Should I ???
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Should I ???
Hey fellow TL lovers, here but been lurking for some time now. I have a dilemma and need some feedback:
I have an '09 shawd non tech w/ 24.5k miles in clean condition and personally near excellent condition. I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on '13 w/ the manual tranny, black on black. I currently owe 19k and they're giving me 20.5k for my '09 and they're selling the '13 for 40k. I think I could knock another 500 or 1k off though. I pay 500 out my pocket. This will be a lease to own most likely as I feel I'll be throwing money away on a lease IMO. I always wanted a manual w/ awd and had the opportunity to test drive the beast over the weekend. SHE RIPS!!! I'm in love.
I also heard Acura will introduce the 5th gen in June of this year w/ the TLX badge. So I don't know whether to wait but I don't like the direction Acura is going with their hidden exhausts now and I'm not sure if the TLX will even come w/ a manual tranny. I'm also considering Audi S5, albeit a used one.
What should I do? Thoughts? Thanks in advance!
I have an '09 shawd non tech w/ 24.5k miles in clean condition and personally near excellent condition. I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on '13 w/ the manual tranny, black on black. I currently owe 19k and they're giving me 20.5k for my '09 and they're selling the '13 for 40k. I think I could knock another 500 or 1k off though. I pay 500 out my pocket. This will be a lease to own most likely as I feel I'll be throwing money away on a lease IMO. I always wanted a manual w/ awd and had the opportunity to test drive the beast over the weekend. SHE RIPS!!! I'm in love.
I also heard Acura will introduce the 5th gen in June of this year w/ the TLX badge. So I don't know whether to wait but I don't like the direction Acura is going with their hidden exhausts now and I'm not sure if the TLX will even come w/ a manual tranny. I'm also considering Audi S5, albeit a used one.
What should I do? Thoughts? Thanks in advance!
#2
Advanced
The tlx looks to be on the same chassis as the new accord. But I also heard that a coupe tlx might be in be works. I would prob wait since ur current ride is near perfect. You could always find a Clean 2013 if the new tlx doesn't appeal to you.
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TeamAcura (03-11-2013)
#3
Burning Brakes
Based on the financials that your post stated, I don't think you should make the move. I would concentrate on getting that '09 paid or at least significantly reducing the debt on a 4 year old car. By getting the new car, all you're doing is prolonging the debt load for yourself. Just my 2 cents worth.
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TeamAcura (03-11-2013)
#5
Suzuka Master
I would be shocked if the TLX was released this year. As much as I want one I don't think we will see it for 12 months. There has not been a single spy shot of one yet nor a peep from Acura and everyone that thinks they know someone with information seems to be saying same thing, it will be shown later this year and then released early 2014 as a 2015 model. I have been so on the fence right now that I am about to pull the trigger on a 13 Accord Touring and dive that for 10-12 months until I know what is up with the TLX then give the Accord to the gf at that time. That buys me the big option to wait and see the TLX, the 14 Genesis and the 14 Q70 (M37) while I save a few bucks and not have to worry about what to do when my lease is up in a few months. Also will give the TLX a few months to be out so I can get a decent price on it.
#7
This^
Trending Topics
#8
CTSV,TL, Audi Q7 & A5SB
Hey fellow TL lovers, here but been lurking for some time now. I have a dilemma and need some feedback:
I have an '09 shawd non tech w/ 24.5k miles in clean condition and personally near excellent condition. I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on '13 w/ the manual tranny, black on black. I currently owe 19k and they're giving me 20.5k for my '09 and they're selling the '13 for 40k. I think I could knock another 500 or 1k off though. I pay 500 out my pocket. This will be a lease to own most likely as I feel I'll be throwing money away on a lease IMO. I always wanted a manual w/ awd and had the opportunity to test drive the beast over the weekend. SHE RIPS!!! I'm in love.
I also heard Acura will introduce the 5th gen in June of this year w/ the TLX badge. So I don't know whether to wait but I don't like the direction Acura is going with their hidden exhausts now and I'm not sure if the TLX will even come w/ a manual tranny. I'm also considering Audi S5, albeit a used one.
