2012 TL SH-AWD Advance vs. 2011 Audi S4 Premium
03-08-2011, 02:49 PM
#41
Three Wheelin'
Far from scientific, but I always tell people if you want to get a good idea of what a brand offers, see what others type in Google.
For example, typing in "audis are" promotes the following top three entries:
audis are junk
audis are unreliable
audis are not reliable
...typing in "acuras are" shows the following:
acuras are ugly
acuras are gay
acuras are hondas
Like I said, far from any scientific study, but it gives you a general idea of why those responses appear. I would argue that yes, Acura has lost its styling ways. And yes, I would also agree that Audis are unreliable. And I think the ZDX being voted the "top gay professional automobile for 2010" has something to do with Acuras being gay I guess
For example, typing in "audis are" promotes the following top three entries:
audis are junk
audis are unreliable
audis are not reliable
...typing in "acuras are" shows the following:
acuras are ugly
acuras are gay
acuras are hondas
Like I said, far from any scientific study, but it gives you a general idea of why those responses appear. I would argue that yes, Acura has lost its styling ways. And yes, I would also agree that Audis are unreliable. And I think the ZDX being voted the "top gay professional automobile for 2010" has something to do with Acuras being gay I guess
03-08-2011, 03:01 PM
#42
the overexplainer
My friend bought a CPO Audi A3 with a manual transmission.
He had to get the entire transmission replaced a few months in. I dont know if he was too hard on it, but the dealer covered it.
He had to get the entire transmission replaced a few months in. I dont know if he was too hard on it, but the dealer covered it.
03-08-2011, 03:16 PM
#43
I've read about the sh-awd being subpar in poor weather condition but noone has elaborated on this issue. Could you explain the difference between the audi and acura awd performance in poor weather?
Some other brands with these types of systems have incorporated a lock mode for those tricky start ups or automtically programmed software that engages a more even torque distribution at the start until a certain mph is reached. Acura has done this with VTM-4 in the Pilot and former MDX which is basically SH minus the vectoring.
SH is said to have better response and electronic integration so there is no need and they are probably right as the only model it would be that apparent in would be a 6MT and the TL is the only SH 6MT. Most wouldn't even detect the degree of slip or split second delay in an auto.
SH is not quite as mechanically sound or built for poor weather driving and therefore relies a bit more on their stability systems and electronics but bottomline, they acheive the same types of sucess and results.
Despite what it might sound like, we are not talking about one having a superior advantage over the other when it comes to poor weather driving, as far as I have ever been able to tell comparing the two. Instead, we are talking about a difference in tendancies. One favoring poor weather, the other dry. Outside of that, both systems are very capable in both regards and either should be able to handle whatever you throw at it as they are designed and tested for much more.
Last edited by winstrolvtec; 03-08-2011 at 03:18 PM.
03-08-2011, 03:22 PM
#44
2010 TL AWD 6MT: New King
03-08-2011, 03:36 PM
#45
2009 TL SH-AWD Tech
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PS. I just can't stop laughing when the RX going up.... lol
03-08-2011, 06:16 PM
#46
Suzuka Master
No problem. From what I understand, the first of the 2012 TL's the dealers will get will all be the FWD models. The SH-AWD models aren't expected to arrive until later (maybe closer to summer?). So if your dealer is saying three months for an SH-AWD model, I'm sure they are giving you an estimate, but they probably aren't that far off if the delay in the SH-AWD delivery is true.
03-08-2011, 06:25 PM
#47
Here is a video you can check out which shows the Acura SH-AWD system vs. Audi Quattro. I don't know about you but I would call this test an example of driving in poor weather conditions. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJZxV...2772B40E710771
Another fun one:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY7VYvG0rzo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJZxV...2772B40E710771
Another fun one:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY7VYvG0rzo
Glashub...Great Find and.....enough said. I had the chance to see the SH-AWD in action the first week I had my car on Black ice going around a turn.....it handled beautifully.BTW I saw the tow truck in the background waiting for that Audi when it was done with the course:
03-10-2011, 08:20 AM
#48
7th Gear
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In Canada the S4 is about 15-20 thousand more for similarly equipped cars after taking into account Audi does not discount much at all. As well, Audi leases are way too expensive because their residuals are very low. I believe the new S4 also is plagued by some infamous water pump issue which there doesn't seem to be a fix still. I could be wrong here but recall reading about this issue and how many owners have been stranded because of it. I test drove both cars and IMHO think the TL AWD handles better.
