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Well, bad news. The buzzing is back 18 months later, although I'm not sure whether to blame caps this time around. Tapping the black plastic box that clips to the amp changes the pitch/volume of the buzz, and sometimes makes it go away. Going to have to investigate those wire harnesses...
Hi chefboyardee, I really enjoyed the thread about the amplifier capacitor issue that produced buzzing. I have an 05 TL and had the same problem develop over the past few months. I purchased replacement capacitors and replaced 35 of 36 capacitors last weekend with the same uF capacitors (I couldn't replace one of the 1000 uF caps due to height restrictions in the metal box). I did not notice any of the old caps were bulged or discolored. I am a novice solderer, but think I did a decent job, and made sure of the right polarity. As a scientist, I did a "quality check" to make sure all the new capacitors were secure, but I couldn't see whether any capacitors were cross linked with solder from the top side of the board. I tried to use the solder sparingly so to avoid this cross link situation. Anyway, I re-installed the amplifier and the buzz was gone when I first turned the car on and tried the radio (woo-hoo!). But the next day when I had to drive somewhere, the buzzing returned as soon as I turned over the engine (boo-hoo). The buzzing is even louder than before. I played around with the speakers (balance/fade) and the speakers are not the issue.
I've read about possible grounding problems in the center console stereo component, and the possibility of cold-solders in the amplifier box. Are there any other sources of the buzzing I can investigate? Did I just bumble the soldering? Any ideas are welcome! Thanks.
Mine started buzzing a few weeks ago and now the volume is slowly dying- level 30 now sounds like level 20 used to, for example. Planning to give this a try soon.
Ok, so I don't have buzzing in my '04 TSX, but my rear speakers do not work at all.....I have no sound back there. I'm going to bypass the factory amp by running jumper lines directly to the speakers to ensure they are not the problem, but am fairly certain the AMP is bad. Can anyone help explain how the amplifier might be allowing all sound to go to the front speakers but nothing to the rear? Furthermore, where on the boards might the culprit be? I've tried tracing the signal flow through the boards, but it has quickly shown me that I don't know what I'm doing. Would it be one common component within the amplifier or should I just replace all of the capacitors? My gut tells me that it's one common thing that everything in the rear goes through in the amplifier which has gone bad. Unfortunately, I don't have any symptoms that led up to this, as I bought the car like this. It appears as though the previous owner had an amp installed, as I found the wiring stuffed under the rear seat where they pulled it back from the trunk.
I am by far no audiophile. With that said, my only concern with that kit is they aren't audio grade. I have no idea if that will have an impact on your sound quality or not.
I haven't read through this whole thread, but will throw out some advise. I've been an electronics tech for 30 years, working on anything from military grade communications through televisions.
Point one,,,,,never change the capacitance, especially down when replacing signal capacitors. Capacitors are filters and in basic terms, help regulate voltage/signal running through a circuit. If a 3.3 uf (micro farad) cap was originally used, use that only. Voltage can go up, but not down. If a cap is labeled 35 V, then its ok to use a 50 V,,,,but not a 25 V.
Second, the white highlight on one side of the cap, indicates negative (or probably ground in these amps). Electrolytic capacitors must be installed observing polarity. The striped side of the capacitor goes to that mark. Do not use any other type of capacitor. They have different properties. No, I don't even remember the why....it was in basic electronics that I took in the mid 80's. And I don't remember half of that,,it isn't relevant to repairing electronics (most of the time).
Third,,,,many of the problems with electronics today are actually connection related. Meaning the solder used, breaks connection over years of heating and cooling. And most newer solder used, is actually lead free (PCB will be marked PB free). This stuff just doesn't hold up as well as the older solder. And its a little harder to see bad connections. Sooooo, my point, while you're inside the amp, look for "rings" around the solder connections. Especially any plugs that are soldered on the boards. When you hear about kicking the panel to make your amp work,,,,,YOU HAVE bad connections. Do not keep hitting it and making it work. You will blow the amplifiers. Pull the amp, and go over it for bad solder!!!!!
Lastly, on soldering. Most DIY electronics people cause far more damage by not understanding soldering technique. Most commonly, they use a dirty soldering iron. The tip should be clean and shiny. This leads to good heat transfer to the joint. I use a damp sponge every day (I solder hundreds of things a day, every day). Also, when soldering, the soldering tip should only be in contact with the joint a couple seconds tops.....if it isn't melting the solder, then clean the tip, or turn up the heat. Prolonged contact with the circuit board will damage it.
I may pull my amp out at some point, then I can give more actual thought on these. I am by no means slamming anyone in this thread,,,,but saw some huge red flags on the first page. I didn't want to see anyone completely destroying their amps. Just sometimes, years of experience can give a huge boost in you all getting a successful repair.
I'm so glad I found this thread. A few months ago I thought my hearing was going bad. Eventually I was having to turn up the volume to 40 (max) in order to play normal music. And it got worse in the cold. That sounded diagnostically similar enough to be bad capacitors so off I went.
