Honda: Civic News
04-25-2011, 10:53 AM
#2242
The vents in Hyundai are too ergonomically too low. more for leg and neither is steering wheel nicely design. I-IMA gives better display position. They in driving experiance Civic is between Elantra and Focus. middle of the pack.
04-25-2011, 12:55 PM
#2244
My first Avatar....
Sorry...the Civic dash layout is just wacked. 
04-25-2011, 02:12 PM
#2245
The sizzle in the Steak
So much greatness and truth in there!!!!!!!!!!!
04-25-2011, 02:54 PM
#2246
Your Friendly Canadian
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto, Ontario
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Anything that's stealable is taken off before the show. Gear shifts, radio knobs, etc. I got the chance to work at Mazda's booth during a car show, and someone took the time to steal the pedals of an MS3. 
04-26-2011, 06:42 AM
#2247
Safety Car
68.7mpgs
The 2012 Honda Civic Hybrid is officially rated at 44/44/44 city/highway/combined, but the folks over at Hybrid Cars have squeezed 68.7 mpg out of their test unit.
By using some hypermiling techniques on a 10-mile course consisting of country lanes, some light highway motoring and with a handful of stoplights along the route, Hybrid Cars achieved what it calls the "upper limit" of what any 2012 Civic Hybrid driver should expect in terms of fuel economy. At an impressive 68.7 mpg, the Civic Hybrid is certainly a fuel-sipping vehicle if driven using some gas-saving techniques, but the real fuel economy tests will come when everyday Joes slot in behind the wheel and pilot Honda's hybrid sedan under more "normal" driving conditions. Until then, let's just say that the fuel economy rating of the 2012 Civic Hybrid slightly improves upon the 40/43/41 numbers sported by the 2011 model.
04-26-2011, 08:02 AM
#2248
Race Director
The 2012 Honda Civic Hybrid is officially rated at 44/44/44 city/highway/combined, but the folks over at Hybrid Cars have squeezed 68.7 mpg out of their test unit.
04-26-2011, 08:04 AM
#2249
Your Friendly Canadian
Join Date: Dec 2007
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Someone has to have done the same experiment on a Prius by now.
I'm kind of surprised there is a new Civic hybrid out. Doesn't this pretty much eliminate the reason for the Insight's existence?
I'm kind of surprised there is a new Civic hybrid out. Doesn't this pretty much eliminate the reason for the Insight's existence?
04-26-2011, 11:00 AM
#2251
The sizzle in the Steak
04-26-2011, 11:08 AM
#2252
2k to 3k insight per month is nothing to sneeze about especially it is built on downgraded Fit structure. 1.3L 8V engine with light weight structure. not enough refinement.
Prius is built is more compara ble to Avensis platform. upscale than Corrolla.
I would say this new Civic Hybrid has better handling than Prius and at most 1 to 2mpg difference in real driving which isnt much once you hit 40mpg mark.
Prius is built is more compara ble to Avensis platform. upscale than Corrolla.
I would say this new Civic Hybrid has better handling than Prius and at most 1 to 2mpg difference in real driving which isnt much once you hit 40mpg mark.
04-26-2011, 11:27 AM
#2253
The sizzle in the Steak
^^ I'm sure that makes Honda feel better about the success of the Insight.
04-26-2011, 12:58 PM
#2254
Yeah, and if it had come in at the intended price point, I think it's sales in North America would have been different. In that price range, even a small difference in price (say $1000 less) is a large amount to that buyer.
04-26-2011, 03:07 PM
#2255
No. I would never consider a Civic Hybrid since it has a trunk. To compound the "NO" for me, the rear seat doesn't fold either.
So if I wanted a Hybrid from Honda to carry four people/or carry cargo, it has to be the Insight. Too bad the Insight is so bare bones basic.
04-26-2011, 03:09 PM
#2256
Gawd I hate silver spray painted plastics in a car, and Hyundai has covered an acre of the shit in cheap silver spray paint.
04-26-2011, 06:42 PM
#2258
The sizzle in the Steak
Zing!
04-26-2011, 07:44 PM
#2259
Read the Autobild 100K road test on EuroAccord. This thing is beyond the technical capacity of German let alone Koreans.
look at long term fuel economy/ NVH and above all reliability of diesel engine.
http://www.autobild.de/artikel/honda...t-1332129.html
04-26-2011, 08:10 PM
#2260
C'mon, we all know that Acura's silver paint is superior to Hyundai's paint. Acura's paint is of high quality that is designed to last for years while Hynudai's silver paint will degrade and fail quickly, BUT the Hyundai silver painted pieces are covered by a longer warranty so the consumer won't notice. (actually it's not covered by a longer warranty since the 10/100000 thing is only powertrain, but consumers won't notice that either)
04-26-2011, 08:40 PM
#2261
Safety Car
MotorTrend
I must admit, when I 1st saw photos of the 9th-generation 2012 Civic, I was disappointed. I had been hoping for, well, more -- a more radical departure from the 8th gen, a car that, by the way, handily won our 2006 Car of the Year competition. Gen 8 earned the coveted calipers mostly because it was such -- you guessed it -- a radical departure from its predecessor. During 2006 COTY testing, I recall the Civic blowing away all the Motor Trend judges with its sleek, standout sheet metal, futuristic interior, and unbeatable value. In describing why we chose it as our COTY, we wrote: "Honda deserves a standing ovation for not playing it safe again, for crafting a compact car that's edgier and more soulful than it needs to be." For this new 2012 EX sedan, Honda deserves mildly enthusiastic seated applause.
