GM May Make More Cuts, Shed Brands
07-09-2008, 08:53 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by agranado
So long hummer, saab, gmc... hopefully they hold on to buick and offer two or three cars... vnvicta, enclave, and a gn+? 
07-09-2008, 09:38 PM
#42
Saab is a dead man walking and has been for years. No one will buy it IMO. Hummer is toast. Nuff said. Pontiac and Buick are redundant with Chevy around. Saturn is a good brand but as someone already said, they have next to no advertising.
I still really dislike GM for the way they treated me with my lemon tahoe so I'm not all choked up by this. In the end, this will all be good for the consumer though. Their lineup will consist of cars people really want or they will go away only to have their market share taken over by another brand.
I still really dislike GM for the way they treated me with my lemon tahoe so I'm not all choked up by this. In the end, this will all be good for the consumer though. Their lineup will consist of cars people really want or they will go away only to have their market share taken over by another brand.
07-10-2008, 12:49 AM
#43
Originally Posted by msl82
Its obvious to me that your pretty ignorant how car industry works. Since you wanted, lets do Pontiac VS Hyundai.
Maybe for you Hyundai cars are crap, but to mass middle income people (Which matters the most!!), Hyundai is coming out with more apealing vehicles that sells well, and Hyundai is making tons of net profit and revenue. Why don't you compare the stock prices of GM and Hyundai, which is very good indicator of company financial status. Ever hear about Hyundai Elantra, Sonata, Santa Fe and Tiburon? There is no Pontiac car that outsells Hyundai Sonata and Elantra right now.
And I am not even talking about international market. In South America, Russia, SouthEast Asia, China, small sized Hyundai cars are selling very well, and making huge profits. Do you think Pontiac can sell like this internationaly? no way. Hyundai's future strategy and decision making is clearly better.
And about your friend who was die-hard Toyota fan and now converted G8 worshiper, Good for him. However, come back to me when he actually buys the car. The company makes money from actually selling the car, not just from getting attention and no close-deals.
Hyundai Lineup.
1) Accent
2) Elantra
3) Sonata
3) Tiburon
4) Santa Fe
5) Genesis
6) Genesis Coupe
Pontiac Lineup:
1) Vibe <----- LOL
2) Grand Prix <------- LOL
3) Soltice
4) G5
5) G6
6) G8
7) Torrent <----- LOL
And the best of all, Isn't Pontiac the company that made AZTEC? I think it won the award of most ugliest car of the century? LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Maybe for you Hyundai cars are crap, but to mass middle income people (Which matters the most!!), Hyundai is coming out with more apealing vehicles that sells well, and Hyundai is making tons of net profit and revenue. Why don't you compare the stock prices of GM and Hyundai, which is very good indicator of company financial status. Ever hear about Hyundai Elantra, Sonata, Santa Fe and Tiburon? There is no Pontiac car that outsells Hyundai Sonata and Elantra right now.
And I am not even talking about international market. In South America, Russia, SouthEast Asia, China, small sized Hyundai cars are selling very well, and making huge profits. Do you think Pontiac can sell like this internationaly? no way. Hyundai's future strategy and decision making is clearly better.
And about your friend who was die-hard Toyota fan and now converted G8 worshiper, Good for him. However, come back to me when he actually buys the car. The company makes money from actually selling the car, not just from getting attention and no close-deals.
Hyundai Lineup.
1) Accent
2) Elantra
3) Sonata
3) Tiburon
4) Santa Fe
5) Genesis
6) Genesis Coupe
Pontiac Lineup:
1) Vibe <----- LOL
2) Grand Prix <------- LOL
3) Soltice
4) G5
5) G6
6) G8
7) Torrent <----- LOL
And the best of all, Isn't Pontiac the company that made AZTEC? I think it won the award of most ugliest car of the century? LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You forgot about the Hyundai Tucson too. Yeah, lots of people really want a Tucson! It gets so much attention, that you (of all people) forgot that it even existed in the Hyundai lineup
You're just a fine example of a sad Hyundai fanboy who tries to convince everyone that Hyundai is the best ever.... when in fact people are hardly showing interest in their lineup, and the only 2 cars that are getting attention are the Genesis and Genesis coupe. No one gives a damn about what the next gen Elantra is going to have, what the next Sonata is going to look like, or what changes they're going to make to the Tiburon.
