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These look like fantastic instructions. I just ordered my parts and will give it a go. However, living in the south, I'm worried about the capacitors failing in higher temperatures. I contacted Digi-Key (DigiKey Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor) and they gave me alternate part numbers for capacitors with higher heat tolerance. Here they are, in case you want them. My order came to about $22.
ok so i literally stumbled on this post upon months of scratching my head and plotting and planning on how to replace my sound system and bypassing the stock system with loc and so forth and was just generally about to cry about the amount of money i was gunna spend on redoing the whole, my system had to be turnt up to 40 for the radio and wasnt even good enough to hear with the windows down and my ipod aux was terrible too, bro after ordering these parts and taking like 3 hours to solder everything in my system bangs like better than new man bass rattles the rear deck FRIGGEN LEVEL 6 my stock system is amazing i cant thank you enough for this write up man
These look like fantastic instructions. I just ordered my parts and will give it a go. However, living in the south, I'm worried about the capacitors failing in higher temperatures. I contacted Digi-Key (DigiKey Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor) and they gave me alternate part numbers for capacitors with higher heat tolerance. Here they are, in case you want them. My order came to about $22.
ok so i literally stumbled on this post upon months of scratching my head and plotting and planning on how to replace my sound system and bypassing the stock system with loc and so forth and was just generally about to cry about the amount of money i was gunna spend on redoing the whole, my system had to be turnt up to 40 for the radio and wasnt even good enough to hear with the windows down and my ipod aux was terrible too, bro after ordering these parts and taking like 3 hours to solder everything in my system bangs like better than new man bass rattles the rear deck FRIGGEN LEVEL 6 my stock system is amazing i cant thank you enough for this write up man
Just to update everyone- I was curious to see if it made a huge difference to swap out all the caps with the Nichicon KT series that ebs007 listed. It's a good point about the 105C rating, though where I live now I doubt it'll ever get that hot.
I pulled my amp again and replaced the whole set. I can verify that ebs007's list of capacitor values is 100% correct (not that we ever doubted you- thank you again!!).
I decided to try boosting a few of the decoupling (non signal chain) capacitor values, plus I accidentally forgot to order the 47uF one, so here are the mods I made:
- Replaced all 470uF caps with 1000uF
- Replaced both 1000uF caps with 2200uF
- Replaced the 47uF cap with 100uF
All the voltages are the same as their original values, and all were still with the Nichicon KT series. These mods still fit the original holes (almost) perfectly, so none of the caps are sitting crooked or sideways. Also, the 2200uF caps still have a good 1/8" of clearance from the top of the case, so plenty of room.
Here's the final result:
As far as sound quality goes: I'm not going to lie, I can't really hear much of a difference. I'm not a huge audiophile, but I do appreciate a good sounding stereo. I think it sounds great, but not significantly better than before. I spent a few hours trying to make high-quality recordings in the car before and after the swap and then compared the spectrograms.. and didn't notice any huge differences. Spectrograms are actually pretty lousy at revealing what our ears actually hear, though, so take that for what it's worth.
I will, however, rest easy knowing that I won't have to deal with this for the rest of the car's life.
After all that, I'm going to stand by my original statement: it's probably best to do everything if you're going to go through the effort to pull your amp out and do this repair. If you want to do the bare minimum and just get it working, though, you can get away with just doing the small caps (the ones up to 10uF) and you'll probably be fine. Either way, you're not significantly improving the sound of the amp, just repairing it. I chose the Nichicons for dependability, not just sound quality.
I bought a used TL last week and the radio volume was incredibly low. Found the guide here and switched out a majority of the capacitors. I didn't have time to do the lower 10uF capacitors, but I hooked up the amp and there's a world of a difference.
It wasn't the prettiest work, but it got the job done. I'm dbeating whether or not to go back in and switch the rest of them out.
I had all of my caps replaced, and the sound is much better now. However, the front door passenger speaker is making a hiss when car is on, and goes up and down with the engine. Do you guys think this is a polarity issue or a grounding issue? It does go away, but rarely, and it is only in that speaker.
