An eye opening experience-changing plugs at 100k...
#1
An eye opening experience-changing plugs at 100k...
Hey there, we had an amazing improvement in throttle response and power by doing just a little extra maintenance on our TSX...I know now more than ever maintenance is key to having a fun and reliable car!
Check out what I did here:
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/pitboard/?p=849
And the results of my excitement came with the unveiling of a completely new maintenance plan based on real world needs of the car, not the penny pinching mentality provided by manufacturer maintenance standards! The HT-Spec maintenance schedule is almost done...we'll be announcing it as soon as it is!
Marcus
Check out what I did here:
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/pitboard/?p=849
And the results of my excitement came with the unveiling of a completely new maintenance plan based on real world needs of the car, not the penny pinching mentality provided by manufacturer maintenance standards! The HT-Spec maintenance schedule is almost done...we'll be announcing it as soon as it is!
Marcus
#2
Race Director
Oh man, I can't believe you're using a K&N filter. You're ruining your car....:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
#4
Banned
I'm so happy you did this write-up. A kid with a 1st gen CL-V6 is being sluggish and revving up/down at idle (ISACV) but im def linking this to his thread as I told him it prob needs simple tune-up too as he just bought and doesn't know anything that could have been done previous to his purchase.
#5
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
I item I want to mention is that anti-seize solution, in moderation, should be used on all the spark plug threads. It's not the exposure to the environment that can cause the possibility of seizure; it's just the environment that the plugs see. There are pros and cons on using the anti seize solution, but if used in moderation and placed on just the threads, no problem will be seen with conductivity or torque values and it is recommended in the Acura FSM.
These plugs will last quite a long time and with modern electronics it's unusual to feel any difference when the plugs are replaced, unless there was a misfire prior to replacement.
These plugs will last quite a long time and with modern electronics it's unusual to feel any difference when the plugs are replaced, unless there was a misfire prior to replacement.
#6
it's a car-drive it
had the spark plugs and the filters replaced when my 06 had about 110,000 miles. Also had the usual oil/filter change, tire rotation/balance, the power steering recall done and had the wipers replaced per the TSB. Cost me less than $100.00.
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#8
Turbo nut, nobody said the plugs don't last a long time, but they definitely don't perform very well after you get up into 70-80k. If you are running up to 100k and not feeling any difference at the change I'd say you either aren't very sensitive to it or are doing something else in your driving to make them last longer. Every "100k mile plug" car I've owned has seen a significant improvement in drivability and efficiency. I got almost 10% gain in mpg on my MDX, for example, and we changed those plugs at 80xxx miles.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
#9
Team Owner
Oh man, I can't believe you're using a K&N filter. You're ruining your car....:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
The changes are likely due to getting the 100,000 mile plugs out of there.
#10
Team Owner
Turbo nut, nobody said the plugs don't last a long time, but they definitely don't perform very well after you get up into 70-80k. If you are running up to 100k and not feeling any difference at the change I'd say you either aren't very sensitive to it or are doing something else in your driving to make them last longer. Every "100k mile plug" car I've owned has seen a significant improvement in drivability and efficiency. I got almost 10% gain in mpg on my MDX, for example, and we changed those plugs at 80xxx miles.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
#11
B A N N E D
iTrader: (4)
Oh man, I can't believe you're using a K&N filter. You're ruining your car....:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
I item I want to mention is that anti-seize solution, in moderation, should be used on all the spark plug threads. It's not the exposure to the environment that can cause the possibility of seizure; it's just the environment that the plugs see. There are pros and cons on using the anti seize solution, but if used in moderation and placed on just the threads, no problem will be seen with conductivity or torque values and it is recommended in the Acura FSM.
These plugs will last quite a long time and with modern electronics it's unusual to feel any difference when the plugs are replaced, unless there was a misfire prior to replacement.
