Don't get me wrong...I love my TL but I've been pushing it a little bit lately now that I'm more comfortable in and familiar with the car. It’s a fantastic freeway cruiser and great in the twisties as long as they aren’t too tight. Even in A-SPEC trim, however, if you accelerate during a sharp 90 degree turn (like a street corner) torque steer rears it’s ugly head and the wheel pulls like a sob , especially if the road is uneven. For those of you naysayers...before you turn on me for knocking our wheels, try it and you will see. It can be pretty unnerving. This car would just be perfect with RWD or AWD!
If they ever offer a TL with AWD, I may just have to go for it.

 

I am of the opinion, that if you do something very very aggressive, the car will react just as aggressively. When you accelerate heavily in a 90 degree turn, it will suffer from torque steer. Equally stupid things can be done in a RWD vehicle, you won't feel torque steer, but you might just oversteer into a tree. (Yeah, I know I'm exaggerating, but if you know how to deal with torque steer, understeer and oversteer it is not a problem).

I cannot claim to have great knowledge about driving RWD, so if I encountered oversteer I probably would not deal with it very well. Because I have most of my experience driving FWD cars, I can almost expect when I will feel torque steer, so I grip the steering wheel harder or I ease of the throttle slightly. It works.

 

I don't consider accelerating in a 90 degree turn stupid...it's called fun. As long as their are no cars or people arround it's fun to occasionally drive aggressively. I'm not taking about speeds more than 40 mph arround a 90 degree turn. A RWD car would spin out if you push it too hard, but it doesn't give you torque steer. I new I'd get replys like this. You must drive like a grandma...

 

It's not torque steer. Tourqe steer is with straight line acceleration like in my modified TT. It's the VSA kicking in. When you have the wheel cut that far you are putting the car into an oversteer position. It is the VSA trying to prevent that situation. I agree it is very alarming when it happens. The FWD just exaggerates the situation. It has prevented me from making some of those "quick" u-turns which isn't a bad thing I guess. Just safer

 

Interesting...I'll try it with the VSA off!

 

You're trying to ask the car to do something it wasn't designed to do. Sounds like you bought the wrong car.

 

I havn't tried that yet but ther eas an article on vtech.com "I think" that explained it. Theoretically it shouldn't happen with VSA off.

 

Torque steer is minimal considering the amount of HP and torque. It's a not problem at all in my opinion.

 

Everyone is hailing RWD as the savior for this car - having driven RWDs all my life except for this TL and my previous car - I would disagree. While it will resolve some complaints such as torque steer, it will drum up new complaints of fishtailing, spin-out on takeoff, terrible in the snow etc. FWD and RWD each have their own pros and cons and you just have to accept the ones you don't like and enjoy the ones' you do.

I have also noticed that the TL throws me pretty good if I am taking a shap turn - like an entrance ramp or something and if I am really testing the edges of my tires and I hit a bump in the ramp - she will throw me out pretty fierce - but I would blame suspension more than FWD or RWD I guess in that example.

Just my 2c thats all. This car loves to get up and hang between 85 and 95 without even breaking a sweat. It rides real nice at those speeds.

 

Yes I drive like a grandma. I think aggressive driving should be banned.

I don't know if you took offense to my reply, but it was not meant to. I mean that:
1. In regular driving, torque steer is not an issue for me. But the fact remains that this is a FWD machine with a lot of hp/torque.
2. If you are going to drive aggressively, you should be prepared for the results. When I drive aggressively, torque steer is not a monster, merely because I try to compensate for it. If you are aware of the torque steer you can deal with it.

It is the same concern in Maximas, Grand Prix's, and other high powered FWD applications. I don't think that just because it is FWD you should not drive aggressively at times. I believe that for me to drive safely and aggressively (not mutually-exclusive concepts), I should understand the dynamics of my vehicle, how it will react, and how I can make it do what I want it to do.

All that said, in my own opinion, the torque steer is not bad at all. If you think that means I'm not driving aggressively enough, you are entitled to that of course.

 

As long as you meant no offense, I take no offense...
I'm just stating a fact of how the TL behaves...and it would be nice and preferable it didn't do that. RWD cars don't.
Whether it's the VSA or torque steer (and I believe it's torque steer) it happens.
I plan to try it with the VSA off ...I'll let you know.

