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Update received from ZF regarding 9 speed software update

 
Old 07-21-2015, 12:39 PM
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Update received from ZF regarding 9 speed software update

I know this is not much, but when I couldn't get a definite answer from Acura, I went to ZF. Below is the response.



Wes Beard reviewed ZF Aftermarket US & Canada


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I drive a 2015 Acura TLX, and the way the transmission performs is terrible: not suitable for a luxury car. I have read so many articles about this transmission, and the other issues with other manufacturers. ZF states it is merely a software issue, but Acura has yet to release a permanent fix.
I want to love the transmission performance as much as I love the rest of the car. Do you know if and when a solution will be brought forward for the TLX 9 speed transmission? Acura states they are working with the OEM on a solution (presumably ZF).
Thanks for any insight or help. I have had this car since December, and everyday I drive it, I am so focused on preparing for the jerky shifts that I can't enjoy the rest of the car.

ZF Aftermarket US & Canada
Commercial & Industrial





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    ZF Aftermarket US & Canada Hello Mr. Beard,

    Currently software updates are available based on vehicles’ VINs and production dates. Your local dealership should have all the latest updates. Acura and ZF are working diligently to write the necessary software to correct shift quality issues. Unfortunately we do not have a definitive date of when the update will be available for your vehicle, but your dealership will have access to it as soon as it’s ready. Please continue to check back with them for the latest updates.
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      Wes Beard Thank you so much for the response. I am very pleased to hear that the two companies are working together to fix this, and that the current state of the transmission is not the final state.
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Old 07-21-2015, 12:49 PM
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awesome! hopefully it will be sooner than later for our models.
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Old 07-21-2015, 02:59 PM
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Posting on a company Facebook page or by PM is a great way to get a company to reply. I tried reaching my cable company by all of the "preferred" methods (phone and email) with no luck. Sent a PM on Facebook and got a reply in about 15 minutes....someone then called my house to schedule a repair.

Thank you for contacting them and posting.
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Old 07-21-2015, 07:42 PM
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ATXTLX -- this is very, very helpful. Thanks for the legwork and for reporting to the community.
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Old 07-21-2015, 08:01 PM
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I am so happy to hear that ZF is involved in this process too; not just Acura.
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Old 07-21-2015, 08:12 PM
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Although I don't have the same drastic shifts as some others experience, I would like the transmission to shift a little smoother in the lower gears. I'm sure this is a hot topic between the 2 companies and with more models going to 9 and even more gears it's something they'll want to get fixed sooner rather than later.
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Old 07-21-2015, 08:38 PM
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I am told no updates are available for my car or rather, my car is up to date when they run the diagnostic check
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Old 07-21-2015, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Stew4HD View Post
I am told no updates are available for my car or rather, my car is up to date when they run the diagnostic check
Per ZF, the software update is in the works. Nothing has been released yet. Whether this comes in 2 weeks, 8 weeks, or 120 weeks, no one seems to know.
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Old 07-21-2015, 10:36 PM
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My 2 cents.... Acura made a strategic mistake in deciding they needed a new transmission for the TLX. The car would have been a great seller with a carry over 6-speed. But they wanted better MPG and some marketing points to make. Problem was they didn't have an in-house project thanks to under funding their R&D. So they went to ZF and ZF sold them a smoldering pile of BS about this 9-speed. They sold everyone, not just Acura, on this transmission. Acura got themselves in a bind relying on ZF for this product and fully a year after the TLX was released they (ZF) still can't get this thing right. I bet there have been more 4-letter words dropped in Torrance related to ZF than could be imagined.

But in the end Acura has to take responsibility. In hindsight it may have been a mistake, but now they need to fix it and posting something in facebook a year after the car goes on sale is not exactly owning up to the problem.

Meanwhile the 8DCT is all on them. As they develop their own new transmission (I hear it might be a 10 speed.. wtf?) they have damaged their reputation. This looks all too familiar when it comes to Honda/Acura and transmissions.

I really really want Acura to resolve this because I want the TLX to be my next car. But a year to update the software???? What is really going on Acura?
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Old 07-22-2015, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocket_man View Post
My 2 cents.... Acura made a strategic mistake in deciding they needed a new transmission for the TLX. The car would have been a great seller with a carry over 6-speed. But they wanted better MPG and some marketing points to make. Problem was they didn't have an in-house project thanks to under funding their R&D. So they went to ZF and ZF sold them a smoldering pile of BS about this 9-speed. They sold everyone, not just Acura, on this transmission. Acura got themselves in a bind relying on ZF for this product and fully a year after the TLX was released they (ZF) still can't get this thing right. I bet there have been more 4-letter words dropped in Torrance related to ZF than could be imagined.