I agree with you on the Audi residuals...they suck. But at least they have multiple residuals based on the mileage you choose. Picking the lowest option (16000kms/yr) gives me the same residual as the TL at 24000kms/yr.
Water pump issues were fixed with the '11 but I agree with Cat below that it was poorly handled by Audi. At least in the states.
Asking for an Audi comparison on an Acura forum is just stirring the hornet's nest! I did have a 2010 TL SH-AWD 6MT, and went back to an Audi, the 2011 S4 Prestige 6MT. You asked specifically about AWD; the Audi is better in poor weather, but otherwise I consider them equal. Acura did an amazing job on the SH-AWD, and I'd bet a software update could fix the inclement condition issues.
I've heard the horror stories. On my fourth Audi, I haven't lived through a horror story. And there have been several TL horror stories here. I think it's somewhat luck-of-the-draw, with the odds better with an Acura but either way most people will get lucky.
The water pump problem impacted the 2010 models only; no 2011 reports of it I believe. Audi did a terrible job of dealing with this though. It reflects badly on them. It's certainly a good reason to avoid the brand.
You cannot equip the cars similarly. Can't be done. The TL will always be roomier, the S4 will always have folding rear seats, the TL will have dual aux inputs, the S4 will have better integrated electronics and far more adjustable seats. I'm not saying you can't make them equally nice per se, just that there will be huge differences. Just because both have an iPod interface doesn't mean they work equally well, for example. The cars really don't look alike, don't feel alike, and don't accelerate similarly either.
But keep in mind that the S4 Prestige is like 1/3 more expensive than the TL SH-AWD. On a value basis, the TL clearly wins. For $13K more or so, the S4 should offer some additional refinement.
I've heard the horror stories. On my fourth Audi, I haven't lived through a horror story. And there have been several TL horror stories here. I think it's somewhat luck-of-the-draw, with the odds better with an Acura but either way most people will get lucky.
The water pump problem impacted the 2010 models only; no 2011 reports of it I believe. Audi did a terrible job of dealing with this though. It reflects badly on them. It's certainly a good reason to avoid the brand.
You cannot equip the cars similarly. Can't be done. The TL will always be roomier, the S4 will always have folding rear seats, the TL will have dual aux inputs, the S4 will have better integrated electronics and far more adjustable seats. I'm not saying you can't make them equally nice per se, just that there will be huge differences. Just because both have an iPod interface doesn't mean they work equally well, for example. The cars really don't look alike, don't feel alike, and don't accelerate similarly either.
But keep in mind that the S4 Prestige is like 1/3 more expensive than the TL SH-AWD. On a value basis, the TL clearly wins. For $13K more or so, the S4 should offer some additional refinement.
03-10-2011, 10:15 AM
#49
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No problem. From what I understand, the first of the 2012 TL's the dealers will get will all be the FWD models. The SH-AWD models aren't expected to arrive until later (maybe closer to summer?). So if your dealer is saying three months for an SH-AWD model, I'm sure they are giving you an estimate, but they probably aren't that far off if the delay in the SH-AWD delivery is true.
03-10-2011, 12:07 PM
#50
built for speed
Here is a video you can check out which shows the Acura SH-AWD system vs. Audi Quattro. I don't know about you but I would call this test an example of driving in poor weather conditions.
Not a fair comparison unless all the vehicles are wearing identical tires.
03-10-2011, 01:19 PM
#51
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Why not? It should be fair if they are all wearing stock tires - then all manufacturers would have optimized the vehicles to those tires. Seems like a pretty realistic representation of what I could expect walking out of a dealer with one of those vehicles... it's not like only the Acura got studded tires or something.
03-10-2011, 05:36 PM
#52
Audi's aren't reliable. I had a friend who had an A6. He last previous cars were a Nissan Z and Lexus IS 350. He loved it (the Audi) when it wasn't in the shop. After his electrical issues where finally fixed (after months) he sold it after 1.5 yrs of ownership. He's now looking to get an Hyundai
Hate Audis. I keep getting cut off by the douchebagette's who drive them. They are worse than an Altima driver.