This is not to say the new EX isn't an excellent compact sedan. It is. In fact, in just about every objective measurement, this 2012 outclasses its COTY-winning predecessor. Further, its improved dynamics and better road manners might very well elevate this EX to the top of its class, a claim we'll be verifying very soon (stay tuned!). Still, there's something missing with Gen 9. Maybe it's the exterior's perceived lack of newness, the interior's familiarity, or the engine's identical peak output. Or all 3.
According to Honda, Gen 9's body was designed to be distinctive, clean and energetic, but the end product appears too similar to that of Gen 8. The so-called "mono-form body" remains -- Honda wanted the new model to be recognizable as a Civic -- making the new car look more like a refresh than a redesign. Part of the similarity stems from the dimensions, which have stayed the same at 177.3 inches long, 69.0 inches wide, and 56.5 inches tall. Only the wheelbase, at 105.1, differs, shrinking 1.2 inches. All-new design? Yes, but this object in the mirror appears more or less the same.
![](https://image.motortrend.com/f/32735104+w750/2012-honda-civic-EX-steering-wheel.jpg"]http://image.motortrend.com/f/32735104+w750/2012-honda-civic-EX-steering-wheel.jpg)
Inside Gen 9 is a fresh take on Gen 8's twin-tier dash, which continues to house a large analog tachometer on bottom and a digital speedometer flanked by fuel and engine-temp displays up top. New for 2012 is a 5-inch intelligent media info display, or i-MID, that resides in the right corner of the upper tier. Controlled via a steering wheel-mounted keypad, i-MID shows information for audio, Bluetooth phone/audio, fuel economy, clock, and upcoming navigation turns. Our $21,255 EX tester didn't have nav ($1500) or leather ($1450), but did boast a 160-watt 6-speaker audio, USB and aux inputs, power moonroof, and keyless entry. Even better: The price for this new EX has gone up only $100 over '11 Monroneys. And, lest I forget, interior and cargo volume are up, as are rear legroom and shoulder room. What's missing? A proximity smart key, for one, which means the Civic won't unlock automatically when you approach the vehicle. There's also no pushbutton start or back-up camera. As a result, the Civic already feels a bit dated when compared to the Hyundai Elantra, which offers all 3 of the aforementioned niceties.
Under the Civic EX's hood, Honda has improved the 1.8-liter i-VTEC 4-cylinder, although you'd never know it looking at the spec sheet. That's because peak output of 140 horsepower and 128 pound-feet of torque remains the same as last year's 1.8. Honda couldn't find 20 horses or pound-feet hiding in there? Not even when Ford's new Focus hits the street with 160 horsepower and 146 pound-feet? That said, the Civic's torque curve between 2000 and 4000 rpm is now fatter, so there's more low- to mid-range muscle for motoring around town. The 5-speed automatic has been revised with a higher capacity torque converter and a reduced friction clutch, but the number of gears has not swelled. Honda says it passed on a 6-speed because it massaged the 5 to return fuel economy of 28 city/39 highway, right near the top of the econo class and notably better than last year's 25/36. Still, it's hard not to think a 6-speed could have catapulted Civic to the pinnacle of the mpg mountain, right up there with Chevy's 42-mpg-hwy Cruze Eco.
As we mentioned earlier, at the test track the new EX handily outperforms its predecessor -- in this case an EX sedan we tested back in 2008. The sprint from 0 to 60, now 8.9 seconds, drops 0.5, while the quarter mile run of 16.8 at 82.1 mph decreases by 0.3. Obviously, the powertrain modifications are paying off. That, and the new EX has lost 61 pounds. Braking, from 60-0 mph, shrinks a mere foot (126 feet versus 127) and lateral acceleration, at 0.81 g, stays status quo. Not surprising, really, as the EX's rolling stock - 205/55 tires mounted on 6.5 x 16-inch alloys - hasn't changed. A shame, really, given that other compacts in the class offer 17- and 18-inch wheels. But Honda generally tends to under-wheel/tire its vehicles -- heck, even the new Si comes standard with just 17s when 'Speed3s and Ralliarts are zipping around on 18s.
Out in the real-world test track, the Gen 9 Civic again exhibits improvements over Gen 8. Turn-in is less abrupt and dynamic transitions are softer, so when pushed aggressively, the Civic seems less jittery and more collected. Thanks to a lighter and stronger body with more high-strength steel, the 2012 Civic is smoother, quieter and more polished than its precursor, which, six years into its lifecycle, was showing its age in terms of lower ride quality and higher cabin noise. Of course, the new Civic is far from library-quiet. With the throttle pegged to the firewall, the 1.8-liter remains a loud engine - refined, sure, but nonetheless loud. But if you heed the advice of the new dash-mounted Eco Assist button, which lights the dash green when the driver conserves gas, then you'll rarely be hearing the engine wail at redline.
