iforyou

iTrader: (1)

Exactly. The 3G TL was a good value because:

1.) Good looking
2.) Good balance of handling and ride comfort
3.) Highest horsepower rating despite not being the fastest. Heck, my 2G TL-S is faster than a 3G TL 5AT in stock form
4.) Comprehensive feature set
5.) Affordable pricing
6.) Very important is the fact that the competition was relatively weak.

By the end of the lifecycle, the 3G TL's straight line performance was mediocre, its features didn't quite match up with the others, it had an outdated tranny, no AWD option, etc. And these shortcomings reflected in the sales numbers too:

2006: 71.3k
2007: 58.5k
2008: 46.7k
2009: 33.6k

Even with the help of the Type S trim, the sales just fell in the final two years of the 3G TL. And that was before the economy went sour.

The 4G TL came out exactly when the economy tanked. The fact that the car was still using 5AT didn't help either. To make things even worse, its styling was controversial at best. Don't forget, at around that time, new CTS, facelifted G, new A4 all came out.

Hopefully, Acura will get the TLX right. It's such an important model for the brand if they want to get a slice in the entry-level luxury sedan market. Acura should be familiar with the formula that brought them so much success with the 3G TL. Add to that with multiple new ED powertrains, AWD and hybrid options, and keep the size and weight reasonable, and that should get the sales up.

Fibonacci

Nobody said marketing isn't important, but my point is product comes first. Hyundai and Kia are doing very well because they have compelling products at competitive price points.

Ask OG Aziner's who've left the brand since '05 why they left, I highly doubt its because Acura's marketing didn't strike their fancy.

Power Plenum originated with the 2G MDX and proliferated from there and has been nearly universally panned. Yet, Acura insists it is a winning face.

Fibonacci

I object to the mediocre performance label for my 6MT SH-AWD. It ran neck and neck with the S4 with most critics. IF you can get past the plenum, it is a very compelling daily driver. But the facts of the matter are, if I didn't get a five gizzle ugly discount, its highly unlikely it would be in my garage.

ttribe

This^^^. It's outright arrogance on Acura's part to continue to foist that "face" on their customers.

fsttyms1

Couldnt agree more.

fsttyms1

Their sales alone should show them that this design isnt working and needs a major overhaul. Something that Made for Mankind isnt going to fix.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

I agree that product comes first. Just saying when you have a good product, you gotta know how to market it too, and Acura is failing this part big time. This is not to say better marketing = 4G TL being the best seller in class.

Hyundai and Kia now have good products. But they also have the marketing to boost sales even higher. Heck, they even go as far as providing false EPA information to gain sales.

I don't know, but IMO I don't think the grille on the 2007-2009 MDX is the power plenum.

Original Power Plenum Concept:


2007-2009 MDX Grille:


2010+ MDX Grille:

phile

I still like that 2nd gen MDX pre-MMC refresh shield.

AZuser

Best looking MDX so far, IMO. Even better than the 3G MDX

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

That should have been the Acura grille...but oh well..at least the latest version of the power plenum doesn't bother me anymore...

TSX69

Civic Breaks 13-Year-Old Monthly Record on American Honda 20-Percent Sales Gain;
Acura Sales Jump 18 Percent on MDX Monthly Record and All-Time Light-Truck Sales Record

American Honda Motor Co., Inc. today reported July 2013 U.S. sales of 141,439 units, a total increase of 20.9% compared with July 2012 (up 16.1% based on the Daily Selling Rate, or DSR*). The Honda Division posted July 2013 sales of 126,289 units, an increase of 21.3% compared with July 2012. Acura Division U.S. July sales of 15,150 units jumped 18.1% compared with July 2012.

Honda

Accord and Civic both top 30,000 July sales, with Civic breaking a 13-year-old July sales record
CR-V breaks July sales record set last year by more than 6,500 units, with sales of 27,226, up 32.5% compared to July 2012
Pilot and Ridgeline both see 5th consecutive month of double digit sales gains, up 32.5 and 67.7 percent respectively, from July 2012

"In July, all of our core models - Civic, Accord, Odyssey and CRV - showed double-digit gains," said John Mendel, executive vice president of sales at American Honda. "This indicates Honda's commitment to retail sales is resonating with consumers seeking not only fun and fuel-efficient vehicles, but also products that retain their long-term value."

Acura

Acura posts a 18.1-percent sales gain, and a 35.4% gain in light-truck sales setting an all-time light-truck sales record
MDX, new from the ground up, topped 5,500 units and set a new July record last set in 2005, making it Acura's top-selling model
RDX continues its amazing run with 15 consecutive month of record sales (3,936 units sold)

"The all-new MDX is off to the kind of dominating start we expected, teamed with RDX to give Acura a powerful 1-2 punch in the important luxury light-truck segment, and new momentum in Acura showrooms," said Jeff Conrad, vice president and general manager of Acura sales. "MDX delivers due to its fundamental advantages in areas that resonate with luxury SUV shoppers."

