Rating of Factory Window Tint (OEM)
07-02-2007, 12:45 PM
#42
Drifting
Originally Posted by Xpditor
My hand-held GPS will not function well, if at all, when I bring it into the center of the TL. I have to put it on the front dash so that it can successfully communicate with the satellites. Obviously, the metal shell of the car is blocking the signals. This is not theory..... it is actually observed and repeatable.
Originally Posted by Xpditor
The same can be said for cell phone calls. I have had, on many occasions, to go outside of a building to make a phone call as there was too much interference on the inside. This again is a common and repeatable experience.
Originally Posted by Xpditor
Since Acura has no connection with tint makers or installers, they have no reason to say this if it were not true. Your suggestion implies that they are just plain ignorant of the topic. I doubt that. :shakehead
Originally Posted by Xpditor
I suggest that, if a person has always experienced this because he/she has always had metallic tint, then they have nothing with which to compare the performance of their Navi..... 
In other words, they don't know it could be better, faster, more accurate.
In an area of strong satellite coverage, this may not be that noticeable. But the very purpose of Navi is for navigating new places while traveling away from home. This difference could become important at a place and time when you most depend upon it.
In other words, they don't know it could be better, faster, more accurate.
In an area of strong satellite coverage, this may not be that noticeable. But the very purpose of Navi is for navigating new places while traveling away from home. This difference could become important at a place and time when you most depend upon it.
Originally Posted by Xpditor
Bottom line is: Does the tint shopper want to save a few bucks and chance it? Or does the shopper want to listen to the advice of the car and Navi manufacturer, spend a few dollars more, and get the peak performance out of an accessory for which he has just spent $2000?
I could care less which tint you buy. I'm just trying to clear up mis-conceptions about metallic tints. Because that's what they are, misconceptions.
07-02-2007, 01:37 PM
#44
Oderint dum metuant.
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Originally Posted by Bearcat94
Well, here's the ANSI standard: ANSI/SAE Z26.1-1996
I cannot find a "clean" copy on the internet, but it covers specifications and tests for glazing materials for automotive glass.
I cannot find a "clean" copy on the internet, but it covers specifications and tests for glazing materials for automotive glass.
ANSI Z26.1 requires most passenger car windows to pass a light transmittance test that assures that they transmit 70 percent of the incident light.
07-02-2007, 02:06 PM
#45
Drifting
Originally Posted by leedogg
hmmm, I thought GPS signals used Microwave signals not RF signals? Thus they are prone to magnetic interferences....
Microwave and "RF" are both electromagnetic radiation, and exhibit similar characteristics. Some are more pronounced than others, due to being different wavelengths... (Lots of calculations are based on length of a wavelength of the radiationion in question, so solutions for one might not work for the other, but the same laws/prinicples apply)
07-02-2007, 05:21 PM
#46
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by avs007
Then your GPS unit has a crappy antenna. (sorry no offense). My handheld GPS works fine anywhere in the cabin of the car. Even if my car is inside my garage, with the garage door open.
A lot of manufacturers also say to change the oil every 3,000 miles, what's your point?
Whatever. I've driven my cars for quite a while before I had the windows tinted. I also have multiple handheld units, that's I've used in my cars, as well as other people's cars. I also go hiking and such, and have used my handheld and car navi when going out into the country/wilderness/etc.
Bottom line, is that I was explaining things to you the way our RF engineers explained it. Cement walls and such are one thing... Ungrounded plastic films with unknown metallic flakes is quite another. Are you going to listen to scientific fact spouted by RF engineers with PhDs and years of research in the field, or some guy at a tint shop that is trying to sell you a more expensive ceramic tint, based on unscientific hearsay?
In that thread, someone had a good idea. Take a sheet of the metal film and lay it on the back window. Then look at your Nav screen. The green letters "GPS" only show up when the signals are locked in. The other parts of the nav system, the gyros and wheels sensors for dead-reckoning are independent of the satellite signal. They will function without satellite but are not very accurate.
We also hear from people, such as you, who haven't observed any problems with metallic tint. So....... "you pays your money and you takes your chances."
