jproy_RENAMED

Has anyone heard anything about this? I have not but am curious to know if it is even possible on the new 04 TL? Are there any reasons why it would not work? Should Comptech be able to do a carry over from the CLS 6spd charger to the new TL with new tuning? I am sure the fly-by-wire throttle on the new TL will provide some new challenges. When could something like this be available?

Does anyone have the scoop on this issue? Does anyone know anything? Even if you don’t what are your thoughts?

Thanks,
Jim

shingles

I am sure comptech is working on it already. The engine is still the J32 so I am sure they can reuse a lot of things. As for the throttle, I don't think that'll cause much issues. Most issues would be mounting and fuel control.

jproy_RENAMED

shingles,

thanks for the post. that is what I figured. anyone else have input on the topic.

thanks jim

niko14

the higher engine compression ratio is also gonna cause some big issues.

jproy_RENAMED

i understand it is only 0.5 higher. 10.5:1 verses 11.0:1 Does this have THAT huge an impact and could someone explain why if it does.

curious,

jim

youngmic

I assume that comptech will eventually come out with a supercharger and headers for the 04 TL. The idea of 300+ hp is attractive. I've never pursued this kind of enhancement to a vehicle before. I assume that these would void the warranty?

theslik1

My quick and dirty goes like this: forced induction raises the internal cylinder pressure and hence cylinder temperature. That higher temperature reduces the margin to auto-ignition of the fuel-air mixture inside the cylinder. If the mixture auto-ignites, that's what we know as detonation or knock. A little bit of knock is tolerable, more than a little can be destructive. Our cars are equipped with a knock sensor; the ECU will retard spark timing if knock is sensed, and will continue retarding the spark until it reaches a timing limit or the knock goes away. Kinda counterproductive when the original goal was to make more power.

A compression ratio of 10.5:1 is pretty damn high to begin with for forced induction; 11:1 won't improve the situation any. I assume that you'd have to run relatively rich to provide some margin. As far as I know, Honda engines don't have any magical properties that make them more boost friendly at high compression. I'm a turbo guy, so I have serious misgivings about running 11:1 and boost on a daily driven car. I'll leave that to the serious drag racers. I'm confident that Comptech can build a supercharger solution that'll work at stock compression, but you won't get nearly the gains that you would have at 9.5:1 compression or less.

I personally wouldn't supercharge my TL without a piston change for long-term reliability's sake.

Please feel free to correct or elaborate on any of this. None of my post was supposed to bear any resemblance to a technical discussion.

SteVTEC

Higher static compression ratio means less and less boost friendly. 11.0:1 is *very* high. I think only the 2ZZ-GE engine in the Celica GT-S (11.5:1) has a higher compression ratio in the US.

High static compression + boost = ridiculously high cylinder pressures which isn't good for durability. The other problem is the pressure ramp occurs much quicker on higher compression engines which makes the engine much more knock prone. Again, that + boost can cause issues. The other thing to be concerned about is the very aggressive air-fuel ratio from the dyno that the fellow here posted. If that's accurate that would be a big concern also, as aggressive AFR also makes an engine more detonation prone and less boost friendly.

To run any sort of boost on the engine (safely that is), I think engine management (timing retard, richer AFR) will be critical. Not much you can do about the high compression ratio for cheap, but a thicker head gasket is a nice little trick if available. It also might be interesting to see if you could lower it a bit with J32A1 9.8:1 comp pistons but now you're talking big bucks. I'm not sure what Acura did to get the higher compression, though. Could have been chamber modifications for all I know.


edit: theslik1 beat me, but pretty much ditto on my thoughts.

Bitium

about 11:1 ratio.....all they do is lower the boost. I think on the CL 10:5 ratio they were running 6 psi.....for the 04 TL 11:1 they would just run at 5 psi. A little less power.

About the throttle body, YES this will make it harder. One reason why is because the CL supercharger they relocated the entire throttle body. They have a different one with no cables, so they have to go back to the drawing board to accommodatethe new TB.

Another thing is the price ??? $ 4,500.00

Here is the pic so you see it for yourself:

zmanishere

with 11:1 you are really pushing it with forced induction. $4500 only gets you about 30-50 ponies. At that ratio I would seriously look into a cooler as well.

from Garrett:

3. What happens when running a high compression ratio with a turbo? (Same as with an SC)
There are many considerations that might be overlooked when turbocharging an engine that was not originally designed for one. The turbo is generally robust to higher engine compression ratios. However, peak cylinder pressures are more easily reached with forced induction, and the risk of blowing a head gasket, or even fatiguing the head bolts increases. If compression ratios are too high for the turbocharged application, teams might also encounter temperature related issues. These include: an overheated engine, overheated turbine housing, coking of oil, an incomplete combustion process, poor exhaust performance, and other heat-induced engine problems.

youngmic

What do you think Acura did to the a-spec concept to get 300hp?

Bitium

Turbo JK I wish

don't dream about 300hp because "svtmike" says "Honda's MO is to not make major platform changes in the middle of a generation.

I would consider adding 30hp a major change. The man knows

youngmic

Yeah, but if Honda did it on the concept, maybe we'll be able to do it on the TL w/aftermarket offerings. It's fun to think about.

jproy_RENAMED

I like the thought of figuring out what Acura/ Honda did for the extra 30 ponies. I wonder what comptech headers and intake will do for the new TL.

where can I find this concept 300HP TL you guys keep refering to?

Thanks,
Jim

jimthegreek

the concept vehicle has headers, intake and moded exhaust. Those 3 together will give you about 20-25.. I dont know what else they could have done to it.

In regards to Comptech and the supercharger. I emailed them a few weeks ago, and from what they replied back, they will not be testing or making a supercharger for this vehicle, until at least next year.... I was pretty disappointed.

jproy_RENAMED

I understand Comptech makes great, maybe the best, products but boy do they take there sweet ass time bringing products to market. I hope they develope and make one soon if they are even going to bother. I have a CLS6. They waited till the last year of production of the CL to release the charger. STUPID marketing. I know the CLS6 came out late, the sole benifactor of the supercharger. I dont understand.

Jim