AZuser

Someone found an Element to sell two years after it was discontinued?


MDX sales still strong. RDX sales down slightly from last month. Same with ILX, TSX, and TL sales. Maybe the RLX is taking sales from the againg TL? Or maybe it's because the RLX has the exclusive pot hole proof feature.

biker

Maybe there's some hope for the RLX.

oonowindoo

Nope. RLX only came out for a few months, let's give it a year and it will be dead like the RL.

Hapa DC5

617 people bought a pot hole proof sedan. Nice.

phile

and selling about 200 more units a month vs the usual 400 units isn't exactly blazing any new trails.

on another note, I saw a new MDX on the road the other day. Gotta say, it was one good looking cuv.

TSX69

American Honda Posts Record August Sales Up 26.7 Percent As Year To Date Sales Top 1 Million Vehicles

09/04/2013 - TORRANCE, Calif.

Best month ever for CR-V contributes to Honda brand 29.1% sales increase
Accord, Civic and CR-V each top sales of 30,000 units in August
All-new MDX breaks all-time record, boosting Acura brand sales up 9.0%
Acura RDX posts 16th straight record month of sales

Setting a new August record, American Honda Motor Co., Inc. today reported U.S. sales of 166,432 units, a total increase of 26.7% compared with a year ago (up 22.2% based on the Daily Selling Rate, or DSR*). Year-to-date sales of 1,053,449 units represent a year-over-year increase of 11.0 percent. The Honda Division posted August 2013 sales of 149,381 units, an increase of 29.1% compared with August 2012. Acura Division U.S. July sales of 17,051 units were up 9.0% compared with the prior year.

Honda

CR-V breaks all-time sales record set in March 2012, with sales of 34,654 up 45.1% compared to August 2012
Accord and Civic both top 38,000 units, with Civic posting its best August since 2009
Pilot and Ridgeline both see 6th consecutive month of double digit sales gains, contributing to a new all-time Honda light-truck record

"With 3 of our core models topping 30,000 units and the Honda brand up more than 29%, our August sales definitely didn't take a break for the holiday weekend," said John Mendel, executive vice president of sales at American Honda. "We're keeping our foot on the gas as we transition into the 2014 model year including the introduction an all-new Accord Hybrid in October."

Acura

Acura posts a 9.0% sales gain, and a 27.3% gain in light-truck sales, setting an all-time light-truck sales record for the 2nd straight month
The all-new MDX set a new all-time record with its best month ever, up 17.1 percent
RDX was up 49.7% with its 16th successive monthly sales record

"More luxury SUV shoppers are choosing the Acura brand than ever before," said Jeff Conrad, vice president and general manager of Acura sales. "RDX is unstoppable after 16 straight monthly records, and the all-new MDX is already proving it's the 1 to beat, setting records in its 1st 2 full months of sales."

oonowindoo

The only thing that keeps Acura alive is RDX and MDX. 2 SUVs ... sad.. just sad...

AZuser

RLX sales fell again. Went from 617 in July to 459. It would be nice if Acura could stay fairly consistent like with the MDX and RDX and increase sales.


Feb '13 = 60
Mar = 336
Apr = 400
May = 273
Jun = 499
Jul = 617
Aug = 459

dom

But boy did they ever hit a home run with the MDX and RDX. No surprise really. If they ever get their sedan's in order look out Lexus.

RLX was DOA from day 1. No surprise what so ever.

Costco

Clearly it's a supply issue, nevermind the demand part. Also, the economy.

oonowindoo

That will require a new car with a new engine.

ttribe

Tsunami...again.

Edward'TLS

Sarcasm in red color please.

Costco

Eh, sometimes I like to mindfuck

Wasn't it pretty obvious though?

biker

Look at that % increase for the Clarity.

Legend2TL

+1, 11K of 17K Acura's monthly sale are from those two.

Honda is on a roll with it's decent sales blended across a range of vehicles (Accord/Civic/CRV/Ody/Pilot).

A nice upscale FWD Accord is no longer to cut it for Acura, they need to be serious with their sedans.

Hapa DC5

We've been saying this for nearly a decade.

fsttyms1

25-33% drop in the TL from 1 year

oonowindoo

The problem is pretty obvious, other than the beak, of course.

Accord V6 has 95%+ of what a FWD TL offers at a much lower price. So Honda made the Accord too good.
Now if Acura makes the next TL(X) better to further differentiate from Accord, then it will get into RLX territory.

It seems like it will become the old TL/RL story all over again.
Honda/Acura never gave itself enough room to "Advance" when they made the RLX only SLIGHTLY better than their current TL.