I had all of my caps replaced, and the sound is much better now. However, the front door passenger speaker is making a hiss when car is on, and goes up and down with the engine. Do you guys think this is a polarity issue or a grounding issue? It does go away, but rarely, and it is only in that speaker.
Thanks in advance, awesome post!
One of the symptoms of a bad capacitor is that the performance is better when the amp temperature is warm (in other words - on a hot day) vs a cold day. Does the hiss get better after some hours in the sun? IMHO it sounds like one of the power supply filtering caps, therefore you're getting alternator whine coming through the audio.
Is it possible that "most of the caps" were replaced instead of "all of my caps replaced"?
Other thoughts - it's also possible that one of the small components or copper conductors near a capacitor was damaged during the replacement. Or perhaps the capacitor was installed in the wrong orientation (wrong polarity), or maybe the solder iron was applied to the new capacitor for too long which could "cook" the capacitor and degrade it's performance.
I hope that these comments are helpful as I'm not intending to disrespect your skills with PCB repair ... :-)
One of the symptoms of a bad capacitor is that the performance is better when the amp temperature is warm (in other words - on a hot day) vs a cold day. Does the hiss get better after some hours in the sun? IMHO it sounds like one of the power supply filtering caps, therefore you're getting alternator whine coming through the audio.
Is it possible that "most of the caps" were replaced instead of "all of my caps replaced"?
I tightened the 3 screws holding the amp, thought they were tight enough, but I guess not. The sound was gone when I started the car. Drove around for about 20 minutes, it never came back. Have to spend about 3 hours in the car tomorrow, hopefully will not hear it.
Thanks for the replies.
Last edited by pawelTL6MT; 02-25-2015 at 10:28 AM.
Reason: adding
One other thing I wanted to ask. The rears speakers have been low for quite some time. Since getting this done, the rear ones are louder than they were before, but I don't think they are as loud as they were before I started having this issue. I thought the front ones were fine, but they are even louder, so I assume since all caps were changed, they seem to be like new.
If I recall correctly, when sitting in the driver seat, all levels being equal, shouldn't the rears be heard more than the fronts, I am pretty sure that was the case before.
If that is true, what would you guys recommend I try next, change rear speakers? check connections?
I think we have determined that the KA series caps are a little too large to fit into the case without having to tilt them. Also, they are only rated for 85C, not 105C like most automotive components.
Here, with Mouser Electronics part numbers, are the exact replacement values for every electrolytic cap on the board. These are the Nichicon KT series, which is still in their "High Quality Audio" series, just temperature rated for automotive applications. They also match the sizes of the original capacitors (except the smallest ones are a little taller- no big deal).
pawelTL6MT: Glad you got it all sounding good again!
As far as I know, with the fade/balance setting on the HU set to center, you should probably hear the fronts slightly more than the backs when sitting in the front seats. That's how mine is. All the speakers are roughly the same sensitivity, so for a given amplifier power they should all be equally loud. The fronts also have dedicated tweeters, so they can 'seem' louder and more present.
If the rears are still significantly quieter, then the easiest answer is to adjust the fade to send more to the rear. If that isn't enough, I would double-check polarity on all the caps you replaced first. Then check all the speaker wires and speakers. You can measure resistance with a multimeter from speaker+ to speaker- at the harness to the amp to check both the wire and speaker at once. I haven't done it, but I would expect a resistance of a few ohms (1-8 ohms?) and the two rears should match each other pretty closely. The fronts may be slightly different because they are also powering the tweeters, but they should still be in the same ballpark and should match each other.
Im about to order a set of these, my amp don't sound bad but I think its a good refresh for it for just 14 bucks. Question though the 07 type S is the same amp as all years? I haven't removed my amp yet.