What's lost in the new Civic -- the old car's charming, quick turn-in and descriptive ride -- is made up for with refined road manners, more composure at the limit, improved fuel economy, and added interior room and conveniences. Yet, after spending extended time with the 2012 EX, as clearly competent as it is, it's hard not to reminisce about the previous Civic, a car that was an instant standout. That vehicle shook up the small-car segment, leaving the competition dazed and confused. Gen 9 is a superior, albeit less visually striking, effort, but in light of its predecessor, it stands out considerably less. Which is why we cannot give it a standing ovation.
2012 Honda Civic EX
BASE PRICE $20,505
PRICE AS TESTED $21,255
VEHICLE LAYOUT Front engine, FWD, 5-pass, 4-door sedan
ENGINE 1.8L/140-hp/128-lb-ft SOHC 16-valve I-4
TRANSMISSION 5-speed automatic
CURB WEIGHT (F/R DIST) 2725 lb (61/39%)
WHEELBASE 105.1 in
LENGTH x WIDTH x HEIGHT 177.3 x 69.0 x 56.5 in
0-60 MPH 8.9 sec
QUARTER MILE 16.8 sec @ 82.1 mph
BRAKING, 60-0 MPH 126 ft
LATERAL ACCELERATION 0.81 g (avg)
MT FIGURE EIGHT 28.2 sec @ 0.60 g (avg)
EPA CITY/HWY FUEL ECON 28/39 mpg
ENERGY CONSUMPTION, CITY/HWY 120/86 kW-hrs/100 miles
CO2 EMISSIONS 0.60 lb/mile
BASE PRICE $20,505
PRICE AS TESTED $21,255
VEHICLE LAYOUT Front engine, FWD, 5-pass, 4-door sedan
ENGINE 1.8L/140-hp/128-lb-ft SOHC 16-valve I-4
TRANSMISSION 5-speed automatic
CURB WEIGHT (F/R DIST) 2725 lb (61/39%)
WHEELBASE 105.1 in
LENGTH x WIDTH x HEIGHT 177.3 x 69.0 x 56.5 in
0-60 MPH 8.9 sec
QUARTER MILE 16.8 sec @ 82.1 mph
BRAKING, 60-0 MPH 126 ft
LATERAL ACCELERATION 0.81 g (avg)
MT FIGURE EIGHT 28.2 sec @ 0.60 g (avg)
EPA CITY/HWY FUEL ECON 28/39 mpg
ENERGY CONSUMPTION, CITY/HWY 120/86 kW-hrs/100 miles
CO2 EMISSIONS 0.60 lb/mile
04-27-2011, 07:41 AM
#2262
Race Director
Read the Autobild 100K road test on EuroAccord. This thing is beyond the technical capacity of German let alone Koreans.
look at long term fuel economy/ NVH and above all reliability of diesel engine.
http://www.autobild.de/artikel/honda...t-1332129.html
look at long term fuel economy/ NVH and above all reliability of diesel engine.
http://www.autobild.de/artikel/honda...t-1332129.html
There were some interesting numbers on there.
04-27-2011, 08:48 AM
#2263
i'm adding another one to my ignore list, so far he's done nothing but shit on Hyundais.
04-29-2011, 10:44 AM
#2264
Safety Car
Comparo
Any time there's a new Honda Civic, it's a big deal in the small-car market. The Civic, together with the Toyota Corolla, is 1 of longest-running nameplates in the field, and it regularly vies with the Corolla for the top spot in sales. This year, however, the new Civic is hardly the only big news in small cars. The past few months have also seen the introduction of an all-new Hyundai Elantra and an all-new Ford Focus, both vastly improved over their predecessors and both coming from companies that have been on a roll lately. It seemed natural to get the new Civic together with these upstarts to see how the freshest entries in the field compare.
The Many and the Few
The Civic is available in more different iterations than any other compact car. For the 2012 version, Honda has upped the count by 1, adding a new HF high-fuel-economy model. The Civic already offers 2 body styles, coupe and sedan. There are a total of 8 trim levels: DX, LX (the biggest seller), EX, EX-L, the sporty Si, as well as HF, Hybrid, and Natural Gas (due out this fall). For this comparison we had an EX-L sedan.
Ford's new Focus also comes in 2 body styles. The 2-door coupe available previously is gone, but there's a new 4-door hatchback to accompany the 4-door sedan. There are 4 trim levels: S, SE, SEL, and Titanium. A Focus electric is joining the lineup in late 2011. We had an SE hatchback here.
The Hyundai Elantra has the simplest lineup. The new Elantra is offered only as a 4-door sedan, in GLS or Limited trim. (The Elantra Touring, a high-roof 4-door hatchback, shares the Elantra name but is really a distinct model.) For this comparison, we had an Elantra Limited.
Who's Got the Looks
We'll wade only briefly into the subjective area of design. The new Civic reverently continues the design theme of its popular predecessor. The large cabin is visually elongated with a steeply raked windshield and backlight, while the hood and the trunk are abbreviated. The result is on single-arc profile, which has been freshened somewhat with more sculpted surfaces. Designers of the Elantra and the Focus appear to have given no thought whatsoever to maintaining a visual link to the previous models -- and rightly so, since both were dowdy and downmarket-looking. The Elantra's flowing lines may not be to everybody's taste, but they're certainly dramatic and stylish for a car in this class. The Focus bears a familial resemblance to other Ford of Europe products, with an oversize grille, raised creases along the body sides, a rising beltline, and a small greenhouse. Overall, we think the design works better on the hatchback than it does on the overly busy sedan, although in both cases it's very similar to the subcompact Fiesta.