03-16-2011, 08:39 AM
#53
Wow, there's quite a bit of Audi hate in this thread. I'm not a fanboy by any means, and I give credit where credit is due (i.e. 4th gen TL), but I don't think the S4 is THAT bad.
I actually looked at a '10 6spd TL before picking up my S4, and enjoyed it. As usual, the TL is very nicely equipped for the price. However, I didn't like the aesthetics of the car, and I didn't get the exhilaration when I stepped on the gas that I do with my car. Interior fit and finish I have to give to the Audi. It's just so nice and goes really well together. At first the MMI controls didn't appear to be intuitive, but I can control everything now without having to take my eyes off the road.
One thing that does annoy me a bit about the 3G MMI is that it doesn't have A2DP functionality. I mean, seriously?? Other than that, I'm very happy with my purchase. Aside from the water pump issue (mine was replace preemptively) I have had no problems whatsoever with the car and have loved every minute of driving it. That being said, I wouldn't have minded the TL at all if I couldn't afford the Audi. With the RonJon grill, the car actually looks more attractive.
Don't hate on the S4 until you've actually gotten a chance to drive it and experience it for yourselves.
I actually looked at a '10 6spd TL before picking up my S4, and enjoyed it. As usual, the TL is very nicely equipped for the price. However, I didn't like the aesthetics of the car, and I didn't get the exhilaration when I stepped on the gas that I do with my car. Interior fit and finish I have to give to the Audi. It's just so nice and goes really well together. At first the MMI controls didn't appear to be intuitive, but I can control everything now without having to take my eyes off the road.
One thing that does annoy me a bit about the 3G MMI is that it doesn't have A2DP functionality. I mean, seriously?? Other than that, I'm very happy with my purchase. Aside from the water pump issue (mine was replace preemptively) I have had no problems whatsoever with the car and have loved every minute of driving it. That being said, I wouldn't have minded the TL at all if I couldn't afford the Audi. With the RonJon grill, the car actually looks more attractive.
Don't hate on the S4 until you've actually gotten a chance to drive it and experience it for yourselves.
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03-16-2011, 10:53 AM
#54
Racer
I'm in Canada, and have also looked at both cars. But your calculations about the pricing is a bit off IMO. The S4 is would not hit 20K more than TL. Top end 2011 TL SH-AWD w/Tech is $46,990 + Freight & Taxes etc. 2011 Audi S4 Premium Auto is $58,800 + Freight & Taxes. & if you want the fully loaded with Nav & Bang & Olufsen system, you would top out at $63,850. So difference is $16,860.00. It's alot of car for that price difference. I think it's worth it.
In Canada the S4 is about 15-20 thousand more for similarly equipped cars after taking into account Audi does not discount much at all. As well, Audi leases are way too expensive because their residuals are very low. I believe the new S4 also is plagued by some infamous water pump issue which there doesn't seem to be a fix still. I could be wrong here but recall reading about this issue and how many owners have been stranded because of it. I test drove both cars and IMHO think the TL AWD handles better.
03-16-2011, 02:37 PM
#56
The Sicilian
Audi's are overpriced and overated. I would buy a BMW or MB before I would buy an Audi. But they are sharp looking cars.
I also think this is true about Volvo's and Jags.
I also think this is true about Volvo's and Jags.
03-16-2011, 03:35 PM
#57
Disclaimer: Derogatory statement follows, if you are sensitive please go screw your self.
Audi drivers are douche-bags!
EDiT: Funny, I just noticed I had posted something similar above...sorry for the repost, but I'm not going to delete it.
Audi drivers are douche-bags!
EDiT: Funny, I just noticed I had posted something similar above...sorry for the repost, but I'm not going to delete it.
Last edited by Mr Marco; 03-16-2011 at 03:50 PM.
03-16-2011, 03:40 PM
#58
Senior Moderator
Erm...comparing an S4 to a TL is kinda...unfair to the TL. 
A4 maybe...S4? If money is no concern, S4 all the way. Not even close. Sorry...
A4 maybe...S4? If money is no concern, S4 all the way. Not even close. Sorry...