I have no electronics experience other than 2 semesters of EE in college 20 years ago. Certainly no actual circuit board work. I bought a cheap soldering gun on Amazon with a solder sucker. I had considered buying the desoldering wick but didn't. For the most part I just followed the instructions in this thread and watched a bunch of videos on YouTube about soldering (and desoldering) technique. I purchased the exact CAPS as in post #55 (from DigiKey). Here's some snags I ran into along the way:
1. Taking out the amp. Pretty easy. Should have been 5 minutes, but I didn't have a deep 10 mm socket for the top bolt. Make sure you have that, plus enough extension to get at it. (side note: when I took off the kick panel I notice that something (a mouse, perhaps, had chewed the padding and left some seeds...hmmm).
2. Desoldering. By far the hardest part. Like I said, I just had the solder sucker which was fine for most things. But there were a few places I wish I had the wick. Anyway, I probably did use the solder gun too long in some spots, but nothing seems to have been damaged.
My volume 10 is like the old volume 40. So glad to have my stereo back.
1.) THANK YOU VERY MUCH to all the people that posted tutorials and info to this posting. It made it alot easier.
2.) Replaced all the 0.47, 1.0, 2.2, 3.3, 4.7, and 47 uF caps in my amp yesterday.
3.) Buzzing is gone, seems a little louder (more gain).
4.) It seemed like there was some leakage around the 3.3uF caps near the Class-D power amp IC's (that connect to the heat sink).
Here's some pics, what's unusual is the OEM smaller value caps were very small for their size compared to the replacement of the same capacitance BUT the larger value OEM caps were larger than the replacement. I didn
t replace the 470uF and 1000uF as their ground leads were connected to the bottom ground plane and my little 25W iron (with a badly worn tip) was having problems with the other caps. And the only other iron I had was a 325W soldering gun (which was too big)
FWIW, I also replaced electrolytic caps in my sister-in-law's plasma HDTV over Xmas and twice now for our GE double home oven. Some pics below of that, electrolytic caps are a lifespan component to say the least.
On the oven the caps leaked and the fluid corroded the copper traces on the PCB, which I had to "rewire" with some 30AWG copper wire.
I have not used a soldering gun in a long time but spent $13 on the caps and bam my amp is running again. I am going to guess by reading some comments that mine was a little worse than some of you. My old 40 volume is now 3 yep I turn it up to 3 and its as loud as it was on 40 before. Big thank you to Chefboyardee for the post and all the others that helped and posted pics also. My kids are going to freak next week when I pick them up no more Daddy I can't hear it, lol.
The OP did a great job with the write up and the photos and the rest of you guys really put effort into your repairs and upgrades. i really am impressed with this group. I am a mobile audio repair tech. been at it for 16 years. I recently bought at 04 Base TL and i did swap out the amp since I had one in stock, but i can also repair these amps so if any of the new guys reading this want the amp in there TL's repaired you can send it to me and i will do a very quality job and i am easy on the price too.
Thanks, but I would like to do it myself, does anyone know what type of caps is required to upgrade it?
Open it up and check. You can get higher voltage caps but you are not supposed to increase capacitance. I usually order them from Digi-Key. Don't get the cheapest, also no need for the most expensive. Panasonic caps are good, also nichicon are good.
Ive read through the majority of this post and am wondering if this would fix the issue I am having, when i turn my radio on i get static, and occasionally hear radio stations mixed up together in very low volume, nothing works, volume, radio, cassette or CD, the radio will pop for a bit then i hear a big pop and suddenly the radio, cassette and CD will work fine. Has anyone encountered, this problem?
Thanks in advance.....
This fix works! I just did it and it wasn’t hard at all. I couldn’t believe the sound when I turned my radio on after I re installed the amp. It blew me away. My system never sounded so clear and crisp. The volume and the bass is better then ever. Thank you for the write up. It only cost $20 for the parts (I purchased a big multipack of resistors from amazon). You saved me a ton of time and money. Thank you!
All caps are labeled Nichicon except the 4.7uF which was ELNA and blue.
x6 0.47uF 50V 105C CP
x12 1uF 50V 105C CP
x1 2.2uF 50V 105C CP
x6 3.3uF 50V 105C CP
x1 4.7uF 50V 85C ELNA - can't tell which product group.
x2 10uF 16V 85C CP
x1 47uF 16V 85C VR
x1 100uF 50V 85C VR
x4 470uF 16V 105C VZ
x2 1mF 16V 85C VR
CP is advertised to 10,000 hours at 105C load life. Also I don't know how high is "high ripple current" but it says so as well as some other product lines by Nichicon.
VR seems to be just average minature cap, able to keep original specification AFTER 2,000hr of load at 85C, or 1,000 hrs of storage, when cooled back to 20C. Product catalog suggests VZ is high temp version of VR.
VZ is strange, because it's all the same as VR but at 105C. But the catch is, it performs as specified after ONLY 1,000 hrs of load or storage at 105C.
I haven't found out which product series the blue ELNA falls under. Their online catalog isn't as Googleable as Nichicon's and the actual cap doesn't say anything. I will update if I find out what it is.
One problem : UCPs don't come in smaller ones I need. Smallest now is 27uF.