 

i came from a 250hp prelude(ZEX 75 shot) and i some how cant stay out of my TL and i can say cornering in this car is GREAT! I know im impressed

 

i have had MANY cars front and rear drive including an S2K. my 6spd tl w/ falcons continues to impress and sometimes even shock me with its handling. The only time I feel a “pull” is when I accelerate hard out of a sharp turn or on very bumpy/ uneven pavement. The lsd is incredible at pulling this car around corners. The harder you push it the better it corners…

I don’t think that the vsa would cause a “pull” as it cuts power.

 

The VSA does cut power but to only the wheels that power needs to be cut to. Not both at the same time in this situation.

 

My sentiments exactly...it only hapens when you accelerate hard out of a sharp corner. Otherwise the TL is magnificent!

 

but thats the lsd pulling-not, t-steer

2 diffrent things

 

You can't over-accelerate FWD cars. No good will come from it!

The TL, especially in 6MT A-Spec form, can be driven very hard without encountering this condition.

 

As Deandorsey said, you are feeling the LSD. Only the 6mt has an LSD, so you will not feel the "torque steer" on a 5AT (one more reason I am giving up on the 6MT).

A differential works by putting more power to the wheel that is turning faster. This is what allows your outer wheel to take a longer track as you turn than your inner wheel. The problem is that when you are going strait, if one wheel looses grip, it will get *more* power than the other wheel (not what you want). A Limited-Slip Differential (LSD) limits the amount of power that goes to the faster wheel (so more is going to the slower wheel). It is "limited" so that you can still turn. However, when going strait (and flooring it), if one wheel looses its grip then the other one still gets plenty of power (faster 0-60). Note that this is just the opposite of what VSA does. The VSA puts on the breaks and limits the engine power. The LSD just puts the available power where it can get more traction.

When you floor it on a corner (with rough pavement), one of the wheels is loosing its grip on the road. The other wheel has a disproportionate amount of power, and that wheel tries to move ahead of the other wheel. With 270 horses, that engine can really jerk the steering wheel.

The one time I felt it, I was test driving a 6MT on a rainy day. I took a right-hand turn and floored it. The wheel really jerked to the left. This kind of scared me. What happened was that my outer wheel lost its grip on the road (blame the tires 8-). The inner wheel had most of the torque, and it tried to move faster than the outer wheel. This has the effect of trying to straighten out the car (and hence jerk the steering wheel against my turn).

If you ask me, Honda should leave the LSD to rear wheel cars, where this effect can't be felt through the steering wheel. Of course, in a RWD car, you will just feel your butt wagging back and forth. I guess the moral of the story is that if you are going to floor it on a turn, hold on to the steering wheel!

--Mark

 

Thanks for a beautiful explanation...
So if I try it with the VSA off it won't make a difference then.

 

SBTL, as an owner of a 6MT TL and a previous owner of an 88 911, I respectfully disagree. The 1st 2 or 3 times I pulled out in my RWD 911 for a sharp turn under acceleration, I almost did an end around. I was able to save the car, but I learned a lesson that applies to the TL. There are situations, where the power of a TL or 911, have to be moderated, because the tires can not connect to the ground. In the TL the car pulls. (not technically torque steer, but feels like it) In the 911 and some other RWD cars, the rear end tries to come around on you. I'll take the TL thanks.

 

Well if you don't like torque-steer... Moral of the story:


Buy a Prelude SH

or...

Buy a 2005 Acura RL

 

I hate to say this, but it isn't VSA or LSD or torque-steer. This is a FWD car working. You are asking the wheels to turn at near-full lock while applying acceleration. This puts strain on the CV joints in the axles, which are having to put that power through a shaft that changes direction (i.e. straight the axles are _ _, wheels turned they are _ / ). They do not want to do this in any situation, since it is easier to turn a CV joint when it's straight. With normal driving, the "willingness" of the CV joints to straighten out is hardly felt (if at all) because they are not being over-taxed. With enough power attempting to be applied, the joints are being over-taxed, thereby tugging at the steering wheel.

Torque steer occurs when the axles have differing amounts of power being applied. Since, like markj said, an open differential is trying to put the power to the wheel that is spinning the fastest, the car will tug in the opposite direction. Sometimes, in very bad cases (like old turbo Saabs), the power will actually alternate between the two wheels, causing one to sort of zig-zag down the road instead of going dead straight. Torque steer even occurs in RWD cars with open diffs. Ever see a muscle car with an open diff accelerating hard with decent traction? Zig zag city. This is torque steer. But since there really is no term for a FWD car's CV joints trying to straighten themselves out, it's lumped into the torque steer category as well.

Sean

PS Even my 150 hp 2.3CL does this at full lock or near-full lock, it's the nature of the beast.