screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

Looks like his site is down. Kinda strange - one of my Win10 runs it fine, the other crashes.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I think that was my issue. I download it from another website and it keeps crashing. Just going to wait for the site to update so I can put up my N/A map vs turbo

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

Love it! Time to turn it up! That holset LOVES 25+ PSI.

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

In my experience, the j-series makes great reliable power around 11.3-11:5 AFR on stock internals.

Loving that boost?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I am loving the boost. The extra tq is soo nice. We are done doing wot timing just doing afr now

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

here how far I have come. datalog 6 (low timing and 10psi max) vs 13 (optima timing and 8-9psi max) (currently on map 15 and will update later )




datalog 14 wasn't good. I hit a bump in the road and it triggered VSA so the dyno showed 800 whp. lol

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

Not sure if the waste gates were set at different levels or not between these two runs but did you notice that 10lb log never seems to stabilize at a specific boost pressure when compared to the consistency of the 9lb log. If no waste gate springs were changed between these two logs I'd be looking for possible excessive restriction, back pressure, loose line, etc considering the waste gates stability are solely based off of intake and exhaust pressure differentials.

Btw, if it were me in your shoes, I'd definitely opt for running the optimal timing and lower boost pressures since running a retarded ignition can cause combustion temps to increase. This is surely something you don't want when running pump gas as your chance of knock will be more likely. This is assuming the "optimal" ignition settings are still in the safe/reliable zone and not taken to the edge of the knock threshold. As they say, tune for reliability.


I'm with you btw man! I'll be installing my water injection setup this weekend and will be aiming for the high teens by Sunday. They say it's damn near impossible to encounter knock on e85 but I'm a little skeptical. I'll always try and prove theory's wrong. And if I don't, then that's a good thing too! I'm thinking that I'll use the water injection in place of the intercooler and literally route the turbo straight to the throttle body. I'll try injecting pre and post turbo together to achieve the greatest cooling effect. This all depends on how things go with higher boost pressures and water injection WITH the intercooler first!

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

I'd be careful trying to prove that theory wrong, lol. The problem with E85 is since you never detonate, you just keep adding timing, well past MBT. You aren't detonating, but you're also not making any more power. Talk about putting a beating on the bearings. I've seen bozo tuners just throw a ton of timing at E85 tunes when they don't need it. What's your goal in trying to remove the intercooler? For a track only car, I could see it, but for something on the street, I'd definitely want an intercooler, even with E85. I wouldn't doubt you could see IATs of 300 degrees or more after a WOT run without an intercooler.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I think I swapped the emusa 5 waste gate with a turbo smart 7psi one in between runs. The car wasn't stable with the emusa since I was boost creeping and the spring couldn't keep up.

I am really happy about the car right now. I am just going to leave boost as is and keep tuning

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

Lol, maybe I explained that wrong. I can see how you assumed that's what I meant by pushing the limits of e85 knock threshold.

I didn't mean this would be done by running up ignition advancement. I meant by testing its limits by throwing as much boost at it as possible on stock compression and internals to see how far I can go SAFELY. When tuning, I use datalog timing versus engine RPM to determine if power was made from ignition adjustments while using the exact same stretch of road every time. Since being boosted, this car has never once seen a dyno for tuning. It's been done using this exact method and don't ever plan on changing it. It's that reliable. I make small adjustments for humidity levels and temps and that's about it.

As for my purpose of wanting to rid the intercooler, two reasons: to increase airflow across the radiators core and also to shorten the travel time between the throttle body and turbo. I calculated nearly 8.5 feet of charge pipe length a few weeks ago and reducing this down to 1.5 feet should add a great deal of response and power. Not sure what my current pressure drop is but I'm sure it's at minimum 1 lb of boost!

As mentioned, if I don't see an almost identical (or better) air charge temperature using water injection, then I'll gladly revert back to intercooler or running both. My plans are observing the temperature improvements with intercooler and then without. Not really sure what to expect but I know that e85 already possesses great cooling effects so running without an intercooler may be feasible.

UTAH TSX

My guess is water won't cool as much as you hope for, the drag race V8 guys around here do it without an intercooler but they use straight methanol and a shit ton of it, on another note our IAT sensor is so slow to react it will be hard to tell what is really going on, I trimmed as much of the plastic off the tip as I dared (ruined a few going to far and cutting the copper hair thin wire in half) and it helped some at least it will move in third and fourth gear more than a few degrees.