Hey, remember this thread? https://acurazine.com/forums/car-talk-5/whats-badge-worth-392576/
Scroll to the middle/bottom.... that should jog your memory. Keep telling yourself that people want a Hyundai if it makes you feel better.
I almost feel sorry for you.https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...0&postcount=11
^that one makes me laugh the most, did you SERIOUSLY think anyone gave a crap about that video? I didn't even watch it! What a clown.... do you seriously think everyone is going to go out and buy a Hyundai, when they actually don't even care? The only person here that ever agrees with you in Manual Transmission. And he bought an IS350, even though Hyundais are the best cars ever....
07-10-2008, 08:13 AM
#44
Senior Moderator
Hyundai has been coming along with some fairly decent products over the past few years, with value that is hard to beat. However, it still does not have anywhere the same draw as Honda, Toyota or Nissan and is more of a default brand. If Honda, Toyota and Nissan were priced to match Hyundai (while maintaining their normal quality levels), Hyundai would not last much longer here in the states.
That said (and MODERATOR'S NOTE), let's get this back on topic.
That said (and MODERATOR'S NOTE), let's get this back on topic.
07-11-2008, 09:39 PM
#45
GM needs two brand, like most of the car brands out there.
having too many brands and too many option is difficult to control and management.
look at toyota/lexus honda/acura nissan/inifiniti etc..
these guys have good line up because they dont have to mess with 5 or 6 brands and putting their designer to work.
having too many brands and too many option is difficult to control and management.
look at toyota/lexus honda/acura nissan/inifiniti etc..
these guys have good line up because they dont have to mess with 5 or 6 brands and putting their designer to work.
07-12-2008, 09:33 AM
#46
Mr. Wagoner also denounced reports that the company was considering the elimination of any of its brands beyond Hummer, which G.M. has said could be sold.
“I think we’ve been pretty clear on this for a while — we don’t have any plans to eliminate any more brands,” he said.
The review of Hummer resulted from a “dramatic change” in the sales rate of low-mileage, full-size sport utility vehicles, Mr. Wagoner said.
But that decision should not be interpreted, he said, to mean G.M. wants to shed other brands like Saturn or Pontiac.
“Our focus on all of our brands is what we can do to make them more profitable, to take advantage of the products we have and, in some cases, how we want to evolve the product portfolio into this current world,” he said.
Mr. Wagoner said the rampant speculation about bankruptcy or the sale of brands has distressed G.M.’s dealers at a time when sales are already difficult.
“I was with dealers last night, and I think it’s fair to say that this kind of news isn’t helpful,” he said.
“I think we’ve been pretty clear on this for a while — we don’t have any plans to eliminate any more brands,” he said.
The review of Hummer resulted from a “dramatic change” in the sales rate of low-mileage, full-size sport utility vehicles, Mr. Wagoner said.
But that decision should not be interpreted, he said, to mean G.M. wants to shed other brands like Saturn or Pontiac.
“Our focus on all of our brands is what we can do to make them more profitable, to take advantage of the products we have and, in some cases, how we want to evolve the product portfolio into this current world,” he said.
Mr. Wagoner said the rampant speculation about bankruptcy or the sale of brands has distressed G.M.’s dealers at a time when sales are already difficult.
“I was with dealers last night, and I think it’s fair to say that this kind of news isn’t helpful,” he said.
07-12-2008, 12:22 PM
#47
Administrator Alumnus
Get rid of ALL the brand names, and go with General Motors period. 'nuff said.
I remember when I was a kid and I asked my Dad why GM had 10 different car manufacturers competing against one another along with Ford and Chrysler, etc... 20+ years later, I still don't get it.
IMO, if GM wants to survive they need to do some serious rebranding. And I think it may start by doing some bigtime consolidation.
I remember when I was a kid and I asked my Dad why GM had 10 different car manufacturers competing against one another along with Ford and Chrysler, etc... 20+ years later, I still don't get it.
