Chevrolet: Volt news **Production Cut (page 8)**

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Old 08-13-2009, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JD23
From what I've read, the cost of the electricity to power the car would be equivalent to less than $1 per gallon on average, so it would save money on fuel costs. The bigger issue is the high upfront cost of the car. It will probably take many, many years for the average driver to recoup the initial cost.
That's why the majority of the vehicles will be leased.
Old 08-13-2009, 01:59 PM
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They will be expensive for a couple years, or at least until the other makers can put out a product that boasts similar performance. (The Volt is clearly a step beyond the Prius and similar...) Naturally GM is anxious to recoup development costs, and make a profit selling a hot product (that isn't a Corvette), so it should not be suprising the car comes with a premium pricetag.

It think they will sell very well. It's a nice looking car.
Old 08-13-2009, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
That's why the majority of the vehicles will be leased.
I agree with you. Only reason I brought up the 40k price tag is because its the number most people wrap their heads around when considering buying or leasing a car (plus its the number being thrown out there).
Old 08-13-2009, 02:12 PM
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Even at 40K GM has said they'll lose money on the Volt for some time. They obviously feel they'll recoup it in other areas.
Old 08-13-2009, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by dom
Even at 40K GM has said they'll lose money on the Volt for some time. They obviously feel they'll recoup it in other areas.
It's a long term deal....the tech should trickle down to other GM product over time.
Old 08-13-2009, 02:37 PM
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And the possible halo effect. To some, suddenly that Cruze is looking more fuel efficient than a Civic or Corolla.
Old 08-13-2009, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Brandon24pdx
They will be expensive for a couple years, or at least until the other makers can put out a product that boasts similar performance. (The Volt is clearly a step beyond the Prius and similar...) Naturally GM is anxious to recoup development costs, and make a profit selling a hot product (that isn't a Corvette), so it should not be suprising the car comes with a premium pricetag.

It think they will sell very well. It's a nice looking car.
Bob Lutz said GM will still lose money on the Volt at $40K. The primary purpose is it to be the 1st leap product to work out the operations/vendors/engineering. If all goes well transfer the technology to other GM platforms similar as what Toyota did with their hybrid approach.

It's definitely a big step for GM to go beyond the Prius, interesting to see how well GM executes the electric drivetrain in terms of performance and realibility.
Old 08-13-2009, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Brandon24pdx
It think they will sell very well. It's a nice looking car.
, the redesign really improved it. I also think it'll be a success to GM in the urban and some suburban market.
Old 09-03-2009, 01:49 PM
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Volt: a car for idiots

The upcoming Chevrolet Volt may promise a 230 mpg city rating, but not everyone in the automotive community is convinced the buying public is ready for a $40,000 electric car. Not surprisingly, Audi president Johan de Nysschen – an avid diesel supporter – is dubious of the Volt, even going as far as to call it a “car for idiots”.

de Nysschen’s biggest gripe with the Volt is its estimated $40,000 price tag. Although that price competes with mid-size luxury sedans, de Nysschen points out that the car itself is more in line with $25,000 competition. As such, the Volt might struggle to find buyers.

“No one is going to pay a $15,000 premium for a car that competes with a (Toyota) Corolla,” de Nysschen told MSN. “So there are not enough idiots who will buy it.”

de Nysschen admits plug-in hybrids have an advantage over diesel in stop-and-go driving, but feels the majority of hybrid buyers are still trying to make a statement. “They’re for the intellectual elite who want to show what enlightened souls they are,” he added.

Although Audi has some hybrid vehicles on the way, the German automaker will rely heavily on its diesel technology to increase fuel economy and reduce overall emissions. Compared to standard gas engines, Audi’s diesel consume 25 percent less fuel and emit up to 35 percent fewer Co2 emissions – all while saving costs over a typical hybrid system.

In the end, de Nysschen predicts the Volt will be a sales flop, with the government intervening – once again – to keep the program afloat.
http://www.leftlanenews.com/audi-pre...tml#more-20876

Old 09-03-2009, 02:17 PM
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"a car for idiots"

Old 09-03-2009, 02:27 PM
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I dunno, with all the things I hear about Audi quality (and experiencing some of it myself), I'd have to say pot, kettle.
Old 09-03-2009, 02:38 PM
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^^ And you would be wrong too.

Present day Audi versus +3 years ago is night and day.
Old 09-03-2009, 02:41 PM
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Those cars are still on the road, and still in the marketplace. It's a valid point.
Old 09-03-2009, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by CocheseUGA
I dunno, with all the things I hear about Audi quality (and experiencing some of it myself), I'd have to say pot, kettle.