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

Funny you mention the IAT sensor and the delayed response in temperature fluctuation that seems to occur. I've noticed this several times while observing some datalogs but quickly realized that it's not the sensor itself but it's the refresh rate of the factory ECM. I discovered this by also examining the ECT sensor as well and how it tends to do the same thing. I bet if you checked the resistance of either sensor while applying heat to their tips you would get almost immediate reactions.


And to the original point of your response, I'd like to first say that I had successfully finished my water injection system install today and increased the boost to roughly 16lbs. I realized that I had grabbed everything for the install from my shop except the stupid nozzle and so I had to drive the car 25 min away to pick it up. On the way there, I decided to be daring and so I touched up the tune before heading out and richened/retarded everything from my previous boost max onwards. I was happy to see that all looked well and the IAT's stayed right around the same as they were before. It was 90* when I left the house and while driving, I was seeing slightly over 100* charge temps. Got to the shop, installed, the nozzle, poured in a 50/50 mix (not just water) and my IAT's went down to 86* during full boost....the ambient temp by that time had dropped to 84*. That's only 2* above ambient at 16lbs of boost! The car was an absolute monster and REALLY loves the e85. It's never felt so smooth and happy under boost like this before. I've got some more dialing in to do before I can stand on the pedal longer but I'm very happy ATM.

Anybody that has access to e85 and running a boosted j-series should seriously consider the change. You won't be disappointed. I'm loving it.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I wish we had e85 here. W.v hates alternative fuel. Rolling coal here all day

UTAH TSX

Same here the only E85 station in Utah is a 30 minute drive from our house

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

Robert, are you still on the stock fuel lines and returnless setup? I'd like to go E85 but don't want to get that far from stock, and I wasn't sure how much power the stock stuff can support on E.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

installed the mishimoto 68*C thermostat. OEM is 78*C so about an 18 degrees opening difference.

I did notice that the mishimoto one had some white specks on it. I am not sure if it was metal or wax, but it doesn't hurt to clean it before install. Car took about 1.2 gallon of coolant. Get ready for a big mess when you pull off the thermostat.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

i bought another oem starter. going to return the aftermarket one and do warranty on it. they keep failing after heat soak and wont start up until the car cools. i bought a thermal blanket for the new stater. lets hope this problem goes away.. so i am not sure what is going on. maybe the wiring going to the starter is not large enough? i think it is a gauge wiring. or wiring from the battery is not larger enough? also 4 gauge. problem started to happen more so after the battery relocation. at first i thought it was the clutch relay switch since it clicked and no start.

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

Funny you had that issue. I went out to drive my car yesterday and it wouldn't crank. No issues with power it just wouldn't turn over. I thought the clutch interlock switch had gone bad at first. Come to find out, the power wire from the battery was a tad loose in its connector. I would have thought in a situation like this that when I tried to crank I would lose all power, but it never did that, it just wouldn't energize the starter. Had the starter tested too just in case. Redid the power wire and all was well. Double check your power connections just in case.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I feel like after the car heatsoaks there is a lot of resistance in the wiring to engerize the starter. So it just click and dies. Only after the car has cooled down it will start with no issue. So either the motor is getting stuck because of heat expasion or it is an electrical issue.

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

I forgot, are you running pump gas only or pump gas supplemented with water/meth injection?

Contrary to what's said about the low temp thermostats, this was hands down THE BEST mod I've done for the cooling system. Much happier with the ECT's and FP made the tuning easy. Not sure if you made any adjustments with cooling fan on/off temps but this also helped. Right now since the summer months in Texas are insane, I've got the fans on at 185 and off at 182. This keeps the ECT more stable since it naturally cools off much lower during cruising or highway speeds. Otherwise you will see some pretty massive temp fluctuations of around 15-20* or so. At least I did here with the hot weather.

