Grand_hustle17

So to start.. I have an 04 base tl 6mt.. Low compression in cyl 1 n 3 due to more than likely bent valves.. Not ideas have been floating in my head on what i want to do besides just replacing the valves (hoping there isnt any more internal damage)... Here are a few ideas i have floating around (keep in mind im not some kind of J series genius or motor head of that level) im fairly knowledgeable but def needs guidance... (This isnt some great build thread.. Just looking for upgrades and moderate power increase).. Obviously all thoughts is with replacing valves

1st- Thought of going the J37 heads route and with either TL-s cams or RL but i havent seen anywhere where the J37 cyl heads offered more power over J32..

2nd- Keep J32 heads, research in the J37 crank fits no crazy modifications and also look into oem 4th gen pistons which seem to offer slight boost in compression.. 11:2:1 vs 11:0:1 (none of which i know works as ive been thinking about my 1st option up until now).. And either tl-s or RL cams...

3rd- cam regrind keep it simple..

All of this have been floating in my head and im clueless on which route i want to take.. Ive browsed a few on here and v6performance and came up with nothing concrete.. Ive seen the crazy builds but in all honesty im not even going for crazy power.. I touch 300whp and im celebrating.. I get 280-290whp and im satisfied lol... I think im looking for at least over 260wtq


If you guys can provide links n vids n preferably dyno sheets to help make up my mind that would be much appreciated

Grand_hustle17

Botch J37 pistons lol.. Bores seems different

Grand_hustle17

Seems imay be speaking to ghosts lmao.. To v6performance i go lol

Sonnick

My heads Lmao. Cams would be great and probably make a lot of power with a tune, but you won't push 260wtq in the 3.2.

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

Getting into that bottom end is a lot more complicated and expensive than you think to get it done right, look at how much trouble KN has been going through.

I considered it at one point.. but it's expensive. It may seem not-that-expensive because some of the parts can be had fairly inexpensively, but everything is going to add up quick.

There's a few sets of heads in the BM Sonnick's and the ones I just had ported that would've gone on my TL if I had decided to buy a 2012 6MT accord.

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

To add to what mzilvar said, there is no HP made in the bottom end of a motor. With all other things being equal, increased displacement will merely add torque, and shift the power band lower.

I'd say stay with the 3.2, get some heads, and a good set of cams for NA HP. With the right set of cams, I don't see why 330 - 350 whp isn't possible from the 3.2L.

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

I wouldn't use me as an example of a typical build. I am doing this for my own personal experience and learning. The things that have happened along the way shouldn't happen with a seasoned builder and I am spending the extra money with the goal of doing it as correct as possible.

simione

iTrader: (2)

THIS EXACTLY.

I built a j36 using j37 heads and rl cams and only made 298/271 tuned with flashpro. The low end is great, but loses steam quickly. My previous motor was a j32a3 with bolt ons and type s cams that made 289/240 with the oem ecu running it. I agree with screaminz28 heads with upgraded valvesprings/cams and flashpro for tuning, and you'll be golden

Sonnick

Buy mzilvar's heads and throw some TB Motorworx spec'd cams in there....you should easily make 300+ (with supporting mods) and have the ability to rev to the moon.

Grand_hustle17

This is what i was looking for.. Numbers.. I guess i need to botch the thought of added tq.. Found a steal on heads.. Mdx heads about $250

simione

iTrader: (2)

https://acurazine.com/forums/perform...-913726/page2/

Please read post 64 before you decide on the j37 heads

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

Has anyone ever actually flow benched a set of stock 3.2 heads? Bigger isn't always better. I'd focus more on the cams rather than the heads.

simione

iTrader: (2)

I agree. There is a 3.0 on v6p with type s cams, full bolt ons, rdx injectors tuned on flashpro making 305 sae corrected

6spd-GERCO

Grand_hustle17, what do you have for mods currently?

I would make sure that your low compression is from bent valves. Have you done a leak down test? I would do that first before starting to look at mods.

If it ends up being bent valves get'em fixed and if you have the cash for cams, springs and Flashpro+tuning, head that route. I don't have many mods but FlashPro is hands down my favorite.

Grand_hustle17

Thats exactly how we came to the conclusion of cyl1 n cyl3 being low on compression

Sonnick

You found a set of 3.7 heads for $250? Where? You sure therr are 2 and they're fully assembled?

If you really want cams etc, I say buy mzilvars heads...

6spd-GERCO

Ok in your first post you mentioned low compression and didn't specify if you did a leak down test with the compression check, this why I suggested it. What was your leak down percentage for cylinders 1 & 3? Also curious to know how your valves got bent.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

That almost defies logic. Do the RDX injectors really help? I've thought about going larger, but I just looked at my last datalog and I'm only hitting 81% at wot.

