Allen-

I have always been curious about how Cadillac was going to evolve their 'Art & Science' design language.

The ATS looks exactly like I imagined it would. Needs something new and fresh.

pttl

Cadillac Ices Rest of ATS

WTF?!?!?!?!

http://www.motortrend.com/features/a...s_rest_of_ats/

Hapa DC5

Old GM rearing it's ugly head again..

pttl

Yeah...I hope somebody comes to their senses about it. This car looked fantastic at the auto show in Philly. Perfect size... brand new architecture...magnetic ride adjustability etc. Please GM, dont eff this one up.

Belzebutt

C&D says that the back seat space in this car is less than the previous gen 3-series. If so, that could be a drawback for many buyers. I really liked the IS300 but I would have never bought one because of the ridiculously tight back seat leg room.

The CTS already felt to me about the same size inside as my A4.

I hope they're still going ahead with the ATS wagon though. It'll probably look even better than the CTS wagon.

NwTSXmt

its a looker saw it at the philly car show...On the small side, but a looker. if your vehicle has to he pretty its for you....

krio

pttl

Birng the coupe, I bring my check.

biker

Looks good in MT trim.

Moog-Type-S

Elegant interior...nice!

Belzebutt

The front kind of has the same proportions as Buick. For a small car I expected it to have a lower more aggressive stance, more like a 3-series. I wonder why they couldn't pull it off.

Rocketsfan

I'm a reliability-first nut, but I love the looks of this ATS. What has Cadillac reliability been like as of late? Any common problems with, for example, the newer CTS? I'll more than likely be buying a new car later this year or next year, so the itch is getting bad. lol.

Moog-Type-S

^^^ My guess is you are not really a "reliability-first nut" as much as you claim.

If you were, you would know that Cadillac is currently ranked #3 behind Porsche & Lexus...according to J.D. Power & Assoc.

Pretty darn reliable. :wink:

pttl

Stick with Ack....plenty reliable.

charliemike

Having seen one in person, I think it's definitely worth checking out.

Given how expensive the 3-series has gotten and how bland the Gs are I think everyone looking to spend $33-40k on a car should really look at an ATS.

Rocketsfan

I'm enough of a nut to know manufacturers bounce up and down every year on JD Power's VDS surveys. Sometimes I have a hard time believing companies are improving or failing that much in a matter of 1-3 years. Not to mention the variance among positions on that list can be miniscule. Lastly, the VDS is a measurement of "quality" after only 3 years of ownership. I need to know what the car's doing after 100,000 miles. lolol.

pttl

Why go out of your comfort zone? Stay with the Asian brands most are pretty reliable.

Rocketsfan

One reason is because had the 4G TL design caught my eye, it would be a no-brainer for me - I'd get another TL. Although I've kind of come around on its looks and kind of like it now that they've toned down the bulldozer/snapping turtle grille, I know a new one is coming in maybe another 1-1.5 years or so. I also know the G37 body style is ancient and a new design is coming up for that as well. Same with the IS, I believe. This leaves me with the issue of "if my car were to die next week, what would I get?" I have no clue since every car I'd think about getting (a G, the TL, and the IS) is in the last year or so of its model style or is brand spanking new and I have no previous experience with its manufacturer (ATS). If push came to shove, I'd get another TL, though.

pttl

I understand the need for reliability, and I understand not wanting the last MY of a particular car. I just feel the need to move on and give other manufacturers a chance. The worst case scenario is the next car is problematic for a period of time...then I move on again....but sooner.

I just need more driving dynamics now than when I bought the Acuras. Then again, when I bought my Acks...they were pleasing to look at. I simply cannot abide the 4G TL in any way shape or form. The TSX is gutless and FWD The RL....well...

I just hope Caddy produces the ATS in coupe form....in the V variant.

MTEAZY

I think the G37 sedan is OK looking, I liked the original one much more. Fast car but the engine is very rough above 5 or 6k. 4G TL is bearable after the update. ATS seems better looking than both. Most new car styling these days is overdone.

F23A4

I wouldn't call the TSX V6 gutless. It would be great with a 6MT but, yes it is FWD.

fsttyms1

Very nice!

pttl

BUT it doesn't come with a 6MT. Also my 3G TL is basically the current TSX.

charliemike

And boring as shit (IMO).

Moog-Type-S

Vanilla....some people are drawn to it.

Moog-Type-S

Go back and look at 2007.....you will find Cadillac in 3rd place once again......yes, that is 5 years ago.

They have been pretty consistent in reliability and dependability.

....but it sounds like you are hell-bent on the Asian car reliability myth....so there is no point in discussing facts here.

pttl

For the most part. Infinity has some worthwhile cars. (RWD coupe)



I prefer it when it comes it ice cream.

charliemike

True, but I really thought we were talking about ATS sedan competitors.

Rocketsfan

Did Honda eat your babies? Seriously dude - I see this maniacal reaction from you in damn near every thread. Maybe an Asian at your babies? LOL.

Reading is fundamental : All I asked was how its reliability was - I never said "it's not reliable". I wouldn't be in this thread if I weren't interested in Cadillac. Sorry for offending your anti-Acura/Honda sentiments by inquiring about Cadillacs.

charliemike

All you have to do is spend a decent amount of time here in the 2002-2006 timeframe to see all the posts about failing transmissions (multiple times) from people and then other problems since then to get a good sense of why most of us do not buy that "The Japanese are more reliable" argument anymore.

Honda ruined several great cars and a lot of goodwill by putting shitty transmissions in the Accord, CL, and TL and then refusing to do anything about it.

Some of us have been around the block too many times.