Any improvement on the next TLX will destroy RLX.
Not that it has any hopes left anyways.

dom

Hmmm, what could they possibly do to differentiate the TL(X) from the Accord????

I can't think of anythi.......oh wait what if the TL(X) and Acura in general has its own platform?? maybe even RWD based? what if they had a unique powertrain.....

:thehorseisdeadgiveitup:

oonowindoo

um.. for starters.... Make the TLX Smaller than the current boat size TL and RLX bigger.

If you can't differentiate TLX from Accord, at least try to differentiate TLX from RLX.

Edward'TLS

I'm thinking the same. TL(X) : RWD, AWD; Accord : FWD only.

But that will never happen.

So a more realistic approach would be :

TL(X) : AWD only, no 2WD available.
Accord : FWD only.

JAB00

Honda does not need to make a sedan that's leaps and bounds better or luxurious than the Accord. They just need to make a good looking luxurious looking sedan. The 3G TL sold like hot cakes upwards of 7K a month. The Pilot or CRV can be optioned out to be as nice as the RDX or MDX. However the RDX and MDX distinctly look like upscale SUVs and are marketed that way. The 4G TL was a monstrosity. The revision in 2012 made it more palatable. This will not cut it in a hyper-competitive entry level luxury market.

oonowindoo

Um... yes they do.

Have you seen the Accord in the 3G TL Era?

3G TL's interior/exterior/feature/power were all 1 or 2 levels above 7G Accord.
Now? not so much

um... CRV is a 4 cylinder.. and RDX is V6 now. Do you remember what happened to the RDX when it had 4 cylinders?
Pilot is a nice car but the interior and power is not even close to the MDX.

Honda made the 9th Gen accord so good, i can't see what else they can do to differential TL (i know what they can do, but Acura will not do it)

Acura will try.. and try so hard that no one will buy RLX anymore.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

The rumour is that the TL(X) will be smaller than the existing accord and it will replace both TSX and TL. This means the TLX will be much smaller than the RLX to prevent the previous TL vs RL issue.

I think we can all forget about RWD for the TLX. I can see a base model with the K24 with DI that is slightly more powerful than the Accord's unit (220hp/200lbft) mated with CVT or 6MT. The next step up could be the J30 from the Chinese RDX which is good for 260hp/220lbft (6AT and 6MT perhaps). The top trim will have the RLX's J35 for 310hp. Some of the above might come with P-AWS or the mechanical SH-AWD.

As for hybrids, we might see trim with the Accord's hybrid system (higher tune?), and another trim that has the eSH-AWD (detuned to 350hp?).

Price range should be $30k (base 2.4 6MT) to $55k (eSH-AWD).

MeehowsBRZ

I'm not one to keep track of Acura commercials considering I already know there's nothing they sell that interests me but I did stumble upon this article today:

http://jalopnik.com/acuras-new-ads-p...ing-1369932279

ttribe

Thought this quote from that link was worth repeating:

TSX69

Stylish Honda Accord and Civic Lead Honda September Sales; Acura’s Newest Products Continue to Advance Brand Growth

American Honda today reported September 2013 U.S. sales of 105,563 units, a decrease of 9.9 percent compared with September 2012 (a decrease of 2.1 percent based on the Daily Selling Rate (DSR*)), while year-to-date sales remain up 7.9 percent over 2012. Reflecting Honda's consistent focus on retail sales, the Honda brand posted September 2013 sales of 93,915 units, a decrease of 8.7 percent compared with September 2012 (a decrease of 0.7 percent based on the DSR). Acura U.S. September sales of 11,648 units decreased 18.9 percent compared with September 2012 (a decrease of 11.9 percent based on the DSR).

Honda

Strong sales of the Accord continue, up 13.8 percent year to date, on sales of 25,176 units in September
Honda light truck sales are up 7.8 percent year to date compared to 2012 helped by the Ridgeline, which tallied a 7th straight month of sales gains in September, up 9.9 percent compared to 2012
Solid September sales of 22,983 units keep Civic up 8.3 percent year to date and 6.7 percent compared with last September

"Even as we catch our breath from all-time record August sales and with 2 fewer selling days this month, the Honda brand continues on a strong pace for the year," said John Mendel, executive vice president of sales at American Honda. "The already strong appeal of the Accord lineup will grow even greater with the launch late this month of the 2014 Accord Hybrid, which delivers 50 mpg1 city EPA-rated fuel economy."

Acura

Acura light truck sales including the all-new 2014 MDX and 2014 RDX are up 16.2 percent year to date compared to this point in 2012
RDX sets 17th successive monthly record, with sales of 3,022 units
MDX remained the top selling Acura model in September, with sales of 4,539 units

jwong77

What happened to TL sales? Did they stop making them?