Grand_hustle17

Mis shifting.. Cant really ever remember shifting to a lower gear but ill race my car here n there so im sure at some point i did.. I dont remember the actual number.. Friend of mines whos a member here (anthracitecl) did the test for me.. I think cyl 1 n 3 was in the 190's while the rest was in the 200's.. Def well over 28psi difference

Grand_hustle17

Well im sure there is more done.. With the bigger injectors all you are doing is making the car in essence run more rich then leaning it out with air which in turn could net gains.. Also the duty cycle of the injectors would be more efficient as to where they arent overworked and maxed out.. I can see gains from a tune but i def wont say anything crazy significant.. But hey.. Ive also seen stranger things lol

simione

iTrader: (2)

The newer injectors (rdx,mdx) do have a better spray pattern for better atomization. It helps, but I'm sure not that much. All I know is that his car MOVES, And he backs it up by smashing numerous cars in races. SONNICK can confirm this

Grand_hustle17

To be honest im not so sold on just drop in heads.. I feel as if one was to port the a3 heads in the 3gtl then one can see similar gains as j37.. Idk.. Looking at both heads n type S cams i cant say im sold.. But in my head im trying to tell myself it does have great gains lol

simione

iTrader: (2)

https://acurazine.com/forums/perform...-913726/page2/

Read post 64. That will explain why I am against j37 heads. The new port shape is POO

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

Your life will be made infinitely easier with this car if you just drop in a new set of stock heads, Hype-S cams, bolt-ons, 3.7 swap, and tune.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

^^

Agreed, but I'd substitute RL or MDX cams for hype-s.

Grand_hustle17

I take it "hype S" cams are type S?

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

Other than cost, I don't see why OEM cams get so much love. Hell, not even cam gears are available, so why on earth does everyone use an OEM cam? They are not designed for high rpm power. They are made for good idle quality, fuel consumption, and midrange torque for Americans that like to lug the motor around.

Aftermarket cams are the way to go for a true N/A power build. Too many people here are wasting cash building bottom ends with bigger displacement yet choking them down with stock cams.

Sonnick

We will be good friend one day, screamin.....good friends.

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

This guy isn't talking about building out his motor, and as long as that's the case, then an aftermarket cam isn't going to be maximized efficiently either, the same way if you had a built bottom end with a stock cam you won't get as much. It's all or nothing if you want gains. On that note, it cost me 100 bucks to get a new set of cam gears cut to spec with my regrind. The bigger issue is that the cams on the j-series can't be adjusted electronically like they can on a K20.

The OP hasn't really mentioned anywhere that he's looking for a big build.

Furthermore, there are virtually no options for aftermarket cams, other than TB Motorworx which is ungodly expensive considering the gains will be minimal at best. Yes you can regrind instead but that's not really an "aftermarket cam".

I can't speak for others in this thread, but I'm trying to save this dude money and time because the reality is once you hit 300-315 hp on the j32/j35, you're going to see incredible diminishing returns on the money you sink into mods. You have to be all-in and of the proper mindset at that point.

99% of people are better off just going FBO, 3.7 swap, and tune.

Sonnick

I still think taking the specs of the TB Motorworx cam and having it reground somewhere for cheaper is a good option on a stock motor, especially with the 11:1 CR of the TL. Our stock heads flow quite well and the stock cams are pretty weak in terms of lift at 0.372" according to the specs.

I'm definitely at a loss when some people will spend $800-1000 on a catback, but won't spend the same on cams. I understand more expense comes with cams such as a tune, etc., but a full exhaust (depending on where you buy it) can cost anywhere from 1-2K. That just about offsets the cost of cams/tuning assuming you have the FlashPro already. Of course, some will want to play it safe and buy upgraded valvetrain which throws my argument out the window far, far away.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, but there's a definite aural component to the cat back, that isn't there with cams. Some people do it strictly for the sound. Kind of ironic though, since at this point I want my car to be whisper quiet.

Sonnick

Me too lol, which is why I have the stock catback and cutout

Cams will surely add to the exhaust sound though. The K20 sounds great on stock cams, but on some billets............

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

I think most shy away from cams due to the added work to install, they can bolt on the catback in under an hour but for cams they've gotta get way down into the engine on the 3g you can get the cams out with the engine in the car but that takes removing the entire top end less the heads, the timing belt, a fuel line by the rear head and the egr plus anything else that gets in the way of sliding it out the sm does have a step by step procedure for it though

I was always wary of the vague comments on type s cams or rl cams etc swapping oem cams for oem

If you're going to do all that labor might as well at least go stage 1 on stock springs otherwise you'd have to pull heads and upgrade Springs and retainers, might as well do valve stem seals at that point and do stage 2 or 3

Grand_hustle17

Do you know how refreshing it was to read this post lol... My god you understood exactly and i mean exactly where my mindset is.. I am not trying to do anything over the top.. But at the same token i dont want to waste money getting parts nust to say "i upgraded" but cant tell or see the upgrades outside of a mod list.. But you sir got exactly what im trying to do... Thats kinda why yhe cam regrind and all the other shananigans havent really struck me as impressive because mods to $.. I could just get a better clutch replace my valves and run a 100shot of nitrous n call it a day.. But thats not what i want either.. Just something very slight

Grand_hustle17

One last question.... Any reason why i would want to get a 3.7 TL UIM vs a 3.7 MDX UIM... Found the mdx manifold for less...

1black_seven

iTrader: (2)

^I had this same dilemma. I think you mean the ZDX manifold? It's the same part just just listed for less.

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

I think the only difference between the '12 TL-SHAWD IM and the ZDX IM is the TL one comes painted while the ZDX one comes bare.

Grand_hustle17

Naaaaw i meant MDX intake manifold lol
Oh thats it? Lol... Pfffft lol.. Mdx intake manifold it is.. Aint popping the hood for a show lol... When i attend a show im the one looking not showing lmmfao

Grand_hustle17

Found a 07 mdx 3.7 manifold for $100...

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

I don't know if the mdx is the same, I know the ZDX is off the 2012 thats the one we've all been using or the TL manifold off the SH-AWD 2012.