What should I do? Thoughts? Thanks in advance!
I have an '09 shawd non tech w/ 24.5k miles in clean condition and personally near excellent condition. I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on '13 w/ the manual tranny, black on black. I currently owe 19k and they're giving me 20.5k for my '09 and they're selling the '13 for 40k. I think I could knock another 500 or 1k off though. I pay 500 out my pocket. This will be a lease to own most likely as I feel I'll be throwing money away on a lease IMO. I always wanted a manual w/ awd and had the opportunity to test drive the beast over the weekend. SHE RIPS!!! I'm in love.
I also heard Acura will introduce the 5th gen in June of this year w/ the TLX badge. So I don't know whether to wait but I don't like the direction Acura is going with their hidden exhausts now and I'm not sure if the TLX will even come w/ a manual tranny. I'm also considering Audi S5, albeit a used one.
What should I do? Thoughts? Thanks in advance!
At this point I would even be happy if Acura just released info and photos by June to end all the speculation.
#10
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I heard from the dealer. Take it with a grain of salt. I would not be surprised if they introduce it in June/July though and it would start going on sale this fall. This also gives the new RLX its time to shine until the new TL/TLX is introduced. All signs lead to it: extended $1,500 cash incentive and they knock out 4k off MSRP on all new '13 TLs only. A fully loaded TL for 40k is bargain compared to its competitors. To me, that means they are trying to unload their current inventory to make room for the '14. Of course what I'm saying is just my own theory.
#11
Suzuka Master
Still don't see it coming this year, but we will see. The discounts are due to crappy sales. They need to sell some cars to keep the line loving and people employed. Also they have to compete with the G37 as it is getting blown out so cheap if Acura did not do these discounts they would not be selling anything.
#12
Racer
Based on the financials that your post stated, I don't think you should make the move. I would concentrate on getting that '09 paid or at least significantly reducing the debt on a 4 year old car. By getting the new car, all you're doing is prolonging the debt load for yourself. Just my 2 cents worth.
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TeamAcura (03-11-2013)
#13
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I appreciate the feedback fellas. I'm really tempted though since I will only be paying $59 more on top of my monthly payment with $500 out of pocket. I'm happy with my ride now but also know I'd be interested in a new car later down the road. I have some time to think about it but keep the comments coming please! It will help me out a lot in my decision.
#14
TeamAcura...As KeithL and Potmilkz have stated, I am also on the camp that says Acura will not release the TLX until next spring at the earliest. We would have seen hidden pics, camo shots etc....I would say that if I were you, wait until we start seeing some spy pics of the TLX (or prototype) and make an informed decision then. Chances are, you will be able to put your hand on a remaining 2013 model or possibly a 2014 with great deal as the TLX will be introduced as a 2015 model (to hit the showroom in the spring of 2014)....My best guess.
#16
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
wait
#17
Three Wheelin'
I would agree with most everyone that a June release this year of a 5g TLX is highly unlikely. I could perhaps see October (my wishes due to lease expiration) but most likely late Spring of 2014. To the OP, not sure what your other financial obligations are but if you really want and can afford the car go for it. To move from your current vehicle to aw one with Tech package is a significant improvement.
#18
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Hey guys, after some thought I've decided to stay with the '09. I've got positive equity and in no rush to get a new one. Thanks everyone for the comments. It played a big part in my decision. That and the insurance was an extra 800 a year along with extra 700 a year on payments was enough to hold up on the trade. It wasn't worth it for me; not right now anyway.
And I still think they will reveal the new TLX this summer!
And I still think they will reveal the new TLX this summer!
#19
^^ They may reveal it, but revealing and releasing are two different things
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Vidol642 (03-12-2013)
#21
Suzuka Master
I appreciate the feedback fellas. I'm really tempted though since I will only be paying $59 more on top of my monthly payment with $500 out of pocket. I'm happy with my ride now but also know I'd be interested in a new car later down the road. I have some time to think about it but keep the comments coming please! It will help me out a lot in my decision.
