FamilyGuy

Did some aggressive driving a month or so ago when I was dialing in my coils, but only at 20-30mph. Rotated my tires this weekend and noticed the fronts were ripped apart a bit on the inside.

Anyone know what would cause this particular type of ripping? Was it the aggressive cornering, bad road surfaces, alignment?

Tires are pilot super sports, stock size, stock wheels, ~32-36psi cold. Car is lowered about ~1.5"-2".

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

I feel like it would be alignment, since its mostly concentrated wear in the very edge. I know the rear toe alignment can go off by quite a bit when there's a lot of weight in the rear, do you carry people in the back seat often?

main70072

I had those same tires on a previous car and they did the same under normal driving conditions. IMO, they are garbage...

FamilyGuy

No, hardly carry anyone in the rear. These were in the front, I rotated them to the rear and that's when I saw the damage.

Really? Wow, first I've heard of this. They have excellent grip, and I've had them for ~15k miles. They were fine last time I rotated them, around 5k miles ago.

NBP04TL4ME

When last did you have an alignment? What kind of shape are your LCA bushings in? I have fairly severe inner tire wear on my snows, but believe my LCA bushings need replacement. I have yet to put my summer PSS on because I don't want to see the same thing as yours.

nfnsquared

I seriously doubt your LCA bushings are causing that tire wear.

First step for you and the OP should be to get your alignment checked....

FamilyGuy

I installed new LCA bushings with the coils, all 3 bushings in each lower arm, with the skunk2 adj top arms. New sway bar bushings too.

I don't have the alignment sheet because the printer ran out of ink but everything was at 0.x* in the green after alignment 2-3 months ago.

thoiboi

toe should be set to 0.0

t-rd

Tires shouldn't rip even if toe is off unless you run over some sharp object. I drove hard on crappy Ingalls adjustment arms for 3 years and my Yokohamas never ripped.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

i googled the PSS' and it looks like more people are having this problem, which could mean that the tire compound that Michelin is using is causing this issue.

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

Most likely just those tires. Some tires tend to do that.

I have over 16 autocross events, probably 200 laps total and 5-10k street miles on my Dunlop Star Specs and they still look and grip great.

FamilyGuy

Yea I'm kicking myself in the butt right now for not saving the receipt from tirerack.com, might've been able to do something under warranty? They're just over a year old, with ~15k miles on them, although they are almost at the warning track, only ~2/32" left in the tread life range.

IIRC toe was set to something like 0.0 or 0.1 front and back.


When I was test driving to dial in the coils, there were a couple of hard turns where the outside front corner would sway up and down a few times around the bend, very much like a busted shock up / down motion. At the time, I thought it was the soft OEM compliance bushings, but now I'm thinking that was the tires ripping apart.


Not sure what to do, I love the grip on these tires, best I've ever tried, and the tread wear is as high as I've seen for this category of tire. I might pick up a new set but save the receipt this time for warranty...?

FamilyGuy

Wow tirerack.com still has all my purchase history since my 1st purchase in 2004!

NBP04TL4ME

Why do you find that surprising??

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

If it was me, I would not buy those same tires again. Go with something like hankook RS-3.

NBP04TL4ME

FWIW - I have the PSS and they have been a phenomenal tire.

FamilyGuy

Because I didn't know they did that via their website. I thought I was going to have to call them and cross my fingers. Company records retention times are a crap shoot.

I'll check out the RS-3's.

I still like these tires and have driven aggressively cornering wise and spiritedly overall since day 1, and only now has this happened, they are at the end of their tread life. But tires shouldn't shed tread like this either, no matter how much tread is left, so huh...what to do what to do

NBP04TL4ME

Gotcha! I didn't know you were referring to the availability of the purchasers data via the web.


As I'm sure you know the PSS is made of a fairly soft rubber compound. If you are out of alignment, the inside tread is probably being subjected to some serious heat and forces other than rotational wear. The combination is more than likely causing the ripping or failure you are seeing. I'm not saying there isn't an issue with your tires and am not blindly supporting Michelin or the PSS. I'm just saying a Summer tire on a car out of alignment is going to wear and fail much faster.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

the PSS' are expensive for what they are.

a better tire is the hankook RS-3

NBP04TL4ME

I got them for a crazy good price when they first came out years ago. My commute has changed so I'm not sure I would go with them again as I roll on more miles than I used to.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^right, unless you get a super deal on them, there are tires that are cheaper that perform equal to or better than the PSS'.

its all about value tho, so if one think the PSS is a great value, purchase away!

also, i'd probably stay away from PSS' after googling the chunks missing from PSS'

FamilyGuy

Yup I hear ya. The car was aligned same day as I picked it up with the tires.

Would love to try it, but that's an extreme performance summer tire with a 200 tread wear and A A rating. The PSS is a max performance summer tire with 300 and AA A. I'm trying not to go below 300 tread wear, so they last at least a year. The RS-3's also seem to be heavier.

Both are about the same price at the moment, just over $140/tire.

NBP04TL4ME

Alignments can go out at any point based on road conditions and/or a good pothole. I followed the same logic/criteria when selecting the PSS. I definitely wanted to stay with the higher tread wear rating tire in the "summer" tire category.

FamilyGuy

Yea I know. I've read our compliance bushing is also at fault for the car not holding alignment specs the moment you drive off the shop. Who knows...def gonna get an alignment with a new set of tires.

I don't normally drive as aggressive as I did when setting the dampers on the coils, and the tires did fine right up to their last legs, so tough call. A few people on line have solved the problem with camber, but I want my wheels straight. A couple also mentioned keeping tire pressure up in the high 30's helps. I might try that. I usually set it at ~36-38 cold and let it fall to ~32ish before re-filling.

Idk, I'll see what else is avail in the max perf summer category, but I'm not afraid to give these a 2nd try.

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

If you drive aggressively, a 200 treadwear can last as long or longer than a 300 treadwear.

Bought my Star Specs(200 treadwear) in 2012 and they are still good. 15k miles plus with over 200 autocross runs and always driven aggressively on street.

I prefer star specs but recommended RS-3 based on price and better ride comfort.

FamilyGuy

Tirerack is looking into a possible warranty replacement so fingers crossed

6spd-GERCO

Solid recommendations Brian!

That's good news I had de lam issues on my Conti DW's (covered under factory warranty) otherwise they have been a good choice for summer tires. I have RS-3's for my Integra and they are nice tires for Autox.

FamilyGuy

I like the RS-3's from what I can see on tirerack, except for the wet traction scores, and this guy's comment:

"in heavy rain at highway speed it can get dangerous"

This is my daily driver and I have family in the car often. I drive normally when they're in the car, but the highways here in south fl cruise along at a pretty good speed, so traction in the rain is very important to me.

Never had any issues with the Conti extremes back when I used them a few years ago, but I was using the dws (all seasons) not the dw. I lived in new england. That was a great tire, but living up north sucks, you have to run all seasons unless you run 2 sets of wheels / tires for summer / winter. Summer tires + south fl weather =

NBP04TL4ME

Good luck

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

I have driven my Star Specs in heavy rain on highway with no issues. I have also driven aggressively in 20 degree temps without issues.

Keep in mind our cars are front wheel drive, not rwd. We don't really have to worry about rear coming loose and spinning car like rwd cars do.

Just don't drive like an idiot in a downpour or on bald tires and you will be fine.

Having a set of summer tires and a set of winter tires is the way to go.

csmeance

Driving very hard while cornering can cause this, I managed to do this to the front tires of my 760 (continental DW) after a "fun" day on some closed roads.

You'll be lucky if you get them replaced under warranty