jst17

First of all, I’d like to say that I have search tsxclub and acurzine threads for this topic. But I am still quite a bit confused. Ive had the 04 TSX(100k miles now, corolla before the tsx:P) for about a year now, it was quite a bad investment as the engine was burning 1L of oil/1000km, and the dreaded timing chain check engine light code came on. I got those two issues resolved using Auto-Rx and new sensors. But I feel that 04 TSX was a pretty bad year in terms of reliability, thus I am selling the car in the spring, and buying a TL or 06-08 TSX in the fall as spring is the car selling season.

I have heard that 04-05 TL have transmission issues, so im trying to stay away from those unless they are MT.

My maximum budget is about $12000. And of course, the less the better. Right now the current prices in Toronto for a 06 TL is around $11000, and an 07 TL is about $14000, and 06 TSX is about 11000. And those prices are for cars around 75k miles or 120k km.

I feel like the 06 TL suits my budget the best; however, the 07+ TL just look more updated, and if I were to do a bumper to bumper conversion it would be at least 2.5k not including any electronics or the interior updates. I am concerned with the fact that the transmission with the 06 might fail, and costing me thousands of dollars to replace, and its is very rare to see a MT TL for sale. Should I get the 06 TL in the fall or just get an later model TSX, or wait till next year till I have enough for the 07 TL. Any advice would be appreciated. I am currently 19 going 20, in second year university studying mechanical engineering. I do have internship every year so I have the money to do regular maintenance on the car, and from what Ive been hearing the TL’s maintenance isn't much more than the TSX.


TBH i feel really under powered while driving the TSX especially at highway speed..and my mechanic suggested that Honda's 2.4L are not very good as their V6s.

Alexns05

Seems like you spent a lot of money fixing things on your TSX. Why would you trade it in AFTER you spent all that money fixing it? You should either trade it in before fixing it or fix it and keep it. Now you're going to buy another car with another set of problems that you don't know about?

The TL will eventually need the timing belt job done which costs around $1000. 3G TLs do have some transmission issues but so does every other car model.

As far as trading in your TSX for another TSX, what's the point? An 08 TSX is going to be the same as an 04 TSX, except more expensive and less miles.

Even with the TL, the car looks practically the sames besides being a little bigger. It will have a more powerful engine but weighs a lot more so you won't see much power increase.

It depends what you're trying to get out of a car. But honestly I think it would be stupid to trade your car in like you suggested. You're going to lose about $6000 trading for something very very similar to what you already have.

If I could get any Acura around the 12000 price range I'd definitely get an 05 or 06 RL. Bigger engine, more reliable transmission, 4 wheel drive, and better looking (worse gas mileage though). But in your case you should just keep your car.

jst17

I am still not entirely sure if I fixed the problem, only CEL went away (but randomly came back last month for a day or two) but there could still be a possible timing chain replacement in the very near future, and 165k km is pretty high milage for this tsx, because i dont have any previous maintenance record before 140k km. Rattles, strange vibrations are becoming more and more frequent. That's the main reason why I am selling the car, and getting a newer model with lower mileage, so that I can drive the car longer with less worries about fixing the car all the time. Plus 04 TSX is quite outdated, RL are nice but they does not suit my taste IMO.

jst17

TBH i did not spend a lot on this car. Initially, spent a total about 600ish "fixing" the problems, I did not actually replace the timing chain(at least 1.5k). The burning oil requires an engine replacement or constant oil addition, I just put Auto-Rx when i change the oil which temporary stops the oil burning issue.

jst17

$1000 for the 105k miles doesn't sound expensive at all to me, as the mechanics was quoting me 3k for engine replacement and 2k for timing chain.

jst17

bump.

photog

Honestly if you've put a lot of money into getting any quirks out of your current car, I'd keep it. I have easily put a couple thousand dollars getting my 07 TL in top-shape. Also, with a v6 you are probably going to get more rattles and especially more vibrations the longer you own the car. They're heavier, hit bumps a lot harder, and these honda v6's have so much natural vibration. The 07-08 models do have the revamped RL-like transmission, but it comes with it's own set of issues. The shifts are more uncomfortable and the transmission always chooses what seems like the wrong time to shift. I've been doing the pressure switch replacement and fluid changes frequently to smooth it's action out as much as possible. Here's a list of most of the issues I've had with this car since purchasing 2 years ago:

