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Old 09-24-2003, 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by fdl
cup holders is a North AMerican thing for sure. We like our cup holders and want lots of them.

I dont think a cup holder is a big deal unless its really badly done...like the old A4 (not sure baout the new one). That cup holder design was silly.
The new A4 has terrible cubholders. There is one on the center console, above the radio stack. Worst location, cups fall off all the time. The have some under the front armrest, but those are completely impractical, and uncomfotrable for your arm.
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Old 09-24-2003, 12:20 PM
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CRAP Sorry about that triple post
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Old 09-24-2003, 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by ryder1650
The new A4 has terrible cubholders. There is one on the center console, above the radio stack. Worst location, cups fall off all the time. The have some under the front armrest, but those are completely impractical, and uncomfotrable for your arm.
Ya the on coming straight out of the center console above the radio..thats the one i was talking about. I wasnt sure if they changed it in the new model. So easy to spill coffee all over your console...gets inthe way...completely useless. But for some reason the europeans really dont care about that sort of thing.
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Old 09-24-2003, 12:21 PM
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Originally posted by bowersan

One issue i've already got with the design of the interior, however, is that of the choice of the style of cupholder cover. Instead of going with the removable tilting panel (a la TSX), the Acura designers have decided to go with a sliding unit. Personally, while space saving, I find that this style is less attractive than the others (read: it looks cheap). This is quite a shame considering how well designed the rest of the interior appears to be.

What are your opinions on this?

J.
I think they used the textured, retractable style for the purpose of putting objects there, e.g. cell phone, keys, PDA. They showed a cell phone sitting on top of it in one of the interactive showroom slides.
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Old 09-24-2003, 08:11 PM
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The cover is OK, with me. Glad to see the trip computer will do avg. speed. Hope it also does instant and avg econ.
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Old 09-24-2003, 09:45 PM
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My major gripes

1) those 2 HUGE silver knobs are out of place
2) the eruo style 3 gauges are ugly and should be replaced w/ the better looking single cluster of the TSX
3) I don't even want to see that tape deck, Do I look 65?

need id3 tags too
Has it for XM
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Old 09-24-2003, 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by moreace
My major gripes

the eruo style 3 gauges are ugly and should be replaced w/ the better looking single cluster of the TSX



The Euro style 3 gauges are ugly and should be replaced with the better looking 1984 Corvette dash.
Sheesh, even after 20 years Acura still hasn't caught up.
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Old 09-24-2003, 10:58 PM
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The tape deck is a mistake. There can't be that many people out there who gripe about not having a tape deck.

How does Acura justify all the technology in this car and resort to putting a tape deck in it. That makes no sense whatsoever.
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Old 09-24-2003, 11:10 PM
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Originally posted by bowersan
One issue i've already got with the design of the interior, however, is that of the choice of the style of cupholder cover. Instead of going with the removable tilting panel (a la TSX), the Acura designers have decided to go with a sliding unit. Personally, while space saving, I find that this style is less attractive than the others (read: it looks cheap). This is quite a shame considering how well designed the rest of the interior appears to be.

What are your opinions on this?

J.
I think I'm the only one who agrees with you. I would've preferred the cupholder cover a la TSX, with the wood on top to dress it up a little. I think the center console could use a little more wood than what's already there.

Speaking of cupholders, I really don't like the rear cupholders. Yes, they slide out of the armrest, which is pretty cool, but they're ugly.
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Old 09-24-2003, 11:38 PM
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Originally posted by VtecMW
The tape deck is a mistake. There can't be that many people out there who gripe about not having a tape deck.

How does Acura justify all the technology in this car and resort to putting a tape deck in it. That makes no sense whatsoever.
For all you junior executives out there. The tape deck is most often used for books on tape these days. Also, I often get training tapes from my company on cassette. Commute time is great for this type of stuff.
Books don't require the audio fidelity of CD/DVD, but will hold 2 hours of audio. With CD you end up with twice as many disks at an increased cost, if you can get them.

I am happy to see it is still there. However, MP3 on CD would solve all of these problems.
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Old 09-24-2003, 11:43 PM
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Originally posted by 2004AcuraTLFan
The friggin' thing won't work for me... very frustrating. It stays on the "loading" page forever, even after getting to 100%, and never changes. Anyone else having any connectivity problems?
I was having the same problem and it worked when someone gave me the direct link

http://www.acura.com/showroom/frames...?module=tlmini
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Old 09-24-2003, 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by first99TL
For all you junior executives out there. The tape deck is most often used for books on tape these days. Also, I often get training tapes from my company on cassette. Commute time is great for this type of stuff.
Books don't require the audio fidelity of CD/DVD, but will hold 2 hours of audio. With CD you end up with twice as many disks at an increased cost, if you can get them.