These plugs will last quite a long time and with modern electronics it's unusual to feel any difference when the plugs are replaced, unless there was a misfire prior to replacement.
as far as a total misfire, not totally true (it can be a partial burn/misfire also), but yes more apparent, and there are times the ECU will not even pick up a misfire, but you sure as hell can feel it though, especially an idle misfire, where misfires are not really monitored
Turbo nut, nobody said the plugs don't last a long time, but they definitely don't perform very well after you get up into 70-80k. If you are running up to 100k and not feeling any difference at the change I'd say you either aren't very sensitive to it or are doing something else in your driving to make them last longer. Every "100k mile plug" car I've owned has seen a significant improvement in drivability and efficiency. I got almost 10% gain in mpg on my MDX, for example, and we changed those plugs at 80xxx miles.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
#12
Team Owner
I honestly would have gone with what turbonut had said if I didn't experience it myself. I would have thought it would take a total misfire to make any difference.
#13
The biggest screw up in the maintenance schedule is the transmission. Z1 simply isn't good enough to go the recommended service interval. My car was brand new and the shift qualiity started to degrade significantly at 15k miles. My car is a daily driver, and isn't tracked either.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
#14
Team Owner
The biggest screw up in the maintenance schedule is the transmission. Z1 simply isn't good enough to go the recommended service interval. My car was brand new and the shift qualiity started to degrade significantly at 15k miles. My car is a daily driver, and isn't tracked either.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
#15
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
This is from the NGK site:
FAQs - Spark Plugs
Q: How much of a performance improvement can I expect from changing plugs?
A: A common misconception is that changing spark plugs will result in a large power increase. In most cases, removing even seriously worn out spark plugs will only result in very modest power gains, typically about 1-2% of total engine output. This could be even less for computer-controlled vehicles, primarily because most newer vehicles have more powerful ignition systems and the vehicle's computer can make adjustments so that vehicle operation seems smoother and more seamless.
Many people think that simply supplying more spark to the firing tip can and will combust more fuel. What they don't understand is that most newer cars' engines are so efficient that they are already burning all of the available fuel. Simply adding more spark voltage can't burn more fuel because there is no more fuel to burn.
When a stock or near-stock engine is given a fresh set of spark plugs, peak efficiency is restored. The power gains that come from this restored state of tune are usually minimal. Any company that tells you that their spark plug will provide significant gains in power in a stock or near-stock engine is making blanket statements that may not be supportable.
#16
Team Owner
This is from the NGK site:
FAQs - Spark Plugs
Q: How much of a performance improvement can I expect from changing plugs?
A: A common misconception is that changing spark plugs will result in a large power increase. In most cases, removing even seriously worn out spark plugs will only result in very modest power gains, typically about 1-2% of total engine output. This could be even less for computer-controlled vehicles, primarily because most newer vehicles have more powerful ignition systems and the vehicle's computer can make adjustments so that vehicle operation seems smoother and more seamless.
Many people think that simply supplying more spark to the firing tip can and will combust more fuel. What they don't understand is that most newer cars' engines are so efficient that they are already burning all of the available fuel. Simply adding more spark voltage can't burn more fuel because there is no more fuel to burn.
When a stock or near-stock engine is given a fresh set of spark plugs, peak efficiency is restored. The power gains that come from this restored state of tune are usually minimal. Any company that tells you that their spark plug will provide significant gains in power in a stock or near-stock engine is making blanket statements that may not be supportable.
#17
B A N N E D
iTrader: (4)
The biggest screw up in the maintenance schedule is the transmission. Z1 simply isn't good enough to go the recommended service interval. My car was brand new and the shift qualiity started to degrade significantly at 15k miles. My car is a daily driver, and isn't tracked either.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
I would say 30k miles MAX if you are using Z1, then do a full 3x3.
i would say 30k changes normally, but that first initial one is critical, just like changing engine oil at like 50, 500, and 1000 miles, to help clean out all the shit from building it and break-in
edit: WTF I Hate Cars, just got banned
Last edited by friesm2000; 01-01-2011 at 04:50 PM.
#19
2011 CR-Z EX 6spd Navi
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You just motivated me to do the plugs on my TL (currently at 98k). I got spoiled having to change the plugs on our Element and Civic though, the TL is a completely different beast!