03-16-2011, 03:53 PM
#59
03-16-2011, 05:17 PM
#61
Erm...comparing an S4 to a TL is kinda...unfair to the TL
Still, car for car...performance and luxury standpoint, the S4 wins. This is not even a comparison
The only performance aspect that the S4 is better in is straightline acceleration. The TL has proven to handle and brake better on more than one occasion.
And the only luxury aspects it's better in is image or prestige, plus use of a few more soft touch plastics and vinyls.
Other than straight line and price, we are not taking about anything more than marginal differences. The S4 has touches and features not available in the TL and the TL has touches and features not available in the S4. A perceived luxury level still exists above both of these cars with vehicles like the RL and A6.
What's not an equal comparison is one is a high end luxury compact the other is a low end luxury mid sized. Both compete in a near luxury or entry level segment, mostly determined by base price, but they can be (and are) very different cars with different purposes and markets despite that. Neither comparison is entirely fair to the other, it doesn't work only one way because of what one prefers individually.
03-16-2011, 05:49 PM
#62
Senior Moderator
It's unfair mostly on the basis of price where the A4 would fit better but sometimes price doesn't dictate anything actually related to how the cars compare objectively other than their costs.
Car for car? Really? What if I want a mid sized sedan for more space and comfort? Or something that people might find more relaxing to drive while being nearly as fun and capable?
The only performance aspect that the S4 is better in is straightline acceleration. The TL has proven to handle and brake better on more than one occasion.
And the only luxury aspects it's better in is image or prestige, plus use of a few more soft touch plastics and vinyls.
Other than straight line and price, we are not taking about anything more than marginal differences. The S4 has touches and features not available in the TL and the TL has touches and features not available in the S4. A perceived luxury level still exists above both of these cars with vehicles like the RL and A6.
What's not an equal comparison is one is a high end luxury compact the other is a low end luxury mid sized. Both compete in a near luxury or entry level segment, mostly determined by base price, but they can be (and are) very different cars with different purposes and markets despite that. Neither comparison is entirely fair to the other, it doesn't work only one way because of what one prefers individually.
Car for car? Really? What if I want a mid sized sedan for more space and comfort? Or something that people might find more relaxing to drive while being nearly as fun and capable?
The only performance aspect that the S4 is better in is straightline acceleration. The TL has proven to handle and brake better on more than one occasion.
And the only luxury aspects it's better in is image or prestige, plus use of a few more soft touch plastics and vinyls.
Other than straight line and price, we are not taking about anything more than marginal differences. The S4 has touches and features not available in the TL and the TL has touches and features not available in the S4. A perceived luxury level still exists above both of these cars with vehicles like the RL and A6.
What's not an equal comparison is one is a high end luxury compact the other is a low end luxury mid sized. Both compete in a near luxury or entry level segment, mostly determined by base price, but they can be (and are) very different cars with different purposes and markets despite that. Neither comparison is entirely fair to the other, it doesn't work only one way because of what one prefers individually.
I've sat in both cars and objectively, there is no way I'd compare the TL to an S4. I can give you further analogies: It's like comparing a Tissot watch to an TAG Heuer...a Ralph Lauren suit to a Boss. Notice I didn't use higher ends like Rolex or Armani here. None of the cheaper brands are inferior...but, it is not a fair comparison.
I may as well go and try to compare my FX50 to a loaded Cayenne. Again, no comparison...and unfair to the FX.
Still, there is a move up here. Anyhow, as I said...agree to disagree.
03-16-2011, 06:47 PM
#63
This type/sort of argument has gone on and on in the other forums on AcuraZine. And let's just put it this way: Agree to disagree.
I've sat in both cars and objectively, there is no way I'd compare the TL to an S4. I can give you further analogies: It's like comparing a Tissot watch to an TAG Heuer...a Ralph Lauren suit to a Boss. Notice I didn't use higher ends like Rolex or Armani here. None of the cheaper brands are inferior...but, it is not a fair comparison.
I've sat in both cars and objectively, there is no way I'd compare the TL to an S4. I can give you further analogies: It's like comparing a Tissot watch to an TAG Heuer...a Ralph Lauren suit to a Boss. Notice I didn't use higher ends like Rolex or Armani here. None of the cheaper brands are inferior...but, it is not a fair comparison.
