Innovative Mounts Review
09-11-2008, 04:19 PM
#81
Excelerate is right, the mounts will become softer as the bushings break in. The only vibration I have now is when the A/C is on. No vibration with either cold starts/warm starts.
I am pretty constant on checking the torque making sure everything is still buttoned up and the mounts seem to be staying tight. On the center bolt throught the mount, I just hand tightened and then made a quarter turn with the wrench and then I checked it with my torque wrench and it is right at 30 ft-lbs. That seems the way to go.
I am pretty constant on checking the torque making sure everything is still buttoned up and the mounts seem to be staying tight. On the center bolt throught the mount, I just hand tightened and then made a quarter turn with the wrench and then I checked it with my torque wrench and it is right at 30 ft-lbs. That seems the way to go.
09-12-2008, 08:11 AM
#82
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As posted Sunday night on the other board:
"Alright, I've done a little testing since I finished the initial install friday night. I determined the air ratchet tightened the through-bolt to about 45 to 50 ft-lbs, and I adjusted down from there. I made sure I stayed in each torque spec for at least three drive cycles, so that I could get an adequate feel for each. I've been doing alot of driving in the last 48 hours or so. My results (keep in mind, this is done by ass-dyno only):
45-50 lb-ft: Heavy vibration, sound magnified significantly through the frame.
40 lb-ft: Only slightly better than 45 lb-ft.
35 lb-ft: noticeably quieter, much less vibration, but still a good deal more of both than stock.
30 lb-ft: very close to stock vibration level, only slightly noticeable magnification of engine noise.
25 lb-ft: no discernible difference over 30 lb-ft.
Traction level stayed about the same across the board.
My conclusion: 30 lb-ft is the ideal torque setting for reduced vibration while maintaining the highest possible clamping value. I would recommend a light application of loc-tite on the bolt ends as extra insurance, but 30 lb-ft should be quite adequate to maintain this torque value.
Hope this helps people."
"Alright, I've done a little testing since I finished the initial install friday night. I determined the air ratchet tightened the through-bolt to about 45 to 50 ft-lbs, and I adjusted down from there. I made sure I stayed in each torque spec for at least three drive cycles, so that I could get an adequate feel for each. I've been doing alot of driving in the last 48 hours or so. My results (keep in mind, this is done by ass-dyno only):
45-50 lb-ft: Heavy vibration, sound magnified significantly through the frame.
40 lb-ft: Only slightly better than 45 lb-ft.
35 lb-ft: noticeably quieter, much less vibration, but still a good deal more of both than stock.
30 lb-ft: very close to stock vibration level, only slightly noticeable magnification of engine noise.
25 lb-ft: no discernible difference over 30 lb-ft.
Traction level stayed about the same across the board.
My conclusion: 30 lb-ft is the ideal torque setting for reduced vibration while maintaining the highest possible clamping value. I would recommend a light application of loc-tite on the bolt ends as extra insurance, but 30 lb-ft should be quite adequate to maintain this torque value.
Hope this helps people."
09-13-2008, 07:33 PM
#83
13.19@105.48MPH
So who else is running the 85a mounts? well it has some vibration, long story short it feels normal to me due to my other car has 95a in it, but i guess its not for everyone
09-16-2008, 01:14 AM
#84
Safety Car
According to this source,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steering
the IM mounts could be reducing torque steer. According to the cited source, torque steer is caused by (in addidtion to other reasons) :
- Transient movement of the engine
- Tolerances in engine mounts
Thus, the opposite should be true. Less engine movement and stiffer engine mounts should cause less torque steer.