IMO, if GM wants to survive they need to do some serious rebranding. And I think it may start by doing some bigtime consolidation.
07-13-2008, 07:53 PM
#48
I feel the need...
Originally Posted by Scrib
IMO, if GM wants to survive they need to do some serious rebranding. And I think it may start by doing some bigtime consolidation.
Hmm, let's learn from the most profitable OEM's in teh biz....
Toyota/Lexus (scion)
Nissan/Infiniti
Honda/Acura
Is there a trend in here somewhere?
07-13-2008, 07:59 PM
#49
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Originally Posted by Fibonacci
Hmm, let's learn from the most profitable OEM's in teh biz....
Toyota/Lexus/Scion/4% Subaru
Nissan/Infiniti/Renault
Honda/Acura
:
07-13-2008, 08:03 PM
#51
GM can’t just stop building Saturns and Saabs and walk away with a half-hearted apology to the brand’s few remaining loyalists. State franchise laws make it nearly impossible to close a franchise without dealers suing—and usually winning—millions for their bad investment. Remember, GM announced the sale of Oldsmobile in 2000 and it eventually cost about $2 billion. When GM is looking for ways to raise cash and survive this economic slump, bribing a bunch of Saturn, Saab and Pontiac dealers with a few billion bob just isn’t in the budget. Somehow over many decades, GM has managed to get itself in business deals that prevent it from laying off workers, cutting benefits or disposing of brands without paying someone to go away.
Instead, expect incrementalism. GM will end up feeding the strong brands, like Chevy, Cadillac and Buick (it’s liked in China) and cutting back new-car programs for the weak ones. Meanwhile, GM is getting dealers lumped together into one channel. Many Pontiac, Buick and GMC stores are now together under one roof and owned by the same dealer. Eventually, when all of those dealers are grouped together into one store, GM could cut brands. The dealers will be reluctant to sue if they have still have one of the remaining brands to sell. Plus, the dealers will probably get better models and more marketing support for the brand they keep.
Instead, expect incrementalism. GM will end up feeding the strong brands, like Chevy, Cadillac and Buick (it’s liked in China) and cutting back new-car programs for the weak ones. Meanwhile, GM is getting dealers lumped together into one channel. Many Pontiac, Buick and GMC stores are now together under one roof and owned by the same dealer. Eventually, when all of those dealers are grouped together into one store, GM could cut brands. The dealers will be reluctant to sue if they have still have one of the remaining brands to sell. Plus, the dealers will probably get better models and more marketing support for the brand they keep.
07-13-2008, 09:18 PM
#53
intelligentsia
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Originally Posted by titan
Don't forget Saturn. They're not doing so great either, but thing can definitely turn around for Saturn. ... I can see hummer getting sold. GMC lying dormant for many years, perhaps forever. Saab can be salvaged, I think. Their new product begins rolling out in 2010. A new, true 9-5, followed by proper 9-3 and 9-1 cars will help the brand a lot; not to mention the new 9-4x. It'll boost sales both hear and in Europe. Buick is the easiest to totally revive. It's the oldest brand GM has, and the history is rich. Also, unlike Olds, whose name actually conjured images of "old" instead of "fresh," "new," or "hip," Buick's brand isn't objectionable, as evidenced by the Enclave's sales numbers. Obviously, consumers had a problem with the product, not the brand. With the proper identity and product, the brand is sure to thrive. GM's brand positioning of Buick as a "value luxury" brand, offering a lot for the dollar, seems to work. An entry crossover, under the Enclave; the Invicta, and a Zeta RWD Flagship, along with a two door halo (Regal concept, anyone), is all Buick needs to survive. In a perfect world, I'd give Buick three sedans, but it only needs two. Keeping the Super trim level isn't a bad idea either.
07-13-2008, 09:26 PM
#54
Originally Posted by SRK85
Saab has the ability to be a great brand. I think GM is keeping them back, I love everything about the 9-3 except for the awful interior. Maybe if the 9-3 had a lucrene type interior it would sell better. Buick is pretty good however why the hell did the Chinese have super for so long, yet it was just released in America?
GM has been making poor decisions for a while, and they are just now figuring it out.
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