bluenoise

Last Thursday, I had my 245/45 Avon tires replaced with a set of 235/45 Goodyear Eagle F1 AS tires. I was talked into getting them as a) they were in stock and b) they are wider than some 245s, including the Bridgestone RE960s. This morning, I had the 235s replaced with 245s in the same GY tire (there's a long story I don't feel like typing as to why I was back at the tire shop again). While I didn't expect to notice any differences in feel, I did. Namely...

1. The 235s had a much crisper turn-in response.
2. The ride was more harsh on the 235s.
3. While rim protection was 'OK' on the 235s, it's better on the 245s.
4. Both tires hold really well, but the 245s feel a bit more mushy.

Both sets are running the same air pressure, but the 235s felt overinflated compared to the slightly underinflated feel of the 245s.

Has anyone else noticed this sort of thing? It doesn't really bother me much, but I wouldn't have 'upgraded' to the 245s had I known the difference was going to be so significant. That said, I do appreciate the reduction in ride harshness with the 245s, so maybe it's a wash.

lusid

hrm.. i'm gana go from OEM MXM4's Garbage 235's to RE960 245's.

I'll report back fri / sat.

chill_dog

1) This makes sense...the 235 is more stretched than the 245, which decreases sidewall flex.

2) This makes sense...the sidewall on the 235 is slightly smaller than the sidewall of the 245; a larger sidewall absorbs more of the impact.

3) This makes sense...the tire is wider while the rim is the same width.

4) I'm guessing by hold you mean handling, or basically something related to #1 and/or cornering...if so, this makes sense, as well.

It is interesting that there is a noticeable difference, though. You're talking less than a quarter inch increase in sidewall height and less than half an inch increase in overall tire width. However, what you've reported is why my next set of wheels will have 235's on them.

bluenoise

In point number 1, I was describing how quickly the car began turning after I turned the steering wheel. There is zero lag with the 235s, but a little slop with the 245s. In point 4, I was talking about how well the tire held during a long turn, such as a freeway cloverleaf ramp. Both tires grip well and give me fair warning as I approach the limit of traction.

I think another reason the wider tires might feel a little less harsh is that there is more tire area to bridge the imperfections in the road. But, as you said, the actual dimensional differences are quite slight.

GLowrdr

I actually just put some 245's on my car this past summer. I actually found that I liked the handling better. I do know exactly what you mean by they aren't as agile when your turning (the 245's) - but I think it's kind of nice. I feel that there is more effort required to turn the wheels because they are a little more grippy.

Hard to explain, but if you've gone from 235's to the 245's - you all probably know the differences.

XxAfG786xX

so wider tires dont give better handling?

lusid

What tires you got GLowrdr? I'm from MN too.

01tl4tl

Sidewall strength is where a lot of the differance lays
You trade sidewall flex for less roll over but sacrafice ride for it
Or you go the opposite direction and take ride over absolute performance
Unless you track day your car- most drivers wouldnt know what tires are on it
More width also scrubs off more speed when you turn in to the corner-
more tire surface is expressed to the road-

bluenoise

Wider tires *may* give more traction with the larger contact patch (on dry surfaces), but sidewall height/strength may affect the crispness of the turn-in. As 01tl4tl said, there are pros and cons to each width of tire.

When I wife asked me just a bit ago if my new tires were working better, I told her they weren't as harsh-feeling. She said, "Oh good...I didn't like the way you could feel every bump with the narrower tires." So, in my case, the "wife acceptance factor" (WAF) is higher with the wider tires.

chill_dog

^^^So in other words, for as long as you own the car, you'll be getting wider tires .

lusid

okay I feel better now. I'm going from grand touring tires to UHP(ultra high perf) tires.

that alone should make a nice difference.

donc

One difference between GT tires and UHP tires is tread wear - UHP tires wear faster because of the rubber compound is stickier and thus wears faster. UHP tires also have a stiffer sidewall to withstand corner forces. This will increase tire harshness but if you want UHP you want response not a cruiser.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

If you're comparing different makes in the different sizes, it's like comparing apples and oranges. It's like comparing touring to HP to UHP tires, and even within each category you'll find tires the same designated size, but with different tread width, section width, and even different diameters.

The TL I purchased had 235/45-17 Bridgestone's, but had the dealer switch rims as I didn't like the nicks. Along came Sumitomo 235/45-17 which changed the ride drastically. Better handling, but a much harsher ride. I then installed chromed Acura wheels and Yoko Advan S.4 245/45-17 which afforded a better ride, crisper handling and overall better driveability, but at a price, as the tires weren't inexpensive.

lusid

This maybe true, but the BS RE960's had a 40k warranty. So even with quick tire wear i'm not too concerned.

GLowrdr

I picked up a set of ContiExtreme's from discount tire. I think I ended giving about $100 per tire. They were having a sale at the time I think - normally they are like 120-130.

I just got them this summer, so I can't say how they go i nthe snow, but I've heard they are pretty good for snow and ice. I personally like the dry and wet performance.

XxAfG786xX

so which tire size gives the best handling??idc about the bumpy ride

I hate cars

You went wider but kept the aspect ratio the same which gave you a taller sidewall. Your sidewalls are now 45% of 245 vs 45% of 235. With rare excetions taller sidewalls will always give you a more mushy feeling. You would've been better off going with a 255/40 so it has a nearly identical sidewall or diameter of the stock tires.

bluenoise

I'm not sure if you're talking about my initial post or not, but just to clarify my own experience...

I was comparing brand-new Goodyear Eagle F1 A/S 235/45 to brand-new Goodyear Eagle F1 A/S 245/45 when I made my observations. I'm on the 245s now.

So far, I'm really digging this tire. They are quiet, sticky, and they have virtually ZERO tramlining. I commute a bridge every day that has a seam in the concrete right along my tire's path. All my previous tires would grab this groove and 'lock in.' These tires don't grab it at all, so I don't have to drive off-center in that lane anymore. I'm guessing this is because this is the first tire I've had that doesn't have straight grooves running parallel to the tire's sidewall.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Sorry, I guess I read the OP a little too quickly.

GLowrdr

OK.. so it's a little late in the game --> but I just now realized that I've been talking out of my ass this whole thread. I didnt go from 235/40's to 245/40's. I went to 235/45's and got a wider tire.

That's why I like the handling a lot better. I couldn't figure out why everyone was saying it was mushy...lol

lusid

I'm lost rofl.