09-16-2008, 08:15 AM
#85
94 DC4 RS LSV/Turbo
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^ makes sense... I am also immune to torque steer, I actually use it to corner lol... kinda like how I friggin power slid my car yesterday... friggin crappy mickellins... intentionally mispelled
I dont know what I am waiting for to do this mod, I def got the install down to a t, done it 3+ times already... sigh... ACTROS sell em ur mounts lol
I dont know what I am waiting for to do this mod, I def got the install down to a t, done it 3+ times already... sigh... ACTROS sell em ur mounts lol
09-19-2008, 11:36 AM
#86
Finally got the rear mount installed yesterday. Some love and hate results. It's more responsive than just having 2 mounts, but the vibration is definitely there now. I've even made sure all the mounts were at 30ft/lbs. I will drive on them for a while and hopefully they will break-in. All in all, I'm please performance wish.
09-19-2008, 09:54 PM
#87
Safety Car
1) From doing research on these IM on the CL and 2G sub-forums, most agree that it is the rear mount that contributes the vast majority of the vibration out of the three mounts.
2) I was wanting to wait a week or so longer before saying anything just to be sure. But, I will open my mouth now in case others can benefit from the tentative info.
My mounts have broken-in after 500 miles.
My stiffer 75A (Black) mounts have become less harsh. The mounts have less intense vibration and less noisy (that roaring when sitting at a red light). I estimate that the vibration and noise is reduced by at least half compared to the first few days after installing them.
Again, I had read others say the same thing about the mounts breaking-in. But honestly, I did not believe that this was possible. Rhetorically, how can a chunk of polyurethane "break-in" ? If anything, I thought the driver became numb to the mounts, not that the mounts broke-in.
But, I can say that I was wrong. I know (I think ???) that I did not become numb to the mounts. I would need a hell a lot longer than just 500 miles to get use to that roaring sound at stop lights that sounded like a jet taking off when you seat next to the plane wing.
Plus, I had not driven my car in 7 days because of hurricane Ike here in Houston. And when I drove my car yesterday for the first time after Ike, I could easily spot the less intense vibration and noise. If it was me that was becoming numb, I think that I would had felt the full wrath of the mounts after not driving the car for 7 days. Instead, they felt about 50% less intense.
2) I was wanting to wait a week or so longer before saying anything just to be sure. But, I will open my mouth now in case others can benefit from the tentative info.
My mounts have broken-in after 500 miles.
My stiffer 75A (Black) mounts have become less harsh. The mounts have less intense vibration and less noisy (that roaring when sitting at a red light). I estimate that the vibration and noise is reduced by at least half compared to the first few days after installing them.
Again, I had read others say the same thing about the mounts breaking-in. But honestly, I did not believe that this was possible. Rhetorically, how can a chunk of polyurethane "break-in" ? If anything, I thought the driver became numb to the mounts, not that the mounts broke-in.
But, I can say that I was wrong. I know (I think ???) that I did not become numb to the mounts. I would need a hell a lot longer than just 500 miles to get use to that roaring sound at stop lights that sounded like a jet taking off when you seat next to the plane wing.
Plus, I had not driven my car in 7 days because of hurricane Ike here in Houston. And when I drove my car yesterday for the first time after Ike, I could easily spot the less intense vibration and noise. If it was me that was becoming numb, I think that I would had felt the full wrath of the mounts after not driving the car for 7 days. Instead, they felt about 50% less intense.
their softies hahaaha
09-21-2008, 12:27 PM
#94
94 DC4 RS LSV/Turbo
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Well for the front you might be able to get at the front mount from underneath, for the side 50/50 chance youcan get at it, for the rear that's no problem at all
For the front if you can see the center bolt just see itn you can do it without removing the blower
Since I haven't seen a blower in a while I'd say it is definitely possible
Them swivel tip extensions ftw
For the front if you can see the center bolt just see itn you can do it without removing the blower
Since I haven't seen a blower in a while I'd say it is definitely possible
Them swivel tip extensions ftw
09-30-2008, 05:43 PM
#98
ugh... FINALLY installed mine today.. big difference in shift, wheel hop and acceleration.... shifts are smooth... vibrations are DEFINITELY there... but it may break in
Anyways.. heres a piece of info for some of the others on here
The Vacumm lines... they are designed to release the tension in the mounts when the engine is idle.... you wont get that function with the Innov. mounts... so, thats why we all state "alot of vibration at idle or at red light"
i wanna go rip my car apart and do some nasty 0-60 pulls, but i just installed new brakes today, and i wanna break them in.. also, they dont feel 100% right (big UH-OH for me !!!