-Upper Trans Mount and all 3 motor mounts torn @ 60k
-Motor Oil Pump Leak @ 70k
-Purge Control Solenoid failure @ 75k
-Starter failure @ 85k : did a partial rebuild
-Torn control arm bushings (all 6) @ 90k
-Starter failed again @ 95k and I did a full rebuild
-PS Pump leak from the main body @ 100k, rebuilt with all new seals. still makes noise.
-Driver-side Axle cracked in the winter @100k, replaced
-Positive end of battery cable broke apart near the starter from a weak cable-end. Replaced.
-Coil failure at 105k
-Taillight leak at 105k
-Valve Cover spark plug tube leak at 115k, causing a loose spark plug that I was unaware of for about 10k miles
-@ 125k, hood struts no longer hold the hood up, most likely from excessive under-the-hood maintenance

jst17

We're on the same boat here, as we both bought a used car which was not well maintained thus causing all these problem popping up. I didn't permanently fix my problems, and spent less than a grand in total on repairs, so that's why i don't want to keep this old car. The more I drive it the more it seems to become a money pit.

I think your car only represent a few bad apples. From reading numerous other threads, the 06+ TLs or TSXs are mostly trouble free to very high mileage(ex. 120miles, and only regular maintenance is required. That's why i thought switching from my 160km tsx to a 120k TL, would be alright. Plus i only drive about 10k a year. IDK

photog

So hard to tell, my best friend has a '10 TSX that has already had as many issues as mine, other friend has an '07 RSX that's constantly getting repairs, and my neighbor has an 08 TL that has had almost all of the same issues as me and then some. If it were up to me I'd say Acura reliability is on a decline, HOWEVER, my motor was spotless when I took a look on the inside and checked everything. There is no doubt that these engines are tanks and very dependable. It's allllll the other stuff that just tends to break for the sake of breaking. I don't know anyone with any car that has as many frequent component failures as any of the Acuras that I know personally. Also, every replacement OEM part I get is either completely redesigned or different in appearance. I don't understand that.

If I hadn't done all of those repairs myself I'd probably have spent 10k by now.

omnitl

my , I've owned 1 04 tsx 6 speed and 2 tl's 6 speeds in the last 7 years. The TSX is a better overall daily driver if you ask me. Nimble and enough power to pass people if needed. But it's no TL thats for sure. TL is heavy and you can feel it if you come from an TSX. But TBH thats stock for stock. Had BC coilovers on the TSX and have TEIN SS on my current 06 6 speed TL. Both rode like stock while increasing my handling big time! With that said, i would never go back to the TSX over the TL. TL overall IMO is the better car, i get about the same MPG overall 50/50 driving of 25 mpg. TL breaks better, faster, tons more torque but feels like a dog when taking turns compared to the TSX. Each to his own.

06 TSX has the bigger lobe vtec cams which increase high rpm HP. What ever you do decide though, try to get into a 6 speed, Honda and auto trannys are a ticking time bomb IMO.

Good luck, its your money and you should spend it how you want to make yourself happy.

omnitl

I agree, Acura/Honda isnt what it used to be, my 95 GSR in highschool lasted me 6 years from 60k to 175k with nothing breaking other than normal wear and tear. Same for my 02 RSX minus some TSB stuff "never buying a first year model again!" My 06 TL has had its share of fixed, Power steering leak problems, Axels breaking, Brembo pads wearing really fast...... the list goes on.

There was an 07 RSX? or did you mean RDX?

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

I have an 07 TL-S and I dont have most of those problems. my original starter is still working 100%, oil pump no leaks, axles have no leaks, battery cable never broke, coil never failed, taillight never leaked, and spark plugs never came loose.

