I hate cars

Ethanol? Was it high compression or did he just tune it to take advantage of the octane?

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

No, Ethanol was his screen name on here. I'll have to find that thread from a few years ago where he was talking about running the Bisimoto stage one cams. You had some posts in that thread.

I hate cars

That makes a lot more sense lol. I remember him now.

Sonnick

I would expect at least 108 traps from this fully built TL-s. I trapped a best of 104.5 in 500ft DA, with most others in the 103.2 - 103.7 range. Don't forget the 106.66 in -2000+ DA lol.

Now that FlashPro is out, the rev limiter increase will definitely help. Mine is currently set at 7100 and it sounds awesome.

bouncer07

It does sound awesome, but it would sound like the power would flat out up top wouldn't it on stock cams?

fsttyms1

Not to But here is a short vid of my freshly built 3.7
Driving with my knees, shifting with one hand, holding camera with the other. Hard to tell in vid, but 2nd i was modulating throttle to about 2/3 to minimize wheel spin, Around 70 i start going up hill until i let off in vid for traffic ahead. Throttle response is amazing. I need to get rid of the stock 3.2 throttle body and get my dual throttle bodies on and get my long tubes built yet

JJH

iTrader: (1)

Lol I don't know how you did that ^ I tried and my knees were no match for the torque steer.

fsttyms1

Years of practice That and the tq steer isnt that bad (even though there is gobs of torque now compared to the 3.2)

03 tls nc

iTrader: (6)

Can't wait to get my engine put together, once again the guys at King have been a big help. I love watching the LT's rev out so quick!!!

NvrDwn

Not hijacking either but how big of a hill was that??

I ask because compare it to mine, a J30A5 almost fully bolted.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

^ what is up with the CEL?

NvrDwn

I completely removed the butterfly flap thinking the ecu wouldn't know. Well it did lol.

fsttyms1

Its not mountain but its a sizable grade. Best i can explain it is about the grade of a short steep on ramp to the interstate but much longer.

Sonnick

I would think so, yea. But.....even if power dropped, it would still be higher when compared to ~5100-5200RPMs (where you land when you shift). So essentially, you would still be making more power than if you were to shift into the next gear. Each and every car here would be quicker with a higher rev limiter.

Adam, I tell you this all the time, buddy....it's too hard to compare speedo vids. I'm not sure what mods are done to the 3.7, but comparing acceleration vids of the same car are really hard to do. Sometimes, I've caught myself looking at speedo vids online, thinking "wow, that moves pretty quick," yet it's a video of a car going 13.9 @ 101. Point is, they are not an accurate assessment of speed.

I hate cars

Since we're doing this, here's my ex's CL65 AMG Mercedes. I was filming with one hand which was kind of hard with 700+ hp from a dig. This video was meant to show how slow it gets when heat soaked but I never got around to making a video of when it was cool and making full power. It sucks I let off before 80 because that car pulls just as hard from 80-140 but it was a short street. It actually makes the same power as my GN but with total luxury. The downside is it weighs 1200lbs more than my car.

I hate cars

In case the vid doesn't work.

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

just a quick update on this -

I was talking with King yesterday because they are doing YAWSPORT's J35a8 build for their SCCA TL and I was curious what is being done - aside from the bottom end raising compression using some custom Mahle pistons, King sent the cams off to Megacycle for some R&D. I'm pretty sure it will be a completely custom cam.

Depending on the results of that, I may revise this build with one of their cams. These would not be regrinds.

the main thing though, is that there is R&D going on for custom cams on a j35a8, which is encouraging.

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

Problem is valve stem depression and the oem rocker arm ratio (roller diameter). A billet cam can only do so much if you cant generate any more lift due to usable stem height. The heads need modified as well as the rockers, (or heck, just replacement rocker design and head work).....period.

Has anyone seen Web Cam's replacment vtec killer rockers for B or K series motors? sick.

TBMotorworx might release this in 2014.....its already been done just not started up and ran!

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

the rocker design needs to be redone. The cams are inverted to one another by design, so a straight billet cam would push against the roller on the rear cam bank which would, um, not work well to say the least.

curious to see what TBM has in store, I will have to start following them.

fsttyms1

One could change the rocker ratio to overcome the cam lobe size limitation very easily by just changing the roller bearing. This would work especially well on a custom made cam as they could take into account for the larger roller.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

^ hmm who can make roller bearings? I have my j35a8 ready to install. Just need to press in those stupid camshaft seals and make sure I don't install it in the wrong direction again.

http://www.timken.com/en-us/products...s/default.aspx

NvrDwn

^^ as in the hole motor or just heads?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

for the rockers silly. Looking to change the rocker arm ratio

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

Are you using the heads with the exhaust manifolds built in(it looks like you are)? If you ran ones without them built in and custom long tube headers I think you can see better gains. Just look at p2r's stock internal 3.2 build. It is making 300-305whp and over 270 wtq with only bolt ons and a tune.

