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Old 08-30-2004, 12:56 PM
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Old 08-30-2004, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gavriil
I can totally see a Diesel Accord making sense...
A diesel hybrid
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Old 08-30-2004, 02:15 PM
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disel hybrid
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Old 08-30-2004, 04:37 PM
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I hate diesel's... Even though they are much more refined lately, I still hate their sound and smoke.

The other day, a brand new Toureg V10 diesel tried to pass me on the highway and you should have seen the cloud of blue smoke that thing made. It's pretty embarrasing to have a brand new $60+k truck that leaves a smoke screen when opened up.
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Old 08-30-2004, 04:39 PM
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It makes a lot of sense. They already sell the diesal Euro Accord/TSX. Might as well bring it here.
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Old 08-30-2004, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by charliemike
A diesel hybrid

Yeap. And we will see a lot of those 5-7 years from now.
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Old 08-31-2004, 10:05 AM
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i'd like to see a diesel in the new truck
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Old 08-31-2004, 08:29 PM
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I'd like to see one in the new civic.
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Old 08-31-2004, 08:31 PM
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I hate the smell of diesel. It's made me throw up on one occassion as a kid
Is it possible to breathe too much?
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Old 11-09-2004, 11:46 PM
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Honda To Build Transmission Plant in Georgia

Date: November 09, 2004 12:09
Submitted by: RyanDL
Source: Honda Press Release
Credibility Rating: Not Specified

Honda To Build Transmission Plant in Georgia As Part of $270 Million North American Powertrain Strategy
-- Investment Includes Expansion at Existing Plants in Ohio and Alabama --

ATLANTA -- Honda today announced plans to build a $100 million plant in the city of Tallapoosa, Ga., 40 miles west of Atlanta, to produce automatic transmissions as part of a broader North American Powertrain Strategy. The plan also includes significant investments to add production of high precision gears at a Honda transmission plant in Ohio, and key engine components at a Honda engine facility in Alabama. In all, Honda will invest $270 million and create 600 jobs across three states.

“This powertrain strategy represents the continuation of Honda’s 25-year commitment to localize our operations close to the customer here in the U.S., and creates a new level of autonomy for Honda’s powertrain production in America,” said Koichi Kondo, president of American Honda Motor Co., Inc., and chief operating officer of Honda’s North America Region operations. “Importantly, the growing experience of Honda associates in America is what enables us to take this next step in powertrain production.”

In Georgia, Honda will invest $100 million to construct its 13th plant in North America, a new 250,000 square foot plant that will begin assembly of automatic transmissions in fall 2006. At full capacity, the plant will employ 400 associates and produce 300,000 transmissions per year. Reflecting Honda’s strategy to base powertrain production near vehicle production for synchronous assembly, the plant will initially support production of Honda Odyssey minivans and Pilot SUVs at Honda Manufacturing of Alabama, LLC (HMA) in Lincoln, Ala., 60 miles west of the Tallapoosa plant.

In Ohio, Honda will invest $100 million and add 100 new jobs to expand Honda Transmission Mfg. of America, Inc., (HTM) in a move that will result in the transfer of the value-added production of high precision gears from Japan to Ohio. As the new Georgia plant begins production, HTM will gradually shift responsibility for transmission production for the Alabama plant to the new Georgia plant and phase-in the new responsibility for gear production. The expansion will increase HTM’s capital investment to more than $261 million, employment to 900 associates and plant size from the existing 361,000 square feet to 631,000 square feet.

In Alabama, HMA will invest $70 million and add 100 new jobs to begin machining additional engine components at its existing engine plant operations. These components are currently supplied by Honda of America Mfg.’s Anna Engine Plant in Ohio and Honda’s Mohka Plant in Japan. HMA began operations in 2001 and, today, has the capacity to produce 300,000 vehicles and V6 engines per year. HMA’s total investment exceeds $1 billion.

Honda currently has an annual production capacity of one million automatic transmissions in the U.S. and has assembled more than nine million transmissions in America since it began producing automatic transmissions at Honda of America Mfg.’s Anna, Ohio, Engine Plant in 1989. HTM assumed responsibility for transmission production in 1996.