But in the end Acura has to take responsibility. In hindsight it may have been a mistake, but now they need to fix it and posting something in facebook a year after the car goes on sale is not exactly owning up to the problem.

Meanwhile the 8DCT is all on them. As they develop their own new transmission (I hear it might be a 10 speed.. wtf?) they have damaged their reputation. This looks all too familiar when it comes to Honda/Acura and transmissions.

I really really want Acura to resolve this because I want the TLX to be my next car. But a year to update the software???? What is really going on Acura?

Rocket , you nailed it !
TLX with the carry over 6 speed would have been the perfect car for me !
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Old 07-22-2015, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Momyc View Post
Rocket , you nailed it !
TLX with the carry over 6 speed would have been the perfect car for me !
Ditto
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Old 07-22-2015, 11:26 AM
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Love my 9 speed and good gas mileage!
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Old 07-22-2015, 03:17 PM
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Quandry, I sure tried to love mine and even tried to overlook this issue but after a while.. just got tired of it.

Especially bad after all I went through to get her
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Old 07-22-2015, 06:44 PM
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I shared my experience with the then new Infiniti 7AT in the ZF 9 Speed transmission discussion before the TLX came out but it didn't get any attention.

Basically I think anything more than 6 speeds is too many. Infiniti released 3 software updates over 3 years and it doesn't still feel right. Gear hunting, rough downshift and downshift hesitation are main concerns with the 7AT unit.

9sp is too many gears.
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Old 07-22-2015, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by hadokenuh View Post
I shared my experience with the then new Infiniti 7AT in the ZF 9 Speed transmission discussion before the TLX came out but it didn't get any attention.

Basically I think anything more than 6 speeds is too many. Infiniti released 3 software updates over 3 years and it doesn't still feel right. Gear hunting, rough downshift and downshift hesitation are main concerns with the 7AT unit.

9sp is too many gears.
Right there with you.

But over time my G37 w/7AT has come around (or at least Ive been able to adjust to how it drives). At least Infiniti fixed the more glaring issues like the lag when coasting and then trying to get back on the throttle.

6 speed IS the sweet spot. Hell, my wifes 2003TL w/5AT still gets 20mpg city. It aint THAT much worse than the 9AT, at least city mpg wise.
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Old 07-23-2015, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by chris03tl View Post
Right there with you.

But over time my G37 w/7AT has come around (or at least Ive been able to adjust to how it drives). At least Infiniti fixed the more glaring issues like the lag when coasting and then trying to get back on the throttle.

6 speed IS the sweet spot. Hell, my wifes 2003TL w/5AT still gets 20mpg city. It aint THAT much worse than the 9AT, at least city mpg wise.


You're right.. between my 2009 TL (5 speed !!) and TLX (on Sport+ , like I said I cannot drive it otherwise) on the city TLX is only 2 mpg better which I don't care vs what I lost on driving dynamics...


Yes , on highway the TLX is much better , but again my daily commute is 40/60(City/Highway) , but the highway portion is bumper to bumper , so not too much gain there either.

Last edited by Momyc; 07-23-2015 at 07:49 AM.
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Old 07-23-2015, 07:54 AM
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Honda/Acura did NOT really "do us all a favor" by giving us more mpg.

They are really only concerned with meeting CAFE requirements (requirements which I dont agree with, but it is what it is). So eeking that last 0.5mpg out on some not-even-close-to-real-world test by the government is their goal. Better highway mpg for consumers is just a happy side effect, possibly negated by unhappy side effects like a transmission that cant figure out WTF gear to be in.

What I find ironic is that there are manufacturers out there that actually have gas guzzlers they need to account for in CAFE rules, but those manufacturers havent resorted to 9 speed automatics. All Honda/Acura has that "guzzles" fuel is the Pilot/MDX and eventually the NSX. They should easily be able to meet the overall CAFE average without needing fancy electronics and lots of gears in a transmission.
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Old 07-23-2015, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocket_man View Post
My 2 cents.... Acura made a strategic mistake in deciding they needed a new transmission for the TLX. The car would have been a great seller with a carry over 6-speed. But they wanted better MPG and some marketing points to make. Problem was they didn't have an in-house project thanks to under funding their R&D. So they went to ZF and ZF sold them a smoldering pile of BS about this 9-speed. They sold everyone, not just Acura, on this transmission. Acura got themselves in a bind relying on ZF for this product and fully a year after the TLX was released they (ZF) still can't get this thing right. I bet there have been more 4-letter words dropped in Torrance related to ZF than could be imagined.