Just ordered the set of capacitors. Huge thank you to Chefboyardee for doing the research and sharing the results!!! The amp was already out and I was just gettign ready to drop it off at the local repair shop. I haven't soddered anything in some time so I'm a little aprehensive, but will give it a try. The local shop want's a $150.00 bucks so saving some cash is always a good thing! Of course my girlfirend will find a way to spend the ~$100+ savings! LOL
Have been away travelling, but now that I am finally back and had some time to take a look....
So initially before doing anything, I just had the issue with low volume in the rears, no buzzing. Now I have good volume, but the driver side door speaker is buzzing like crazy. Here is the video, and ideas on what it could be? All caps were changed, but they are not all the same, hope that is not the issue...Please help, the noise is horrible. The video is on Volume 0, so you can see how bad it is, i was turning ON and OFF. stupid photobucket won't let me embed the video
No, that doesn't matter, but I'm pointing to a spot on the board where a cap should be located.
No, that cap was never populated from the factory. If you look at my board earlier in the thread, mine doesn't have it either.
That's definitely not a good sound- does it sound like that with the amp on but at volume 0? I ask because the amp has a "mute" feature that kicks in when you go to volume 0, and it's done at the power amp stage. If it still buzzes at volume 0, it's the power stage or the supply (or some other external grounding issue). If it goes away at volume 0, then it is more likely to be in the signal chain somewhere before the power amp (but possibly still on this board).
I would check the following:
- All connectors are properly seated
- Check solder joints on all the caps you replaced- maybe try wiggling them one by one while the amp is plugged into the system and on (though don't do this for too long or the power amp packages may get hot)
- Use a multimeter to see if any of the caps are shorted (0 ohms resistance). This one is less likely, I'd think
No, that cap was never populated from the factory. If you look at my board earlier in the thread, mine doesn't have it either.
That's definitely not a good sound- does it sound like that with the amp on but at volume 0? I ask because the amp has a "mute" feature that kicks in when you go to volume 0, and it's done at the power amp stage. If it still buzzes at volume 0, it's the power stage or the supply (or some other external grounding issue). If it goes away at volume 0, then it is more likely to be in the signal chain somewhere before the power amp (but possibly still on this board).
I would check the following:
- All connectors are properly seated
- Check solder joints on all the caps you replaced- maybe try wiggling them one by one while the amp is plugged into the system and on (though don't do this for too long or the power amp packages may get hot)
- Use a multimeter to see if any of the caps are shorted (0 ohms resistance). This one is less likely, I'd think
Good luck!
Hey,
Thank you for the reply.
It was happening when sound is 1+, so nothing on 0.
I ended up trying to wiggle the 1000 in the middle that is most crooked as it appeared to be touching the casing of the amp. I also looked at all the harnesses around the amp, applied electrical tape to make sure they weren't touching anything else. I had to do the same to the iPod connection (this is the original one that came with the car when I bought it, it still works, so I do use it often actually.
After doing all that and being careful about putting things back, I am happy to say the noise is gone. Spent 8 hours in the car this weekend and did not have any issues, although volume was never raised above 10 due to baby. Will test up to 30 tomorrow, but I think I should be in the clear.
Thank you again, as I was ready to pull my hair out or bring it to a shop for diagnostics.
This morning when I went to turn on my radio it was acting extremely wonky. The HFL icons show on the display but that's the only thing. IF I put my tape adapter in it shows up as well, but when I play something it goes away. In addition I've been having some sort of intermittent static noise that comes, particularly when I hit a bump in the road.
Any ideas? I replaced all my capacitors already so I'm not sure if I need to reset the radio or take a closer look at the amp.
I did a little more troubleshooting. Looks like I have a lot of static on AM channels but the FM channels play absolutely fine. No XM radio at all either.
Display still only turns on with tape and nothing else. Doesn't look like a fuse either as the passenger side fuses all checked out.
I took the amp out today after work, one capacitor had a low reading on my multimeter but I think the rest looked alright. I replaced that capacitor but no go.
I'm not sure what to do here. Does anybody know if the radio display turns on if the amp is not connected? I have the HFL icons all showing up but the radio doesn't do anything.
