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05 base TL morphed to 08 TL type S

Old 03-23-2018, 08:14 PM
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05 base TL morphed to 08 TL type S

Hi everybody!
I have a 3.2L base TL that I love and is in great condition but 200k miles on it. I canít find a 3g type s and even the 3.5L base model is getting hard to find and expensive compared to a swap. Iíve done tons of research and thought about doing an engine swap and what will work. I found a wrecked 07-08 type S and can buy engine, trans, wiring harness and ecu for $2500 shipped.

I want your opinions, thoughts, recommendations from you who have done this. This will probably turn into a build thread.

my car is an automatic and the type s is also an automatic. I figured itís way too much work to change to a manual. So Iím hoping this swap will go right in.

other than the wiring harness and ecu is their anything else I would need to complete this swap that I might have missed? I have all the bolt ons already that I will put on the new setup and will get hondata eventually.

what work can I have done on the trans? Like a stall converter and where I could get one.

Thank you all for your input, I will post lots of pics when I do this. Letís have some fun!
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Old 03-23-2018, 09:37 PM
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A few comments:
  • There never was such a thing as a 3.5 liter base model, all 3.5 liter 3G TLs were the Type-S.
  • All of the non-Type-S models had the 3.2 liter engine.
  • I don't know what you mean by "I can't find a 3g type s", they are all over the place; granted they aren't cheap, but they are available.
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Old 03-23-2018, 09:51 PM
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I was looking at buying another type s I found I think two when I did a 200 mile search and the cost was a lot more than doing a swap, which is why I decided to go that route, and I donít mind the work that would go into it. I also thought that the 07-08 tl has a 3.5L non type s option in addition to the 3.2, I know the 04-06 only had the 3.2. Thanks for the info.
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Old 03-23-2018, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
I was looking at buying another type s I found I think two when I did a 200 mile search and the cost was a lot more than doing a swap, which is why I decided to go that route, and I donít mind the work that would go into it. I also thought that the 07-08 tl has a 3.5L non type s option in addition to the 3.2, I know the 04-06 only had the 3.2. Thanks for the info.
Instead of doing the work of trying to retrofit the Type-S engine, transmission, and electronics (which I have anecdotally heard can be problematic), it might be better/faster/cheaper to drop in a 3.5 (J35A6, if memory serves) from an Odyssey. There is a thread around here somewhere which states the engine is literally a bolt in replacement, no transmission or wiring changes needed.
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Old 03-23-2018, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by horseshoez View Post
Instead of doing the work of trying to retrofit the Type-S engine, transmission, and electronics (which I have anecdotally heard can be problematic), it might be better/faster/cheaper to drop in a 3.5 (J35A6, if memory serves) from an Odyssey. There is a thread around here somewhere which states the engine is literally a bolt in replacement, no transmission or wiring changes needed.
Found the thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/third-g...-3-5-a-961849/
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Old 03-23-2018, 10:15 PM
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I wanted to eventually be able to fully tune the motor and I read that I canít do that with my 05 automatic tl. which is why Iím swapping the ecu as well as the harness, because I also read that the 07-08 auto tl can use hondata.
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Old 03-23-2018, 10:18 PM
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Now you're stepping into the realm of you becoming a guinea pig. Keep us posted on your project.
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Old 03-23-2018, 11:01 PM
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The TL-S uses CAN Bus to communicate with the ECU, where the 04-06' TL's use K-line. So your gonna need to update your OBD2 port and run CAN wiring to the ECU.

As for the the swap itself, only obstacle may be the transmission mount as it's a different set up with the newer trans.
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Old 04-03-2018, 11:45 PM
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^^^ thank you! This is the kind of knowledge I was looking for.
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Old 04-03-2018, 11:53 PM
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The TL-S uses CAN Bus to communicate with the ECU, where the 04-06' TL's use K-line. So your gonna need to update your OBD2 port and run CAN wiring to the ECU.

^ the motor and tranny swap will be easy for me but Iím still a novice with electrical, can you go into more detail with what I will need to do or share a link where I can learn how to do this. Thank you!
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Old 04-04-2018, 12:37 AM
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I also have a set of rl cams, since Iím going to have the heads PnP and new springs will it make a difference? I donít want to go all the way race, and get big cams but I do want to make it fast since I have the motor out (the j35).
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Old 04-04-2018, 11:42 PM
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Thoughts on stall converters? Any recommendations on a good one and where to get it?
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Old 04-04-2018, 11:54 PM
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I was looking at electric power steering pump kit out of curiosity. How much hp do you think that would free up since it wouldnít be running off the engine?
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Old 04-06-2018, 07:42 PM
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Iím hoping to get some good feedback from you guys with the experience. Among the other things I brought up. I have the new motor all apart now, Iím sending the heads and runners in to be pnp. I was going to leave the rotating assembly as is but now that itís apart I was thinking of having new piston rings in and the block honed etc. are there any recommendations on changing the pistons, rods, crank? I want to make it faster but still want some reliability and not fully raced out. This will be a n/a engine.

