mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

To the best of my knowledge stock injectors will be used. A rising rate fuel pressure regulator will be used to squeeze more fuel through the stock injectors during their intended from the factory cycling. Fuel pressure raises from 50psi at WOT to 100psi at WOT with the new fuel pressure regulator; as psi increases fuel pressure increases. This does introduce the possibility for long-long-long term reliability issues with the stock injectors because we are pushing twice the pressure through them as they were designed for. But no one has had issues with this in the 2nd Gen CL/TL kit.

Or, Comptech could completely change that for the new kit. It is possible to modify the stock injectors to flow more fuel. They've already done it for the TSX and RSX injectors; increasing flow from 310cc to 520cc. Since the new ACM has the ability to control injector pulse width it would be possible to maintain a factory like drivability for normal driving and then crank up the pulse width when you're under boost.

I do not know which route Comptech is going to go for this new kit. Modifying stock injectors is much safer that relying on a rising rate fuel pressure regulator to increase fuel delivery. Also, the FPR has been known to fail on a few occasions.

A higher flow fuel pump (Walbro 255lph) will be included.

Ramairgt1

does anyone have a picture of thi supercharger installed in a TL? I am curious to see what it looks like
thanks

chusteveb

What size and impedence are the stock injectors for the 3G TL? Would the impedence change if the injector size was altered? I know that on my Integra I had to get a resistor pack to accomadate for difference in high to low impedence injector type. I have no problems using the stock injectors with the S/C as long as they are not running any where near 100% duty cycle. However I'd probably have them flow tested just in case and so with them out and the cost to perform that test I guess new injectors wouldn't be too far fetched. It's just that with different size injectors I worry about possible issues with the driveability tune.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Those are questions Comptech can answer.

SweetJazz

I would not be suprised if the TL SC was delayed for the new Civic SI SC. Comptech will sell far more SC's for the Civic than the TL.

Pro Stock John

But the 2004-2006 TL kit might just be a few small changes from the previous generation kit.

If they don't provide bigger injectors, maybe the stock ones have a lot of room left in 'em.

dan.....k

iTrader: (1)

Comptech updated their page today comptech

I can't wait till mine gets here!

dan.....k

iTrader: (1)

The numbers have been released. 288.1 HP. The test car was an AT, so we can expect higher numbers on the MT.

chill_dog

Install seems a bit involved...might be worth the $800 or so...still, gains look good...

Scribesoft

Have they published a finalized price for it yet? Maybe it's there, but I couldn't find it.

special-ed

hell yeah baby, an extra 60hp on top of the lil extra from the exhaust is exactly what this car needs. Not too crazy, but definitely going to make this car much more fun to drive. Deposit is going in......add me to the list.

Excelerate

iTrader: (1)

I'm going to try and organize a Groupbuy for this Supercharger Kit. MSRP is $4495 but I am checking prices now. I will be following through on this and it will be an actual Groupbuy in the sense that I will need deposits and a list of a few people before the order is placed with Comptech.

dan.....k

iTrader: (1)

MSRP is $4495.

Excelerate

iTrader: (1)

By the way it seems that some 25 kits have already been pre-ordered so what are people paying so far for these kits?

special-ed

way to jump the gun on this one excelerate. Well, at least now I won't feel so bad holding on to the money order I was just about to send out today for the UR pulley!
May have to put my deposit in with you!

Man, looking at the dynos, we're almost hitting 300 at the rear wheels for an auto!
This car is gonna be a blast and to think I had a couple of passengers last week tell me the car felt pretty quick with the intake and exhaust.

TeamXRSX

With no programmable ECU support, it will be hard to get the most out of this mod using just a AFC device that i'm sure will be provided by Comptech to regulate AFRs by tricking the MAP sensor(which BTW, is not a complete or effecient fix for tuning a forced induction mod on a Naturally aspirated engine).