I did however replace all my motor and transmission mounts(~$300 in parts), rebuilt power steering pump myself(only $15 in parts), and my purge control solenoid was 50% cost covered by dealership(even though I was out of warranty). And yes I replaced my hood shocks ($35)

In my experience, everything I did on my car was normal and would have happened to any other car. I personally feel my car is very reliable and has not caused me any issues. I do take good care of my car and give it inspections quite often to replace anything before it has a chance to go bad.

Do keep in mind I live in socal where weather is great year round so maybe that has something to do with it

JLsTypeS

I also had a 2004 TSX 6 speed with 150,000 miles on it and just recently bought a 2007 TL Type S 6 speed. Pros for the TSX are you get better MPG, I got 29 MPG average which was amazing, and the handling was more agile and lighter. Pros for the TL, I've never driven a non-Type S, but for the Type S, faster, solid steering, brembos really stop you fast, I'm averaging 25 MPG, looks way better, bigger, and overall in my opinion a better car. I have really enjoyed both cars but the TL has more of that sport luxury feel to me, while the TSX felt like I was driving a Civic, which I pretty much was. Also I would never ever ever trade your car in to a dealership, they are called stealerships for a reason. Take the time to sell it on Craigslist or Autotrader and make your money, I sold my 04 TSX with 151,000 for $8,000 to a private buyer. And I bought my 07 Type S with 95,000 miles for $12,500, best deal I've ever made in my life. All I had to do was fly to get the car and drive back. Unless you are buying a certified used car, don't go to the dealership. I work for one and I want to tell the customers to run away. Just be patient on finding the right TL from that older gentleman with all of the maintenance records and garaged and you will enjoy it for sure.

omnitl

Wow, that's a nice upgrade at an amazing price. Congrats

jst17

im not a handy man, but $10,000 on repairs within two years of ownership? I am comfortable with maybe about $1000/year for maintenance. I mean, im not expecting a 75k miles(120k km) car to only require the two oil changes every year, but should honda's maintenance be $5000/year?! that's ridiculous.IMO..

This threads:https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-2004-2008-93/whats-too-many-miles-2004-acura-tl-861043/
Maybe some of your repairs are not entirely necessary i suppose.

jst17

I agree with your opinion on the difference between the tsx and tl. The engine problem on my tsx is really what sold me on selling the car.

As long as the annual maintenance and repairs doesn't go too excessive, i am comfortable with owning the car that costs $1000 a year to maintain because after all it does have 70-80k miles ranked up already. But from looking at various threads, pple seems to just do oil changes and are just fine.

jst17

good advice, thats probably the reason why the west coast have higher used car prices, since they dont get as much snow as we do here in toronto.

jst17

wow. congrats on the great deal with the type-s. I will try to sell it over autotrader, but I just feel going through the dealer would be a lot less work, as I can avoid the test drivers and low ballers. Plus the car is only worth $7k anyways, so the difference will not be very big in terms of $$. But when Im buying, I will be sure to take my time this time to find that right one

Acuura

Hey, I'm in the SAME boat as you are.

I recently had sold my 2004 Acura TSX with 120k KMs. It was burning oil, and it was a 6MT. This was was had the smoothest transmission and gear switches i've ever drove and it was a blast. About 200hp give or take competed with a lot of Honda Si's.....a lot. But since the TSX was 2004, first year of production, it had many flaws. Map lights going out, burning oil, the reverse gear syncro? no A/C and many more.

Overall, it was a very fun and rewarding car to drive but let me tell you this, i've test driven a few TL's and they are completely different cars and feels. A TL is simply.... a TL.

I'm in my first Year of University and been looking for a TL for quite some time OR like you said, 06-08 TSX. (preferred MT) - rare] with a budget of about $10,000.

I'm really set out on the navigation, it's such eye candy for me but i'd have to work my entire 4 month summer break to look into a 07-08 TL w/ navi and MAYBE even a TL-S if there are some around for sale. Ones up for grabs for 15k in my province.

