KeithL

Acura TL holds it value amazingly well, better than Accord and better than most of its competition. There is a reason I have been able to flip to new TL so often, on my 5th 3G, the TL is a very in demand car, except for right now when nothing is in demand due to economy.

xen-cuts

I think that all of these sources are useless, particularly Forbes, but they do back up my points completely. Ebay prices are a better source than those, FYI (I'm doubting you'll take my advice on this, but you should.)

I'm NOT saying the TL drops more than BMW or Mercedes...it does not. It DOES drop more than Lexus, Infinity (it's main competition), Accord, Civic, and comparable Audis.

Obviously if these strange guys on AZ who drive their car 1000 miles/year sell them, they are going to get a decent amount for those vehicles. Who wouldn't want an unused used car? But for an average mileage vehicle, the price will plummet more.

If you historically look at the falling prices for Acura when newer models come out, they drop exactly to the $12-15k range. I'll admit to low-balling my estimate, but I wouldn't buy an 05 with 40-50k miles on it for more than $18k TODAY (and I only discuss Navi...I cannot even believe that people buy non-navi anymore.) When the 3Gs came out I watched the 2G prices religiously. You could not get one for less than $12k that was not driven into the ground; but you could snag one for around that price pretty regularly. I've seen people talking this month about how they want $12k for their 2Gs...these people are smoking crack! There is no way they'll get that out of a savvy buyer (I cannot account for idiots, lol.)

And you comments just get me on a whole 'nother topic: would you actually pay KBB value? I got my TL for way the hell lower than KBB. I realize you Californians live a different life from the rest of us, but around these here parts, we call KBB value "not a good deal."

I can accept that everyone here is excited about their TL. I know I am! And I think it's pretty reliable. But I'm also not going to make believe that it's solid gold on wheels. I actually got my TL cause I thought it was a better deal than an Accord, which is what I started out looking to buy. The reason it was a better deal is that the TL's price dropped so much.

Clean>Rice

fo sho

Will Y.

So your evaluation as to the TL dropping in value more than Audis is based solely on Ebay prices? Let us know if there is some other reference point besides auction starting bids that you rely on.

And where is "these here parts" where used TL prices seem drop so drastically? Is there more than a 2% differential between the depreciation on the Accord and the TL where you are?

Let's put it this way- most cars that were equivalent to the TL pricewise in 2005 are selling for less than the 2005 TL in my neck of the woods- CTS, BMW 3s (generation change, though), GTOs (which new couldn't get sold for $25K), Saabs, Mercedes C class, etc.

Out here in Los Angeles, many people look at the standard references- KBB, cars.com, msn, etc., then the real world- Craigslist, Autotrader, local papers, Pennysaver, etc. - to establish a market value for a vehicle. Audis drop like rocks compared to the TL- fewer people want to risk out-of-warranty Audis than Japanese cars- but BMW 3s hold up pretty well- not far from the TL. The used TL/G35 market in Los Angeles is pretty competitive, and I can't tell if there is any significant difference between them. The IS300 has been dead for a while; I don't know what the used IS350 market is like- too new that a significant discount is likely due to a salvage title or damage. I don't care what the ES300/350 market is like (soporific cars that weren't worth buying new to start ).

xen-cuts

I figured you would take the low-brow approach and that is why I mentioned it, yet it is really cheap of you to take that bait. What else can you base your price on other than...um...price? If you want to sample the market, get your head out of a magazine or be prepared to overpay. Then again, if you want to masturbate to how much our cars are overvalued, keep your head down in the magazines.

I would happily sell you my 2005 TL for the $23k or whatever that you think it's worth. Then I could upgrade to a 2007+ with navi traffic. I really like that feature.

Actually, Cali has some of the lowest prices on TLs, so I would have to widen my geographical designation to...the USA. There is a deal on a TL in California every day of the week. I'd move to the bay area and buy a new-ish TL every year if they'd pay attorneys something commensurate with the living expenses...