Doug from Hondata has confirmed on many occasions with me that there is no plans in the near furture for a programmable ECU or even a ECU reflash for the J32A3 engine or any J series varient.

Giving the fact that the J32A3's ignition timing is already tuned aggresively from the factory, it will be interesting to see how Comptech will get around this issue with out taking full control over ignition timing (and i don't mean using an AFC device).

I will keep lobying my good friends at Hondata for more support on the J32A3, but ultimatly, it is in their hands as they are pretty busy with the K-series developments of late.

CJ

special-ed

goodnight GS430, IS350??, G35??. Question marks by the IS and G since owners of these cars maybe more into tuning versus the market/niche that buys into the 430....

Will this be enough to keep up with a stock M3 latest generation?

special-ed

Yeah, that's the only thing I hate about this car being available to the usa and canada only. Have to rely on local outfits like comptech to come out with anything.
This isn't so bad, since at least someone is doing it but we would have much more aftermarket support if this model were available overseas. Sometime I wonder if I should just trade up for the RL/legend.

Maybe if Hondata sees and realizes, "hey, if comptech can come up with a solution and still make good margins so why can't we?", I can't see why it would be such a big issue with an outfit such as Hondata who probably has much more engineering resources and funding to make something? Like Excelerate mentioned earlier, there are 25+ kits already pre-ordered for the SC and I'm sure these people would be really interested in an ECU upgrade from Hondata.

In the meantime, I'm sure I can still be happy with "only" an extra 60 whp.

TeamXRSX

This will most likely depend on what can be extracted by the boost levels that the CTSC will be providing the engine. If there was a way i could dyno tune the engine from scratch, i gaurantee that i could extract alot more power from the engine at the same boost level than if you just used a AFC device to regulate AFRs(Air Fuel Ratios) by manipulating the MAP sensor which in turn manipulates the injector pulse width(which allows for semi-precise tuning of the AFR). Problems do occur when using this option to tune. If you guys like, i can go into this further in my next post.


CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

This kit is MUCH improved from the previous kit. Most of what I said previously does not apply with this kit. I'm excited to see what you guys come up with.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Comptech isn't using an AFC. They're using their own ACM which controls VTEC change over, pulse width, ignition timing, and MAP signal. Of course a custom tune specific to the vehicle would provide some more gains but that isn't in the cards here.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Where are the install instructions?

TeamXRSX

I am pretty close to Hondata and understand their thinking on this. Is it worth it for them to do a years worth of R&D/reverse engineering on the J32A3's ECU just for a handful of TL owners to buy into the idea? Lets face it, the TL is not targeted at the same kind of people the RSX-S or Civic Si is or even the TSX, not to take anything from the TL....i own one that i love, but it's a different kind of car from my 450WHP turbo charged RSX-S. There may not be but a handful of TL owners willing to slap a programmable ECU in their car....lightly modded engines will not benefit from a prgrammable ECU that costs $1500(speculation) for an extra 5-10WHP.....but moderatly to highly modded engines will need this ECU for a complete tune not only for performance sake, but for reliabilities sake as well.

Also, keep in mind that every ECU Honda makes for every different run of engine series usually uses a different type of ECU......it would be very diffecult to reverse engineer ever single ECU honda uses. Not to mention, Honda is famous for changing the genetic make-up of a givin' ECU from one year to the next, as we have seen with the k-series ECU's. Basically the same engine, but two completly different ECU's from 02/04-05/06.

I will say this, taping into the J32A3 ECU will be alot easier than the work they did to reverse engineer the popular k-series' ECU's. Mostly due to the fact that the J32A3 does not have VTC(Variable Timing Control) or in laymens terms, variable intake cam phasing as the k-series does. This is what puts the "i" in i-VTEC. For anybody that has used the Hondata K-pro ECU, you will know that it is very complex, as is the engine it is controling. With the J32A3(or any j-series engine) you have alot less variables to tune.......it's actually just like tuning any VTEC engine(d-series, b-series, h-series...ect.) using Hondata's S100/S200 software, expect you have 6 cylinders instead of 4 among other things.

