MSZ

And before you make another nonsense reply, take a look again:

61,041 vs 44,563

If their compact ACE Corolla is that much behind the underpowered 7th gen Civic, imagine what the new Civic can do in the last 2 months in 2005 and the full 2006 year.

Toyota is in big trouble, thats why they don't even bother thinking to make room for Scion in Canada.

gilboman

Yes Toyota is in BIG TROUBLE

and you have yet to post the US civic coupe numbers that you say easily outsells scion tC's 70,000+?

gilboman

okay..did you read what i quoted you? you said CIVIC COUPE SALES IN THE STATES,

toyota/lexus outsells honda/acura in canada, so how does honda/acura own the canadian market

gilboman

uh huh... strong stuff you've been snorting

gilboman

toyota has the new yaris and corolla in the compact market. and from the site you posted, you can see that toyota's compact offerings easily surpass the civic by a wide margin.

heyitsme

Belzebutt

It's too bad they had to make the tail lights so elaborate, I really like the simple Civic ones better, I find they actually look more upscale. Hopefully they look better in person.

MSZ

Cry me a fucking river. You are going to put yet another entirely different line(Yaris/Echo) there and tell me their offerings surpass one single Civic line. Look who has been snorting here.

The reason why I haven't posted the Civic coupe numbers yet because Honda America never released that. But unlike the "Corolla series" trick Toyota have been using for years, 7th gen Civic sedan and coupe are basically the same thing except the coupe has 2 less doors. Take the Matrix sales away from the sales chart and you will see Corolla was actually outsold by the Civic in the states.

Now you can throw in all "Corolla/Martix/Echo/tC outsold Civic" bullshit you want. I'm done with this topic.

iNteGraz92

the yaris is civic competition?
please just stop posting here.

gilboman

so you make up the idea the civic coupe outsells the scion tC

you said the civic coupe outsells the scion tC, so you just admit to saying something with absolutely no proof?

gilboman

well as evident in this thread, you have mentally unstable people saying toyota is in trouble, honda/acura owns toyota, toyota is having bad sales

and best of all the Accord,TSX,TL, RL all share the same platform apparently according to ricekid

but its nice to see you are still delousional. are you gonna come make up stuff like MSZ that can't be backed up so you go post some random numbers?

how bout you say Honda is world's leading PC maker but say the number's aren't available?

you know what..i'm gonna say Toyota is the world's largest starship maker, but like MSZ, i can't back it up... so i'll just post the population of toronto to back it up..um 4.4million

M TYPE X

They would like to be. The world's blandest starship maker.

gdcwatt

I didn't think that it was Canadian incomes were lower, but rather our expenditures are highter...+15% on the car, +15% on the insurance, +100% on gas, + 15% on service and parts, +300% on scotch, +15% on the tires and fancy rims... Take that $30,000 CSX, with leather and navi, and add $1,500 freight and PDI, plus $4720 in taxes (you probably missed the 15% on the freight and PDI), and you're coming very close to TSX territory.

And then, you add some salt to the wound, which makes a lot of Canadians wonder why they should buy a car which will rust away, in 7 or 8 years, to nothing. The new BMW 3 series is giving 12 years on rust perforation, which sounds like a negotiating point to me.

Looks like noboby's seen the CSX write-up in yesterday's Toronto Star Wheels Section. I thought I'd heard Lawrence Yap's words, "...accelerate with authority..." somewhere before.

youngTL

"coming very close to TSX territory" is an illusion, because the exact same thing happens to the TSX, or any car. So once you add those things to the TSX, it's still the same gap away.

deandorsey

first drive

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/pw/06csx.htm

F23A4

I'd just save some extra $$$ and get a TSX; it me short on power but it at least looks sharp.

heyitsme

Imo they really should have these extra options/features on the US civic to have the same features a Mazda 3 has. I'm not sure why Mazda can do it but Honda can't.

gdcwatt

YoungTL, just to clarify my comments: there was an American reference to Canadians always buying "cheaper" cars vs Americans, not Cdn TSX vs Cdn CSX.

corey415

Well, the most expensive CSX (highest trim/auto) has a price tag of $31,900 CAD. At today's exchange rate, that's $26,986.49 USD. For that price, I'd rather get an Acura TSX, which is made in Japan, has 50 more hp, available 6-speed manual, VSA/TCS, a longer warranty, 1 inch bigger wheels, and projector HID (instead of reflectors I believe that the CSX has).

heyitsme

Thats what I don't get. Mazda 3S Grand Touring offers comparable options to the most expensive CSX for 24k msrp. Being able to pick up a loaded Civic with all those options seems resonable enough at 24k considering you would most likely be able to deal under that.

Belzebutt

Oh crap so the CSX HIDs are reflectors?? That's really disappointing, I was wondering why none of the pics showed a projector type lens

F23A4

My Murano's projector HIDs are WAY better my Maxima's reflector type.

