crimson002

tsx-mdxman

So is a Ferrari 360 but like the G35, it also costs a lot more than the TSX, so what's your point?

AcuraFan

Guys...we have to remember here that some people value performance above all else. It doesn't matter how crappy Infiniti's interior is...the important thing is that their fast and that's all that matters to some. Heck, I don't see why they aren't praising the Neon SRT-4 over the TSX...after all, it's a lot faster.

I personally like comfort and interior quality. But that's jut me.

AcuraFan

I don't agree with you. I've driven both and they are very different cars and appeal to very different people. Those who would normally buy an RSX are looking for a fun little pocket rocket. The Accord coupe might be faster but it doesn't handle as well (partially do to the weight of the V6), feels too big (which also hurts the handling), and isn't nearly as much fun to drive. The only reason you can compare the two is because they both have 2 doors and come from the same company. Those looking for one aren't going to look too closely at the other. IMHO

Junkster

Okay, back to the original post topic...

Who is the source for this RSX post? Can we verify the validity of the poster?

Honda working on a 'street' V8 is news, since they announced that the RL and the NSX will be carrying 6's in the next generation... kinda late in the game to incorporate a 8 design into the equation... does Honda have a chassis/platform to handle a 8?

A TSX AWD, IMO, isn't a far-off possiblity, with the entry market of all major lux sedans carrying the AWD option. My guess would be in about a year and a half to two years for the introduction of a AWD TSX model.

The RSX should be killed off for a more luxury-minded roadster/open top. The way things are going at Acura, with the upward movement of their models, the RSX is getting left behind. A TSX-based coupe would be nice, if they can transfer the design lines well.

First post since Christmas... I might be a little off on me comments.

Junkster, who went to Tuscon for a week and caught a glimpse of the next Pathfinder/Xterra.

larchmont

What am I missing?

(Is that in Kansas City instead of Japan or something like that?)

JTso

iTrader: (2)

Here's the actual thread on ClubRSX.

http://forums.clubrsx.com/showthread...cord+TypeR+AWD

dom

That same guy named muvelonyc posted this in that same thread

"The saddest thing is that I haven't seen one DC5R at all. Most car enthusiats in Japan consider Honda weak (like we consider Hyundais) and go for the bigger stuff like the STi or GTR.

Could muvelonyc be Gilboman who is also in Japan apparently right now?

Why do the Japanese consider Honda weak? Have they seen the NSX, Type R's etc??

DEVO

The Integra in Japan... had AWD. I remember reading that is where the got the AWD system for the CRV.

My point being that they could easily add AWD to the TSX... but I'm not a big fan of the Real Time AWD system.

vwong

Honda Japan already has an AWD Accord on the market. I don't have the specs with me now, but I think it has a lower output K20 motor. The chassis code for the AWD Accord is CL8.

edited: Here's the link to JDM Accord's spec (grade as Japanese calls it), http://www.honda.co.jp/auto-lineup/a...ata/index.html.

tsxer.ca

well... i don't think the AWR TSX will come any soon.. and even AWR model will show up in Acura dealer ,mostly RL and TL will first take as a opiton.. after a year or so the TSx will take as a option. Just like M-benz first the S class then E calss last C class. and that option won;t come in cheap. Another type-S TSX?!

RJC RSX

he's reliable

AcuraFan

BMW's only AWD sedan is the 3 series...which is the TSX's prime target.

phile

So you're saying all that is posted is indeed true?

dom

I have a really hard time believing Hondas made a Turbo 2.4. I'm not saying he's a liar, but I doubt it.

And I don't want a Turbo, I like my NAE (Naturally Aspirated Engines)

Junkster

I was also thinking that as well domn.

Than I remembered reading somewhere that Mugen (run by the son of the founder of Honda) went sour in its finances and was integrated into the Honda family. If such a out-source department is being utilized by Honda, than a turbo wouldn't be out of the question for a performance model.

Junkster, who still does doubt most forum 'insider' info.

YBA

I would consider a AWD TSX if it came with more omph.

justinjsw

An AWD TSX is not that far fatched for the US market. They had brought over an AWD JDM Accord to the States during the summer for testing. This was all talked about sometime ago. The data is already in Torrance on rather an AWD TSX is a sellable vehicle here.

BlackTSXer

justin, when do you think they will stop selling the tsx's that are currently selling in the U.S. with all the talk before of a limit of being 15000 proved wrong, how many cars are they actually going to produce??

larchmont

15,000 was never a "limit."

A while back, some of us looked for the original quotes from Honda/Acura, and what we found (not counting the after-the-fact paraphrasings from the media) was that the 15,000 was a target.