In terms of the comments Audi CEO's of North America make, they (Audi CEO's) tend to make some fairly idiotic comments themselves. My favorite one, although a few years old I still love this one.

http://www.automobile.com/audi-of-am...w-phaeton.html
Old 09-03-2009, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by CocheseUGA
Those cars are still on the road, and still in the marketplace. It's a valid point.
...but nobody was talking about reliability
Old 09-03-2009, 04:17 PM
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Obviously this guy is not bothered by political correctness and calls them as he sees them. I have a feeling he would have said the same thing of the Prius when it first came out. There will be enough "idiots" at first, but long term he might be right.
Old 09-03-2009, 04:28 PM
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Bob Lutz made similar comments about the Prius and hybrids in general, then he switched sides and was the top GM exec behind the Volt (although reason is for less imported oil not CO2).

Gotta love Lutz, he always speaks his mind no matter what.
Old 09-03-2009, 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by biker
Obviously this guy is not bothered by political correctness and calls them as he sees them. I have a feeling he would have said the same thing of the Prius when it first came out. There will be enough "idiots" at first, but long term he might be right.
Perhaps...but the larger issue here is the 40k price point...the Prius (although more expensive than a civic or other compacts) is nowhere near that price point and is closer in line in pricing to its competition.

For 40k you can get some serious lux vehicles......or a Volt with a Prius quality feel to it.
Old 09-04-2009, 06:01 AM
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We don't know how much of this is influenced by politics (Obama may be "nudging" GM toward a car like this in exchange for the bailout), marketeers gone wild, tree huggers, etc. Strictly on economics it'd be a tough sell.
Old 09-04-2009, 06:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
^^ And you would be wrong too.

Present day Audi versus +3 years ago is night and day.
And how is he wrong? Unless you have internal repair and warranty data from Audi you know what the rest of know, being nothing.
Old 09-04-2009, 06:57 AM
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For $40,000 for a 4-seater it's going to be a niche vehicle. Although I think in Ontario it might get as much as $10,000 in tax credit, so we'll see, maybe it will be comparable to a Prius in price.
Old 09-04-2009, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by CocheseUGA
I dunno, with all the things I hear about Audi quality (and experiencing some of it myself), I'd have to say pot, kettle.
I have a 2005 with 46k miles on it and have had only minor issues like headlight condensation and a sensor in the rearview mirror being replaced under warranty.
Old 09-04-2009, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Legend2TL


In terms of the comments Audi CEO's of North America make, they (Audi CEO's) tend to make some fairly idiotic comments themselves. My favorite one, although a few years old I still love this one.

http://www.automobile.com/audi-of-am...w-phaeton.html
Actually VW/Audi is not bothered by GM products around the world. and not even Toyota Prius. Toyota Prius is limited success to US/Japan markets. rest of the world is not that much bothered by it. It is Honda Fit/VW Polo/VW Golf that are more in demand.
Old 09-04-2009, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Legend2TL
And how is he wrong? Unless you have internal repair and warranty data from Audi you know what the rest of know, being nothing.
Let's put it this way....owners who post on all the various VW/Audi forums/sites...and VW/Audi owners on this site as well pretty much are all of the consensus that the quality/reliability of their vehicles is vastly improved from the past vehicles of +4 years and earlier.

...not to mention VW/Audi statements about their goals to increase reliability of their products over the past years.

No doubt some past products were pretty bad, but you can't argue with the current products.
Old 09-04-2009, 10:37 AM
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Audi president de Nysschen explains Volt is for idiots comment

Following a media storm over his comments calling the Chevrolet Volt a “car for idiots”, Audi president Johan de Nysschen has released a statement explaining his side of the story. de Nysschen says he doesn’t recall specifically labeling the Volt as a car for idiots, but is dubious about the immediate viability of electric cars.

de Nysschen expresses doubt about several aspects of the electric car, but particularly takes issue with the Volt’s projected $40,000 price tag. “The 50% or so price increase that the Volt represents over a similar gasoline car cannot be offset through the savings from reduced fuel consumption,” de Nysschen said. “The only way to offset the extreme premium for the Volt is through taxpayer-funded subsidies. So I question if that makes economic sense.”

de Nysschen is also wary of the environmental impact of electric vehicles. Although electric vehicles would have no emissions themselves, de Nysschen thinks that the electrification of the automobile will only “shift greenhouse gas emissions from the tailpipes of cars to the smokestacks of coal-burning utilities”.