Honda’s first U.S. powertrain operation – the Anna Engine Plant – completed a $20 million expansion in July 2003, adding a new assembly line that further increased its flexibility to produce both 4-cylinder and V6 engines. The Anna Plant now has a capacity of 1.16 million engines per year. Together, Honda’s Ohio and Alabama engine plants have annual production capacity of 1.46 million automobile engines and supply all Honda and Acura vehicles produced in North America.

Honda recently celebrated the 25th anniversary of its first U.S. manufacturing plant, September 10, 2004. Collectively, these latest investments will bring to more than $8.5 billion the amount Honda has invested in its North American production, R&D and marketing operations. Using domestic and globally-sourced parts, Honda now has the annual capacity to produce 1.4 million cars and light trucks in North America at five auto plants in the U.S., Canada and Mexico.

Honda began operations in the U.S. in 1959 with the establishment of American Honda Motor Co., Inc., Honda’s first overseas subsidiary. Honda now employs more than 30,000 associates in North America. Honda currently has 12 manufacturing plants in North America, producing automobiles, light trucks, motorcycles, all-terrain vehicles, personal watercraft, engines, transmissions and other components. Nearly 8 of 10 Honda and Acura cars and light trucks sold in America are produced in North America as well. Many of these products are now designed and developed at one of Honda’s U.S. R&D centers. Honda annually purchases more than $12 billion in parts and materials from suppliers in North America.


http://vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=299183
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Old 11-09-2004, 11:48 PM
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About fucking time Honda started taking some responsibility for their v6 auto trannies being pieces of crap.
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Old 11-10-2004, 07:06 AM
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Cool, now Honda owners won't have to wait as long for a replacement tranny to get to them.

*rimshot*
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Old 11-10-2004, 07:38 AM
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wait are the current transmissions japanese made?? If so, this is good news cause American made transmissions are usually alot stronger from what I've experienced. The engines in American cars go out before their transmissions; lol!The tranny in my Accord was replaced a couple months ago. It still shifts very slow and rough. Hopefully future models can come with stronger gears and my love for honda will slowly come back.
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Old 11-10-2004, 11:55 AM
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From what I've heard, Honda tried to save money by outsourcing the transmissions to an outside vendor who obviously didn't do a very good job. But this news is pretty exciting for those that like having an automatic.
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Old 11-11-2004, 12:37 PM
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Why fix it, they gonna build more
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Old 11-12-2004, 01:26 PM
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And guess who will be paying that plant a visit in hopes of supplying test and measurement instrumentation.
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Old 11-12-2004, 01:51 PM
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:whocares:
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Old 11-12-2004, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by TypeS_boi
:whocares:
Probably about 600 people.
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Old 12-15-2004, 04:17 PM
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Honda developing Turbocharged engines

The latest issue of Car-Mode (Japanese Magazine) claims to have a scoop on the next NSX-R, predicting that it will feature a turbocharged V8 good for 500ps, which matches the predicted output of the upcoming Skyline GT-R and surpasses Toyota's upcoming GT supercar by 50ps.

While turbochargers haven't been used by Honda very frequently in the past, for the past 18 months or so there have been lots of whispers surrounding the secret development of turbo Hondas.