The Civic's Familiar Surroundings
Consistency is again the name of the game for the new Civic's interior, which clearly follows the format laid down by the previous model. Under the large windshield is a very deep dashboard that, as in the last Civic, is bisected into two tiers. The upper binnacle houses a digital speedometer, flanked by readouts for fuel level and another one for fuel economy. Bracketing the speedometer are lights that glow green when the driver lets off the gas or blue when he gets on it. Set below the upper binnacle is the large, analog tachometer, which the driver sees through the small-diameter, 3-spoke steering wheel. An additional, 6.5-inch LCD screen just offset to the right within the upper binnacle is new for 2012. It can display a variety of information, which the driver can scroll through using the relatively simple buttons on the steering wheel. Readouts include audio system info, Bluetooth phone info, turn instructions from the navigation system, trip computer info, or a wallpaper photo that you upload. Our EX-L was equipped with the optional navigation system. Its large touch-screen was fairly easy to use and we had no qualms with the system's logic. But the audio and nav-system buttons that surround it are tiny, and the whole units looks like its 10 years old. The Civic's other switchgear is typical Honda: simple and of high quality. Aside from our top-spec EX-L model's leather seats, the cabin is otherwise fairly basic and unadorned. Interior space, though, is quite good -- slightly better than before despite unchanged exterior dimensions -- excepting rear-seat headroom under the sloping roof. And the comparatively generous window area makes the cabin feel large and airy.
The Cockpit-like Cabin in the Focus
The design philosophy of the Focus cabin is definitely in contrast to that of the Elantra and the Civic. The driver's environment is more enveloping and less open. Although the dash slopes away from the occupants so as not to feel oppressive, the center console area is much higher and it flows right up into the center dash. A smattering of brushed-metal trim provides some relief in the mostly black interior, whose firm but supportive seats are upholstered in a grippy cloth (although leather is available). The Focus hatchback's rear seat is easier to get into and out of than the two sedans', but there's less legroom once you're in there. It's still adult-habitable, though. Of course, the Focus hatchback offers unmatched cargo-carrying utility, even before you fold the rear seats. Unlike the other two cars here, our Focus SE was not equipped with navigation (it can be had on the SEL and Titanium only), but it did have the optional MyFord and Sync package. This is not the same as the MyFordTouch touch-screen system, which is standard on the Titanium. This somewhat simpler system has 2 small screens, one in between the speedometer and tachometer and one in the center stack; they're accessed via a multi-function controller on the steering wheel (similar to the Civic's) and cell-phone-like buttons in the center of the dash -- the latter require a bit of a learning curve.
3 Fours
All 3 compacts feature 4-cylinder engines; the Ford and Hyundai engines are new, while the Honda 4 is largely carryover. The Focus engine is the largest, at 2.0 liters, and it alone uses direct injection. Its power and torque ratings are the highest of the three at 160 hp and 146 pound-feet. The Elantra's 1.8-liter is next, at 148 hp and 131 pound-feet of torque. Both engines are more powerful than their predecessors. The Civic's 4-cylinder, also 1.8 liters, is a modified version of the previous Civic engine, but its horesepower and torque figures are unchanged from before, at 140 hp and 128 pound-feet. The drivability characteristics of all 3 were remarkably similar, perhaps because they all make their peak torque within the relatively narrow range of 4300 and 4700 rpm. Their relative differences in horsepower were blunted by the cars' differences in curb weight, where we find the Civic to be the lightest, the Focus the heaviest and the Elantra in between. The uptake is that none of these cars is a sparkling performer off the line, but all 3 have sufficient gusto for passing and highway merging.
Mileage Matters
The Hyundai was the only car here with a 6-speed transmission -- in fact, whether ordered with a manual or an automatic, all Elantras have 6 forward gears. That probably helped the put the Hyundai out in front in the fuel-economy race, with EPA ratings of 29 mpg city and that suddenly all-important 40-mpg highway number. With the Civic, you get only 5 forward gears whether you choose a manual or an automatic like we had here (only the Si gets a 6-speed manual). Still, the Civic is only a tick behind the Elantra in both city and highway measures, at 28/39 mpg. Our Focus had a 5-speed stick, but the Ford's automatic is a 6-speed. Not surprisingly, the manual-transmission Focus is the less economical variant, rated at 26/36 mpg. Both Ford and Honda can advertise higher numbers: 40 mpg highway in the case of the Focus, and 41 mpg on the part of the Civic. But in both cases, those figures are only for special, high-mileage variants: the Focus SE with the SFE package, and Honda's Civic HF model, whereas all Elantras achieve the same EPA rating.
On the road
Ford has been making strides in the dynamic behavior of its small cars -- witness the Fiesta -- and that's clearly evident with the new Focus. The Focus felt particularly buttoned-down, and it had easily the best steering. The Honda proved to be a bit more eager to turn in than the Hyundai, exhibiting less understeer. It also rode notably better. We were less pleased, however, with the Civic's steering, which was rather vague on center. As impressive as the Hyundai was otherwise, it was somewhat disappointing dynamically. Its brakes were grabby and the suspension didn't do much to mask bad pavement. The Elantra's handling, though, was pretty good and its steering, while light, was not totally dead.