Nonetheless, i will continue to lobby Hondata for something for the J32A3 down the line.

CJ

TeamXRSX

Could you please go into further detail for us?

CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

There is no end-user adjustability. Think of it as a piggyback controller/reflash.

special-ed

Yeah and I can totally understand their take and also, if we're talking an extra $1k+ for just another 5 HP then I wouldn't even consider it especially since after this SC mod, there really isn't much we can do unless we plan on totally gutting the engine.

TeamXRSX

OK.....this is a MAP sensor clamp.....this is what is considered an AFC......AFC stands for Air Flow Converter....AKA MAP sensor clamp. It works by altering fuel by manipulating the MAP sensor voltage to the stock ECU. It needs to do this to run with larger injectors, otherwise the car would run far too rich. This causes the ECU to lookup data from parts of the maps where ignition is more advanced and uses the knock sensor to retard ignition timing when the presence of knock is heard.

You cannot run the same amount of ignition timing on a boosted engine that you can on the same engine, but in naturally aspirated form. Releying on the knock sensor to retard ignition timing for you is a clever little trick, but is not safe at all.

CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Not gonna happen. If they wouldn't do it for the boost friendly J32A2 they aren't going to do it on the new motor.

The e-Manage is our only proven option. It'll work fine for boosted applications (ignition timing retard, pulse width, MAP voltage clamp) but for N/A cars it won't do much if anything at all on the J-Series because we couldn't get it to advance timing.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

You don't need to explain what a MAP voltage clamp is to me

But it's more than just a signal clamp. That's what their ESM did. Their ACM does much more and they are trying to use it on the '05 RSX kit but with the K-pro out for that now it isn't really required IMO, even though the '05+ K-pro is kinda a hack-job.

TeamXRSX

it would absolutly be worth it for you running a SC, to have a programable ECU, it may not be worth it for the guy that has a intake and exhaust. For the SC guy, you will unlock alot more power by using a fully programable ECU for your engine, as every engine is different and needs to have a custom tune specificaly for that engine to unlock it's fullest potential. But for the guy with I/E....the power difference may only be 5-10whp...which may not be worth the 1k+ price for a ECu like this. Also keep in mind that the J32A3's ignition timing is already tuned pretty aggresive in the stock form.....this is another thing that scares me about using an AFC device on the J32A3 in Forced Induction form.

CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Again, it's not an AFC. It does much more than controlling air flow/fuel trim.

TeamXRSX

Then, please explain thier "ACM" in more detail....because..in my professional opinion, it's nothing more than an AFC, unless you can come up with details as to why i should not call it that.

CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

And Comptech doesn't manipulate the MAP signal to control fuel. That's very dangerous because it requires very high fuel pressure levels to lean the mixture out. The MAP signal clamp is to prevent the ECU from retarding ignition timing. Even having the clamp off by 0.01+v will affect the way the car drives.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

It can DIRECTLY control pulse width which is something a typical AFC, such as the popular Apex'i product, can't do.

It is much more advanced that what we used on the previous-gen kit which was strictly a voltage clamp.

TeamXRSX

You want to retard ignition timing in boost.....not advance it. No offense, but what you are saying makes no sense....again no offense.

CJ

TeamXRSX

Please, don't let my low post count fool you.

CJ

TeamXRSX

Show me some techical data to back this up.......

CJ

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Sigh. I'm talking SERIOUS amounts of ignition retard. Like to the point where the car is making ~100whp and not drivable.

Of course you want to retard ignition timing under boost, but there's enough fuel that timing doesn't need to be retarded. Timing stays as if the car was still N/A. The traditional ESM (Comptech's MAP signal clamp) could only do this. It's a mute point though because the ACM is completely different.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

What are you talking about?

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

It was posted on Comptech's site during development.