#22
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
#23
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Well guys, I ended up trading up my '09 in for a '13 6MT in BWP (the color I always wanted). I know I went against what most of you advised but this dealer gave me an offer I couldn't refuse. After it's all said and done they sold it to me for $37.5K. I really thought hard about waiting for the TL(X) but I know I wouldn't buy it right away and there's too much uncertainy as far as looks, transmission, price, etc. Also, I was not underwater and they gave me $3K more than what I owe. There were no intentions of me keeping my '09 for that long anyhow and figure now is best time to trade up. I'm planning on keeping her for a long time as well. I'm leaving work early tommorrow to pick it up. I was supposed to pick it up today but the weather is shitty and I don't wanna drive my new baby in this weather.
#24
Sounds like your the perfect candidate for a lease, too many people think its throwing money away... but if you like to have a new car every 2-4 years its a waste to buy the vehicle.
Lets assume a sale price of 41k all in.
Buying the car gives you a $755 monthly payment @ a 3.9 APR
Lets say you lease the same vehicle and get a agressive deal. - which I was just quoted @550 per month
3 years go buy and you want a new car, you would have a payoff of about $17500.
assuming the dealer is going to give $21000, I just walked away with $3500
my total of payments on the loan was $27,180 minus the 3500 I got back that puts me at 23,680
my total of payments on the lease was $19,800
Thats means I lost almost 4k by buying the vehicle.
Its very hard to beat an agressive lease if you want a new car every 2-4 years.
Lets assume a sale price of 41k all in.
Buying the car gives you a $755 monthly payment @ a 3.9 APR
Lets say you lease the same vehicle and get a agressive deal. - which I was just quoted @550 per month
3 years go buy and you want a new car, you would have a payoff of about $17500.
assuming the dealer is going to give $21000, I just walked away with $3500
my total of payments on the loan was $27,180 minus the 3500 I got back that puts me at 23,680
my total of payments on the lease was $19,800
Thats means I lost almost 4k by buying the vehicle.
Its very hard to beat an agressive lease if you want a new car every 2-4 years.
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TeamAcura (03-19-2013)
#25
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
dturboman, I'm thinking the same thing LOL. The smart move is to buy it out after the lease. This way you will not incur any additional charges with the wear and tear of the vehicle over the duration of the term. Also, chances are you will be right at or above the sale price in the used car market. And you could always trade up and it's almost certain you will have positive equity in the vehicle. If your in the market for a new upscale/luxury car, leasing is the way to go IMO unless you're rich then money wouldn't be in issue.
Also, these dealers always start high with the lease. I'm way too familiar with that 500ish a month. Lowested I was quoted was 430 a month for 12k miles a year, 36 months. I always tell myself, don't be scared to tell them the price you want or I walk out and keep shopping. I went thru 4 dealers to get within my price range.
Also, these dealers always start high with the lease. I'm way too familiar with that 500ish a month. Lowested I was quoted was 430 a month for 12k miles a year, 36 months. I always tell myself, don't be scared to tell them the price you want or I walk out and keep shopping. I went thru 4 dealers to get within my price range.
Last edited by TeamAcura; 03-19-2013 at 10:21 AM.
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dturboman (03-19-2013)
#27
Sounds like your the perfect candidate for a lease, too many people think its throwing money away... but if you like to have a new car every 2-4 years its a waste to buy the vehicle.
Lets assume a sale price of 41k all in.
Buying the car gives you a $755 monthly payment @ a 3.9 APR
Lets say you lease the same vehicle and get a agressive deal. - which I was just quoted @550 per month
3 years go buy and you want a new car, you would have a payoff of about $17500.
assuming the dealer is going to give $21000, I just walked away with $3500
my total of payments on the loan was $27,180 minus the 3500 I got back that puts me at 23,680
my total of payments on the lease was $19,800
Thats means I lost almost 4k by buying the vehicle.
Its very hard to beat an agressive lease if you want a new car every 2-4 years.