Conclusions
The Elantra is an impressive effort and boasts a long list of superlatives. It gets the best gas mileage, has the largest interior and trunk, and the best electronics interface. Less surprising but no less important is the fact that it has the most equipment at the lowest price. The Elantra is a good $2000 cheaper than the Civic, and would offer similar savings over a comparably equipped Focus. For many people, that wraps it up right there. To choose the Civic over the Elantra, 1 would have to place a greater weight on more subjective qualities. The Honda cabin feels more airy and comfortable and is easier to see out of. We found that the Civic also rides better. Its power deficit isn't really an issue because it's the lightest car here, and its fuel economy is close enough to the Hyundai's that it would hardly make a difference in real life. The Civic has the composure of a bigger car, but the ease of use of a small one. The Focus was a bit of an outlier in this test because of the way it was equipped. We had lined up a more directly compatible version (a sedan with an automatic transmission) but it was damaged at the last minute and this sporty SE hatchback stepped in. Despite its lower spec, the Focus was our favorite car to drive, with its nicely weighted steering, natural clutch action, and responsive handling. True, the Focus was the least economical, but we enjoyed rowing its manual gearbox. The hatchback body style is a versatile configuration that neither competitor offers. The Focus cabin wasn't as stylish as the Elantra's but neither was it quite as pedestrian as the Honda's, although it is more intimate than both. In any event, the Focus was the best driver's car, and while they may not be the most important factor for most small-car shoppers, it's where our prejudice lies, so the Focus is our pick.
2012 Ford Focus SE hatchback
Base price: $18,785
Price as tested: $21,945
Standard equipment: 2.0-liter 4-cylinder engine, 5-speed manual transmission, air-conditioning, power windows, 16-inch steel wheels with wheel covers, tilt/telescoping steering column, automatic headlamps, fog lights
Options on this vehicle: Rapid Spec 203A (convenience package, cruise control, perimeter alarm, MyFord & Sync package, MyFord Tech/6-speaker stereo/Sirius satellite radio, Snyc voice-activated system); SE Sport Package (16" painted aluminum wheels, piano black grille, rear disc brakes, rear spoiler, cloth sport seats, metallic interior trim, leather-wrapped steering wheel and shift knob); Winter Package (heated seats, power/heated mirrors, turn signal mirrors)
Key options not on vehicle: automatic transmission, power moonroof, SFE super fuel economy package, leather seats
Fuel economy:
26/36/30 mpg (city/highway/combined)
Engine:
2.0L I-4
Horsepower: 160 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 146 lb-ft @ 4450 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
5-speed manual
Curb weight: 2920 lb
Wheels/tires:
215/50R17 Continental ContiProContact
2012 Honda Civic EX-L with Navi and XM radio
Base price: $24,205
Price as tested: $24,205
Standard equipment: 1.8-liter 4-cylinder engine, 5-speed automatic transmission, air-conditioning, 16-inch alloy wheels, power windows, power door locks, cruise control, leather-wrapped steering wheel, tilt/telescoping steering column, power moonroof, leather-trimmed interior, heated seats, Bluetooth, Navigation, satellite radio
Options on this vehicle: None
Key options not on vehicle: None
Fuel economy:
28/39/32 mpg (city/highway/combined)
Engine:
1.8L I-4
Horsepower: 140 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 128 lb-ft @ 4300 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
6-speed automatic
Curb weight: 2773 lb
Wheels/tires:
205/55R16 Continental ContiProContact
2011 Hyundai Elantra Limited
Base price: $19,980
Price as tested: $22,110
Standard equipment: 1.8-liter 4-cylinder engine, 6-speed automatic transmission, four-wheel disc brakes, air-conditioning, power windows, power locks, power mirrors, power sunroof, 17-inch alloy wheels, fog lights, satellite radio, tilt/telescoping steering column, Bluetooth, leather seating surfaces, heated front and rear seats
Options on this vehicle: Premium Package (navigation, rearview camera, premium audio system, automatic headlights, proximity key entry with pushbutton start); carpeted floor mats; iPod cable
Key options not on vehicle: None
Fuel economy:
29/40/33 mpg (city/highway/combined)
1.8L I-4
Horsepower: 148 hp @ 6300 rpm
Torque: 131 lb-ft @ 4700 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
6-speed automatic
Curb weight: 2877 lb
Wheels/tires:
215/45R17 Continental ContiProContact
Base price: $18,785
Price as tested: $21,945
Standard equipment: 2.0-liter 4-cylinder engine, 5-speed manual transmission, air-conditioning, power windows, 16-inch steel wheels with wheel covers, tilt/telescoping steering column, automatic headlamps, fog lights
Options on this vehicle: Rapid Spec 203A (convenience package, cruise control, perimeter alarm, MyFord & Sync package, MyFord Tech/6-speaker stereo/Sirius satellite radio, Snyc voice-activated system); SE Sport Package (16" painted aluminum wheels, piano black grille, rear disc brakes, rear spoiler, cloth sport seats, metallic interior trim, leather-wrapped steering wheel and shift knob); Winter Package (heated seats, power/heated mirrors, turn signal mirrors)
Key options not on vehicle: automatic transmission, power moonroof, SFE super fuel economy package, leather seats
Fuel economy:
26/36/30 mpg (city/highway/combined)