Thanks chefboyardee for updates and parts list. I just ordered all caps from Mouser and hope i can get these installed with out issues. I haven't done much soldering and hope I dont mess it up.
Whats the best way you all are desoldering these caps off?
I repaired mine over the weekend and it sounds fantastic! I didn't end up using the 4.7, 3.3, .47 and 2.2 caps. I may go ahead and change them out, but it's been solid with no buzzing, great volume and no funny noises through all inputs for the last 2 days with roughly 4-5 hrs of use.
I used a RadioShack Desoldering Iron to remove the old caps. It wasn't the best tool as it didn't get hot enough to fully melt the old solder.
Overall I couldn't be happier! I saved over $100 plus bucks and gained some expereince soldering electronics. Plus I have the satisfaction of knowing it was done right.
Whats the best way you all are desoldering these caps off?
I just did this myself today, and very pleased that annoying hum when no audio is going through is gone! Was a bit tedious removing all them capacitors, but at least I get them for free through my job. I just went and removed them the old fashion way using a solder-sucker and a soldering iron. Was just glad this board isn't made with Rohs solder, as that stuff is a lot harder to remove due to the higher temperature.
Man o man o man!!! And the sound mystery on my TL solved , thanks to this thread.. Replaced all the recommended capacitors and walaaa ... This thing works as it was brand spanking new!!!! I can't thank enough on this solution. for years i have been just listening to crap volume... At times i would just shut it off because the damn volume was just low!!!!
Thank you once again for this awesome post !!!!!!!!
Really really appreciate it!!!
I think we have determined that the KA series caps are a little too large to fit into the case without having to tilt them. Also, they are only rated for 85C, not 105C like most automotive components.
Here, with Mouser Electronics part numbers, are the exact replacement values for every electrolytic cap on the board. These are the Nichicon KT series, which is still in their "High Quality Audio" series, just temperature rated for automotive applications. They also match the sizes of the original capacitors (except the smallest ones are a little taller- no big deal).
pawelTL6MT, what are you hearing that makes you think you have a grounding issue?
I'm having a noise issue with my stereo but it's a little different than the buzzing sound that was posted earlier and I have no issue with loudness. I hear a wavering hum/whine when the car is turned on and I'm listening to an AM radio station that is low on the spectrum (of course it's the one I listen to regularly). Higher frequency AM stations sound fine as does all of FM, CD's, etc. I'm thinking I have a bad ground somewhere since the sound will get louder when I pass street lights that are on or are turning on. Has anyone else experienced this? Anyone have suggestions as to how I should troubleshoot a ground issue?
has anyone tried using BT Series High Temperature, Automotive Grade, Radial Leaded Aluminum Electrolytic Capacitors Nichicon?
The BT series can operate up to 125°C making it ideal for high temperature automotive or industrial applications.
pawelTL6MT, what are you hearing that makes you think you have a grounding issue?
I'm having a noise issue with my stereo but it's a little different than the buzzing sound that was posted earlier and I have no issue with loudness. I hear a wavering hum/whine when the car is turned on and I'm listening to an AM radio station that is low on the spectrum (of course it's the one I listen to regularly). Higher frequency AM stations sound fine as does all of FM, CD's, etc. I'm thinking I have a bad ground somewhere since the sound will get louder when I pass street lights that are on or are turning on. Has anyone else experienced this? Anyone have suggestions as to how I should troubleshoot a ground issue?
I redid all the caps and no more buzzing, however my rear speakers are really low, and when driving, the fronts just stop working for a few seconds and the kick back in again.
I am thinking that it's some sort of connection issue, but have not been able to find out where exactly, anyone had this issue. ideas?
01-14-2015, 03:14 PM
Was a bit tedious removing all them capacitors, but at least I get them for free through my job. I just went and removed them the old fashion way using a solder-sucker and a soldering iron. Was just glad this board isn't made with Rohs solder, as that stuff is a lot harder to remove due to the higher temperature.