But in the end Acura has to take responsibility. In hindsight it may have been a mistake, but now they need to fix it and posting something in facebook a year after the car goes on sale is not exactly owning up to the problem.

Meanwhile the 8DCT is all on them. As they develop their own new transmission (I hear it might be a 10 speed.. wtf?) they have damaged their reputation. This looks all too familiar when it comes to Honda/Acura and transmissions.

I really really want Acura to resolve this because I want the TLX to be my next car. But a year to update the software???? What is really going on Acura?
Yes! In the TLX we have a better looking car than the TL and TSX, it's quieter, faster, more efficient, and has a nicer interior but this transmission really lets it down. When I drive service loaners with the 6AT it feels like an athlete on caffeine in comparison, it's eager and responsive. Instead, I don't really enjoy driving this car as much as I wish I did with this wet blanket of a trans. holding it back.
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Old 07-23-2015, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by jeich182 View Post
Yes! In the TLX we have a better looking car than the TL and TSX, it's quieter, faster, more efficient, and has a nicer interior but this transmission really lets it down. When I drive service loaners with the 6AT it feels like an athlete on caffeine in comparison, it's eager and responsive. Instead, I don't really enjoy driving this car as much as I wish I did with this wet blanket of a trans. holding it back.
I feel the same. I think the car, itself, is beautifully designed, rides great, all the bells and whistles I even needed (except HUD) but It is no longer a pleasure to drive. The longer that I have been put off by Acura, the less I like it.

If I wasn't a huge loss on the car stage, I'd move to something else.
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Old 07-23-2015, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Stew4HD View Post
I feel the same. I think the car, itself, is beautifully designed, rides great, all the bells and whistles I even needed (except HUD) but It is no longer a pleasure to drive. The longer that I have been put off by Acura, the less I like it.

If I wasn't a huge loss on the car stage, I'd move to something else.


Ditto !!!
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Old 07-23-2015, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Momyc View Post
Ditto !!!
I agree 100%... The transmission and vibration problems make this car the worst driving car I have ever purchased. Ponder this... In stop and go city traffic I get to enjoy the rough and clunky gear hunting and horrible 2-3 up shift over and over. Then, when I finally get to open her up and cruise down the highway, I get to sit in a cabin that shakes so bad that it can clearly be seen on an iPhone video. I never thought I would be trying to get OUT of brand new Acura.
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Old 07-24-2015, 06:04 AM
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For the record: I just turned in a 2015 Chrysler 200 (not a bad car overall) rental that I had for a day. It has the same 9 speed zf transmission - in the 100 miles or so I drove it there were 3 or 4 times when it jerked like a monster while shifting from 1 to 2. It wasn't like the little bump I sometimes get in the cold with my DCT - it was a substantial jerk.
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Old 07-24-2015, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by mojo_79 View Post
The transmission and vibration problems make this car the worst driving car I have ever purchased....... I never thought I would be trying to get OUT of brand new Acura.
Your frustration is noted, but somewhere underneath these problems is a fine car. Disposing of the car will be costly so keep working with your dealer to resolve the problems. I suggest this because my car does not exhibit these symptoms so something must be different and potentially can be resolved. This is the best driving car (of 21 including 2 MB's & 1 Infiniti) I have ever purchased.
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Old 07-24-2015, 09:50 AM
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Agree 100% with Quandry!

Originally Posted by Quandry View Post
Your frustration is noted, but somewhere underneath these problems is a fine car. Disposing of the car will be costly so keep working with your dealer to resolve the problems. I suggest this because my car does not exhibit these symptoms so something must be different and potentially can be resolved. This is the best driving car (of 21 including 2 MB's & 1 Infiniti) I have ever purchased.
BEST Acura I've had; 6 since 1998!
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Old 07-24-2015, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Quandry View Post
Your frustration is noted, but somewhere underneath these problems is a fine car. Disposing of the car will be costly so keep working with your dealer to resolve the problems. I suggest this because my car does not exhibit these symptoms so something must be different and potentially can be resolved. This is the best driving car (of 21 including 2 MB's & 1 Infiniti) I have ever purchased.
It's the kinds of issues we are having that make the expression "One Oh SHIT wipes out 1000 atta-boys" When the car does not shift properly and Acura Customer Relations keeps saying, "Sorry, no fix for it nor is there one upcoming" wipes out the "fine car" underneath.

You know it must be bad for me to turn against the car. I want nothing more than to drive my car to the dealership and toss then the key fobs and take my business elsewhere.

