Is the 4G TL Type-S getting the V-8 the next gen RL is suppose to get?
10-24-2008, 10:00 AM
#42
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10-24-2008, 11:22 AM
#44
Racer
>>I really dont see why people are bashing Acura releasing a V8.<<
I am not sure we are "bashing". I think some us are just wondering what a V8 really does for the brand. There is probably better "drive-train" technology Acura should be pursuing than V8's (that is more efficient and better performing). V8's help sell cars in the 1950's. I am not sure that is true today. There is a reason the Japanese car makers have been successful at building efficient 4's and 6's. Is the goal to say "We have a V8 too" or is it to sell cars? And a lot of "Tier 1" auto makers also pay hefty "gas guzzler" taxes on their cars:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
What exactly does a V8 get you that another engine doesn't? And sure, the Corvette can get 26 MPG on the highway [15 city] (a lot better than most any European sports car) but does the TL REALLY need a 400 HP engine? I have a '99 TL (est. 225 HP) and I can tell you, it will still get up and go the rare times I feel like putting my foot into it (and no, I never did get the car to 150MPH). And is the TL really designed to handle well with that kind of horsepower? Just an aside, in my "little" 225 HP TL I have already replaced all the engine mounts and the drive shaft when I had the tranny done. Acura better be ready to upgrade all this stuff to handle the power.
And for those who say "If you want more MPG buy a Honda" I could say "If you want higher horsepower buy a Viper or Vette....or even a Dodge Challenger SRT". I don't think Acuras desire is to be a muscle car builder.....or maybe it is now, who knows.
I get the feeling Acura is trying to be too many things to too many people now. I am not even sure what being a "Tier 1" brand gets Acura, especially if ALL luxury brand sales are down. Why would I want to build what is not selling well? I would just like to see Acura offer a high-MPG version of the TL, along side the regular TL and "S" type if they are determined to offer that, and let the market decide. But hey, maybe I am wrong, maybe all those one-million+ Prius buyers bought the Prius because it looks great and has all those luxury features
I am not sure we are "bashing". I think some us are just wondering what a V8 really does for the brand. There is probably better "drive-train" technology Acura should be pursuing than V8's (that is more efficient and better performing). V8's help sell cars in the 1950's. I am not sure that is true today. There is a reason the Japanese car makers have been successful at building efficient 4's and 6's. Is the goal to say "We have a V8 too" or is it to sell cars? And a lot of "Tier 1" auto makers also pay hefty "gas guzzler" taxes on their cars:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
What exactly does a V8 get you that another engine doesn't? And sure, the Corvette can get 26 MPG on the highway [15 city] (a lot better than most any European sports car) but does the TL REALLY need a 400 HP engine? I have a '99 TL (est. 225 HP) and I can tell you, it will still get up and go the rare times I feel like putting my foot into it (and no, I never did get the car to 150MPH). And is the TL really designed to handle well with that kind of horsepower? Just an aside, in my "little" 225 HP TL I have already replaced all the engine mounts and the drive shaft when I had the tranny done. Acura better be ready to upgrade all this stuff to handle the power.
And for those who say "If you want more MPG buy a Honda" I could say "If you want higher horsepower buy a Viper or Vette....or even a Dodge Challenger SRT". I don't think Acuras desire is to be a muscle car builder.....or maybe it is now, who knows.
I get the feeling Acura is trying to be too many things to too many people now. I am not even sure what being a "Tier 1" brand gets Acura, especially if ALL luxury brand sales are down. Why would I want to build what is not selling well? I would just like to see Acura offer a high-MPG version of the TL, along side the regular TL and "S" type if they are determined to offer that, and let the market decide. But hey, maybe I am wrong, maybe all those one-million+ Prius buyers bought the Prius because it looks great and has all those luxury features
10-24-2008, 09:43 PM
#45
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Having a Tier 1 luxury brand ain't about what you "need" it's about what you want.