)
Anyways.. heres a piece of info for some of the others on here
The Vacumm lines... they are designed to release the tension in the mounts when the engine is idle.... you wont get that function with the Innov. mounts... so, thats why we all state "alot of vibration at idle or at red light"
i wanna go rip my car apart and do some nasty 0-60 pulls, but i just installed new brakes today, and i wanna break them in.. also, they dont feel 100% right (big UH-OH for me !!!
)
09-30-2008, 11:00 PM
#100
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if he didn't pull the blower he must be running custom fans, cuz I couldn't get the fan out without removing the blower and without twisting the bracket on the fan, possible likely but not without modifying stock parts
as for allon + brakes, I thought you said you were not going to be doing brake mods
ps. oem pads are dusty as fuck but they are real good
as for allon + brakes, I thought you said you were not going to be doing brake mods
ps. oem pads are dusty as fuck but they are real good
09-30-2008, 11:50 PM
#101
^ just went for stoptechs.. no biggie... much cheaper than OEM.. but they dont feel to be as "grippy" .. only got about 3 miles on them
as for the mount install... wasnt that hard, but after a few days... my mechanic was telling me, its good to unbolt the mounts... start the car, put it in reverse, then drive, then neutral, and re-tighten...
im getting some serious vibrations. i tq'ed the middle bolt (through the mount) to about high 30's lb/ft.... when i put the ac on... (which thank god i dont need until june) the car goes into like a `69 Chevy SS 454 mode... everything shakes
im gonna be building a custom cup holder/ash try soon... all my change and drinks rattle like fck with the ATLP/Rv6 setup.. these mounts didnt help
im hearing from others, that they break in though?
as for the mount install... wasnt that hard, but after a few days... my mechanic was telling me, its good to unbolt the mounts... start the car, put it in reverse, then drive, then neutral, and re-tighten...
im getting some serious vibrations. i tq'ed the middle bolt (through the mount) to about high 30's lb/ft.... when i put the ac on... (which thank god i dont need until june) the car goes into like a `69 Chevy SS 454 mode... everything shakes
im gonna be building a custom cup holder/ash try soon... all my change and drinks rattle like fck with the ATLP/Rv6 setup.. these mounts didnt help
im hearing from others, that they break in though?
10-01-2008, 05:23 AM
#103
Originally Posted by TheWanderer316
^ yea, mine had serious vibrations for about the first week, now i barely notice it all.
10-01-2008, 11:16 AM
#104
10-01-2008, 04:09 PM
#106
Safety Car
by "vibration" are you guys talking about in the STEERING wheel? mine couldn't be any worse with my already BEND center hub/axle. or could it possibly get worse? I haven't ordered a set of these yet, but I'm planning on it.
Josh (excelerate), do you sell these bad boys? lol
Josh (excelerate), do you sell these bad boys? lol
10-01-2008, 05:01 PM
#108
by "vibration" are you guys talking about in the STEERING wheel? mine couldn't be any worse with my already BEND center hub/axle. or could it possibly get worse? I haven't ordered a set of these yet, but I'm planning on it.
Josh (excelerate), do you sell these bad boys? lol
Josh (excelerate), do you sell these bad boys? lol
10-02-2008, 06:15 AM
#110
Three Wheelin'
So when you guys say 'break-in,' the only thing I can imagine happening to cause this is the urethane material conforming smoothly around the bolt.. Anyone agree?