If i were you, i'd sell the TSX before you run into bigger problems, you are a uni student and I'm assuming you aren't loaded with cash for be up for all the repairs that will come your way. 04s-06s do have transmission problems but I think 06s are less likely you mess up as I was told by a salesman from Acura.

My advice would be to look at the bigger picture and just wait if you can, and you never know, there might be a deal and a half that could pop up on the path to saving up for a 07-08 TL. Stay away from first year production cars as they will have the most flaws and whatnot. 06-08 TSXs are much more refined and consistent than 04-05s.

abrieluno

Your budget is $12000 right check this out, wojo1998 came across with it at kijiji
07 Type S 93800 kms for just $12500

http://ontario.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehi...AdIdZ550629859

photog

You're right, most of the items aren't entirely necessary but I'm talking about keeping the car as close to spec as possible. The car rarely fails me as far as point A to B, but thing really puts up a damn fight. Once I fix one thing there's bound to be another issue soon after. I expected a slightly better experience when I chose to buy a luxury tier Honda. Also, I find that anything Acura will break before anything Honda. Brand name curse lol

JLsTypeS

To some people taking the time to sell it isn't worth it, but the highest offer from a dealer was $5,000 and I got $8,000 for it. But you have to do what pleases you. Goodluck with selling and buying!

jst17

90k km and only $12k seems too good to be true. it was posted half a month ago, and 14k people have seen it already. It either fake or already gone.

It is very easy to sell cars under $3k on Craigslist, for cars that are above $15or20k it is better to sell over auto trader.

jst17

I hope so. I actaully have coop in the summer as well, so that's also the reason I am buying in the fall, when prices will drop even further than current prices. And I noticed 06 TSX are about the same price as 06 TLs.IDK why

Hows the search going? I suppose you are going to search after summer when you've got the cash ready.

YeuEmMaiMai

IF you got a Honda engine burning oil, you got to ask yourself who beat the piss out of it before it's first oil change?

There are not any Honda engines known for eating oil and the i4 engines are not known for eating mounts either

OP since fixed your car, keep driving it. 12K is not going to get you another Acura with low miles

my car is a 2002 CLS and I have fixed the following over 134K miles (214Km)

lower ball joints 5 times (roads are crap here)
front brakes at 81K miles
rear brakes at 55 and 110K miles
Timing belt, oil sender, A/C condenser, all engine mounts at 118K
front and rear end links, sway bar bushings, passenger lower ball joint at 131k

Paid $15K for the car back in 2006, spent about 5K in repairs since then. So 20K for a car that has last me 8 years and 134K miles isn't bad

Next up, front and rear shocks for about $1000 in parts (I am buying complete assemblies that are OEM)

jst17

Firstly, I did not fully fix my car. IDK how to put it, but its just got so many little things like vibration and strange noises, plus the big engine issue and the CEL(temporarily fixed? IDK hasn't popped up since)


IDK Im not the first owner, bought the car one year ago at 90k miles now at 100k miles for $7k. At least, in Toronto $12k will be able to get a 06+TL/TSX with about 70k miles as I will not be buying now, but in about 6-12 months. I drive less than 10k miles a year, so getting to 100k miles like I have now on my TSX will be 3 years worth of driving.

Acuura

Well, i've been on the search everyday. Nothing is popping up for Acuras (3G TL/1G TSX). I really don't want to have to ship a car from another province up here in Canada, just feel like a lot of money is being flushed down the drain for shipping, which I could rather use for mods. The longer it takes to find a car, the more cash i'd have saved up for a easier purchase I suppose.

Conan O'Brien

debatable whether early F20 engines burn oil over time, otherwise good point

jst17

TSXs have K-series engines.. or are we not on the same page? cuz F20 engines were developed later on for like the s2k.

jst17

But for buying a car, dealerships should be a less of a risk than buying from a stranger. Technically, dealerships are not allowed to sell cars that have major defects without disclosing that information. I mean, we are not regarding those sktechy used car lot "dealerships", but the more on par ones, and they have regulations. Buying private is cheaper for a reason, we take more risks.