For sure I don't listen to tint installers. Most of them never heard of ceramic tint and do not carry it. Their advice? Same as yours: "I've tinted a million TLs with metallic film and never had a problem."
The installers aren't trying to move people to ceramic because most don't have it. They want to install their money-maker that they do many times a day and they are used to. They will also tell you you don't need moleskin (for the same reasons).
Non-metallic dyed films are cheaper than metallic films so they don't want to move you there either.
All one can do is read what others have experienced, listen to their trusted sources and make an educated personal choice.
I could care less which tint you buy. I'm just trying to clear up mis-conceptions about metallic tints. Because that's what they are, misconceptions.
07-02-2007, 08:08 PM
#50
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by 007TL-S
what's the (best) slower fading tint on the market anyone?
Metallic film and ceramic film are very fade resistant and last longer.
New films are hitting the market every day. Dyed film is non-metallic. 3M has a new "nano" something-or-other dyed film that they claim will not fade.
I haven't had the opportunity to check that claim out.
07-03-2007, 09:54 AM
#51
Oderint dum metuant.
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I asked this in another thread, but given the direction of this one, this looks like a better place. What is the difference between metallic and non-metallic (let's say ceramic as dyed is pretty much pointless)? Is there a difference besides not affecting electronic devices?
07-03-2007, 11:12 AM
#52
Drifting
Originally Posted by chill_dog
I asked this in another thread, but given the direction of this one, this looks like a better place. What is the difference between metallic and non-metallic (let's say ceramic as dyed is pretty much pointless)? Is there a difference besides not affecting electronic devices?
I think ceramic rejects even more heat than metallic.
07-03-2007, 12:37 PM
#54
Well, the main visible difference are the hues...
metallics will have a metallic reflective hue similar to oakley glasses, whereas dyes and ceramics will have a pure glossy black. Ceramic and dyes have different hues of glossy black.
metallics will have a metallic reflective hue similar to oakley glasses, whereas dyes and ceramics will have a pure glossy black. Ceramic and dyes have different hues of glossy black.
10-04-2007, 03:48 PM
#56
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Originally Posted by flnsx
It's been three months now since I put the mole skin on and still no problems with my tint.
I`m in CHICAGO IL. area .
Any clue anyone?
thanks for any help....
10-29-2007, 10:41 PM
#57
Banned
Bump!
I got a question for you guys, will having metallic tint on the side windows affect the Navi? I'm planning on using metallic for the side rear windows, but using ceramic on the rear windshield.
I got a question for you guys, will having metallic tint on the side windows affect the Navi? I'm planning on using metallic for the side rear windows, but using ceramic on the rear windshield.
10-29-2007, 10:57 PM
#58
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Shouldn't
The Navi owner's manual says not to use metallic tint on the REAR window as the antenna for the GPS is under the rear package shelf.
Problems with metallic on the sides have not been reported to the best of my recollection. I believe that is a viable alternative.
Problems with metallic on the sides have not been reported to the best of my recollection. I believe that is a viable alternative.
10-30-2007, 01:26 AM
#59
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All this hoopla about tint 
, good stuff, but if anyone in the DC/MD/VA area is interested in getting their windows tinted, I can tell you the best place. I have been taking my rides there for the last 11 years, same guy.
You watch him work and its like he just throws the tint on the windows and it lands perfectly...
T & D Auto Sound & Window Tinting
5415 Annapolis Rd
Bladensburg, MD 20710
(301) 864-6599
They have car alarms, rims and all the other crap, but I go for the tint. He's the best around. Just had my TL done today.
, good stuff, but if anyone in the DC/MD/VA area is interested in getting their windows tinted, I can tell you the best place. I have been taking my rides there for the last 11 years, same guy.You watch him work and its like he just throws the tint on the windows and it lands perfectly...
T & D Auto Sound & Window Tinting
5415 Annapolis Rd
Bladensburg, MD 20710
(301) 864-6599
They have car alarms, rims and all the other crap, but I go for the tint. He's the best around. Just had my TL done today.