Rocketsfan

Understood. And believe me, I'd be pissed, too. If you look over to the left, I've been here since 2003 and knew about the transmission issues when I bought my 3G. I was on this forum reading about Acuras back then. I gambled on that 3G purchase, but it's proven to be a good gamble. Ten years later, I'm not sure I want to gamble anymore.

I'm not going to live in the past and say "American cars are junk and Japanese cars never break down". My parents owned a damn Chevy Chevette for God's sake. If anything I should never be thinking about buying a GM vehicle. LOL. Ford and GM have built utter garbage in the past, but I'm not going to knock them 10 years later when I know they're building better cars - which is why I'm looking into Cadillacs.

I'm more of a guy that wants a very reliable car that looks good and performs well, but reliability is first and foremost. I don't buy cars every 3-4 years, so this puppy has to last me at least 150,000 miles. It's just not enough for me to say "well, this one sucked, let me go get another one".

Anyways, like I said, I understand the hate when you put it that way, but not when it's directed at people looking to purchase vehicles.

Moog-Type-S

Don't get your panties in a bunch. There is no hate here, just facts.

Again, if you were a true reliability is first nut, then you would have known that Caddy has been at the top of the heap for years and years.


...but it's apparent that you have been a bit blinded by the Asian car reliability myth, which makes you question the reliability of Cadillac in the first place.

An unbiased, informed, reliability nut would have already know this.....it's not like Caddy just hit the top three last year.

pttl

You're right when it comes to sedans. I'm not sure if the Infiniti G sedans are competitors to the ATS sedan or not. But there certainly is a shortage of Asian brand sedans in the RWD or AWD arena.

Hopefully the ATS becomes a coupe.

Moog-Type-S

+1 for a coupe version

Rocketsfan

No. I'm a reliability nut in that I seek to find out what is reliable. The last time I've had to look at buying a car was 2003. I don't buy a car every year, but when I do, I research their reliability first. Hence, here I am asking and apparently unleashing your inner demons. LOL.

Where did I question the reliability of Cadillac? I inquired about it. Post facts. I believe Asian cars are universally reliable? And you know this how? Please quote where I said this. Eagerly awaiting your reply or how you dance around it with "facts".

Sorry, but when I buy a car, I don't buy the entire lineup. So saying "Cadillac is reliable" alone isn't enough - which is why I asked about the CTS as it would be more akin to what an ATS would be. But to educate you further :

2007 - JD Power ranked the CTS as having "average" Powertrain Dependability. Body Interior Quality and Design were below average.

2008 - JD Power ranked overall mechanical quality as "average".

2010 - JD Power ranked Powertrain Dependability as "average".

2011 - JD Power ranked Powertrain Quality and Body and Interior Quality as "average".

Ratings of "average" for power train and mechanical quality are not necessarily enough. I don't care about the DTS, the STS, SRX, or any other vehicles. The vehicle closest to this ATS would be a CTS - hence the specific inquiry. Please read and understand before getting your panties in a wad with your hallucinated "facts".

Rocketsfan

The one thing I like about the ATS is that Cadillac is still sticking with that edgy-but-good-looking design and throwing a good powerplant under the hood (from the looks of it). This is where Acura failed - they tried go edgy and ended up making a boneheaded mistake. On the other hand, I thought the Infiniti lineup had that edge and the guts, but for some reason, they keep softening the lines on the car as each year goes by. The coupe looks watered-down visually but then maybe it's because this generation is getting a little long in the tooth.

I remember wanting a diesel just to have torque and fuel efficiency, but nowadays they're jacking diesel prices up, too. Oh well, here's to GM at least having design sense in terms of knowing what people want and giving them a choice. In contrast, Acura gives us the ILX. Decent looking car with no guts from the looks of it. lol.

charliemike

I saw that you joined back then but 800 posts in nine years made me think you signed up, left for a while and then came back. I wasn't assuming you didn't know what you were talking about. Just that perhaps you missed the worst of it.

I don't think anyone here is saying anyone is stupid for buying a Japanese car. But rather we have no tolerance for fanboys who choose to ignore the faults of their beloved Acura/Honda.

pttl

Totally off topic...This is one of the BEST things about Azine and in particular Car Talk and Automotive News. Fanboys are recognized and called out for their blind loyalty to a brand...in this case H/A.

I am on other car forums and the fanboy-ism is absolutely mind bending... quite frankly, it's sickening. I am amazed at the peeps who call themselves "car guys" or "enthusiasts", yet all they really love is "their" brand, and do nothing but bash the "competition".

This is not pointed at you Rocketsfan.....just saying.

/

Rocketsfan

Yeah, believe me, I understand that. I honestly never came to this part of the forum ... ever... until recently. I always hung around the 3G and 4G forums. I'm not a blind buyer who just buys one brand - I'm not stupid. I've only owned 3 cars in my lifetime - a Toyota, a Nissan, and an Acura. I don't have some rigid brand loyalty - if they screw me over, I don't go to them. An Acura dealer here did a bait and switch on me when I was looking for my 3G, so I refused to take my TL in for repairs to them for as long as I owned it even though it's about 20 miles closer than the next dealer repairshop.

Anyway, it's all good. I'll keep looking at this ATS and can't wait to test it out. It's one of the few vehicles I see nowadays where the design makes me say "nice" - something Acura should learn from. Or better yet, maybe steal an Audi or BMW designer. lol.

KillerG

Its equally important not to fall into a anti Honda/Acura circlejerk. While I applaud the diversity and intelligent opinions often coming out of car talk/automotive news, remember that its just as easy to become a reverse fanboy, especially with a crowd cheering you on.

Take everything with a bit of salt and objectivity guys