Eric91Z

Now, let me prefrence this by saying I don't want to start a flame ware between the 2 generations as I know they are both extremely nice cars in their own right. I like the looks of both, I like the fact they both have V6 motors, and I like the fact they are both Hondas (whoops, sorry, Acura's...)

Anyway, I am asking or looking for differences between the 2 to help me decide which would be the more practical upgrade from my current car a 1992 Honda Accord EX Coupe with 5 speed manual tranny. This car currently has 262,000 miles on the original motor, paint etc, and pretty much runs and looks just as good as it did 12 years ago coming off the dealer lot (yes, this is a one family owned car).

Anyway, I am starting to think it is time to upgrade to something a little nicer and something with 4 doors as we already have a 7 year old and and are planning on another one at some point. Now, the wife already has a 4x4 SUV that we love, but I need something that will be reliable and get decent gas mileage, but still be enjoyable to drive.

If I went with a 2nd Gen, it would have to be a TL-S, and if I went with a 3rd Gen, I would consider the 6 speed, more so for the front brake upgrade than to have a manual tranny. But here are some of my questions:

1) Other than maintenence records (if the owner has them), how can I tell if a 2nd Gen TL-S has had the tranny replaced or rebuilt? This is a BIG concern for me based on what I have read about the problems

2) How are the cup holders in the 2nd Gen? I can not find any good interior pictures to see where they are and that is one of the biggest pet peaves for me with the Accord is crappy cup holders.

3) How much, if any, interior space would I gain with the TL-S over my current Accord? Sitting side by side or driving next to a 2nd Gen TL on the road, it doesn't seem that much bigger than my Accord, but I know the 3rd Gen is bigger and I felt like I was swallowed in the car when I test drove a 3rd Gen (I liked that since I am 6'1" and 240 pounds).

4) How does initial build quality on the 3rd Gen seem to be so far? Anyone getting some miles racked up on theirs yet? I normally put about 20,000-22,000 miles on a car per year and which ever one I get will probably end up being around for quite some time.

5) And that brings up the last thing: since I will end up keeping for a long time to come, should I just save up and go with the 3rd Gen with low miles (or new) and enjoy some of the motor, tranny, and gadget updates for the long term (and decent cup holders).

My purchase time frame will probably be in the next 12 months or so (no hurry - planning on driving the Accord through at least 1 more Iowa winter), which means the newest 2nd Gen TL-S will be 2-3 years old, but the 3rd Gen will only be on it's second model year. Although I am a little leary about buying a first model year of a car and kind of interested to see what, if any, changes are made for the '05.

So, any and all input appreciated. And I have already researched my way out of a BMW 5 series since I need something reliable, cost effective to own, and prefer front wheel drive for commuting in Iowa winters (and, yes, I think the BWM 540i is a valid comparison to a 3rd Gen TL, but that is my opinion). So, just remember we are all Acura/Honda owners and lovers, so help me with the input.

Thanks,

Eric Mann

Eric91Z

Well, I am not sure what happened to this the first time I did it, but I am trying again:

Anyway, I am starting to research a replacement for my very faithful but high mileage '92 Accord EX Coupe with a 5 speed. While I really like the car a lot, and have since day one, there are a couple of things I don't like: limited interior space, 2 doors instead of 4 (comes in to play having a 7 year old and planning on another kid), worst cup holders I have ever seen, and high mileage - 262,000+ miles on original motor and paint and still looks almost new.

Anyway, I have been kicking around going to a TL, but not sure which to go with, especially since cost will be a consideration. I would be looking at a late 2nd Gen TL-S or used 3rd Gen TL (buying time frame is 12 months or so). Some of my questions have been answered by searching on here for things like the 2nd Gen TL-S tranny problems, the fact that the '02-'03 TL-2 has better cup holders (yes, I know, kind of a small point but it is important to me).

My biggest questions are these:

1) Are the upgrades to motor, tranny, suspension, etc for the 3rd Gen TL worth it for the added cost over a similiarly equiped TL-S?