M TYPE X

The pricetag on this car is as high as the CN Tower!

feliz

Drove a CSX yesterday, nothing really stood out but I did like the paddle shifters. The car I drove had no window sticker, was non-navi and apparently sold for $30,000 CAN. Lougheed Acura in Vancouver have a bunch of them.

edit: I was suprised no power seat or homelink is available for this much$, not even as an option.

dysonlu

That's false logic in the automotive world -- you cannot simply use the exchange rate to speculate the price of the same car in the US and vice-versa. The real price in the US is almost always lower than the price in Canada. So, if the CSX was to be sold in the US, it'll most likely cost significantly less than $27K USD.

chungkopi

i just don't understand this move

dom

What move?

dallison

i'd prefer the tsx

derrick

There are A LOT of Canadians who are very brand conscious but don't want to spend the bucks. The CSX has the best of both worlds ... "Acura" name AND Honda Civic utility and fuel economy.

Who else would shell out $$$ to get a Civic with leather seats?

For a fully loaded CSX ... you're almost into TSX territory. TSX a much better buy (and built quality), IMHO. Just needs more grunt.

youngTL

I wonder how much faster the 06 TSX is than the 05? It's getting a power bump as I'm sure you're aware from exhaust and intake tweaks.

The TSX is a fair chunk more expensive though. It's almost $7000 more. If you get Navi on the CSX it's still $4500 more (and that's if you get the TSX without nav).

gdcwatt

By the time you add extra fuel for 200,000km of driving a TSX, and the [for the rest of us] 15% taxes on the $9,000 difference between the two cars, plus some financing costs, it's more like a $15,000 difference between the CSX and the TSX, over 7 or 8 years.

And for that kind of difference, there are a whole lot of other choices - so I still think the CSX is one hell of a performance-value package.

charliemike

The car is a dud, IMO.

Overpriced badge-engineering and the car is ugly too.

gilboman

that's some pretty messed up reasoning, that reasoning is like saying if i buy a daewoo now over 7years i save XXXXXX over an lexus IS

but you don't factor in that for that long period of time you are driving an ugly underpowered car that is not in the same class as the car you are comparing to. you have also not factored in any resale values as well so your figures dont work out.

you can only use this kind of logic in comparing two cars that are in the same class with similar comfort/power etc...

charliemike

And price

Belzebutt

Saw one at the dealership the other day, just from outside. IMO it does not look as good as the Civic, the rear lights especially. It's basically like a Civic rice-out in a not-too-taseful way. But it has all that extra stuff...

gdcwatt

Well, Gilboman, we aren't talking about a Daewoo vs a Lexus, but rather the obvious costs of a TSX vs CSX in non-Alberta Canada (ie. a double tax environment, in case you missed that: you don't have to finance the PST in Alberta), and the fact that one car doesn't need premium fuel, which is something like $.40 per gallon more than regular. I was merely pointing out that a TSX is significantly more than $7000 more than a CSX.

You might not be able to turn a pig into a race horse, but for $15,000 you can make an awefully fast pig. Of course, if you make those kinds of mods you'll likely need premium fuel, too.

F23A4

...the direction of this thread generally indicates that the CSX is probably car that Canadians (by far) appreciate more than Yanks. Admittedly (and assuming this thread is somewhat representative of that market in general), it seems that Honda is justified producing the CSX for up north customers and not for stateside customers.

Maybe Infiniti should reintroduce the G20 for Canadians.....

youngTL

I see a lot of G20's around. If it was priced cheaper, more people would have bought it (obviously). Canadians like stuff like that.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I really like all the gadgets in the new TSX, now all it needs is a stronger engine.

Type S Zero

in terms of volume, the EL was boosting the sales like no other model at acura. us market is sooo different than can market (ie : on vtec.net monthly sales reports, about 35 000 accords are sold monthly and only 25 000 civics..... canadian market is the complete opposite in ratio)
as mentionned above, canadians like smaller cars that are fuel efficient and easy to drive in the city and still have some luxury features.

csx is the first to offer Navi in that price range (voice commands the base tsx doesn't have)
the premium non navi has an in-dash 6 cd-changer reading MP3/WMA the tsx-tl-mdx can't have (even through options !)

also, TSX msrp when up again this year :

TSX m ..........$37 330
TSX a .........$38 630
TSX m navi...$40 130
TSX a navi....$41 430

csx m..............$26 680
csx a...............$27 980
csx p m...........$29 380
csx p a............$30 680
csx p m navi...$31 880
csx p a navi....$33 180

at the dealership i work, the first csx sold was a premium navi.

it has the K20 engine that was in the Si (EP3), so it's a nice boost from last EL's 127hp 1.7l
about the performance ? don't be so hard on it unless you have driven one.
it might not have the 200hp the tsx has, but it's lighter (about 400lbs lighter !) and you can really fell that lower weight in accelerating, braking and quick turns.

when lauching the csx, acura invited employees to drive it on a racetrack, and that's where we saw the real potential of the car. my mom has a 6mt TSX so i'm used to how it drives.... and let me tell you that some situations easily achieved with the csx would hardly be done with the tsx because it's wayyy too heavy. i'm not saying the csx is better performing than the tsx, but it's close behind. the biggest difference on feel, is that the tsx feels more stable in fast highway exits and entries (big fast turns).

in conclusion, this car really has its place on the canadian market. acura made its homework and delivered the right stuff.