Despite de Nysschen’s views, Audi is still developing its own hybrid and electric vehicles, with one example possibly set for a Frankfurt preview. However, Audi’s core competence lies in diesel technology, so expect the German automaker to rely more heavily on clean diesel than EVs in the short term.
http://www.leftlanenews.com/audi-pre...tml#more-20909

He makes some valid points, yet again.
Old 09-04-2009, 12:52 PM
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It's still too early to know if this attempt at quality/reliabity/durability reform at Audi will take hold. In another 3 or so years, then the picture will become clearer. About the only ones who know now is probably Audi, who've logged 10 of thousands of miles on their test/validation fleet.

So noone outside of Audi knows how well the long term ownership cost/issues will work out. I believe this will be Audi's fourth broad attempt at quality initiative since the late 70's. Time will tell how it works out this time.


Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
Let's put it this way....owners who post on all the various VW/Audi forums/sites...and VW/Audi owners on this site as well pretty much are all of the consensus that the quality/reliability of their vehicles is vastly improved from the past vehicles of +4 years and earlier.

...not to mention VW/Audi statements about their goals to increase reliability of their products over the past years.

No doubt some past products were pretty bad, but you can't argue with the current products.
Old 09-04-2009, 01:36 PM
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^^ In the legendary words posted here in automotive news

German Cars: "Built to break"

:wink:
Old 09-04-2009, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Legend2TL
It's still too early to know if this attempt at quality/reliabity/durability reform at Audi will take hold. In another 3 or so years, then the picture will become clearer. About the only ones who know now is probably Audi, who've logged 10 of thousands of miles on their test/validation fleet.

So noone outside of Audi knows how well the long term ownership cost/issues will work out. I believe this will be Audi's fourth broad attempt at quality initiative since the late 70's. Time will tell how it works out this time.
Which was more my point. Those cars are still out there, and for a lot of people, may have been their last car. They certainly wouldn't call anything they built quality, or rather well put together. I keep hoping they get it together, because they have some of the best looking cars on the road...when they're on the road.
Old 09-04-2009, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by CocheseUGA
Which was more my point. Those cars are still out there, and for a lot of people, may have been their last car. They certainly wouldn't call anything they built quality, or rather well put together. I keep hoping they get it together, because they have some of the best looking cars on the road...when they're on the road.
By the same token there are plenty of trouble free Audi cars on the road now, that the drivers would call them a quality product, well put together.
Old 09-04-2009, 02:20 PM
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As said, we'll see how they age.
Old 09-04-2009, 02:31 PM
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^^ So far so good.
Old 12-17-2009, 05:49 PM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvwTMZNWGuk



(wasn't sure if this video should go in this thread or the "Funny Internet" thread )
Old 12-17-2009, 06:37 PM
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As if the idea of all the world's vehicles will run on plug in electric vehicles wasn't the most stupid idea....then comes along a dance that's just a stupid to go along with it.
Old 12-17-2009, 06:53 PM
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Oh c'mon Moog.... You know you like it... it's probably your ringtone by now
Old 12-17-2009, 07:38 PM
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Clearly Chevy has pissed away their bailout money by keeping people employed there that would think this is a good idea.
Old 12-17-2009, 07:46 PM
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This car worries me. It reminds me of the SSR that was all hyped up for many years. Then by the time they finally released it, no one really cared.
Old 12-17-2009, 08:53 PM
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^^^Didn't they try to do that with the Camaro too? The only reason it survived its nearly 4 year gestation period is that its a new "Camaro"....
Old 12-17-2009, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by is300eater


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvwTMZNWGuk



(wasn't sure if this video should go in this thread or the "Funny Internet" thread )
I kept waiting for the blonde chick's boob to pop out... Spoiler: it didn't.
Old 12-18-2009, 08:46 AM
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The issue I see with the Volt is that it's a Chevy. The majority of tree-huggers that buy it for looking "green" live on the two coasts where domestic makers just don't fare as well as the Japanese makers. And while car rags claim the car will be in the low $30K range after the gov't subsidy, the typical buyer will be hard pressed to pony up the $40K+ to buy it. This will not be like CFC where the dealer can front you the $7500.

The typical buyer will go the dealer, see the Cruze/Malibu and the Volt, do the math and end up buying the Cruze.
Old 12-19-2009, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by biker
The issue I see with the Volt is that it's a Chevy. The majority of tree-huggers that buy it for looking "green" live on the two coasts where domestic makers just don't fare as well as the Japanese makers. And while car rags claim the car will be in the low $30K range after the gov't subsidy, the typical buyer will be hard pressed to pony up the $40K+ to buy it. This will not be like CFC where the dealer can front you the $7500.

The typical buyer will go the dealer, see the Cruze/Malibu and the Volt, do the math and end up buying the Cruze.
which may have been an intended side-effect from the get-go...


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