Lets assume a sale price of 41k all in.
Buying the car gives you a $755 monthly payment @ a 3.9 APR
Lets say you lease the same vehicle and get a agressive deal. - which I was just quoted @550 per month
3 years go buy and you want a new car, you would have a payoff of about $17500.
assuming the dealer is going to give $21000, I just walked away with $3500
my total of payments on the loan was $27,180 minus the 3500 I got back that puts me at 23,680
my total of payments on the lease was $19,800
Thats means I lost almost 4k by buying the vehicle.
Its very hard to beat an agressive lease if you want a new car every 2-4 years.
LOAN
--------------
Purchase all-in: $41k
Loan Rate: 1.74% (Pen Fed, for instance), 60mo - $714/mo
3 years, trade in value (using Edmunds TMV for a 2010 SH-AWD): $23,000
3 years, payoff: $16139
$23,000-$16139 = $6861
Payments for 36 months: $714*36 = $25704
Total cost, 3 years: $25704-$6861 = $18843
LEASE:
------------
Using your $550/mo, that means $19800
So leasing cost was ~$1k more than buying, all said.
All that said, if you know you are going to buy / lease another car in 3 years, leasing may still be preferable for you, as it is a bit more deterministic, but I wouldn't say it would necessarily be cheaper.
Of course, if you are in one of the few states (e.g. MI) that charges sales tax on the whole vehicle purchase price, not the net purchase price sans trade-in, then that would be a negative for purchasing.
#28
I'm not sure your numbers make sense; here is what I see running through numbers:
LOAN
--------------
Purchase all-in: $41k
Loan Rate: 1.74% (Pen Fed, for instance), 60mo - $714/mo
3 years, trade in value (using Edmunds TMV for a 2010 SH-AWD): $23,000
3 years, payoff: $16139
$23,000-$16139 = $6861
Payments for 36 months: $714*36 = $25704
Total cost, 3 years: $25704-$6861 = $18843
LEASE:
------------
Using your $550/mo, that means $19800
So leasing cost was ~$1k more than buying, all said.
All that said, if you know you are going to buy / lease another car in 3 years, leasing may still be preferable for you, as it is a bit more deterministic, but I wouldn't say it would necessarily be cheaper.
Of course, if you are in one of the few states (e.g. MI) that charges sales tax on the whole vehicle purchase price, not the net purchase price sans trade-in, then that would be a negative for purchasing.
LOAN
--------------
Purchase all-in: $41k
Loan Rate: 1.74% (Pen Fed, for instance), 60mo - $714/mo
3 years, trade in value (using Edmunds TMV for a 2010 SH-AWD): $23,000
3 years, payoff: $16139
$23,000-$16139 = $6861
Payments for 36 months: $714*36 = $25704
Total cost, 3 years: $25704-$6861 = $18843
LEASE:
------------
Using your $550/mo, that means $19800
So leasing cost was ~$1k more than buying, all said.
All that said, if you know you are going to buy / lease another car in 3 years, leasing may still be preferable for you, as it is a bit more deterministic, but I wouldn't say it would necessarily be cheaper.
Of course, if you are in one of the few states (e.g. MI) that charges sales tax on the whole vehicle purchase price, not the net purchase price sans trade-in, then that would be a negative for purchasing.
http://www.edmunds.com/acura/tl/2010...e-results.html
2010 TH Sh tech 36k, clean condition.
True Market Value®
Trade-in Dealer Retail
$21,850 $24,825
private party is 23,113
In my region finding a 1.74 rate for most will not happen, My best local CU will run a 2.99 -3.99
Also the leases have gotten even more agressive, I've seen a few Sub 500 payments with nothing out of pocket on SH tech with top tier credit.
That alone chops nearly 2k off your total investment
#29
Also that 41k price all is based on incentives that state "Must finance through Acura Financial Services." Sure you can go to another bank, but dont count on getting those same incentives.