That older gentlemen are rare; people are selling their cars for a reason. Sometimes, they dont want to trade it in, because no dealership wants the caras it's got problems. And the dealership cannot openly sell the car without disclosing those issues.

Already made that mistake last time, and ended up with a bad apple 04; previous owner did not disclose anything about the engine burning oil or the Check Engine Light(P0341)...she just denied all accusations after the ownership transfer/sale[Her-> <-Me]

I will try my best but probably gonna go to a dealership, its just less risk with a bit more money.

Conan O'Brien

we are on different pages haha. was referring to the post about how all honda engines are bullit proof

YeuEmMaiMai

well I should say anything within the last 20 years isn't known for burning oil..... I got a 94 accord with 200K plus miles not burning oil and that is a F22b motor... it's still on the original motor mounts and transmission as well....it just won't die

YeuEmMaiMai

unless it costs you so much that you cannot resolve all of the issues (like over 6K or so) with your car, just fix it. you can easily drive that car 100K more once you get it up to snuff. TSX is a nice car and very fuel efficient

jst17

all im saying is that I can get rid of the car now for $7k, plus that $6k your talking about I'll be in the territory of a lower mileage, newer model TSX/TL, and mostly likely without having to spend the price i paid for the car again to fix anything. I bought the tsx in a rush, this time around I wont make the same mistakes again. ever.

Im sorry, but I dont see any logic in spending $5k fixing a car thats only worth $6k.. Even if I fix those issues, the car will still be worth the same. The longer I keep driving it, the more likely I wont be even to sell it running normal anymore. my current TSX is doomed to be a money pit, sigh

jst17

I think so too, Honda has very good engineering especially for their engines, I mean, we see 20 year old civic driving around everyday. However, if you search "04 tsx burning oil" there will be too many threads to count

jst17

Thats true, I might just wait another 12 months instead of buying in 6 months for that 07/08 TL, ill have well over $17k or $18k saved up then, probably buy one with 60k miles and use the rest for maintenance, and some dealer powertrain warranty?

one thing tho, I'm leaning towards the 06+ TSX a little now, because the TL seems to have a lot more problems than the TSXs. Maybe because TSX was the only car that was truly manufactured in Japan, while the TL was assembled in the states? (eg. lexus made in JP?)

Reliability wise TSX>TL. 06+ TSX are bulletproof, while TL has various problems(more time in the shop), even though they did fix the transmission. Can anyone confirm this?

LaCostaRacer

There is no doubt a TL is an upgrade from a TSX. I think the transmission issues are overstated in the TL. The other interesting point I hear often is how well the TSX handles. I find that interesting because the TL is lower, has a higher skidpad rating (.91 .vs. .80) and had a faster slalom speed (62.5 .vs. 61.7) back in it's time with Car&Driver. I have have no problems pacing or passing TSXs in twisty mountain roads.

The maintenance concerns might also be overstated. Not everybody has transmission problems with a TL. I checked out reliability statistics at Consumer Reports and it looks like a 2006 TL is every bit as reliable as the Japanese built TSX. The 2007 and newer TLs can have electrical issues while TSXs seem to have more significant brake issues across all years. I can relate to this in that my brakes haven't been serviced with 62k miles.

I think both cars are good and it comes down to priorities:

TSX: need a fold down rear seat or smaller size
TL: want more power,and room in back seat. Desire more refined interior & electronics

YeuEmMaiMai

it's called no car payment and as such it is ALWAYS cheaper to repair your current car than get a new one unless your current car has a structural failure or you manage to totally destroy the engine and transmission. The other advantage is that you will know what the history is vs. getting someone else's problem child.

8 years 94K miles and $20K total cost of car and repairs.

jst17

You've got a good point. But I'm afraid that the cost of ownership for my 100k miles tsx is going up exponentially. Plus I've been saving up for the next car for a while now anyhow. I'm just the type of person that likes to switch cars often

jst17

interesting, it is actually the first time I've heard that 07 TL have issues with the increase in electronics. Would you recommend an 06 over the 07 then(even though they changed the tranny in 07)? Current used car pricing suggests a $3k difference between the two model years.