10-02-2008, 02:21 PM
#112
stock mounts have actuators in them, and use vacuum lines.. when the car is idle, the mounts have almost NO stiffness to them, as you increase engine RPM in gear, the mounts tighten up... this design is also VERY critical in front end collisions
The TL's engine is designed to drop and buckle when invovled in a serious front end crash... these mounts will stop that front happening as smoothly as the OEM ones would.
Most Acura dealers, will probably give you sh*t over them, and tell you, you've now voided the warranty and the entire cars "frame or chassis" because of these mounts... the increased vibration may lead to new noise rattles or squeaks.. so i hope most of us, who installed these, arent going to the dealer and complain about any type of warrnaty claim related to something that can be affected by these mounts
FYI, i think the ONLY thing on my car thats left under warranty is my side-view mirrors.. which ironically enough, are breaking (they stick & click when moving).. and maybe my power windows
The TL's engine is designed to drop and buckle when invovled in a serious front end crash... these mounts will stop that front happening as smoothly as the OEM ones would.
Most Acura dealers, will probably give you sh*t over them, and tell you, you've now voided the warranty and the entire cars "frame or chassis" because of these mounts... the increased vibration may lead to new noise rattles or squeaks.. so i hope most of us, who installed these, arent going to the dealer and complain about any type of warrnaty claim related to something that can be affected by these mounts
FYI, i think the ONLY thing on my car thats left under warranty is my side-view mirrors.. which ironically enough, are breaking (they stick & click when moving).. and maybe my power windows
10-02-2008, 05:30 PM
#113
Three Wheelin'
stock mounts have actuators in them, and use vacuum lines.. when the car is idle, the mounts have almost NO stiffness to them, as you increase engine RPM in gear, the mounts tighten up... this design is also VERY critical in front end collisions
FYI, i think the ONLY thing on my car thats left under warranty is my side-view mirrors.. which ironically enough, are breaking (they stick & click when moving).. and maybe my power windows
FYI, i think the ONLY thing on my car thats left under warranty is my side-view mirrors.. which ironically enough, are breaking (they stick & click when moving).. and maybe my power windows
my mirror was like that too for a while, all you need to do is remove it and white lithium grease the hell out of the 'plastic ball' thingy... make sure u rotate it so you can get all angles..
10-02-2008, 09:26 PM
#115
Race Director
Whoa, did they go up $10 in 5 days? They were $315 shipped in the other thread.https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=73
10-02-2008, 10:09 PM
#116
Whoa, did they go up $10 in 5 days? They were $315 shipped in the other thread.https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=73
10-02-2008, 11:05 PM
#117
Safety Car
One thing is for sure... they DO break-in !!! My mounts were MONSTERS when I first started the car after the install (NASCAR type vibration and noise). I thought to myself, "oh HELL, I made a big ass mistake
".But now with the break-in thus far, they have turned into pussycat.
Last edited by Inaccurate; 10-02-2008 at 11:10 PM.
10-03-2008, 12:06 AM
#118
But if any fans have to come out, the blower has to come with it.
Last edited by mrlunecy; 10-03-2008 at 12:08 AM.
10-11-2008, 07:00 PM
#120
Safety Car
pinina,
That thing that the wire and the hose are connected to is the solenoid. The ECU uses this solenoid (via a 12v signal) to control the softness of the oem mounts.
You can see the hose running from the manifold to the solenoid. There are hoses running from the solenoid going to the mounts (front and rear, but not the side mount).
I plugged the nipple at the manifold and removed everything (all hoses and solenoid). I used a nylon tie-wrap to secure the electrical connector that had went to the solenoid.
That thing that the wire and the hose are connected to is the solenoid. The ECU uses this solenoid (via a 12v signal) to control the softness of the oem mounts.
You can see the hose running from the manifold to the solenoid. There are hoses running from the solenoid going to the mounts (front and rear, but not the side mount).
I plugged the nipple at the manifold and removed everything (all hoses and solenoid). I used a nylon tie-wrap to secure the electrical connector that had went to the solenoid.