Maybe we will see a turbocharged V6 with SH-AWD on future TL's

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Old 12-15-2004, 04:42 PM
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Old 12-15-2004, 04:44 PM
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still, thad be nice!!!
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Old 12-15-2004, 05:01 PM
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If that's true, the car industry will have some heavy shoes to fill. We live in a great time. Can't wait to see this. Hope I can become rich soon so I can afford it.
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Old 12-15-2004, 08:15 PM
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I for one, hope this isn't true. Although the power bump with turbos is nice, there are reasons that most car mfgs don't use them. They bring along some undesirable traits, the most obvious being lag. Turbos are good for cheap speed, but I'd rather not have to put up with it in a luxury (or near luxury) car.
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Old 12-15-2004, 08:33 PM
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i disagree. turbos are an amazing, genuis invention!!! turbo lag is a negative as far as combaring a turbo to a supercharger, but combaring a turbo to a nonturbo. i would kill for turbo lag. ha. any invention in the world, where you take waste, garbage, and you create power, or energy, is an invention that should always be used. look at these stock little 4 bangers that they throw a turbo on and make them insanely fast! aside from the fact that money/horsepower ration. the turbo is about the best you can get. except for nitrous, but obvioulsy that will never be a factory option. ESPECIALLY, when you take about honda mass producing a turbo kit. right now an average aftermarket turbo kit is like 3 grand. if honda mass produces them, it could be like a 1,500-2,000 dollar option that addes litterally hundreds of horsepower! id love to see the next tl, or even tsx or rsx have a turbo option
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Old 12-15-2004, 09:40 PM
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In present day cars turbo lag has largely been eliminated due to the use of better materials and design. This is especially true of the "light-pressure" turbos. My last car, a turbo V6 Saab with about 4 psi boost had no turbo lag whatsoever. That turbo did virtually nothing for the horsepower level, but did boost the torque to about the same level as the TL now has; however that torque was available from 1900 rpm to 4500 rpm. If the TL had a similar torque band and increase........WOW!
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Old 12-16-2004, 08:39 AM
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good point repecat. this is something i forgot to mention. turbo lag is mostly known from cars getting aftermarket turbos, and getting a kit thats not specifically for that car. if honda where to mass produce a turbo, it probably would have NO LAG, like the saabs. because it would be built perfectly for that exactly model. its such a good idea. im getting excited
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Old 12-16-2004, 02:37 PM
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The turbo option is great if you have to go to high altitudes, no power loss. Used to have one in a Volvo. Downside is they tend to run hotter so you need an intercooler and they are one more thing that can bust as the Volvo's did at $1500 a pop. If honda made one you can bet it would be good.
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Old 12-16-2004, 03:00 PM
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Turbos are not practical. They suck in hot weather and traffic.. that we have plenty in the southern states. A little something called heatsoak robs power.

In order to run high boost levels/compression, turbo engines require high octane gas. Also in the real world this gas is waaay over $2/gallon.

I'd rather honda spent its engine genius on dry sumps, ceramic headers, direct injection, thermally isolated intakes, and matched pistons on engines that can run on 87 octane.
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Old 12-16-2004, 09:27 PM
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i hope its not true, one of the great things about honda is that they stick with N/A cars(just like BMW). i really appreciate the engineering that is involved in getting more and more power without going the route of forced induction. it would be crazy fast but a little disappointing in my opinion. just look at the new M5 500hp and no turbos. now that is impressive, even tho its a V10 it still produces 100hp/liter and revs to 8500.
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Old 12-16-2004, 11:45 PM
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IF Honda decides to go turbo, I hope it does a high tech with variable vane geometry

So lets see VTEC, VVIS and VVG. Lots of "V" acroynyms there
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Old 12-17-2004, 01:30 AM
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Ok.....it said V8......which Honda has stated numerous times will never happen...

I cant say i believe this article.
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Old 12-17-2004, 09:08 AM
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if your m5 is 500 horsepower. its producing 50 horsepower per cylinder, not 100. a stock 05 tl produces 45 horsepower per cylinder. a stock 30,000 dollar evolution 8 produces 69 horsepower per cylinder!! man, i want a turbo!
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Old 12-17-2004, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by superballs
if your m5 is 500 horsepower. its producing 50 horsepower per cylinder, not 100. a stock 05 tl produces 45 horsepower per cylinder. a stock 30,000 dollar evolution 8 produces 69 horsepower per cylinder!! man, i want a turbo!
He said 100 hp per liter of displacement. HP per cylinder is not generally important.
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Old 12-17-2004, 01:12 PM
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ooo. sorry. im an idiot. but if my math is correct, a stock evolution produces 138 hp per liter of displacement.... correct me if im wrong. that would be 38% better than the mp3 thanks to the turbo
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Old 12-22-2004, 08:04 PM
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To say that turbo lag has been eliminated would be naive. All turbos that I've read about or driven (even some later model ones) have some degree of turbo lag. More often than not, the lag is very noticeable and even annoying. True, there have been some cases where it has been mostly squelched either by using very little boost and/or multiple turbochargers. However, it is almost always still there.

Another thing that turbochargers do not do is make an engine more efficient. In fact, the opposite is true in most cases. The basic idea, of course, is to force more air into the engine to allow more fuel in. This results in higher torque and thus, hp. At the same time, you're using more fuel.

Want more torque? Displacement is a better alternative in my opinion.