#30
not sure where you're getting a trade in that high, Edmunds shows the following
http://www.edmunds.com/acura/tl/2010...e-results.html
2010 TH Sh tech 36k, clean condition.
True Market Value®
Trade-in Dealer Retail
$21,850 $24,825
private party is 23,113
In my region finding a 1.74 rate for most will not happen, My best local CU will run a 2.99 -3.99
Also the leases have gotten even more agressive, I've seen a few Sub 500 payments with nothing out of pocket on SH tech with top tier credit.
That alone chops nearly 2k off your total investment
http://www.edmunds.com/acura/tl/2010...e-results.html
2010 TH Sh tech 36k, clean condition.
True Market Value®
Trade-in Dealer Retail
$21,850 $24,825
private party is 23,113
In my region finding a 1.74 rate for most will not happen, My best local CU will run a 2.99 -3.99
Also the leases have gotten even more agressive, I've seen a few Sub 500 payments with nothing out of pocket on SH tech with top tier credit.
That alone chops nearly 2k off your total investment
And the Pen Fed is an internet based credit union, and open to anyone ($15 donation required). But even at 2.99-3.99, it still works out better - especially w/the manual + tech.
So, for the manual transmission, it is actually closer to a $3k positive on the buy side, slightly less for a loan at 2.99-3.99%.
#31
That would be one hell of a discount without the dealer using any supplied insinuative programs
44080 sicker
6000 discount
add back in 2865.60 in sales tax and DMV fees based on Philly area.
40945.60 total price.
#32
CTSV,TL, Audi Q7 & A5SB
Well guys, I ended up trading up my '09 in for a '13 6MT in BWP (the color I always wanted). I know I went against what most of you advised but this dealer gave me an offer I couldn't refuse. After it's all said and done they sold it to me for $37.5K. I really thought hard about waiting for the TL(X) but I know I wouldn't buy it right away and there's too much uncertainy as far as looks, transmission, price, etc. Also, I was not underwater and they gave me $3K more than what I owe. There were no intentions of me keeping my '09 for that long anyhow and figure now is best time to trade up. I'm planning on keeping her for a long time as well. I'm leaving work early tommorrow to pick it up. I was supposed to pick it up today but the weather is shitty and I don't wanna drive my new baby in this weather.
I would have also waited if the weather was crappy. Congrats with the new TL.
#33
You did not select the SH-AWD. You ran the numbers on a base FWD car. Run the numbers on the SH-AWD, and it is $23k. If you select the manual transmission, it is $25k. There is a drop-down box for the various trim levels.
And the Pen Fed is an internet based credit union, and open to anyone ($15 donation required). But even at 2.99-3.99, it still works out better - especially w/the manual + tech.
So, for the manual transmission, it is actually closer to a $3k positive on the buy side, slightly less for a loan at 2.99-3.99%.
And the Pen Fed is an internet based credit union, and open to anyone ($15 donation required). But even at 2.99-3.99, it still works out better - especially w/the manual + tech.
So, for the manual transmission, it is actually closer to a $3k positive on the buy side, slightly less for a loan at 2.99-3.99%.
if you use anything other than AFS your going to miss out on 1500 owner loyalty/conquest cash
which means your paying closer to 43000
@
1.74 - 748 per month - total of payments 26,928
2.99 - 772 per month - total of payments 27,791
3.99 - 791 per month - total of payments 28,476
So even if you were to go with Pen fed @ 1.74 I would have a 16,200 pay off in 3 years, dealer gives me 23k I walk away with 6800 bucks
my total investment was 20128 @ 1.74
@2.9 it was 20,991
@3.9 it was 21,676
If i went with the original lease offer I dropped 19,800 bucks.
if I went with a more agressive lease @ 500 per month which seems to whats popping up now, I've spent 18000.
The best case would be to take it through AFS and refi to a 1.74 a few months down the road, but you're talking total savings over the lease of nearly nothing.
Not to mention the fact of the assume trade in price may drop substantially, its a risk.