Don't get me wrong, there is a premium so there should be premium content and there is, like the S4 being faster and having some softer grade materials and offering higher end features not available in the TL (which you also have to pay more for) but it's not as drastic a difference as the price might indicate.
Much like your comparisons, it's next level money (A6, 5 series) in comparison but it's not exactly next level nice in comparison, the cost is probably more focused into the performance engineering and prestige factor of the S4.
I may as well go and try to compare my FX50 to a loaded Cayenne. Again, no comparison...and unfair to the FX.
Still, there is a move up here. Anyhow, as I said...agree to disagree.
Still, there is a move up here. Anyhow, as I said...agree to disagree.
The premium of it would have you believe it's on another level but it wasn't. A close friend had an Infiniti replaced it with a Cayenne V6, very well equipped. It was well built and tight but some buttons broke, leather warped, and the interior was very lego, like earlier GM.
Even he would admit that the price was for the name and nothing else and I suppose he would have been a lot happier with an FX or MDX for a fraction of the price. Sometimes we assign more value or premium just because there is a premium attached.
Sometimes there are just cost differences for where the engineering and manufactering comes from and brands often have to charge more to profit as much for a product that is not really any or much better, just costs more to produce. Not saying that is the case or entirely the case here but it should always be considered.
Last edited by winstrolvtec; 03-16-2011 at 06:59 PM.
03-16-2011, 07:10 PM
#64
Drifting
03-16-2011, 07:47 PM
#65
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I'm in Canada, and have also looked at both cars. But your calculations about the pricing is a bit off IMO. The S4 is would not hit 20K more than TL. Top end 2011 TL SH-AWD w/Tech is $46,990 + Freight & Taxes etc. 2011 Audi S4 Premium Auto is $58,800 + Freight & Taxes. & if you want the fully loaded with Nav & Bang & Olufsen system, you would top out at $63,850. So difference is $16,860.00. It's alot of car for that price difference. I think it's worth it.
If you think the S4 is worth the 15-20K more than why didn't you buy it?
03-16-2011, 07:54 PM
#66
Why generalize everyone who drives a certain make of car based on a few experiences you've had with some nasty people. There have been many douchey drivers I've come across and they come in all makes and models.
03-16-2011, 07:59 PM
#67
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03-16-2011, 08:28 PM
#68
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I'm in Canada, and have also looked at both cars. But your calculations about the pricing is a bit off IMO. The S4 is would not hit 20K more than TL. Top end 2011 TL SH-AWD w/Tech is $46,990 + Freight & Taxes etc. 2011 Audi S4 Premium Auto is $58,800 + Freight & Taxes. & if you want the fully loaded with Nav & Bang & Olufsen system, you would top out at $63,850. So difference is $16,860.00. It's alot of car for that price difference. I think it's worth it.
Taking my experience and the numbers you provided would make the S4 closer to 23K more according to both our math....no feakn way an S4 is worth over 20K more than my TL, not even 10K.
03-16-2011, 09:19 PM
#69
Honda Fanboy
03-16-2011, 09:27 PM
#70
Drifting
The TL SH-AWD more than holds its own against the S4. Just take a look at the comparos. Throw in the price differential, the TL's higher residual value and reliability delta and it's actually a no-brainer in the TL's favor, IMHO.
03-16-2011, 09:28 PM
#71
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Have you actually tested both cars back to back and read all the reviews?? To mention the A4 tells me you don't know what you're talking about....
03-16-2011, 10:45 PM
#72
To the OP, get what you'd like and what you'll be happy with at the end of the day. Asking this question in a brand specific forum will get you mostly biased answers. If you had asked this on audiworld or audizine you would have gotten different answers.
In the end it's your money and your financial decision to make. It's pretty funny to see people magazine racing these cars. Who cares what they wrote or what they thought of each car? In the end you're the one who's got to enjoy driving the car you pick. IMO both cars are a great choice (price aside) and I don't think you can go wrong with either. Chances are you will never drive either car to such an extreme that you'll notice a difference in performance. If you're looking to track your car, that's a whole other story, but in diner case you would be swapping out stock parts for sportier aftermarket ones anyway. Do your research, make the decision on your own, and I'm sure you'll be more than satisfied with your choice. Good luck and happy driving.
