significantly change, prove to the DOT that the tires aren't going to kill people, prove to whoever else that some other obscure regulation is still compliant, etc...



I'm sure it'll be close but even if it's more expensive, I'd still get the GTI. It's more fun on a day to day basis than the Mazda and it'll probably hold its value better too.
I am not sure if there is any Regulator issues, since a lot of the dealers sell dealer installed wheels and tires (aftermarket or OEM) as part of a package.
Old 06-05-2018, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
I am not sure if there is any Regulator issues, since a lot of the dealers sell dealer installed wheels and tires (aftermarket or OEM) as part of a package.
Dealer installed is different than a factory option for just about everything as it's then considered "aftermarket".
Old 06-05-2018, 04:52 PM
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If we are talking about Factory options, then it is even easier. BMW offers all season runflat, summer performance non-runflat, summer performance runflat.
Old 06-06-2018, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by horseshoez
Then again, if I am not mistaken, the Mazda6 has the SkyActiv 6-Speed automatic transmission and the Honda has the new 10-Speed autobox. That in and of itself may account for the differences in acceleration.
Originally Posted by TacoBello
I'm kind of surprised... the 10at would obviously have much shorter gears than the Mazda 6at... I'd think Mazda could get better traction with the taller gears. They are running on garbage tires, though, that's forsure. The braking is indicative of how shitty they are, also.

Otherwise, I think the Mazda would be closer in competition. One thing to also remember is more gears = shorter gears = faster acceleration (and lower top end, though that's curable with more gears ). The Accord, though making less torque, might still have a wee bit on the Mazda.
The trap speed difference in the 1/4 mile is huge though. 93mph vs 99mph. Traction isn't gonna fix that. And switching from 6AT to 10AT wouldn't close that big of a gap either. It's not like going from 1 gear to 5 gears. Either the Accord is massively underrated or the Mazda 6 is massively overrated in terms of power output. The Accord after all is rated 40lbft less.
Old 06-06-2018, 11:53 AM
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I am just surprised that 2.5T is that slow.... I mean it is not like Mazda doesnt know turbo (Mazdaspeed)
Old 06-06-2018, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
If we are talking about Factory options, then it is even easier. BMW offers all season runflat, summer performance non-runflat, summer performance runflat.
And I'm guessing all of those were run through the various regulatory hurdles because people buying a BMW might actually want different tires for different purposes. The vast majority of people buying a Mazda6 don't know anything about tires other than they are there. Not worth the massive expense for the 15 people a year who would want the sticky tires.
Old 06-06-2018, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by iforyou
The trap speed difference in the 1/4 mile is huge though. 93mph vs 99mph. Traction isn't gonna fix that. And switching from 6AT to 10AT wouldn't close that big of a gap either. It's not like going from 1 gear to 5 gears. Either the Accord is massively underrated or the Mazda 6 is massively overrated in terms of power output. The Accord after all is rated 40lbft less.
What? How would getting extra traction off the line not result in a faster trap speed at the end? If the mazda is spinning it's wheels down the first 50m of the track, it's undoubtedly going to be slower at the end.

Also, going from 1 gear to 5 is the same jump as going from 6 gears to 10 You're right, it likely won't make a 6mph difference... but don't discount the gears. Even look at the 2G MDX vs the 3G MDX... the 3G has less power (10hp less and 3lbft less) yet is faster in all categories than the 2G.

Look here at the MDX 0-60 times and 1/4 mile times...
https://www.zeroto60times.com/vehicl...-60-mph-times/
Old 06-06-2018, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1
And I'm guessing all of those were run through the various regulatory hurdles because people buying a BMW might actually want different tires for different purposes. The vast majority of people buying a Mazda6 don't know anything about tires other than they are there. Not worth the massive expense for the 15 people a year who would want the sticky tires.
Wow, talk about painting everything with one broad brush. Mazda owners don't care? Really? Because we have a few enthusiasts on here that either bought or are looking to buy a Mazda. Something tells me your assertion is wrong.
Old 06-06-2018, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by TacoBello
Wow, talk about painting everything with one broad brush. Mazda owners don't care? Really? Because we have a few enthusiasts on here that either bought or are looking to buy a Mazda. Something tells me your assertion is wrong.
The key words you missed was "the vast majority".

There are and always will be enthusiasts who do care and for them, there's the aftermarket. However, enthusiasts make up a very small percentage of the car buying public and, as such, automakers need to cater to the majority not the tiny minority. This is why Mazda isn't even offering their turbo motor with a manual. Not worth the effort for a tiny take rate.
Old 06-06-2018, 01:48 PM
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A vast majority of BMW owners have no fucking clue what they drive, either. Don't kid yourself. I work with enough women here who drive X3s and 3-series sedans that care about how pretty their car is and what a luxury car it is. Beyond that, you can see tumbleweeds go by if you ask any questions about the mechanics or performance.

BMW is no longer the ultimate driving machine. That market is much too small. They've gone out into the mainstream market where people just like the Mazda crowd you are insinuating exists.

Unless of course, you have any sort of evidence? I'll wait for you to post it
Old 06-06-2018, 01:51 PM
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Sam, put down the crack pipe. The reason there is no 2.5T with a manual is because no one will buy it, except maybe 15 people. Back in 2005-2006, Honda released the Accord sedan with a 6MT... Honda couldn't sell them for the life of them. There was a fully optioned one at my local dealer that sat there for a year before it finally moved, at a discounted price.

Yeah, you can still get a BMW with a manual, but how many do they actually sell? I'm guessing less than 10%. Mazda is smaller than BMW. They can't offer the same shit as BMW. So they don't offer a package that most no one will buy. Even people who say they would buy, often times don't. It's just talk.
Old 06-06-2018, 01:53 PM
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And yeah, Mazda owners don't care about performance whatsoever... said none of the hundreds of thousands of Miata owners around the world. That car doesn't have a turbo either and sells in droves and is the most raced compact car in the world... but you're right... they probably don't care at all.


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