#35
Burning Brakes
Well guys, I ended up trading up my '09 in for a '13 6MT in BWP (the color I always wanted). I know I went against what most of you advised but this dealer gave me an offer I couldn't refuse.... There were no intentions of me keeping my '09 for that long anyhow and figure now is best time to trade up.
Glad you came to a decision you're happy with. If it'd been me, I'd have agonized over it for the next two months. I've really got to work on that.
#36
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
LOL! I was ready to move on but I didn't have anything going on that weekend and was just toying with the idea if it was within my price range I will do the trade. Honestly didn't think it would happen considering what I wanted to pay a month but it did! I kept on thinking about it constantly. It was rough man. LMAO!
#37
This is all based on 6at not manual, most dealers by me dont want the manual they aren't very popular with the owner demographic in Bucks county,pa
if you use anything other than AFS your going to miss out on 1500 owner loyalty/conquest cash
which means your paying closer to 43000
@
1.74 - 748 per month - total of payments 26,928
2.99 - 772 per month - total of payments 27,791
3.99 - 791 per month - total of payments 28,476
So even if you were to go with Pen fed @ 1.74 I would have a 16,200 pay off in 3 years, dealer gives me 23k I walk away with 6800 bucks
my total investment was 20128 @ 1.74
@2.9 it was 20,991
@3.9 it was 21,676
If i went with the original lease offer I dropped 19,800 bucks.
if I went with a more agressive lease @ 500 per month which seems to whats popping up now, I've spent 18000.
The best case would be to take it through AFS and refi to a 1.74 a few months down the road, but you're talking total savings over the lease of nearly nothing.
Not to mention the fact of the assume trade in price may drop substantially, its a risk.
if you use anything other than AFS your going to miss out on 1500 owner loyalty/conquest cash
which means your paying closer to 43000
@
1.74 - 748 per month - total of payments 26,928
2.99 - 772 per month - total of payments 27,791
3.99 - 791 per month - total of payments 28,476
So even if you were to go with Pen fed @ 1.74 I would have a 16,200 pay off in 3 years, dealer gives me 23k I walk away with 6800 bucks
my total investment was 20128 @ 1.74
@2.9 it was 20,991
@3.9 it was 21,676
If i went with the original lease offer I dropped 19,800 bucks.
if I went with a more agressive lease @ 500 per month which seems to whats popping up now, I've spent 18000.
The best case would be to take it through AFS and refi to a 1.74 a few months down the road, but you're talking total savings over the lease of nearly nothing.
Not to mention the fact of the assume trade in price may drop substantially, its a risk.
OK, you are right, if the $41k is contingent on financing through AFS, then that does change some things. However, If you are using higher interest rates, let's just assume then you are going through AFS, and you get the price you used in your other comparisons.
Let's assume 4%, $41k all-in, using AFS. Why are you now increasing the price to $43k? Are there no financing options for 4% or less in your $41k deal?
Let's look at 4%, 3%, and 2%:
LOAN:
------------
$41k, 4% for 60mo
$755/mo payment, over 36 months = $27,180 in payments
Payoff at 36 months, standard amortization: $16690
$23k trade in for 6AT SH-AWD.
$23,000 - $16,690 = $6310
$27180 - $6310 = $20870
$41k, 3% for 60 months
$737/mo payment, over 36 months = $26532
Payoff at 36 months, standard amortization: $16,447
$23k trade in for 6AT SH-AWD
$23,000 - $16,447 = $6553
$26,532 - $6553 = $19,979
$41k, 2% for 60 months
$719/mo payment, over 36 months = $25884
Payoff at 36 months, standard amortization: $16,203
$23k trade in for 6AT SH-AWD
$23,000 - $16,203 = $6797
$25,884 - $6797 = $19,087
So, these are about the same as the lease rates (which makes sense, in that for a lease over 3 years you should theoretically be paying for just financing + depreciation).
So, lease may be better in certain cases (especially in some states like MI), if you are going new in 3 years. But it will most likely not be the $4k benefit you originally mentioned - and with a decent loan rate (2% or less), you will likely come out ahead with purchasing.