Yes, I agree. Those cars suck for resale.

Um, okay, but sticking your head in the sand doesn't make the TL value exceed that of the IS350, which re-sells pretty well. But Toyota/Lexus products that I like (read: not including any Toyota cars) usually resell for a high price that seems to be a little better than Honda/Acura.

Mokos23

well take a look at the resale value of the 1st gen TSX's now that the new 2nd gen TSX is out. it's been the same, but dropped a little.

xen-cuts

Okay so that TSX is off my radar. I don't like compact cars

Aside from the numbers, theoretically I don't think you should see as much drop with the TSX tho. This is because I'm not entirely sure that the new TSX is a big improvement--at least not on the exterior of the car. The interior does seem A LOT nicer to me.

I've noticed in a few searches that older TSXs rarely come with navi--people probably buy them as a budget cool car rather than pony up for the TL, and budget conscious people are the cheapskates who don't get navi. I wonder if this new version will have navi installed more often? If so, that could increase the separation in price for older versus newer a little bit more...at least on the average.

Will Y.

Just one simple question: which sources support your proposition that the TL resale value is/will be lower than comparable Audis, or that the TL prices drop much more than Accords, Lexus, infiniti, etc. "to...the USA?"

You have derided established sources, so we would have to assume you are otherwise just posting a Wild Ass Guess based on some E-Bay auction starting bid, or worse, making up the proposition with no data at all.

If not, tell us where you obtained the information that runs counter to what most of us have seen/read, and feel free to start a used TL dealership buying low and selling high to suckers like me in California!
Oh, and TLs with salvage titles will be the lowest priced, but most people in CA won't buy them.

Mokos23

well the old TSX was small cause of the narrow roads in Europe and Japan being it is a Euro Accord. the new TSX i saw at the dealer is huge and wider than the old one. The new TSX is about the same size as the TL and it's actually even wider than the TL. i never considered the old TSX compact, more like a small midsize, while the new TSX is midsize.

xen-cuts

Huh, next time I'm in for an oil change I will check out this TSX of which you speak!

Mokos23

u didn't know there is a new 2nd generation model 2009 TSX yet? anyways, yeah if you want check it out.

xen-cuts

No idea how you would draw a conclusion that I've never heard of a 2G tsx.

I knew about the 2nd gen, of course, but I have absolutely no interest in TSX because the 1G sucked so much ass. I've seen photos of the 2G on the website only so far while I'm looking for leaked photos of the new TL; I haven't seen a 2nd gen IRL. I hated the 1G so I never really looked at it. But if what you say is true about the 2G being larger I will be interested...a little... The TL will always be the better of the two

Mokos23

well it's not as large as the 08 Accord sedan, but it is wider than the TL. u probably may or may not like the new grill either. i took my gf to see it and she liked it. the sales person was tempting to buy an 08 TL-S.

xen-cuts

picking up one of the last of the 08 type-S's is pretty tempting! I bet you can get a good deal on one. They seem to be pushing those pretty hard.

I'm not totally sold on the new grill, honestly. My main problem is that I speed and the laser/radar guns can detect the nice big shiny grills really easily. For looks, it's not bad tho. I like the look of the MDX okay.

I really want to see this wide TSX. Sounds very cool! I definitely like the redone interior and I anticipate that the TL will be similar. Thanks for the info!

Mokos23

no prob, but just to let you know, no hard feelings that you slammed my 1st gen TSX. i like the TL-S too, but i just paid off my car last year. no debt is fine with me.