10-30-2007, 04:28 AM
#60
Originally Posted by Xpditor
The XM antenna is EXTERNAL so no tint will interfere with it. The AM and FM antennae are also on the outside of the tint.
Your opinion is noted. Here is my actual experience:
My hand-held GPS will not function well, if at all, when I bring it into the center of the TL. I have to put it on the front dash so that it can successfully communicate with the satellites. Obviously, the metal shell of the car is blocking the signals. This is not theory..... it is actually observed and repeatable.
The same can be said for cell phone calls. I have had, on many occasions, to go outside of a building to make a phone call as there was too much interference on the inside. This again is a common and repeatable experience.
Your thoughts about RF signals, I believe, are dependent on the strength and frequency of those signals. Some are more amenable to being blocked than others.
The Acura Owner's Manual does not say that the Navi won't work if you use metallic tint. It says "...be aware that if the tint has metallic properties, it can seriously degrade or prevent GPS reception. This is because the GPS antenna is located under the rear window beneath the package tray." (TL Navigation System Owner's Manual, p.3)
Since Acura has no connection with tint makers or installers, they have no reason to say this if it were not true. Your suggestion implies that they are just plain ignorant of the topic. I doubt that. :shakehead
What does "seriously degraded" mean to the user? Fewer satellite hook-ups, slower resolutions, inaccurate resolutions, showing positions imprecisely, etc. I suggest that, if a person has always experienced this because he/she has always had metallic tint, then they have nothing with which to compare the performance of their Navi.....
In other words, they don't know it could be better, faster, more accurate.
In an area of strong satellite coverage, this may not be that noticeable. But the very purpose of Navi is for navigating new places while traveling away from home. This difference could become important at a place and time when you most depend upon it.
Bottom line is: Does the tint shopper want to save a few bucks and chance it? Or does the shopper want to listen to the advice of the car and Navi manufacturer, spend a few dollars more, and get the peak performance out of an accessory for which he has just spent $2000?
Your opinion is noted. Here is my actual experience:
My hand-held GPS will not function well, if at all, when I bring it into the center of the TL. I have to put it on the front dash so that it can successfully communicate with the satellites. Obviously, the metal shell of the car is blocking the signals. This is not theory..... it is actually observed and repeatable.
The same can be said for cell phone calls. I have had, on many occasions, to go outside of a building to make a phone call as there was too much interference on the inside. This again is a common and repeatable experience.
Your thoughts about RF signals, I believe, are dependent on the strength and frequency of those signals. Some are more amenable to being blocked than others.
The Acura Owner's Manual does not say that the Navi won't work if you use metallic tint. It says "...be aware that if the tint has metallic properties, it can seriously degrade or prevent GPS reception. This is because the GPS antenna is located under the rear window beneath the package tray." (TL Navigation System Owner's Manual, p.3)
Since Acura has no connection with tint makers or installers, they have no reason to say this if it were not true. Your suggestion implies that they are just plain ignorant of the topic. I doubt that. :shakehead
What does "seriously degraded" mean to the user? Fewer satellite hook-ups, slower resolutions, inaccurate resolutions, showing positions imprecisely, etc. I suggest that, if a person has always experienced this because he/she has always had metallic tint, then they have nothing with which to compare the performance of their Navi.....
In other words, they don't know it could be better, faster, more accurate.
In an area of strong satellite coverage, this may not be that noticeable. But the very purpose of Navi is for navigating new places while traveling away from home. This difference could become important at a place and time when you most depend upon it.
Bottom line is: Does the tint shopper want to save a few bucks and chance it? Or does the shopper want to listen to the advice of the car and Navi manufacturer, spend a few dollars more, and get the peak performance out of an accessory for which he has just spent $2000?
1994 accord
1998 accord
2002 CL
I can say that metallic tint has absolutly no affect on the handheld GPS or FM or AM radio reception.........inside my cars the 98 accord didn't even have a sunroof
a lot of the times the warning is there because 1 person out of 11ty billion MAY have a problem......
10-30-2007, 11:39 PM
#61
Originally Posted by YeuEmMaiMai
a lot of the times the warning is there because 1 person out of 11ty billion MAY have a problem......
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