OT: any nor cal 6spd TLers wanna meet up? I'd love to check out your car and compare owners experiences thus far.
In the end it's your money and your financial decision to make. It's pretty funny to see people magazine racing these cars. Who cares what they wrote or what they thought of each car? In the end you're the one who's got to enjoy driving the car you pick. IMO both cars are a great choice (price aside) and I don't think you can go wrong with either. Chances are you will never drive either car to such an extreme that you'll notice a difference in performance. If you're looking to track your car, that's a whole other story, but in diner case you would be swapping out stock parts for sportier aftermarket ones anyway. Do your research, make the decision on your own, and I'm sure you'll be more than satisfied with your choice. Good luck and happy driving.
OT: any nor cal 6spd TLers wanna meet up? I'd love to check out your car and compare owners experiences thus far.
03-17-2011, 02:03 AM
#73
You're right about the reliability between the Civic vs TL vs S4...the Civic and TL are closer in reliability than the TL and S4. On the other hand the TL is closer to the S4 from a performance and luxury standpoint.
03-17-2011, 08:08 AM
#74
Three Wheelin'
Thanks man, that was pretty cool to watch. Anyway, I stopped by Acura of Cerritos last night and inquired about when they will be releasing their '12 TLs. They informed me that they won't be getting the for another 3 months. Now, is this their way of pushing the '11s or are they telling the truth. I had the assumption that the '12s would be released sometime this month based on what i've been reading on these forums. What's going on here?
03-17-2011, 08:21 AM
#75
Where are you getting your S4 reliability info from?
03-17-2011, 09:44 AM
#76
I was considering buying one a while ago and did a little research on them. I was looking to replace my 540 because the maintenance was killing me. After talking to some indy mechanics that specialized in European vehicles they universally agreed that the S4 would need a similar amount of maintenance as my 540. I really liked the S4 but a friend has one and she's had issues with coils, oil leaks and service engine lights which pushed me further away.
From a recent Consumer Reports, "If front-seat comfort, fit and finish, and driving dynamics were all that counted, European cars would rule the roost. As it is, subpar reliability hounds some European brands. Volkswagen's brand reliability has improved of late, but Audi's spotty reliability brings the combined automaker's score down." That's not to say the S4 is the dog that is bringing the Audi brand down but it's still factored into that grouping.
I love the way the S4 and most European sports sedans drive and feel (I still miss my 5) but until they can bring their reliability ratings even close to the Asian brands I'll be staying away.
In case you wanted a link to that quote: http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...view/index.htm
From a recent Consumer Reports, "If front-seat comfort, fit and finish, and driving dynamics were all that counted, European cars would rule the roost. As it is, subpar reliability hounds some European brands. Volkswagen's brand reliability has improved of late, but Audi's spotty reliability brings the combined automaker's score down." That's not to say the S4 is the dog that is bringing the Audi brand down but it's still factored into that grouping.
I love the way the S4 and most European sports sedans drive and feel (I still miss my 5) but until they can bring their reliability ratings even close to the Asian brands I'll be staying away.
In case you wanted a link to that quote: http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...view/index.htm
Last edited by sddale; 03-17-2011 at 09:45 AM. Reason: Link
03-17-2011, 10:54 AM
#77
Senior Moderator
You're kidding, right?
And no, I cannot drive a car to the limits like one of those magazine reviewers. But, as I've said...I've sat in both the cars that this thread is comparing and IN MY OPINION, it is unfair to the TL to compare it to the S4.
If you're getting a bit offended thinking that I'm stating the TL is a bad car, you're incorrect. The TL is a fine vehicle but it is not in the S4's category. I already pointed out my analogy earlier: To me, it would be like trying to compare my FX50 to a loaded Cayenne GTS or whatever.
It's not a fair comparison since the other car is in a different segment. The A4 (let's say the 3.2) loaded is more in par with the TL you guys are talking about.
Would you like me to move this thread to Car Talk which is a bit more objective instead of a very pro-TL sub-forum and see what the consensus is...?