2) While I do like the styling of both, the TL-S seems to be along the lines of my current Accord (kind of), but how is the interior room of the TL-S compared to a 4th Gen Accord (like my '92)? Especially since I would be going to a 4 door from a 2 door, but what about driver space? I sometimes feel like my wife and I are almost touching shoulders riding in the Accord. And I know the 3rd Gen interior is huge compared to my Accord.

3) Which has the better automatic tranny? I have read comments that the TL-S feels like it has more power, but that is because the 3rd Gen is so smooth. I would like smooth, especially since I have to commute for work and do 20,000-23,000 miles a year in driving.

4) Speaking of those miles, that is why I am going this route since I have to drive year round here in Iowa and want the FWD for the winters commuting, but what about long term reliability? Other than normal wear and maintenence items, the Accord has been great and is only on it's second clutch, although ready for a third.

5) And what about aftermarket support? I know the TL-S has it's share and the 3rd Gen TL is growing, but I would want to do springs, struts, wheels, tires, intake, exhaust, etc.

6) Lastly, for now anyway, what about differences in insurance between model years? Can someone through out insurance numbers for full coverage, earlier 30's, married, good record, etc between the 2 models. I know it will be higher the newer the car, but how much difference is there really over the course of a year.

I know we are all Honda/Acura fans, so I don't want this to be a "mine's better than yours" kind of thing, just some input between the 2. It seems so many people come here wanting to compare the Acura to the Infinity, BMW, etc and I don't want that. The only other one I thought of looking at was the E39 540i, but after hearing about repair costs, reliability issues, and dealer problems, that is no longer a choice (and, yes, I think the TL is a good comparison to a used BWM 5-series). I just want some comparison between the TL itself.

Anyone that went from a TL-S to the 3rd Gen TL? Anyway that thought about it but stayed with their TL-S instead? If yes to either question, why. Any and all input would be apprecaited.

Thanks for your time.

Eric Mann

rets

You may get biased views since this thread has been placed here... but wish you could get varied and useful opinions from everyone.

Eric91Z

That is true, but I am not sure how it got placed in this forum as I had originally put it in the general forum. Guess we will see what the replies are.

Gepetto

Eric91Z. . .I'm sure much more knowledgable members of this forum can address some of your points, but I feel like I can comment on your #1 and #6. I was somewhat in the same boat as you about a year ago when I debating replacing my 96 Civic with either a late-build 03 TL-S or waiting another year until I could get a good deal on a late-build 04.

#1: I felt the 04 was superior enough to the 03 TL-S to hold off. This car will be used for hauling kids/grocery getting 5 days of the week, but on the weekends when I drive it I want to have a little fun. A coworker had an 02 TL-S and recently traded to the 04 and just can't say enough about how much better he likes the 04.

#6: I would be shocked if there were a material insurance issue between the two cars. As I mentioned, I'll be trading my 96 Civic and will now become the primary driver on a 99 Accord. My wife will be primary driver on the 04 TL (when it arrives in a week or so). So this isn't exactly an apples-to-apples comparison, but our insurance is increasing less than $10 a month. It's hard to imagine an insurance differential less than that. I'm in my 30s, married, neither of us has had any accidents/tickets since high school (me).

svtmike

1) Only you can answer this question. Drive each one and decide.
2) The TL-S should be larger than your Accord as well.
3) The '03s have problematic trannies. The jury is still out on the '04s but so far reports of real problems have been minimal.
4) The cars are only 1 and 2 years old. No one can really tell you about their long term reliability.
5) Not my area. I buy cars that I don't have to modify to be happy. It seems that more is available for the '03 though.
6) Great question for your insurance agent.

Mike

Eric91Z

Thanks for the replies so far. I really appreciate the input.

As for modifying cars, I guess it must be a "disese" I have because I can't ever seem to leave anything alone. Basics always seem to be tinted windows, alarm, exhaust, intake, wheels tires - at least. Although, I do think the '04 TL looks quite sharp right off the lot (except needing tinted windows, of course).

automata

Don't forget added features like Bluetooth and DVD-A. Sounds like you do alot of driving so these features might be worth the extra $$$.

Eric91Z

Two questions from that:

1) What exactly is DVD-Audio?
2) The readio (with NAV) is XM ready, right?

automata

1) What is DVD-Audio? DVD Empire explains.

2) Both Nav and Non-Nav models are XM ready.