One question : Aren't we supposed to care about ripple current and impedance when replacing OEM caps with different product? I don't mean reinventing the circuitry, but at least try not to deviate from OE design. Like I wouldn't put caps advertised by mfg as "low impedance" where the OEM isn't without knowing what it will do - and I don't.... Well I know just enough that changing impedance changes behaviors of RC filters in general but that's all.
I think we have determined that the KA series caps are a little too large to fit into the case without having to tilt them. Also, they are only rated for 85C, not 105C like most automotive components.
Here, with Mouser Electronics part numbers, are the exact replacement values for every electrolytic cap on the board. These are the Nichicon KT series, which is still in their "High Quality Audio" series, just temperature rated for automotive applications. They also match the sizes of the original capacitors (except the smallest ones are a little taller- no big deal).
Sorry for the poor formatting. I don't know why AZ won't support the TABLE tag in vB/BBcode...
thank you so much chef!!! I just bought this 2005 TL (50K miles on it) and it had the buzz in it. I installed the 1 and 10uF caps and voila! I didn’t have a solder removal tool and doing the job was very tedious without it. Still got it done and the sound is perfect now!
Digging around the thread a little more, I saw some mention that the 07-08 model years use a different amp design. If it is different, does anyone have a capacitor list for that amp?
Hi all!,
I'm having a sound issue with my nwe (to me) 04 Navi TL, When I turn the radio ON, I can hear a faint hiss but no actual sound, if I crank it up all the way the hissing sound doesnt increase in volume, if i go all the way to 0, the hissing will stop, if I change stations, the hissing will stutter for a second while the radio tunes next station.
Will changing the caps like described on this thread fix my issue?
Update on the issue above, I just noticed that if I keep pressing a preset button to save a radio station, I can hear a beep coming from the speakers, so my guess is that the radio is not picking any FM signal and the hissing is just the bad capacitors on the amp.
The CD player don't seem to work (I press tht eject button and nothing happens neither does when i try to insert one) I guess that I need to find a Cassett to test
Many thanks to the OP and all that contributed to this topic. Got a free 2004 TL from my B-I-L and the right channel was all but gone. Replaced all caps with Nichicon Audio rated gold caps and now the sound is back.
Since its a 14 y/o amp, I also ordered the three driver IC and will replace those too.
Long shot but thought I would ask. Anyone on here have knowledge or access of the circuit diagram of this AMP? I was replacing the Caps and got 3/4 done but have an issue with C253 Capacitor. The negative side of the contact on the board is damaged now. Was wondering where it went to maybe put a wire to that point to complete the circuit.
I just got done replacing the caps in my amp as shown in the thread on my 08 TL-S amp. The thread did not make it clear if the 08 had the same caps as earlier TL's but it does.
I really didn't have an issue with my amp, but there was a buzzing if it was really cold out less than 10° F, so I gave it a go. I even upped some of the cap values as shown in post #47 and #114. I took my time and it took a lot longer than I thought. I had a small PCB vice that broke right away, so I recommend using a nice one that can support the whole board. I found the smaller caps easier to desoldering. I also found if you added some solder first it, made it easier to heat up to remove the cap. Also having the imaging of the cap values from post #32 helped a lot too.
As far as sound quality goes, I think it sounds better. There is something about how the subwoofer sounds now that was very noticeable, much cleaner. Over all I'm pretty amped up about how this went. I've also attached before and after photos of my PCB.
Great job, what specific values did you go with? Did you buy them from an online retailer like digikey.com?
I ordered from digikey all UKA 105°C Nichicon caps about $24 shipped. I did notice the factory 4.7 uF cap was an 85°C So I guess it could also be replace with an 85°C
I replaced the 4x 470uF caps with 1000uF, the 2x 1000uF caps with 2200uF and I should have replaced the 47uF cap with 100uF but it looks like I didn't.
I think I'm approaching my wits' end with this amp.
Fall 2012 - audio shop poked, prodded, probed and tested, but came up with no verdict for the buzzing.
December 2012 - I replaced the amp with an A01 (04-06) unit. The buzz eventually returned.
February 2016 - I rebuilt the amp with new caps as described in this thread. The buzz returned late 2017.
This month - I replaced the amp again with an A11 (07-08) unit. The buzz returned this week.
In all cases: The slightest tap on the amp--sometimes just touching the wire harness clamped to it--starts or stops the buzz.
I think I'm approaching my wits' end with this amp.
Fall 2012 - audio shop poked, prodded, probed and tested, but came up with no verdict for the buzzing.
December 2012 - I replaced the amp with an A01 (04-06) unit. The buzz eventually returned.
February 2016 - I rebuilt the amp with new caps as described in this thread. The buzz returned late 2017.
This month - I replaced the amp again with an A11 (07-08) unit. The buzz returned this week.
In all cases: The slightest tap on the amp--sometimes just touching the wire harness clamped to it--starts or stops the buzz.
Might need to troubleshoot further. Seems like a broken wire that is barely making contact or bad connector on the harness.
10-08-2017, 09:39 PM
Many thanks!