#21
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (2)
Oh man, I can't believe you're using a K&N filter. You're ruining your car....:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...wpost&t=695764
#23
RE: transmission fluid, check out this latest Pitboard posting on the switch Honda just made from ATF Z1 to DW1: http://www.heeltoeauto.com/pitboard/?p=875
RE: Spark plugs. Honestly, I don't care what anyone else says here. I have had 3 cars now drive significantly better having changed iridium plugs after the 60,000 mile marker, bit J and K series. We know we felt an improvement, large or small is all relative to the driver. To me, a small improvement in the face of all the electronic gadgetry in the engine means that the improvement is significant.
You know, I wanted to dyno the car before and after the change and didn't thinking I was going to be doing an overkill test. Now, I wish I had!
RE: Spark plugs. Honestly, I don't care what anyone else says here. I have had 3 cars now drive significantly better having changed iridium plugs after the 60,000 mile marker, bit J and K series. We know we felt an improvement, large or small is all relative to the driver. To me, a small improvement in the face of all the electronic gadgetry in the engine means that the improvement is significant.
You know, I wanted to dyno the car before and after the change and didn't thinking I was going to be doing an overkill test. Now, I wish I had!
#24
B A N N E D
iTrader: (4)
RE: transmission fluid, check out this latest Pitboard posting on the switch Honda just made from ATF Z1 to DW1: http://www.heeltoeauto.com/pitboard/?p=875
RE: Spark plugs. Honestly, I don't care what anyone else says here. I have had 3 cars now drive significantly better having changed iridium plugs after the 60,000 mile marker, bit J and K series. We know we felt an improvement, large or small is all relative to the driver. To me, a small improvement in the face of all the electronic gadgetry in the engine means that the improvement is significant.
You know, I wanted to dyno the car before and after the change and didn't thinking I was going to be doing an overkill test. Now, I wish I had!
RE: Spark plugs. Honestly, I don't care what anyone else says here. I have had 3 cars now drive significantly better having changed iridium plugs after the 60,000 mile marker, bit J and K series. We know we felt an improvement, large or small is all relative to the driver. To me, a small improvement in the face of all the electronic gadgetry in the engine means that the improvement is significant.
You know, I wanted to dyno the car before and after the change and didn't thinking I was going to be doing an overkill test. Now, I wish I had!
but as far as the electronic gadgetry, it can cover up alot of driveability issues, but it cannot cover some of the most basic fundamentals, (IE: worn plugs)
but as far as the earlier change intervals, i think that is agreed upon, maybe just not the mileage though...
#28
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
Turbo nut, nobody said the plugs don't last a long time, but they definitely don't perform very well after you get up into 70-80k. If you are running up to 100k and not feeling any difference at the change I'd say you either aren't very sensitive to it or are doing something else in your driving to make them last longer. Every "100k mile plug" car I've owned has seen a significant improvement in drivability and efficiency. I got almost 10% gain in mpg on my MDX, for example, and we changed those plugs at 80xxx miles.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
I am recommending a plug change at 60k mile intervals.
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ChristianRE (06-24-2019)
#29
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
great write up by the way... I also feel maintenance is all about "preserving what you have" and keeping the car running in tip top shape...... very refreshing to see a positive attitude on this forum for a change when it comes to these things for your car sooner then the suggested intervals to keep the performance.
I salute you
I salute you
The following users liked this post:
ChristianRE (06-24-2019)
#30
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
Interesting theory........
#31
B A N N E D
iTrader: (4)
I agree with you, dont waste your time with the "penny pinching" mentality on this site, I feel so many people have a negative attitude towards maintenance for their cars and love to knock people like us who can appreciate and feel maintenance does have some affect on performance and drivability, maybe caues their cheap?, either way its sad cause so many of them will spend money on light up acura emblems but wont invest the money to replace plugs a little early just to help refresh them and get new ones in.