I won't say that squeezing 300HP or more out of a 4 banger isn't something special. I just don't want to drive it, and don't want to pay the bill when the turbos and/or engines go. I respect Honda for not relying on turbochargers to make their cars fast. That's why I hope they keep it that way. Funny how none of the typical high quality manufacturers build cars with turbos. I'm sure it's not completely coincidence that Saab, Mitsubishi, and Subaru aren't on that list...
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Old 12-22-2004, 08:49 PM
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none of the highend quality manufacturers build cars with turbos?? i know some people like to say bad things about mercedes benz, but ive found those are mostly people that cant afford them. lets look at one of my favorite cars on the planet, the cl65. 6.0 liter v12 biturbo producing 604 hp. and im willing to bet the turbo lag on that is almost nonexistant. anyway. i love the turbo/supercharger/nos/naturally aspirated debate. and you definitly have some valid points, but my point is if or when honda mass produces a turbo, i think even you will be pleasently suprised. weather you like turbos or not, dont underestimate honda development staff.
and as far as i know, mulitiple turbos do not help reduce turbo lag, they increase it. as far as ive learned, and i might be wrong, if you have mulitple turbos you need more cylinders producing more exhaust or it wont spool the turbos, causing increased lag. thats why you cant twin turbo a 4 cylinder. i think...
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Old 12-23-2004, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by missmyprelude
Funny how none of the typical high quality manufacturers build cars with turbos. I'm sure it's not completely coincidence that Saab, Mitsubishi, and Subaru aren't on that list...
Au contraire!

Turbos are usually employed in high performance applications (this excludes Lexus, Infiniti):

All Maybachs
All Bentleys
Mercedes Benz E320 CDI, S600, SL600, SL 65 AMG
BMW Diesel (europe only)
Audi A4, A6 2.7, RS6
Ferrari 288
Porsche 911 'Turbo'
Just about every diesel engine (very important in europe & think durability)

If you are thinking about Japanese 'quality brands,' recall:

Toyota Twin Turbo Supra, Celica AWD Turbo, MR2 Turbo
Nissan 300ZX Turbo, Skyline GTR, Silvia and forthcoming 350Z Turbo
Mazda RX7 Turbo, Mazdaspeed Miata and forthcoming RX 8 Turbo
Honda Formula 1 engines in McLaren race cars and forthcoming Acura NSX replacement

The reasons why turbos are not as common:

Increased Insurance
Requirement for high antiknock fuel
Turbos are outlawed in most forms of racing... except rally and drag.
High fuel requirement when on boost (4cyl engines are all about economy)
Low price (relative to world) of gas in US & US has crap diesel (high sulfur won't pass emissions)
Increased warranty costs due to more parts
High boost turbo engines are not as smooth (peaky)
Heat soak in warm climates (complaints of power loss)
Engine output exceeds Japanese limit of 280ps
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Old 12-23-2004, 03:15 PM
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some of you are obviously stuck in 80's technology. turbos of today are far superior than they used to be, meaning that with a engine built and designed for a turbo, turbo lag is almost non existant. for the one who stated that gas mileage suffers due to turbos. wrong. while under normal driving the turbo isnt spooling and isnt forcing air and more fuel in, where as where you wanted larger displacement to do the same hp, you are eating more fuel!

turbos are a great and innexpensive way to make hp. and in todays world, if honda isnt willing to design and mass produce a V8 they better start looking at other ways of getting the hp.
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Old 12-23-2004, 06:00 PM
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If I could afford a Maybach, Bentley, or 911 Turbo, I wouldn't care what powered it. If it broke, I'd toss it out and buy a new one. That being said, these are mostly (all?) twin turbos, which, like I said have done a decent job of keeping the lag down. Not to mention that even without the turbos, the engines in those cars are beasts, so there's enough power on tap even before the turbo kicks in.

Most other cars that use turbos are leaned way toward the sport end of the spectrum. Again, if I was looking for a race car, I would probably look at a turbo. Cheap speed. Who can argue with that?

Now, if I want a car that will be reliable, smooth, and affordable (among other things), I probably won't find what I need with a turbo. Yes, there are a few somewhat worthy choices out there, but the pickings are slim.
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Old 12-23-2004, 07:31 PM
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People that can afford bentlys, maybachs or porsches, did not get that way by throwing things out and wasting money. I dont agree that turbos are unrelialable. I have a few friends with turbo'd cars, a few of them are preludes, and most of them are aftermarket. Some of these people have problems with their turbos because they are aftermarket applications not built for their car. maybe, this is what your thinking of. Saab, and volvos etc, are very very relialable, and thats why people buy them.
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