Engine:
2.0L I-4
Horsepower: 160 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 146 lb-ft @ 4450 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
5-speed manual
Curb weight: 2920 lb
Wheels/tires:
215/50R17 Continental ContiProContact
2012 Honda Civic EX-L with Navi and XM radio
Base price: $24,205
Price as tested: $24,205
Standard equipment: 1.8-liter 4-cylinder engine, 5-speed automatic transmission, air-conditioning, 16-inch alloy wheels, power windows, power door locks, cruise control, leather-wrapped steering wheel, tilt/telescoping steering column, power moonroof, leather-trimmed interior, heated seats, Bluetooth, Navigation, satellite radio
Options on this vehicle: None
Key options not on vehicle: None
Fuel economy:
28/39/32 mpg (city/highway/combined)
Engine:
1.8L I-4
Horsepower: 140 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 128 lb-ft @ 4300 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
6-speed automatic
Curb weight: 2773 lb
Wheels/tires:
205/55R16 Continental ContiProContact
2011 Hyundai Elantra Limited
Base price: $19,980
Price as tested: $22,110
Standard equipment: 1.8-liter 4-cylinder engine, 6-speed automatic transmission, four-wheel disc brakes, air-conditioning, power windows, power locks, power mirrors, power sunroof, 17-inch alloy wheels, fog lights, satellite radio, tilt/telescoping steering column, Bluetooth, leather seating surfaces, heated front and rear seats
Options on this vehicle: Premium Package (navigation, rearview camera, premium audio system, automatic headlights, proximity key entry with pushbutton start); carpeted floor mats; iPod cable
Key options not on vehicle: None
Fuel economy:
29/40/33 mpg (city/highway/combined)
1.8L I-4
Horsepower: 148 hp @ 6300 rpm
Torque: 131 lb-ft @ 4700 rpm
Drive:
Front-wheel
Transmission:
6-speed automatic
Curb weight: 2877 lb
Wheels/tires:
215/45R17 Continental ContiProContact
04-29-2011, 02:09 PM
#2265
In the first pic in that article, the shadows really give the Civics flanks a 'coke bottle' effect. I need to see one of these in person soon.
04-29-2011, 06:59 PM
#2266
The Focus definitely has the coke bottle look going.... but those tail lights are freakin huge. Not offering a 6-speed manual is a head scratcher as well.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
04-29-2011, 07:28 PM
#2267
The Focus looks just as incredible in person as it does in photos. You can tell Ford wants a piece of the market. I was very impressed by the overall Ford display at the NY Auto show.
The Civic's interior is really just OK. it's definitely not bad, but it looks & feels low rent, which is not something I normally associate with Hondas. what the pics don't show is that that grayish plastic dash right behind the steering wheel has sparkles in it. I'm not exactly sure what that's about, but it's different. they need to go back to textured plastics seen on older Hondas. they haven't quite reached the lowest low yet - certain older GM models still hold that distinction (Cobalt for example).
The Elantra's interior is better detailed with different textured plastics and different materials throughout - but it does come off as busy, seeming to try too hard, whereas the Civic is, like Edmunds said, resting on its laurels. But the materials are better than the Civic's.
The Civic's interior is really just OK. it's definitely not bad, but it looks & feels low rent, which is not something I normally associate with Hondas. what the pics don't show is that that grayish plastic dash right behind the steering wheel has sparkles in it. I'm not exactly sure what that's about, but it's different. they need to go back to textured plastics seen on older Hondas. they haven't quite reached the lowest low yet - certain older GM models still hold that distinction (Cobalt for example).
The Elantra's interior is better detailed with different textured plastics and different materials throughout - but it does come off as busy, seeming to try too hard, whereas the Civic is, like Edmunds said, resting on its laurels. But the materials are better than the Civic's.
04-29-2011, 10:14 PM
#2268
The Focus definitely has the coke bottle look going.... but those tail lights are freakin huge. Not offering a 6-speed manual is a head scratcher as well.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
You can can have Civis SI for $24K or Accord Coupe for $29K.
Civic Interior is very functional and not too complicated.
04-30-2011, 07:31 AM
#2269
Safety Car
68.7
The king of compact cars has another impressive jewel in its crown, as editors at website Hybrid Cars managed to juice 68.7 MPG out of the 2012 Honda Civic Hybrid on a 10-mile test course. The car's fuel economy is officially rated at 44/44/44 city/highway/combined miles-per-gallon. So what funky feat of driving allowed this amped up gas mileage?
It all comes down to the logic that how you drive your car affects your fuel economy as much as what you drive. The name of this game is hypermiling, and it can give your car some extra bang for your buck as gas prices creep up to $5.00 a gallon.
Hypermiling, of course, has risen in popularity as a response to the escalating gas costs that tormented the 2000s -- with the current national average teetering around 4 bucks, while parts of the country are closer to $5.00. Hypermiling was so often referred to back in 2008 when gas prices went above $4.00 a gallon that the New Oxford American dictionary officially selected "hypermiling" -- coined in 2004 by Wayne Gerdes -- as the 2008 "Word of the Year."