BTW that appears to have been per year, not for the 2003 calendar year (as many people think) which covered 9 months' worth, nor for the 2004 model year (as many other people think).

In other words, they're already WAY over the "target." They're on course to exceed it by maybe 40% or more.

biker

The "target" is what some number cruncher pulls out of his a$$ (OK maybe an educated guess). The real number that counts for Honda is the bottom line: Can they sell enough of them to make money? This is true for any model.

In the case of the new "pickup" Honda said the minimum for them to break even is 60,000 units per year (they have no idea how many will actually sell). This number is rather high because it's a new model and it takes a lot of sales to get the money back spent on development. In the case of the TSX it's probably a lot lower since it's a modified Euro Accord. Maybe the 15,000 represents the break even point, who knows.

Biker, who thinks that Larch could "write" as credible a story as one with which this thread started.

type-s

from the article "equipped with a turbocharged engine "

Honda ? turbo ?

nahhhhhh

BlackTSXer

do any of you guys know when they will stop selling the current tsx's that are being sold in the U.S.

in other words, when will a new remodeled tsx come out? because I dont want the tsx to be remodeled before i purcahse it .. i like the current tsx the way it is..no awd, no turbo, ...just 4 cylinder 200hp is fine for me... anyone know when acura will stop selling the current tsx's? when will production end for the "04 tsx"?

dom

The current TSX as it stands will get redesigned when the Euro Accord gets redesigned. likely in 5 years. So we might see an all new TSX for 08. But, will the TSX continue to be sold here? as long as sales hold up I'm sure it will. We're also bound to see some freshening between now and then. Type R, A-Spec, AWD, IMA, etc.

All I know is I'm tradind my TSX in for an AWD version if it comes out.

justinjsw

We are currently at/around #21,250. They will produce as many as they can.

There have been alot of different rumors with the RSX. Its too early to get in to that right now. Once more facts come out I will let you all know.

provench

Yeah ... The Oracle has been quiet ... I had assumed you have been working your magic and ready to spring the latest news on all this real soon

Now about that AWD TSX ... you did see the papers on it ... all we can hope for is that the marketing folks come out with a positive business case. I just might have to make the move, but only if it comes with more power as well

Santa Rosa Steve

Doesn't sound much like a "limited production" automobile anymore does it?

Santa Rosa Steve

larchmont

Well, to me it does.

What's the average number of people who buy any given model in a month? OK, I don't know either, but let's pick a conservative number.....How about 5000?

And suppose you and 4999 of your closest friends go around to all the Acura dealers in N.A. and say, "I want a TSX. And I'm even willing to wait a coupla months." Can they all get it?

No.

Not even if they're willing to pay MSRP.

Or over.


That falls within my idea of the phrase. And it's certainly within a reasonable idea of the phrase.

Santa Rosa Steve

So limited production exists any time demand exceeds supply?

Santa Rosa Steve

larchmont

Well, not exactly.......

Gebbeth

Geez, who cares about 15,000 or 50,000. I'm more interested in what the original post had to say, AWD, turbo charged and a V-8?

Either this guy is reliable or he isn't. If he is, all this prior talk about no V-8 this, no V-8 that, that Honda doesn't need it, that it isn't Honda's philosophy is bs. I really don't believe that a car company the size of Honda would completely forego anything beyond 6 cylinder engines for the sake of eco-purity (which sounds like a bunch of illogical, self-satisfying bullcrap, especially from a company now building a jet plane and not able to build a real eco friendly car the likes of Toyota's new generation Prius), but geez, all the experts on this board seem to believe it, so who am I to go against the grain? Turbo charged, same deal there.

AWD would be great, but on the TSX, the car is already on the heavy side, so it's gonna need a pretty good boost in power for it to make sense (also, there's got to be some advance power distribution control like the new G35 AWD system, not just brain dead full time AWD all the time). I'd also like to see an increase in build quality to get rid of these rattles, clicks, misalignments of dashboards, power seats that grind, dealers who don't care and don't want to listen about these problems and "customer service" jerks who have pre-typed form responses to real problems, etc. These things also matters to me.

RSX has to go to Honda. Instead, leave the teenager market behind and bring a real, adult, fun-to-drive roadster/convertible to compete against the Z4s and SLKs. This would set Acura apart from Infiniti and move more toward BMW, Mercedes and Lexus.

One final word on Honda, the eco-champ philosophizing car company too afraid for the environment to make a V-8 have been making thousands, no, hundreds-of-thousands of stinky, gas spewing two-stroke motorcycle engines for years and years and still do, not to mention, lawn mowers, generators, ATVs, etc, and now a jet airplane?????? Real eco friendly there. The internal combustion engine is an inherently polluting creation. So if you are in the business of creating these engines, and you've made efforts thus far to make four and six cylinder engines more fuel efficient, it's disingenuous to say "well we can't go further because V-8 are just baaaaaaad." "Oh, and by the way, never mind the jet engine we're making."