Not sure how you ran the cables after the battery relocation but it's easy to run a single large (minimum of 2g, I ran 0g) positive cable from battery directly to starter lug, then another from the starter lug to the engine compartment fuse block for the remainder of the electrical systems power with a minimum of 4g cable. And for the negative, a 4g minimum (it can smaller since it travels less distance) cable from battery to the closest area of the frame underneath you can attach it to. Make sure the area chosen is wire wheeled clean and you use a bolt/nut to secure the eyelet connector. Lastly, there needs to be another 4g minimum cable ran from the engine block (preferably a starter mounting bolt) to the closest area of the frame again. Keep the two grounds that you run to the frame as short as possible. And probably most importantly, be sure and solder ALL terminals and eyelet connectors used along with heatshrink and install a slow blow high amperage fuse AT THE BATTERY for the positive cable that's at least 350 amps or more. I myself used a resetable breakers at 450 amps that I found on eBay for like $65. If that last step is skipped, you will be risking the chance of burning your car to the ground in the event the positive cable is pinched/shorted to anything metal or if your starter internally shorts out. Let me know if you need any more help/info on this matter. Electrical is my thing.

Sounds like the starter may be failing repeatedly due to an issue with either excessive resistance and/or low voltage to the starter under load.

I'm running e85 at 16lbs of boost so yeah, my fuel system is completely changed. I'm running 3 massive fuel pumps, -8AN supply and return fuel line, aftermarket large bore fuel rails, and ID 1000cc fuel injectors. At full boost, I'm around 58-60% injector load command. The stock fuel lines would doubtfully support more than 280whp running stock fuel system with e85 but more if you increase supply pressure using an aftermarket pressure regulator with RDX injectors and tune with FlashPro.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

running 93 oct with 50/50 water meth.

ill look into a thicker gauge wiring.

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

What's your IAT's look like before and after adding the meth setup? Dropping down close to ambient temps?

gnuts

iTrader: (1)

do you need to replace the rad cap and fan switch along with the thermostat? I was reading up on the mishimoto thermostat and someone mentioned needing to replace all 3. (1.3 bar cap)

my IAT reads 149* tops from my s/c at 3.5 psi.

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

Wow, you must not have any type of intercooler setup on that. I'd shit a brick if my IATs ever went above 120* while under boost. It may see close to that after heat soak but the heat quickly dissipates soon after airflow hits the intercooler. Is that with or without WMI? And haven't you been at 3.5lbs since like 1980? Lmao, how do you resist the urge dude!?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I always run meth even while n.a. while sprayig temps are about 10-20 above ambient with the turbo. Just driving around iat are about 25-30 above ambient

When it was n.a it was about ambient or lower.

gnuts

iTrader: (1)

Ya no intercooler or WMI. Intercooler is on the list. I won't up the boost until that is done. I barely have time to wash it let alone fiddle with mods.
What about the rad cap? Did you guys do that too along with the thermostat?

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

i hear ya on upping the boost. You can't beat the simplicity and effectiveness of chemical intercooling (WMI) though! Do it and have instant access to at least a few more pounds of fun.

as for the higher pressure caps, not really necessary now that I have the low temp thermostat though I did try years back when I was having cooling system issues but it did nothing for me. If anything, it made matters worse. The theory behind it makes since BUT I think that depending on what's actually causing cooling issues really dictates the outcome of that mod. For me, I was running way to little timing at the time and found out later on then issue disappeared (or greatly improved) once that was sorted out. I now have ZERO cooling issues in the cars current state even running a shitty eBay aluminum radiator. If I ever have the chance, I'm either purchasing/installing a CSF all aluminum radiator or (more probable) installing a stock radiator back in. The eBay radiator is just such a thin POS with horrible heat disappation qualities.

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

Isn't the theory behind using a higher pressure cap is to gain extra headroom of pressure over what you currently have for the boiling point which allows for higher temps? Dropping the thermostat temps would generate less heat and pressure, wouldn't it?

With all of the manifold pipes near all of the radiator hoses, what are people here doing to replace the upper and lower hoses? The initial thing I did was just wrap the sections where they came close with the same wrap that was on the manifold.

Just curious if anyone used the SS flexible ribbed stuff or the high temp silicone stuff with a wrap?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

I haven't don't anything. I was looking up sleeves and stuff. But nothing has been done to address that issue.

I hope my starter wrap will do a good job shielding my starter. The wastegate dump tube is right under the starter

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

And the bill keeps adding up. Going to get a turbo smart vee bov. And will be adding the boost controller to help build boost faster

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

The RFL too loud for ya? I always liked the RFL when I had it on my WRX. I had a Blitz as well and didn't care for its whooshy sound.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

Haha it is too loud and I am unsure how many washer to use.

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

Where are the pics of the final product????