03-17-2011, 11:13 AM
#78
You're kidding, right?
And no, I cannot drive a car to the limits like one of those magazine reviewers. But, as I've said...I've sat in both the cars that this thread is comparing and IN MY OPINION, it is unfair to the TL to compare it to the S4.
If you're getting a bit offended thinking that I'm stating the TL is a bad car, you're incorrect. The TL is a fine vehicle but it is not in the S4's category. I already pointed out my analogy earlier: To me, it would be like trying to compare my FX50 to a loaded Cayenne GTS or whatever.
It's not a fair comparison since the other car is in a different segment. The A4 (let's say the 3.2) loaded is more in par with the TL you guys are talking about.
Would you like me to move this thread to Car Talk which is a bit more objective instead of a very pro-TL sub-forum and see what the consensus is...?
I am a 4gtl owner, but anytime I or any others bring up other brands/vehicles, i/we instantly get crucified. There are a few 4gtl owners here that are more snobby than those on the Audi/benz forums i used to frequent. Disappointing to say the least.
03-17-2011, 12:08 PM
#79
Mademoiselle Chanel!!
That would be interesting!
I am a 4gtl owner, but anytime I or any others bring up other brands/vehicles, i/we instantly get crucified. There are a few 4gtl owners here that are more snobby than those on the Audi/benz forums i used to frequent. Disappointing to say the least.
I am a 4gtl owner, but anytime I or any others bring up other brands/vehicles, i/we instantly get crucified. There are a few 4gtl owners here that are more snobby than those on the Audi/benz forums i used to frequent. Disappointing to say the least.
I laugh diabolically anytime I read how an S4 owner states that it's superior to a TL SH-AWD when the hardware is different...compare a coffee with coffee and not a hazelnut cappuccino to one. They are different. Stop the kindegarden tauting my hot wheel is better than your match box with the cavat that spending $15K more for vehicle is a fair comparison to another. Or next time I see a S4 owner I'm going to challenge him to a race of my 18 speed mountain bike verses his skateboard...and I'm going to whip his butt. LMAO!
03-17-2011, 12:23 PM
#80
Senior Moderator
^ Look...it is quite reasonable for anyone to be a staunch fan of the car they purchased. It's valid. It's like insulting a sports fan's beloved team...You'll even get literal fistfights out of it. 
And look...the S4 is not a Pagani Zonda, folks. I'm not saying (and any sensible Audi S4 owner would as well) the Audi is a tremendously superior car to the TL. They have comparable features. In some cases, the differential may not seem like much. Totally valid. However, the people who bought a TL instead of an S4 bought it for what? The price difference and perhaps other reasons (i.e. reliability perception)...Whatever. Again, valid.
The Audi S4 is a few $$$ more for reasons as well. The increased speed...performance...and (as you guys here are going to point out but I kinda disagree) SLIGHT upgrade in luxury. But, guess what? All of that equates to the S4 being better...It's the sum of the whole package. The TL is a fantastic car...but, again...just not fair for it to go up against the S4.
If Acura actually ever got its head out of its @$$ and started to do the "Type R" badge or officially issue Mugen variants of their cars...which, then makes a base model car faster, sportier, etc. etc...then, yeah, compare away.
Otherwise, compare the TL to the loaded 3.2 A4.
And look...the S4 is not a Pagani Zonda, folks. I'm not saying (and any sensible Audi S4 owner would as well) the Audi is a tremendously superior car to the TL. They have comparable features. In some cases, the differential may not seem like much. Totally valid. However, the people who bought a TL instead of an S4 bought it for what? The price difference and perhaps other reasons (i.e. reliability perception)...Whatever. Again, valid.
The Audi S4 is a few $$$ more for reasons as well. The increased speed...performance...and (as you guys here are going to point out but I kinda disagree) SLIGHT upgrade in luxury. But, guess what? All of that equates to the S4 being better...It's the sum of the whole package. The TL is a fantastic car...but, again...just not fair for it to go up against the S4.
If Acura actually ever got its head out of its @$$ and started to do the "Type R" badge or officially issue Mugen variants of their cars...which, then makes a base model car faster, sportier, etc. etc...then, yeah, compare away.
Otherwise, compare the TL to the loaded 3.2 A4.