When a relationship goes sour, it's near impossible to regain that good feeling.
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Old 07-24-2015, 12:00 PM
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I feel your pain Stew, especially after having being labeled a fanboy for writing so many positive posts. But never give up, maybe they will surprise you.
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Old 07-26-2015, 07:52 AM
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I agree with all of you guys....the 6 speed unit from the TL was great and should have been used in the TLX. That being said, we all know that had they dumped the 6 speed unit into the TLX, Acura would have been blasted for using an archeic transmission with ONLY 6 speed.

Th eproblem is that car companies have to react to IDIOTS, and I will say it again, IDIOTS car reviewers, many of whom should not be given any attention whatsoever. How many reviews have we seen about the TLX that they got the facts all backward, mixing transmission etc, yet these are the people that car companies worry about because they have the power to influence the market.

Perfect example, the bashing Acura took about the abundance of buttons so they reacted by coming out with the dual screen. Now, the reviews on the Accord talks about how Honda should have done what Ford did by bringing back the trusted buttons and knobs?!? I mean come on!? We have been saying all along that buttons are the way to go.

While people may not like the look of the IS350 F-Sport with its aggresive fascia, I have the AWD version with an archeic 6 speed unit that shifts so smoothly, a cockpit that has the right amount of buttons for teh essential stuff and an intuitive (for me) mouse for other applications and I can tell you, I am not upset that I sat on the TLX for now....
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Old 07-26-2015, 10:52 AM
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On the top model, Advance/Elite, there is not one more button that I want or need. I can appreciate the need for them on the other models. The designers were caught in a trap; one car and two different physical layouts, or design for the top model and compromise the lower.

I would suggest the problem will be solved with the 2016 is all the models have the Auto control features of the top 2015 models.

But this is off topic from the thread title.
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Old 07-27-2015, 08:05 AM
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HUGE , gigantic let down. I drove to my Acura dealership, and spoke with my service manager. This "new" TSB is apparently the same update that was applied to most of our TLXs months ago. She told me it is no different, and she refused to hook my car up for the update. Please let me know if any of you have this same response.
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Old 07-27-2015, 10:51 AM
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ATXTLX: I get that you are upset and disappointed, but I think that there are a few threads and websites that you missed in posting you displeasure!
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Old 07-27-2015, 10:59 AM
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Yup, it's pretty obvious I am P.O.'ed.
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Old 07-27-2015, 11:50 AM
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^^^
Maybe it's time to go the Lemon Law route?
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Old 07-27-2015, 11:55 AM
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Suit has already been filed. Hoping this would get resolved before, but something needs to be done.
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Old 07-27-2015, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ATXTLX View Post
HUGE , gigantic let down. I drove to my Acura dealership, and spoke with my service manager. This "new" TSB is apparently the same update that was applied to most of our TLXs months ago. She told me it is no different, and she refused to hook my car up for the update. Please let me know if any of you have this same response.
I can tell you're very upset, but I don't know why she refused to connect to determine if your car was fully up to date. I looked at the TSB and it states that 1 of the databases was dated June 25, 2015 so unless you were in barely 1 month ago you may not have the correct firmware.

At the very least, she should have connected to verify beyond any shadow of a doubt that you were up to date. Not to mention, it stated that if the system was interrupted it may not learn the parameters. I'd do some more calling, perhaps to a different dealer close to see what they say.

Regardless, it sucks that you and others are having any shift-related issues to begin with.
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Old 07-27-2015, 04:46 PM
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I got another appointment for tomorrow morning, for Acura to verify what software version I have. I checked my service invoices, and the last TCM update was done on February 27th. I can't imagine this is the exact same version. I also checks P/N versions, and they are completely. I am hoping this was a mistake by my dealership.

Please let me know what your experiences are, if / when you take in your TLXs.

Thanks!

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Old 07-27-2015, 05:08 PM
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Seems like you have already burned your bridges with the dealer, and filed paperwork and they may not want to touch the car at this point. Slim chance but hopefully your appointment will yield something positive.

You must be in the US and Canada has not gotten any of the TSB's.
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Old 07-27-2015, 06:58 PM
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I was told by my service guy that there is no new TSB for the transmission.
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Old 07-27-2015, 08:54 PM
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That is just incredibly unfortunate.
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Old 07-27-2015, 10:17 PM
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Lets see how the new update is since they're claiming that it's to fix what seems to be tranny issues
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Old 07-28-2015, 08:21 AM
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Both are correct. I had the procedure / update completed on my car this morning. The procedure actually updates how the car acts after the idle-learn. From my past experiences, the car is fine after an idle-relearn, but then reverts back to its nasty habits. Maybe this update will actually prevent that from happening. I am not going to update about the results for a bit. No jinxing!
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