#33
#34
it's a car-drive it
I agree with you, dont waste your time with the "penny pinching" mentality on this site, I feel so many people have a negative attitude towards maintenance for their cars and love to knock people like us who can appreciate and feel maintenance does have some affect on performance and drivability, maybe caues their cheap?, either way its sad cause so many of them will spend money on light up acura emblems but wont invest the money to replace plugs a little early just to help refresh them and get new ones in.
#35
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
I agree with you, dont waste your time with the "penny pinching" mentality on this site, I feel so many people have a negative attitude towards maintenance for their cars and love to knock people like us who can appreciate and feel maintenance does have some affect on performance and drivability, maybe caues their cheap?, either way its sad cause so many of them will spend money on light up acura emblems but wont invest the money to replace plugs a little early just to help refresh them and get new ones in.
Also, I believe you started that ridiculous thread about changing ATF every oil change. Ever see manual trans disc dust? The disc will wear every time the pedal is depressed and released, but will last hundreds of thousands of miles unless abused. In fact many pressure plates will lose their tension before the disc is worn down to the rivets.
Time for breakfast!
#36
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
I have no desire or knowledge to do the maintenance on my tsx. I do know how to check the oil, tire pressure and can change a flat tire. I also try to hand wash it when possible. Since I am the main driver of the 06 tsx I have all the service done by a acura dealer I trust and think is excellent. Must be doing something right after 118,000+problem free miles still with the original brakes and 100% stock.
#37
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
Also, I believe you started that ridiculous thread about changing ATF every oil change. Ever see manual trans disc dust? The disc will wear every time the pedal is depressed and released, but will last hundreds of thousands of miles unless abused. In fact many pressure plates will lose their tension before the disc is worn down to the rivets.
Time for breakfast!
Well the findings I had on the drain plug were a little excessive and many would agree with that, changing it each oil change takes another 10 mins considering the drain plugs are inches away from each other.... I thought the thread was good info since the interval on the oil combined with those findings should be a concern for the already problematic trans we have.
Sorry you didnt see value in my thread, I was genuinely trying to add a good thread to the forum other then " what intake should I buy, or what car should I buy next " type threads.... I am just very PRO maintenance for overly cautious protection.
Last edited by OntheJob; 01-03-2011 at 10:14 AM.
#38
Keep'n it clean- Orlando
We may not get a lot of power, but I think as you stated it will help the car run its best... which speaks volumes when you combine that with other needed items, as in this case, the air filter as well.
#39
if you read the owner manual it says if operated in severe service- do the 105 service at 60- that would include spark plugs,, to say the least~
short trips- commute traffic- driving on Earth... all put the car in severe section of the maitenance,,no kidding read the book!
the govt wanted cars to be longer interval on maitenance for the consumer--
so makers figured how far they can push it and thats the new limits,,100k service moved to 105,,
plugs last forever,,,,
and the new severe service designation in fine print at the bottem of the page
where no one sees it
To me: changing the hydraulic fluids of brakes and ps sooner and more often than acura says is cheap insurance on parts destined to fail.. if old cruddy fluid left to rot them an extra year,,from trying to save a few bucks
3 years! who are they kidding--
short trips- commute traffic- driving on Earth... all put the car in severe section of the maitenance,,no kidding read the book!
the govt wanted cars to be longer interval on maitenance for the consumer--
so makers figured how far they can push it and thats the new limits,,100k service moved to 105,,
plugs last forever,,,,
and the new severe service designation in fine print at the bottem of the page
where no one sees it
To me: changing the hydraulic fluids of brakes and ps sooner and more often than acura says is cheap insurance on parts destined to fail.. if old cruddy fluid left to rot them an extra year,,from trying to save a few bucks
3 years! who are they kidding--
#40
note the TL has a very high energy `coil on plug` ignition
compared to old school single coil and plug wires system- there is more impulse reaching the plugs
in theory: more wear but way better spark
regular cars can get 100k on plugs, but us...
compared to old school single coil and plug wires system- there is more impulse reaching the plugs
in theory: more wear but way better spark
regular cars can get 100k on plugs, but us...