I am happy to see it is still there. However, MP3 on CD would solve all of these problems.
Your last sentence is so true...!
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:05 PM
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Hot Topic: Customer brand perception - Hyundai perceived higher than Acura!

U.S. buyers place imports high in brand value study


By CHAZ OSBURN | Automotive News <>

There's more evidence that import brands rule - at least when it comes to what U.S. owners think about the value of their vehicles.

European brands finished exceptionally well, taking five of the top 10 places in the latest Strategic Vision Inc. study of brand value as perceived by customers. The Japanese were close behind with four brands in the top 10.

Newcomer Mini came in first place on the list, which was released last week. Finishing second was Lexus, dropping from the top position last year. Audi rose five spots to finish third, BMW was fourth and Mercedes-Benz was fifth. Infiniti and Hyundai tied for sixth, followed by Honda, Volvo, Cadillac and Acura to round out the top 10.

Strategic Vision, a San Diego consulting firm, compiles the list each year. It bases its results on a formula for measuring what owners think of their new vehicles. Called the Total Value Index, the formula includes such factors as price, warranty, expected trade-in and resale value, operating costs and consumers' perceptions of quality.

Trust plays a huge role in how a consumer feels about a vehicle, Strategic Vision Vice President Daniel Gorrell says.

"People don't buy vehicles from brands they don't trust," he says. "Strong brands have that element of trust associated with them."

Strategic Vision surveyed more than 63,900 consumers who bought 2003 model vehicles.

"We ask the traditional things about satisfaction, the various aspects of the car," Gorrell says. "Then we ask how people feel and how they respond emotionally to the vehicle."

Cadillac's appearance marks the first time in two years that the Big 3 brand has cracked the top 10. Cadillac, which is seeing strong sales from products such as the CTS and Escalade, moved to No. 9 from No. 16 in 2002.

Hyundai had a strong showing, moving up from 11th to sixth. Both the Sonata and Elantra gave the brand a big boost, Strategic Vision reports.

"They went from absolutely terrible product just within the space of a couple of years to product that is really in many cases better than the domestics' product," Gorrell says.

Suzuki was the most improved brand, moving from last place in 2002 to 22 this year.

Whether consumers trust a brand has a lot to do with their perception of value, Gorrell says. That's why, for example, import automakers can sell vehicles with fewer incentives than those from the Big 3.

"The domestics keep pace on immediate economic issues like price and warranty," he says, "but they fall behind import manufacturers on expectations of reliability, durability and resale value. This tends to undermine buyers' sense of trust in the domestics and forces them to offer more incentives to sell their vehicles."

Steve Saxty, a consultant who until this month was head of The FutureBrand Co.'s automotive practice in New York, says there's a correlation between brand strength and advertising costs. Automakers spend on average about $700 a unit on advertising. But the cost drops - to about $400 - for strong brands such as Mini, Honda and Toyota, he says.

In addition to brand rankings, Strategic Vision ranked vehicles in 21 categories that it says are the best values in their segments.

The Big 3 had only three winners: the Chevrolet Avalanche for full-sized pickups, Dodge Ram 2500/3500 for full-sized heavy-duty pickups and the Mercury Marauder for larger cars.

"This is one of the poorest showings I've seen," Gorrell says.

But he says the fact that the Big 3 is poised to introduce a raft of products could help in future showings.

Still, Gorrell is concerned with trust. "The trust gap is serious and most likely will not be overcome in a highly competitive environment," he says. "They (Big 3) must focus on fewer brands and products that have a greater chance of succeeding."
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:07 PM
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So we got

1 Mini
2 Lexus
3 Audi
4 BMW
5 Mercedes-Benz
6 TIE: Infiniti and Hyundai
7 Honda
8 Volvo
9 Cadillac
10 Acura
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:10 PM
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I am totally surprised by Mini and Hyundai. Somewhat surprised by Audi and Honda being so high up.

But the winner I think is that Acura is perceived WORSE THAN Honda! Only Honda could have done such a thing.