A lot of people buy the Prius because it looks different. If it looked like a Yaris sales would not be as great... hence why the Civic Hybrid never did as well... it looked like a run-of-the-mill Civic... no distinction there. People buying SMART cars do so because it looks different... they usually own other cars, too. The Prius does badly in cross winds and wet roads and braking (narrow tires) and has horrible blind spots but it's for show as much as go and the taxpayer foots the bill for rebates and carpool lane rights. Toyota did good PR on it and it helped them sell their gas guzzling trucks by raising their CAFE standards though that business is in the tank now. Toyota didn't do it to 'help the environment.'
BMW and Mercedes-Benz didn't become luxury by offering economical engines with good gas mileage... you have Honda buyers for those products.
A lot of people buy the Prius because it looks different. If it looked like a Yaris sales would not be as great... hence why the Civic Hybrid never did as well... it looked like a run-of-the-mill Civic... no distinction there. People buying SMART cars do so because it looks different... they usually own other cars, too. The Prius does badly in cross winds and wet roads and braking (narrow tires) and has horrible blind spots but it's for show as much as go and the taxpayer foots the bill for rebates and carpool lane rights. Toyota did good PR on it and it helped them sell their gas guzzling trucks by raising their CAFE standards though that business is in the tank now. Toyota didn't do it to 'help the environment.'
BMW and Mercedes-Benz didn't become luxury by offering economical engines with good gas mileage... you have Honda buyers for those products.
10-24-2008, 09:54 PM
#46
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10-25-2008, 12:33 AM
#47
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>>I really dont see why people are bashing Acura releasing a V8.<<
I am not sure we are "bashing". I think some us are just wondering what a V8 really does for the brand. There is probably better "drive-train" technology Acura should be pursuing than V8's (that is more efficient and better performing). V8's help sell cars in the 1950's. I am not sure that is true today. There is a reason the Japanese car makers have been successful at building efficient 4's and 6's. Is the goal to say "We have a V8 too" or is it to sell cars? And a lot of "Tier 1" auto makers also pay hefty "gas guzzler" taxes on their cars:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
What exactly does a V8 get you that another engine doesn't? And sure, the Corvette can get 26 MPG on the highway [15 city] (a lot better than most any European sports car) but does the TL REALLY need a 400 HP engine? I have a '99 TL (est. 225 HP) and I can tell you, it will still get up and go the rare times I feel like putting my foot into it (and no, I never did get the car to 150MPH). And is the TL really designed to handle well with that kind of horsepower? Just an aside, in my "little" 225 HP TL I have already replaced all the engine mounts and the drive shaft when I had the tranny done. Acura better be ready to upgrade all this stuff to handle the power.
And for those who say "If you want more MPG buy a Honda" I could say "If you want higher horsepower buy a Viper or Vette....or even a Dodge Challenger SRT". I don't think Acuras desire is to be a muscle car builder.....or maybe it is now, who knows.
I get the feeling Acura is trying to be too many things to too many people now. I am not even sure what being a "Tier 1" brand gets Acura, especially if ALL luxury brand sales are down. Why would I want to build what is not selling well? I would just like to see Acura offer a high-MPG version of the TL, along side the regular TL and "S" type if they are determined to offer that, and let the market decide. But hey, maybe I am wrong, maybe all those one-million+ Prius buyers bought the Prius because it looks great and has all those luxury features
I am not sure we are "bashing". I think some us are just wondering what a V8 really does for the brand. There is probably better "drive-train" technology Acura should be pursuing than V8's (that is more efficient and better performing). V8's help sell cars in the 1950's. I am not sure that is true today. There is a reason the Japanese car makers have been successful at building efficient 4's and 6's. Is the goal to say "We have a V8 too" or is it to sell cars? And a lot of "Tier 1" auto makers also pay hefty "gas guzzler" taxes on their cars:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
What exactly does a V8 get you that another engine doesn't? And sure, the Corvette can get 26 MPG on the highway [15 city] (a lot better than most any European sports car) but does the TL REALLY need a 400 HP engine? I have a '99 TL (est. 225 HP) and I can tell you, it will still get up and go the rare times I feel like putting my foot into it (and no, I never did get the car to 150MPH). And is the TL really designed to handle well with that kind of horsepower? Just an aside, in my "little" 225 HP TL I have already replaced all the engine mounts and the drive shaft when I had the tranny done. Acura better be ready to upgrade all this stuff to handle the power.