Last edited by Funmonkey; 04-06-2018 at 07:47 PM.
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Old 04-06-2018, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
^ the motor and tranny swap will be easy for me but Iím still a novice with electrical, can you go into more detail with what I will need to do or share a link where I can learn how to do this. Thank you!
I've attached a how to off Hondata's website. Everything you need to do in order to run an 07-08 ECU.
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Old 04-06-2018, 11:36 PM
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Thank you!
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Old 08-06-2018, 01:36 PM
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Turbo build!

After much research Iíve decided to do a turbo build. I want to know from you experts a few things. I want this to be street fast, no drag racing and I want it reliable still (somewhat).

whats the best size turbo to get and what brand is good?

what compression is needed to be able to run regular gas?

do I need better pistons or are the stock ones good enough?

Thank you for the help as I will continue to research.

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Old 08-06-2018, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
After much research Iíve decided to do a turbo build. I want to know from you experts a few things. I want this to be street fast, no drag racing and I want it reliable still (somewhat).
-- As a general rule, any turbocharger application for a car with a transverse V6 motor will be problematic; the TL is no exception. Then there is the reliability aspect; the transmission in your 2005 is already considered a fragile unit, adding turbocharging to your engine will end the life of your transmission sooner or later (probably the former).

whats the best size turbo to get and what brand is good?
-- It all depends upon whether you want as close to instant response/boost when coming off idle, high end power, or a little of both; the two extremes are typically mutually exclusive when it comes to turbocharging applications.

what compression is needed to be able to run regular gas?
-- Hmmm, maybe 6:1, and even then that will be too high if you buy a big turbocharger and push it full throttle to redline.

do I need better pistons or are the stock ones good enough?
-- Once again, it depends.

Thank you for the help as I will continue to research.

See my responses in GREEN.

Stepping back and looking at your various posts for a moment, it seems pretty clear to me you have the wrong car for your needs/wants/desires. Said another way, it will cost you far less and the results will be far more reliable if you simply sell your car and buy something else which has the performance you want direct from the factory.
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Old 08-06-2018, 03:15 PM
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Im gonna have to agree with Shoez here, Yes it can be done and can be done well but the pwople who have done a turbo project can weld and fabricate pieces in order for this to work. That being said if you are able to weld and are very mechanically inclined I say go ahead if you like these cars that much. Im not sure if any companies make a turbo kit but if they do I guarantee it will be at least $3k. Im currently doing this to my mustang and theres a lot involved especially because Im making my own kit. Good luck
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Old 08-06-2018, 03:53 PM
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Stepping back and looking at your various posts for a moment, it seems pretty clear to me you have the wrong car for your needs/wants/desires. Said another way, it will cost you far less and the results will be far more reliable if you simply sell your car and buy something else which has the performance you want direct from the factory.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the input. I understand all of your points since I hear this all the time. This is my favorite car. I know itís expensive to do any kind of upgrade, Iím not looking to do a crazy hot rod build. This is my project and itís fun for me so Iím looking for options. The motor and tranny are from an 08 tls and both are being rebuilt. also I see so many turbo builds on stock compression 11:1 granted itís on e85 or meth. So I was thinking more like 9:1 or even 10:1 Iíve seen on pump gas.
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Old 08-06-2018, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by 90foxnotch View Post
Im gonna have to agree with Shoez here, Yes it can be done and can be done well but the pwople who have done a turbo project can weld and fabricate pieces in order for this to work. That being said if you are able to weld and are very mechanically inclined I say go ahead if you like these cars that much. Im not sure if any companies make a turbo kit but if they do I guarantee it will be at least $3k. Im currently doing this to my mustang and theres a lot involved especially because Im making my own kit. Good luck
yes I am mechanically inclined but I will have a shop weld up the exhaust manifold as well as having a shop do the Dino tuning. It sucks that thereís no kit and have to custom make stuff, thatís why Iím asking around for opinions on turbo size and so on.
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Old 08-06-2018, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
...also I see so many turbo builds on stock compression 11:1 granted itís on e85 or meth. So I was thinking more like 9:1 or even 10:1 Iíve seen on pump gas.
Yes, but you asked about "regular gas"; the assumption being "Regular/87 AKI" fuel not "regular gas" as in "Premium/93 AKI" fuel. If you're going to use 93 AKI, yes, you should be able to do a nice build with 9.0:1.
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Old 08-06-2018, 05:20 PM
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Sorry, I meant premium gas 91-93 octane.
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:26 PM
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So where are you in your project? On 4/6/2018 you had the engine taken apart and was discussing forged internals.
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Old 08-06-2018, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Saving4aTL View Post
So where are you in your project? On 4/6/2018 you had the engine taken apart and was discussing forged internals.
I am currently having machine work done on motor and heads and getting rebuilt. Just playing the waiting game and doing a ton of research. At first I was going to do a N/A build but decided to do a turbo build instead.
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Old 08-07-2018, 08:20 AM
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What size charge pipes, turbo? What brand of BOV will you be running? Hondata?