To hypermile: is to attempt to maximize gas mileage by making fuel-conserving adjustments to one's car and one's driving techniques. Rather than aiming for good mileage or even great mileage, hypermilers seek to push their gas tanks to the limit and achieve hyprmileage, exceeding EPA ratings for a vehicle's miles-per-gallon.
Though the Civic's fuel economy trails that of the Toyota Prius, which gets 50 mpg combined in city and highway driving, it is nonetheless a great case study for exploring the payoff of hypermiling, as well as a way to satisfy a consumer's "greener-than-thou" needs. This new ad for the Civic Hybrid featuring "Jack the woodsman" shows how the image of the hybrid driver lends itself to a few laughs.
Sure, the earth-friendly Eco Assist feature is enough to make one's beard coo with baby birds who have taken up residence. But added to that, the vehicle, which starts at $24,050 and is available at dealerships this month, features a tauter body and more aerodynamic honeycomb grill, a raked windshield, 5-spoke alloy wheels, and a high-performing 1.5 liter, 8-valve, SOHC i-VTEC engine to complement the hybrid features. In short, the styling is an improvement over the sensible-shoe profile of the old one.
Yet even in light of these mechanical tune-ups, even more power may be in the drivers' hands and foot than many drivers understand, especially when trying to eek out 68.7 MPG. Drivers can save a bit on tank gravy based on how they negotiate the machine on the road.
Some techniques of hypermiling involve minor adjustments to driving ergonomics, while others are downright controversial. So how did the Hybrid Car manage the impressive 68.7 MPG figure?
A few no-brainers can help drivers understand how to squeeze out as much mileage as possible from gas.
Resist the need for speed
Speeding wastes gas, and the more you put the pedal to the metal, the less efficient your fuel usage becomes. By the same logic, using cruise control to prevent speed augmentation and shifting to neutral and coasting can take some of the brunt off your gas pedal. The folks over at Hybrid Cars found that accelerating at a steady rate to 45 mph and maintaining that pace as much as possible translated to a top MPG figure in a contest among journalists.
Reduce obstacles and load
Cutting down on friction and the burden on your vehicle can also up the ante. In short, the Robert Frost road-less-traveled-by rationale proves ill-advised here; though the bucolic country road may offer the delight of a nice vista, its bumps, curves, and numerous stops reduce fuel economy. By contrast, a route with a level road and fewer traffic lights and stop signs can, even if longer, be more efficient on your gas tank. By extension, any extra weight you have on your car--the ol' bike or kayak, say--will obviously decrease your fuel economy as you lug around the equipment. And for Pete's sake, take the 40-pound bags of water-softener salt you bought at Home Depot last weekend out of your trunk! Are you carrying a spare tire and jack? If you have never changed a tire in your life, and instead carry around a AAA card and a cellphone to get bailed out of a flat, you might opt out of carrying that extra weight.
Be a rebel
For the transgressive out there, there's a surefire, if risky, way to gain some MPG. Tailgating larger vehicles to save fuel by drafting (i.e. increasing the aerodynamic flow) proves a perennial favorite for hardcore hypermilers. It's your own one-man driving insurrection--all under the auspices of a semi. Another efficient but rule-breaking phenomenon comes in coasting instead of breaking at stop lights and traffic lights.
A few pitfalls to avoid: coasting down hills in neutral, driving too slowly, dangerously tailgating larger vehicles for drafting, recklessly breezing through stop signs, over-inflating tires, and driving with 2 left wheels on white highway strip to reduce friction. That stuff is only for those asking for trouble. We do not recommend it.
Of course, there's been no shortage of fanfare surrounding the 1-up-manship game, as fuel efficiency die-hards have created contests battling for top honors. At the 2008 World Fuel Economy Championship, for example, the Honda Insight, Toyota Prius and the Ford Escape Hybrid all achieved fuel economy world records -- with the Insight turning in an imagination challenging 213 MPG, albeit while rolling through all stop signs and having the tires inflated beyond normal.
Though the new capabilities of fuel economy in cars are impressive, penny pinching drivers or environmental enthusiasts can still milk their cars for more through the advantages afforded them in hypermiling "lite." The only question remains, how much they're willing to risk to save a quick buck.
04-30-2011, 05:32 PM
#2270
Senior Moderator
Had a good look at the Civic Sedan today at a gas station. Still covered in shipping plastic so it must have been on a test drive. Looks ok save for the rear end. Just way too soft and ordinary IMO. Would have been nice to see the 12's front end mated to the rear end of the 8th gen which I always liked.
04-30-2011, 08:58 PM
#2271
Blegh. For some reason I was never a huge fan of the 8G Civic sedan's styling. Technically, the current Malibu came after it but I dislike both cars' rear ends for similar reasons.
REALLY though, if this was badged with the Toyota emblem and the Corolla nameplate to begin with, it wouldn't be a surprise at all. It's like a mix of the previous gen Camry and the current gen Corolla rear. I will still reserve judgment until I see it in person, but I'm not holding my breath.
In this segment I would consider the Civic and Corolla but I'm not sold on either of them. Then again, brands and reputations are kinda hollow for me.
REALLY though, if this was badged with the Toyota emblem and the Corolla nameplate to begin with, it wouldn't be a surprise at all. It's like a mix of the previous gen Camry and the current gen Corolla rear. I will still reserve judgment until I see it in person, but I'm not holding my breath.