It's official folks. Honda who started the "luxury division" craze in USAmerica, is totally inept of selling a luxury car. And I wont even examine if it's able building one.
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:12 PM
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Also the above finding for Acura, I believe, re-enforces the fact that Acura needs to move upmarket. Something we saw to a certain extend with the new TL, but I believe they should have been more aggressive with it.
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:43 PM
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Very interesting list... I can't believe Hyundai being so high
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Old 10-01-2003, 09:42 PM
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i think its the rsx's thats keeping acura so low in ranking, and acura really needs to get a rwd of some sort with lots of goodies to compete in this segment
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Old 10-02-2003, 02:43 AM
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It's official folks. Honda who started the "luxury division" craze in USAmerica, is totally inept of selling a luxury car. And I wont even examine if it's able building one.
Buy him a beer. I am surprised that Lexus finished above BMW and Benz. Wow. The mini, remember a lot of people's folks remember them back in the day. Their marketing has been awesome, IMO.
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Old 10-02-2003, 04:47 AM
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You can thank all those riceboys with Integras for this.
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Old 10-02-2003, 05:14 AM
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Originally posted by Black CL-S 4-Life
You can thank all those riceboys with Integras for this.

dont forget the ones with cl's...
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Old 10-02-2003, 10:34 AM
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where did toyota and subaru place?
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Old 10-02-2003, 11:22 AM
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Originally posted by gavriil
I am totally surprised by Mini and Hyundai. Somewhat surprised by Audi and Honda being so high up.

But the winner I think is that Acura is perceived WORSE THAN Honda! Only Honda could have done such a thing.

It's official folks. Honda who started the "luxury division" craze in USAmerica, is totally inept of selling a luxury car. And I wont even examine if it's able building one.
I'm also surprised about the showing of Audi. I know at least 5 people with Audi's, and every one of them has had greater than average problems with them.

However, I wouldn't go so far as ruling Acura out. This is only ONE COMPANY's survey. I believe last years' JD Power had Acura listed 4th among nameplates.

Everybody has their own opinions, which influences these surveys.
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Old 10-02-2003, 04:54 PM
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I find it hard to believe that Mini scored so high. This survey seems more like a popularity contest than an actual scientific study. I bet the formula they used is really skewed.

And Honda>Acura? I just don't get it. Maybe Acura's marketing is so bland that the Acura brand is just lost in the crowd and forgotten.
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Old 10-03-2003, 06:30 AM
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It's based on what owners think about their cars... well all those Hyundai owners are having buyers remorse and trying to compensate for that by saying how great their car is.
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Old 10-03-2003, 07:10 AM
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Originally posted by GTKrockeTT
where did toyota and subaru place?
Not in the top. I am assuming somewhere in the middle.
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Old 10-03-2003, 07:47 AM
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its because Frog Design is handling Acura's brand image and doing a horrible job.
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Old 10-03-2003, 08:18 AM
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perception doesn't equal reality......
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Old 10-03-2003, 08:47 AM
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Originally posted by Zapata
perception doesn't equal reality......
True but perception affects purchase decisions.
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Old 10-06-2003, 12:49 PM
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Acura web site updated

Nothing new, but it looks like Acura has updated its website to showcase the 2004 TL, and has removed all reference to the '03 model. Probably coincides with the release date (today).

http://www.acura.com/models/model_index.asp?module=tl

Looks pretty good. The TL mini site is still there.
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Old 10-06-2003, 01:02 PM
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Looks very nice from this angle.
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:18 PM
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nice! i just put together a white/qtz w/oem kit! looks sweeet!
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:18 PM
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When u build the Acura online the price is cheaper than the MSRP stated at dealers. What would account for this price difference? Also are we starting to see a waiting perdiod for the TL, and if so how long?
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:28 PM
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i just noticed in the specifications that the TL comes standard with fog lights but i havent seen the fogs in any of the gallery pix. also i dont see any fog light housing in the front bumper, anyone know where they are suppose to be and what they look like?
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:29 PM
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Price everyone has been quoting is including the destination charge. Acura just seperates it.
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by dabuda2004
i just noticed in the specifications that the TL comes standard with fog lights but i havent seen the fogs in any of the gallery pix. also i dont see any fog light housing in the front bumper, anyone know where they are suppose to be and what they look like?
The fog lights are in with the headlights.
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:31 PM
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1) the projectoers act as high and low beams. the halogen looking bulbs on the inside that u think are the highbeams are actually the fogs

2) I thought even w/ the desti charge it was cheaper on the site

3) what octane does the TL require?
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by moreace

3) what octane does the TL require?
91+
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:45 PM
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Originally posted by moreace
1) the projectoers act as high and low beams. the halogen looking bulbs on the inside that u think are the highbeams are actually the fogs

2) I thought even w/ the desti charge it was cheaper on the site

3) what octane does the TL require?
32650+545=33195...
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Old 10-06-2003, 02:49 PM
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What am I, advanced calculus professor?
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