Again, if this guy says he saw a V-8 and a turbo then HELL YES, more power (forgive the pun) to Honda for doing so. It's about freaking time. It's also an admission that there is a glaring hole in the line up.

If all this is just bs, then Honda is one schizoid company.

biker

I think this business of no V8 from Honda was true in the days up now when virtually everyhing they made was FWD. Even with the current TL they somehow are able to get 270HP to the ground reasonably well. But as soon as you jump to a V8 you'll probably going to have more HP that you can apply via FWD hence no need (can't use) for it. This goes hand in hand with the FWD mentality.

So the lightbulb over someone's head must have gone off and woke up to the fact that they're going to have to come up with a RWD platform AND a V8. The eco-friendly business has nothing to do with it. I'm sure Honda can come up with a V8 that is ULEV (BMW already has).

Like Nissan, Honda could come up with a one size fits all RWD platform (G35, M45, FX, 350Z, etc. for Infiniti/Nissan) from which they could use bits and pieces to make an all out sports car a la NSX, the next RL, or some crossover SUV like thing (like the FX).
Honda is not so risk averse to avoid new things. Anyone remember the 88 4WS Prelude? Like that Prelude however, the issue will be: Will anyone buy it in enough quantities to make it last.

RJC RSX

not necessarily, but he's a long time club rsx member and wouldn't make anything up. he's showed his connections in the past and has been consistant.

RJC RSX

don't forget the euro accord, now available with a turbocharged diesel engine. if they've done that much, it tells me they've largely overcome the reliability and emissions concerns that have limited them in the past, and turbos will now be a greater reality for the future.

Champ

I sure do, was it 88? I thought it was 90' They were cool cars to manuever in tight spots and parking

Anyway,
If Honda was bold enough to release a pricey rwd convertible coupe, then why wouldnt they consider an awd platform?

I believe all this and just hope the boneheads over at Acura HQ in Cali. will decide to release it because i believe it WILL sell here very well in NA if not over priced depending on what car they decide to put it on.......

I am guessing a Turbo AWD TSX would cost as much as a TL or more.

Too bad about the awesome RSX...i think it's a great car and i am sad it's not doing well. I honestly dont know why it's not selling well when it's such a cool little hatch back with tons of room for hauling stuff compared to ANY 4 door. It offers other benefits too.

Let's see what happens with all this........

RJC RSX

my theory: the problem with the rsx is that it came out at the wrong time. what's a truly amazing little car is overshadowed by the wrx, rx8, evo, etc. Ironic thing is these cars do not compete with the rsx, but the buyers of all these cars are young males who, i think, are rationalizing significantly more money for awd, turbo, etc. to be the fastest on the block. A turbo awd tsx would really solve this problem and create yet another perfect niche. honda reliabilitiy and practicality with awd and turbo performance. this would really, truly be an awesome car, and i can see it happening. and i'm sure it can be priced around 30k. it will certainly be interesting to see what happens. justin, i know you hate rumors, but anything at all to fuel the anticipation?

BuddySol

Honda has had turbo'd (diesel and non-diesel) cars in it's Japanese lineup. Past and present. None of those applications were geared for boy racer speed and acceleration. It's all about getting enough power in a smaller engine to compete with regular cars. So, altho they can produce turbo'd cars, I'd prolly wouldn't get one since they lack anything performance driven.

I too believe the RSX missed the party. Like I said before, the specialty coupe market (where the Prelude, 240, Eclipse, Celica, RSX all compete in) is on the decline. It has been on the decline worldwide. Would be sadden to see it go, but if the market isn't there to support the amount of cars in the segment, then there's no point in losing money on a model just to appease the rather small following of sport compact kids. It is impressive that the import/sport compact scene is still on the boom after 10 years, but with forthcoming OBD and other emissions obstacles, the whole sport compact industry is being setup to fall soon.

Stokeless_TSX

i read somewhere that there is a turbo awd tsx in japan...i wanna say it was turbo mag...or honda tuning cant remember but that would be the shiet to bring over if they do have one i wanna see about a driveline swap...

mkrsx2003

the best way to solve all of these (rsx)problems is to give the base rsx 180 hp and stop production of the rsx-s, and bring over the Integra Type-R, slap on an Acura badge, and make that the Type-s version- the integra type-r(JDM) is almost if not fast enough to compete with those cars. i read somewhere that it goes 0-60 in 5.6, an does a 1/4 mile in 13.6 stock!- perfect remedy (sales problem solved)

RJC RSX

i'm fairly sure it's not that fast