In this segment I would consider the Civic and Corolla but I'm not sold on either of them. Then again, brands and reputations are kinda hollow for me.
04-30-2011, 10:37 PM
#2272
Another efficient but rule-breaking phenomenon comes in coasting instead of breaking at stop lights and traffic lights.
braking.
05-01-2011, 10:45 AM
#2273
You'll Never Walk Alone
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The Focus definitely has the coke bottle look going.... but those tail lights are freakin huge. Not offering a 6-speed manual is a head scratcher as well.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
Judging from recent reviews of the Focus/Civic and Fusion/Accord it's starting to sound more and more like Ford is beginning to unseat Honda's position as a "poor man's BMW" as far as fun-to-drive is concerned. The same will go for the interiors if Ford continues to improve and Honda continues to slide.
The styling of the Focus is great. However, there's a compromise - cabin space. Rear legroom and rear headroom are not that good.
The cellphone-inspired centre console might look fresh and innovative. However, IMO, the design is from Nokia and not something more...modern (like iphone?). So to me, the design is outdated and weird.
The titanium x trim might get higher quality plastics, but on cheaper models, low-rent plastics can be found.
05-01-2011, 03:51 PM
#2274
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
what a ghey commercial
05-03-2011, 07:43 PM
#2275
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
I saw a new sedan last Wednesday at the dealer. They had quite a few of them. I was less then impressed. I didnt like the 8th gen sedan at all, and I feel as though the 9th gen is uglier.
05-03-2011, 10:12 PM
#2276
Well, the 1st gen Focus was one of the best driver's car in this segment. The 2nd gen was disappointing though. The 3rd gen tries to become a great driver's car again. To a certain extent, it is a great driver's car. However, if you have driven the 1st gen Focus, then this new one will be disappointing. Nonetheless, in North America, this new Focus is pretty much the best in class already in terms of driving fun/handling.
The styling of the Focus is great. However, there's a compromise - cabin space. Rear legroom and rear headroom are not that good.
The cellphone-inspired centre console might look fresh and innovative. However, IMO, the design is from Nokia and not something more...modern (like iphone?). So to me, the design is outdated and weird.
The titanium x trim might get higher quality plastics, but on cheaper models, low-rent plastics can be found.
The styling of the Focus is great. However, there's a compromise - cabin space. Rear legroom and rear headroom are not that good.
The cellphone-inspired centre console might look fresh and innovative. However, IMO, the design is from Nokia and not something more...modern (like iphone?). So to me, the design is outdated and weird.
The titanium x trim might get higher quality plastics, but on cheaper models, low-rent plastics can be found.
Continually stricter safety regulations will ultimately lead to heavier, and thus less agile cars. I'm not surprised. Haven't driven the 2G Focus nor have I cared to though... it's one of the most boring, uninspired cars out there.
As far as the 2012 Focus interior goes, I think the Civic is outclassed in terms of interior quality and styling (subjective of course). The Civic definitely impresses with its ability to get 40 mpg in standard trim with a 5-speed auto..... but see for yourself, these are the highest resolution photos I could find
Focus Titanium
http://www.phillyautoshow.com/wp-con...s-interior.jpg
Civic EX-L
http://www.gotbroken.com/wp-content/...or-Picture.jpg
very high resolution, so I just linked them. The Titanium may have higher trim plastics, but the non-navi Civic looks terrible IMO:
http://www.arabamoto.com/var/albums/...c_interior.jpg
The base Focus (S) isn't much better, but IMO it's definitely better. I definitely see the Nokia influence though
http://hopsandgears.com/wp-content/u...s_Interior.jpg
05-03-2011, 10:33 PM
#2277
Your Friendly Canadian
Join Date: Dec 2007
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Costco: The ass looks just as Camry-like in person, trust me. Even mistaked a real Camry for a new Civic the other day.
It's hard comparing a car to it's older version, better to compare it to its competitors of the time. I think the 2006 Si was a great car compared to its competitors. Only car that' as good in that class was the GTI back then IMO.
It's hard comparing a car to it's older version, better to compare it to its competitors of the time. I think the 2006 Si was a great car compared to its competitors. Only car that' as good in that class was the GTI back then IMO.
05-04-2011, 02:15 AM
#2279
Costco: The ass looks just as Camry-like in person, trust me. Even mistaked a real Camry for a new Civic the other day.
It's hard comparing a car to it's older version, better to compare it to its competitors of the time. I think the 2006 Si was a great car compared to its competitors. Only car that' as good in that class was the GTI back then IMO.
It's hard comparing a car to it's older version, better to compare it to its competitors of the time. I think the 2006 Si was a great car compared to its competitors. Only car that' as good in that class was the GTI back then IMO.
the low-end torque of the GTI is just great. It gives the illusion, until the upper RPM band at least, that its just as quick as the STI or the Evo X despite being nowhere near as powerful.
05-04-2011, 02:26 AM
#2280
The Focus interior rips the Civic interior's head off with its bare hands and shits down its neck, then pisses on its corpse. Then the Focus interior sets that ugly heap on fire and lights up a cigar with the ashes.
I don't give a crap about how aerodynamic the Civic's buttons are or how well its towhook is designed, and I don't think anyone else does either.