purchasing the moog lower ball joints. hope it will come with the updated nut. if not, I will use a washer, or see if the oem castle nut fits on the threads

 

Please update once you have received the part. I plan on ordering the same part from rockauto once it warms up.

 

Just got my moog lbj today. It comes with a nut that has a built in washer now

 

 

Awesome kudos to you! I'm assuming your doing the install yourself?

 

I replaced with the Sankei, it's the OEM part. Works good.

 

Wow after all this time i'm still subscribed to this thread!

Glad MOOG changed the design so no one else has this happen to them! Black TL lookin good dude!

 

for those who want the OEM part # its actually listed in the acura parts diagrams now.


51220-SDA-305
They are ridiculously priced at almost $100 each though so that's why I went with moog

I usually do all car work by myself but been really busy lately so may let a shop do it while they do my axles also. Not gonna do it right away though since it still drives fine

 

I was going to do the same but it doesn't seem too bad. I just need to get the knuckle separated and take it to autozone to press it out but then again I usually run into some kind of problem.

 

$30 vs $100 it's hard to justify the cost unless absolutely needed for some obscure reason (AKA moog one not being right in the past)

 

I agree, but seeing as how that was simply a nut/washer issue, I am fine with it. The ball joint has always been great but they decided to use the wrong size nut on the bottom. Seems like its fixed now, however after the install I will confirm myself visually, and if I really feel like it(which I doubt), I will add a washer.

 

Buy Sankei

 

Thread revival:

How are the updated Moogs holding up?

And FYI, looks like they've done more updates:

 

Hi Guys,
is it me or has anyone face the same ? I got the lower ball joint for 2006 Acura TL from Advance Auto Parts - PartNumber: MOOG K500117; however, this part is different from the original lower ball joint. The bore diameter on my Lower Control Arm is much bigger then the MOOG part that I got. I am getting about 1/4 inch play, well, may be little less, but a decent amount that is clearly noticed.. Is there an additional adapter which comes with the part which will minimize or zero out the play?

Thanks much.

 

Did you notice the sleeve that your old lower ball joint had?

 

hi Roland,
Thx for the reply.. I am not understanding what you mean by 'sleeve' ?

 

There is a metal sleeve that adapts the hole in the control arm to the ball joint stud.

Do you still have the old ball joint? Look on the stud. See the metal sleeve? You need to take that off the old (original) ball joint and put it into the lower control arm cavity.

 

Thanks Roland, and thanks for that link you sent me as well..
this clears the issue for me.. Do i just hammer that sleeve out ? hammering the stud ?

Chet.

 

Jusr wante to add to this thread. I bought an ingalls lower ball joint from heeltoe and it shares the same part number as moog. It came with the "defective" design of a smaller nut and the oem castle nut is smaller than the new ball joints threads so i needed to use the locknut included in the ingall kit. I had my uncle, whos a certified mechanic, install this for me and he told me about the flawed design. He corrected this by adding a washer between the locknut and the sleeve. I've driven the car about 20 miles so far and some very aggressively on turns (im lowered about 1.5" btw) and there has been no issues.

During the install, however, my uncle noticed that the upper ball joints threads have gotten worn down and the oem nut isnt holding on very well. He told me i should get that replaced asap. Cost for both sides is around $120 all together. Just a bit of FYI for u guys doing the lower ball joints.. please check the upper ones as well! Stay safe out there.

 

Just an update. WASHERS DO NOT WORK! Driving my car today the lower ball joints with washers installed failed on me. The washers collapsed causing massive damage to the fender, side skirts, control arm and axle. I bought this part from Heeltoe, the manufacturer being Ingalls. Again, washers do NOT hold up and will break on you. You are better off getting OEM ones with the castle nut, which is the only safe way to get the lower ball joint done. Dont be a fool like me.

 

Sorry to hear. I read your post about using washers...and I thought I had responded with a recommendation NOT to drive like that.

FWIW, I found a similar flaw with hardrace camber arms. Luckily, I was able to reuse the stock flange nut.

My strong recommendation to anyone reading this in the future is to:
-Buy DEALER SOURCED, Genuine Honda/Acura chassis parts.

-If that is not an option, make sure the install is done with a lot of care. If you see an OEM part that looks completely different from the one you are replacing (like this flange nut), STOP and figure out why its different and if it will work. Don't count on Moog, Ingalls, SPC, HR, or any other aftermarket supplier to do thorough R&D. It's obvious that they do not.

 

have you told marcus at heeltoe yet? the same exact issue happened to another TL owner recently but he had the "old" style moog lbj and it tore apart his car. he told marcus and marcus sent out a customer wide email to anyone that had purchased that same lower ball joint...even though this should have been caught back in 2011 and there should be no more of the "old" design out there. you should give him a heads up

 

I already talked to him yes. They issued an email regarding this as well but i was shocked that after finding this thread that this issue was not resolved and had these ingalls for sale with similar design to the old moogs. Makes me wonder why they didnt take these joints off the market knowing that they are basically the same design as the flawed moog joints. I was told by them that a washer would be fine and would hold up. But that clearly didnt work out. The bill I received to get my car fixed for this flawed joint totaled $3500 with parts and labor.