King motorsport does good work but they do not know much about the j series. I have spoken with them on the phone about a N/A engine build and they warned me away from it because of R&D costs since they have never worked on the engine before.

That is why the price is so high.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

^ just the regular j35a8, budget is around 1500. Already had stuff PnP, another 250 or so for the gasket that needs to go in/replace, valve stems, camseals, and etc.

I also called King's and it was like 3200 for just top end build. That's pretty much the cost of a J36 parts only.. lol They do good work, but the money doesn't grow on trees.

Can't do j32a2 head since car will eventually go back to CA.

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

I disagree. The reason why I made such a bold statement earlier can be explained by the first line on this image. Simply changing rocker ratio's ALONE is not going to help enough to be worth the effort. You need further modifications to the head's valve seal area, like TBMW has done. Once you're at .500 - .600 lift on intake, then you're cookin @ 330-350cfm.

I hate cars

Are you talking about the bowl area or the actual seat (angles??)?

It wasn't too many years ago when 330-350cfm was Nascar territory. That's badass for a streetable car.

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

Im speaking of maching down the valve guides on the valvetrain side and performing a mapped CNC port job on j32a2 cylinder heads to achieve revised valvetrain geometry clearance for the rockers when equipped with new rollers, and peak flow. Im sure its also possible on the 2nd gen J motors (j30a4, j32a3, j35a8 to name a few) with just a bit less performance due to exhaust restrictions of the cast-in manifold. Yes, its awesome stuff and is already a reality.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

too much work. Time to save for the new NSX. lol

I hate cars

So what's wrong with a smaller base circle and longer stemmed valves in this engine?

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

Nothing, that's part of what TBMW has done. His package requires longer valves as advertised and the cams are billet

I hate cars

Got it. I was starting to think there was some reason you couldn't do this on the J.

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

Is the 3200 them doing the labor to install your heads or just disassembly, decking, pnp work and re-assembly? I know yours are already pnp though. It looks like thats $1k - $1300 on their website?

Curious, I'm looking at sending the RL heads (they're actually the same as 07/08 Type-S heads with RL cams) I just bought from andy there to be disassembled, pnp, decked (maybe bump compression) and re-assembled. Then I'm going to do the install work myself.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

No idea. I was just told its 3200. Don't remember off the top of my head what was included

eclypse

$16k not counting the price of the car?? maybe it's because i do all of my own work, but i had $16k in my 2001 corvette making 540bhp and 500lbs of torque, counting the price of the car ($13k + $2k in engine, $1k in suspension)

still very cool this info is out there for this platform, and it shows what it takes/makes, so thanks for that.

eclypse

ah, just read the whole thing and saw how much $$ you lost in r&d, basically. christ that's horrible.

after all that, you should go into business like Bisimoto, just selling corrected cams and cam gears! i mean, you sound to be the ONLY PERSON on the planet that seems to have found this information first hand.

if it makes you feel any better, i turboed a FWD Altima years back, and wasted about $6000 in "this part is good" or "this part will work" or having a shop "finish it" only to find i had to undo everything. if i want unique in the future, ill swap in a domestic engine. i just hate dealing with the veil of unknowns, misinformation, and dishonest people that plagued my import work. maybe it's different if you're working on a gt-r, but for the normal day to day stuff, if you dont buy brand new and do it yourself (and even your post revealed that didnt work for you) you're taking a gamble

I hate cars

I tend to stick with a single cam and 2 valves per cylinder myself. There's a lot to be said for tried and true combos where many others have done it before you. Then again it's pretty cool to be a pioneer but I just don't have the time or money.

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

yeah, the R&D was brutal but mostly that was on the cams. Remember I had $2k in replacement parts because i stripped a stock head and cost 1500 for the replacement, then I also had the 105k maintenance parts.

Then another 4k in cam labor that should have been about 1k in a perfect world.

Knowing what we know now, that build would cost probably 7k - basically 2500 for porting the cylinder heads, another 600 for decking, and another 1250 for cams. That plus the labor to re-install everything, degree cams, etc. would put you probably in the neighborhood of 7k.


all that said, the money is long gone now and I'm over it. End-of-year bonus time is coming up in a month which should put another 20-30k in my pocket, so I'll be picking up a few things for the BMW and possibly prepping the TL to sell for somewhere in the 15-17k range. We'll see.

mzilvar

iTrader: (3)

King wants a lot of money to port these heads, I got the 2500 quote from them as well and 2900 if they matched intake runners to the heads & IM gasket.

I got a much more reasonable quote of 600 + shipping from NVA-AV6 to have essentially the same work done by him. I know where I'll be sending them.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

^ i wouldn't say the same, since Paul doesn't bench each port to match flow. But its good for the money.

I had a local machine shop do my head and they did an A+ job with the valve job, hot tank, and gasket matching everything.