And for those who say "If you want more MPG buy a Honda" I could say "If you want higher horsepower buy a Viper or Vette....or even a Dodge Challenger SRT". I don't think Acuras desire is to be a muscle car builder.....or maybe it is now, who knows.
I get the feeling Acura is trying to be too many things to too many people now. I am not even sure what being a "Tier 1" brand gets Acura, especially if ALL luxury brand sales are down. Why would I want to build what is not selling well? I would just like to see Acura offer a high-MPG version of the TL, along side the regular TL and "S" type if they are determined to offer that, and let the market decide. But hey, maybe I am wrong, maybe all those one-million+ Prius buyers bought the Prius because it looks great and has all those luxury features
The TL doesn't need 400hp, and you are right, 200hp is more than enough. But again, it's not about need, it's about want. For me, I feel that my 260hp TL-S still isn't fast enough. I guess humans (or may be just me) are greedy. The 2nd gen TL is known for its weak motor mounts and transmission. These have been fixed for the 3G TL I believe. You gotta understand that the TL is already lacking behind the competition in terms of straightline performance. 305hp in a 4000lb car isn't really a muscle car. It's been speculated that it's not going to be any faster than the 3G TL-S 5AT in a straight line.
Yea, Acura, or Honda is doing many things right now. V8, RWD, NSX replacement, dual clutch gearbox (for NSX replacement), "RWD TL," new X6 fighter, diesel for Acura, V6 for TSX, etc. Who knows, may be they are also working on a diesel TL for people like you
10-25-2008, 10:38 AM
#48
Three Wheelin'
Acura doesn't build "muscle" cars. To me, all these automakers know by now what their "pecking" order is in the auto world. Acura/Honda is all about value and reliability. BMW's are all about performance.....hence, their "Ultimate Driving Machine" motto. The vast majority of Acura/Honda buyers are those who are price conscious....those who put price, reliability, comfort, and value on top of the list over things like performance and how fast their cars go from 0-60. Acura/Honda build cars to meet the needs of these people. I can't understand some people who profess to be performance nuts, go out and buy an Acura, and then complain that it's not fast enough.......and then later trash the 4G because Acura didn't meet their needs. 
10-25-2008, 08:20 PM
#49
U can also be a performance guy (myself) and still want reliability, comfort, value etc. I dont want to have a fast car thats gonna be in the dealer every month with some issue. My boy has BMW M6 and always has some light come on or some other issue with that car and the dealers arent very helpful either. Ive never had any issues with either of my TLs or my accord. Ill stick with my honda/acura........cuz i like driving MY car......not a loaner.
10-26-2008, 09:23 AM
#50
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Honda announced it, they WILL release a V8 RL as for the details they were saying its gonna be very fuel efficient! But for me I was never a big fan of the RL I always found the car to be aimed at an older age demographic. As for the price tag, its gonna be interesting to see what Acura will charge for the extra horsies.. Now even if they released a new TLS with the current 4th gen body type with a V8 in it would be awesome, my big problem is the look of the new TL just doesnt appeal to me.. The new TL like the RL now seem to be designed and geared toward the odler age groups. I just turned 26 not too sure... I think I'll hang on till 5th gen comes out.
10-26-2008, 01:33 PM
#52
With all this said, I still wouldn't mind sticking with my 2G TL-S for now. After all, it's still a TL-S. Reliable, Comfortable, and has decent enough power. All this hype about V8s in Acura's just doesn't make the buying the process anymore appealing than figuring your car is going to eat gas even with the so called "fuel efficiency", which to me is all marketing to get the buyer to be interested in the vehicle.
As for the TSX, I would rather see it with the RDX's turbocharged engine in it rather than a V6. Like others of you have stated, it does make it a bit harder to get into entry level luxury with a car like the TSX having a V6 which obviously is going to raise the sticker price.
As for the TSX, I would rather see it with the RDX's turbocharged engine in it rather than a V6. Like others of you have stated, it does make it a bit harder to get into entry level luxury with a car like the TSX having a V6 which obviously is going to raise the sticker price.
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