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

post # 429

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

Any plans on building a solid foundation in the near future?

10lbs won't last you long. (***says the guy running 16lbs on a stock motor***)

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

to be honest the car in the first 2 gears is like a wild horse. I think I am happy with the outcome so far. So no plans for building the low end. I just want it to drive perfectly. The car is stable at 8psi so far. But let see how much boost creep I get when winter comes.

Also the mishimoto thermostat and new fan turn on point has lower the car coolant max temp by 20*. Highest I seen so far is about 185-187. I used to see 205-207 on the stock thermo.

screaminz28

iTrader: (1)

I took Robert's comment as to being that the motor won't last forever running 10psi of boost. I hope that's not the case. I'd say to avoid 5th gear runs and you should be good for a while (barring any one off crazy problems).

Robert, were you insinuating that 10psi is more than the engine can handle, or that he'll want to turn it up soon? I would think the stock bottom end would handle over 450 Whp as long as detonation is kept in check. Wasn't Libert running in the neighborhood of 500whp before he built the motor?

yungone501

iTrader: (4)

I know, isn't it great with an engine running that cool? It makes all the difference in so many ways.

I'm just speaking from experience. When I got to 10lbs, I knew that I would want much more than that and being on a stock block is borrowed time as it is. As soon as this current motor is eventually destroyed, I will quickly be assembling an even stronger one as I've mentioned.

I know for a fact that these motors can handle 10lbs+ but on pump gas alone, you will be hard pressed to make it reliable around this area. Before switching to e85, I really tried everything in my power to make it work with tuning, cooling, etc. but in the end, I'm glad I made the switch. Not only does this motor take 16lbs with ease, it does it on a daily basis, multiple hits through out the day, tuned pretty damn aggressively. That's the beauty of the ethanol. And just for the added assurance, I installed the WMI with a 500cc nozzle and have now moved on to mixing my own solution using pure methanol and distilled water so that I KNOW my mixture is dead even at 50/50. Since running the ethanol, I haven't seen one knock count but I'm taking precautions with the preignition and using cooler plugs but using a tighter .025" gap instead of the previous .032" as I began to have break up on the top end....assuming from spark quench.

Seems like the j-series is most happy around 11.3-11.5:1 AFR in regards to spool and response. Power can be maintained as wide as 10.2-12.1:1 AFR without a slight variation on the output. Ignition mapping can give good drivability in a wide range as well as long as you're out of boost so I basically added 2* of advance throughout and left any vacuum columns of the map untouched otherwise. On the boost column, it happily accepted as much 6* of timing before power began to drop off. And even when the power dropped, the knock counts still were nowhere to be seen (love it). They say e85 is forgiving and its most definitely true.

As for the WMI, it richened my AFR by an average of .8/point throughout the powerband. After decreasing my fuel values back down to the original 11.3-11.5 and adding around 1-1.5* of timing, this engine may very well be reliant on the WMI. If it was a pump gas motor it definitely would be for sure. I say "may" be as most people are in belief that e85 reacts the same way inside a motor like WMI does and therefore are equal. But I'm not so quick to jump on the band wagon. If you've ever dipped your finger in pure methanol before, you will notice that your finger almost immediately feels like it's being coated with a blanket of ice once it's removed from the fuel. You get the same effect with e85 but maybe half of the intensity. Methanol gets crazy cold, quick! That's gotta be worth something in the world of boost! On top of that, I also seen a gain in power when the e85 fuel value was reduced in place of methanols .8 of a point. Because I measure power by a reduction in run time, I have no idea what the amount is but I'd say a 3rd gear pull missing .425 of a second is a good amount. I admit that that the methanol was able to run the extra timing mentioned above but still, the e85 couldn't run that extra timing and make power out of it. I say E85 + WMI-50/50 FTW!

Btw, anyone else notice that -20 (and below) windshield washer fluid has been pulled from the shelves of all stores as well as all online vendors? I could only find washer fluid rated to 0* which is a lame 23% methanol content. Wtf?!

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

Today was very hot so the ect looks to be around 200 again...

I will install my new honda alternator and thermal blanket later tonight. Some dumb bitch was parked on my spot all last night.



I also tired installing my turbosmart BOV and the inlet port is much different from the RFL. The turbosmart one uses a bigger inlet. So that will be going into the FS with my other left over items. LMK if you are interested.