TzarChasm

Grill size/car color/tinfoil hubcaps have NO effect on radar. They dont have to shoot your licence plate, and they don't have to tune the thing up after every use. Look up the myths on radar sometime.

xen-cuts

Let me try to understand your myth:
1. radar = microwaves
2. microwaves are reflected by metal
3. more metal on TL does not reflect more microwaves

So that makes no sense. It's not likely that a lot more metal will make a lot more difference to a radar gun, but it will make you show up more to cops and it just looks kind of ghetto. Hubcaps can't reflect radar in most scenarios that I can imagine where the radar is shooting across the front of your car or back of your car. I'm not sure what the heck you are talking about with "tune ups" but yes, POP radar is almost unavoidable. With radar, the key is that it's detectable and you have to slow down when you encounter it.

Importantly (and this is what I was getting at in my post that you annoying targeted), the shiny reflective metals are absolutely worse when it comes to laser detection. Laser detection is more popular in the USA now.

TzarChasm

Holy cow.

Your right, radar dosn't work on motorcycles or Yugos because there isnt enough metal. And lasers cannot be used for things like rangefinders in golf or for scopes on rifles because the things you are aiming at are not shiney. Now I know why all those ricers drive their car in primer grey, the police cannot radar or laser them.
Thank you for informing me.

KeithL

IMO something to keep in mind also is it is very likely the 09 TL will be about $2K -$3K higher priced (the new TSX is $1800 more than 08). Most of us recent owners are getting the current TL for abotu $2K under invoice. I got my 08 Type-S for $33221 + TTL.
The fist 6+ months of the 09 TL I doubt you'll get more than $1K off MSRP so the resale of a 3G TL will fairly decnet fir the first 6-12 months of the new TL. So you have to figure a new 09 TL Navi is likely going to MSRP at around closer to $39K making it still almost $5K more than my 08 Type-S!! Figure realistic selling price of $37,500 and my Type-S is still a bargin considering the Type-S is proabbly closer to what the 09 TL-Navi will be, sure the 09 will have more powerful ELS, but the engine is likely to be damn close to the 3.5 today. I think those of us getting the TL lately will be fine with resale.

xen-cuts

Actually, I didn't say radar doesn't work on those things (you forgot to include baseballs). More metal is more metal, that's all I'm saying. But you ignored my point that laser detection DEFINITELY is affected by having a bunch of shiny crap all over the car, lol.

xen-cuts

Yeah I don't know how to account for these modifications and especially inflation--I'm no economist. I personally think that the TL is already overpriced new, but isn't every car? I just wish they would keep the price around $35k and stop being greedy. It will never happen. Eventually our beloved TL will price itself out! Oh, I so hope that doesn't happen... :wistful smiley:

geekybiker

I think ebay is a particularly poor place to get your resale values. Assuming you actually have a large enough sample size to be worthwhile (which I doubt) You are looking at a medium that is asking people to buy cars sight unseen. If anything I would expect ebay prices to be depressed on "normal" car models like the TL. Hard to find rare edition cars might generate enough interest to drive bidding, but average joe would rather buy a car he can drive around the block and take to a mechanic than a car he only has pictures and promises of.

xen-cuts

I understand what you are saying and that is what I considered when I arrived at the conclusion that Ebay actually provides better numbers over an average of a few vehicles than does shopping elsewhere (not counting auction, which I think is the other good place to find numbers--but I don't have direct access to auctions.) I nevertheless think that the depressed value is exactly why Ebay is the best place to find the real value of the car. You are always going to find people who overpay an inflated dealership value because they are scared/dumb/lazy/etc. I got my car on Ebay and I'm certain that some dummy would pay me more, 1 year later, than I bought it for (I got a really good deal.) But that doesn't mean I think it's worth the price that some schmuck would pay for it.

In fact, auctions are how dealers figure out how much older model cars are really worth. So if you can figure out how much your dealership is marking up used cars, then you can subtract that value and find the true value of the vehicle that was paid by the dealer at auction --rather than the inflated value arbitrarily assigned by the dealer or buyer during the sales process.

Mokos23

yo xen-cuts take a look at the new TSX yet?

geekybiker

Well the truth is that the real value is the average of people like you and the "dummies" So while it may not be what you'd pay, you probably don't represent an average section of the population.