 

and for the record he sent the customer wide email after i informed him of my situation and having the washers installed with the joint. Bottom line is you need that castle nut and cotter pin set up on the joint for it to properly work

 

It is obvious that you should use the OEM lower ball joint. I have 07 Accord V6 and the Moog lower ball joint is know to fail and start squeaking within just months. For $3500 in damage, you could have spent a few more for a peace of mind. But... OUCH.

 

Insurance should cover that right

 

Just for the record, after speaking with Marcus at heeltoe, he is constantly believing that my mechanic (my own uncle) lied and said he did not install the joint with a washer. I know for a fact my uncle did because after he finished the install he personally showed me and said that hes not sure it would hold up. At this point thats when i contacted heeltoe and they stated it should be safe an i had nothing to worry about. A month later my car is in the shop with $3500 in damages. Not sure why he keeps trying to deny the fact a washer does not work, but for the sake of everyone's safety do NOT use a washer and just get the proper part. I am thoroughly disappointed in the customer service of heeltoe, especially being a loyal customer to them.

 

Well....heeltoe didn't design the part. I guess, for their sake, saying something like, "a washer will work" is a bad idea.

A washer absolutely (obviously, as you found) would not work.

They're still just a vendor. Its not really their responsibility.

No offense to you or your uncle. He shouldn't have let you drive off with a washer if he thought it wouldn't hold. And if your uncle said he wasn't sure it would hold/did not recommend driving around....why did you ignore that?

Do you have photos of the damage? Did the washer crack/break? Pull through? How much overhang did it have?

While I'm sure that a general purpose washer should not be used to hold the entire corner weight of a car...I'm curious to see how it failed. I'm guessing it rusted and/or cracked through and let the ball joint sleeve slip past.

Or...are you sure the joint itself did not fail? Its an aftermarket chassis part....on a Honda...

 

This is the only pic the autobody shop took for me. The washer actually fell off, basically collapsing and bent inward so it slipped off. I didnt manage to take pics of the overall damage because of the shock of the accident. The car was towed to the shop right away. And again, the main reason was that though my uncle warned me he isnt sure of it is safe, I had contacted heeltoe, and they stated that it was 100% sure to be safe with a washer on and that my uncle did a great job noticing this. It was my fault for believing their words and thinking it was safe for sure.. But after a month of driving or so I thought maybe it was fine then. Guess not.. the stress over time caused the washer to bend and break. Like I said, I just hope people learn from my mistake of listening to a vendor (although Marcus was the man I spoke to and he IS a mechanic), its always in our best interest to use OEM parts. I just hope no one else goes through this bs. It's a lot of headache and money for something that could have been avoided.

 

Damn, sorry to hear that! Never had an issue with MOOG suspension parts before

 

If I am reading this correct a washer is supposed to keep that Moog ball joint connected?

 

M

 

that's probably the complete opposite of the moral of this story.

 

I've seen another case of a TL owner where a washer was used but it still wasn't enough to support the force on the nut and ended up with the ball joint popping out of the knuckle. This is not a part to cheap out on if you value your safety/life. If you have the older faulty design get Moog to replace it on their dime.

 

I went through this thread and iy is really strange what i've read.
I am living in Poland and when guys from my servce chainged balljaint in my car for the first time, the got the one with narrow washer. They did not asked any question, just said WTF and put there really thick and wide washer. They even welded the tube the balljoint goes into to the knuckel. They informed me about it. And nothing happened for 1.5 year till next replacement.
My point is, you do not have to be engineer to say that there was something wrong with that balljoint and it influenced safety. Just service your car in places where people make use of their brains - not just do what they are asked.
​​In last example the shop probably just want get rid off what they have in tn their warehouse. It is economy. The service should not put it into car.

BTW after oem balljoints died aftet 10k miles, I've went into moogs.

 

Instead of using the correct part...they just welded the steel tube to a cast iron knuckle? This is a good way to do things?

You're replacing ball joints every 10K miles or 1.5 years?

Shops aren't responsible for engineering. That weld was a bad idea and can fail. The part supplier (Moog) should have done proper R&D. This was a pretty dumbassed mistake on their part.

 

So the Moog doesn't have the pin... It's self locking?! I do not want to die guys. I'm just reading this thread as the shop works on the car.... Am I a dead man?

 

I would dish out the extra few dollars for OEM. Especially when it's a critical suspension component.

 

Lol too late. Picking it up from the shop now. If i die remember me for the noob that I am.

 

Well I've driven it hard. Tight turns around town, speeds of 90mph on interstate, even hitting bumps and potholes on these shitty Alabama roads. Maybe MOOG fixed it then. Ill admit I had white knuckles all weekend driving it. But I think all is good, for now.