To what size internals are you getting worked? What brand are the internals?
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Old 08-07-2018, 09:17 AM
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Is this going to be a manual trans? My coyote motor is about 10:1 but I am also running e85 with low boost, mainly because my rods will puke out around 750 hp, my turbo is a 75mm on a 302 ci engine so I think a safe size for yours would be around a 60mm. Id find out members on here with turbo cars and start trying to message them.
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Old 08-07-2018, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
After much research Iíve decided to do a turbo build. I want to know from you experts a few things. I want this to be street fast, no drag racing and I want it reliable still (somewhat).

whats the best size turbo to get and what brand is good?

what compression is needed to be able to run regular gas?

do I need better pistons or are the stock ones good enough?

Thank you for the help as I will continue to research.

I hate the be that guy, but I am calling bullshit on all of this. If you have thoroughly done your research you wouldn't be asking what turbo to use, what compression to use. We have yet to see any physical pictures of the project, and you flip flop more than a fish out of water on your end game. If you actually knew what you were doing you would have everything laid out in front of you because there is a lot of info out there, just have to use google. Kudos to you if you are actually doing this and I will enjoy the final product but as of now, it's a NO from me.
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Old 08-08-2018, 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted by BreezyTL View Post
I hate the be that guy, but I am calling bullshit on all of this. If you have thoroughly done your research you wouldn't be asking what turbo to use, what compression to use. We have yet to see any physical pictures of the project, and you flip flop more than a fish out of water on your end game. If you actually knew what you were doing you would have everything laid out in front of you because there is a lot of info out there, just have to use google. Kudos to you if you are actually doing this and I will enjoy the final product but as of now, it's a NO from me.
I think I can agree with you, I think he put the cart before the horse on this one. I would take that j35 motor and N/A it in a eg before I tried to do this or just bought a tl-s after selling his AT 05 and his j35. would have loved to see 280hp+ eg or ej1, would be awesome! It's been done! If you are planning to take this on man, I wish you luck.
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Old 08-08-2018, 09:16 PM
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EG? What is this 2001? Fast and Furious?

Keep the J in the UA7 and build a powerhouse.
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:27 AM
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Wow. Part of my ďresearch ď was coming here to find out what others have done and what others know from experience. I can put the shit together but Iíve never messed with a turbo set up before. To those that think I havenít done anything yet, youíre right. I donít think Iíve put the cart before horse, All Iíve done is bought the j35 motor and tranny that I will Install into the car anyway. I havenít bought anything else yet because again, I wanted to know some things I can or canít do from people that may know or have done this before. Thereís no pictures unless you want one of a box of crap, thatís all I have. Iím also taking my sweet time because thereís no rush for me, my car runs great and this is something I want to do right. This is just a part time hobby for me. I may throw out some ideas/thoughts and spitballing on some posts, itís not meant to show my lack of direction Iím going with this car. Instead Advice/thoughts is what Iím looking for.

Anyways. My end goal is around 400 hp custom turbo (no pics because nothing is done yet). mid to high rpm power band with a slightly raised rev limit. So far the j35 is sitting, waiting to go to the machine shop. the heads are at the machine shop. Iíll continue to read many of the threads from this forum and v6 performance forum. Please leave this constructive if youíre going to comment. Iím still keeping my car, Iím not going to sell it for something better or cheaper.
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Old 08-09-2018, 01:23 AM
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wish you all the best man! apologize if that came off insensitive to the results you want! good luck man.
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Old 08-09-2018, 10:24 AM
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It just seemed from the post I quoted you had all the info you needed to start this build, but then go on to ask "beginning a build" questions. I'd like to see this stuff take off and documented as you go, but as of now all of it is talk. Maybe we all document things differently, who knows. Looking forward to seeing pics of the machined parts! Seems like you have your hands full for this one.
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:01 PM
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^ no worries.
Today I sent the cams in for the regrinds, stage 2. I did decided to send them to bisimoto. I was hoping to find new cams but all I can find are companies that only regrind. I read all the good AND bad about bisimoto from this forum but figured itís still a good upgrade over stock cams. Iíll post pictures when something is done, sorry I wish I had more time to do this fun project, it may be a while before real work is being done.
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:07 PM
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Iíve seen a lot of stock j series motors with turbos on them, how many miles can you get out of something like that?
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Funmonkey View Post
Iíve seen a lot of stock j series motors with turbos on them, how many miles can you get out of something like that?
As presented, that question is impossible to answer. Assuming a proper tune in all cases, a turbo bumping the intake by say 4 psi will probably not impact the life of the engine at all, however, make it 45 psi and you'll be lucky to get 5,000 miles out of the engine.
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:21 PM
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Usually 42 miles or so
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by thoiboi View Post
Usually 42 miles or so

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Old 08-09-2018, 03:38 PM
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Just Bicurious, how long have J32/J35s lasted with 10psi boost?
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Old 08-13-2018, 08:26 PM
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Help!

I have been looking everywhere for some forged 9:1 pistons for this J35. I canít find any pistons for the J35 at all, do you all know of any company that sells them? Iíve reached out to a company called CP-Carrillo that said they can custom make them but need a sample piston from said motor. I donít have any yet, yíall have any recommendations on this?
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