JonDeutsch

I just read the incredibly positive Edmunds reivew, but they did bring up some new angles about the engine and the clutch.

In my test drives, I also stalled a few times. I just assumed it's something I'd need to get adjusted to.

So, for all you veteran 6MTers... how has the adjustment been going? Is every launch a challenge like Edmunds asserts?

Jon

partagas

After 30 min, the clutch is no problem. After 500 miles, it lifts up to the desired height and it's good and easy to use. I have never had any problem with stalling. The tranny throws are short and slick and it's as easy to use as my BMWs or Porsches.

RAdams

The clutch starts to bite very soon after you start letting it out, so it catches a lot of people by surprise. I felt like a complete amateur when I was test driving the car but quickly got comfortable with it. Still, I do tend to need a few minutes to acclimate to it after driving my Civic... the two clutches are so different it's like relearning to drive stick.

I've tipped into it a couple of times now and have found that a moderate slip while maintaining about 2000 RPM is about all it takes to get moving pretty quickly. I plan to test it a bit more in preparation to taking this car to the track for the first time, but so far my impression is that anything much higher that say 2500'ish RPM and it's gonna light the tires up. Also, you absolutely must turn VSA off if you want to do any sort of performance driving... it dulls the throttle response quite a bit -- especially noticeable when you get back on the gas after snapping off a quick shift.

NOX 3.2

Got used to it pretty fast. I love the sensitivity of the clutch, don't need to push it all the way down. No stalling after you learn.

the stick has a notch or something that gets in the way when shifting, I wish it was smoother (maybe when it wears out). My Ford Sierra Xr6Ti was very smooth (engine made in Germany) - not sold in the US. And my Benz is also smooth.

Formula 350

My experience is that it takes awhile to get used to the clutch. I am now at 800 miles and am getting very smooth. My biggest problem is the high (and quick) reving engine. I would give it more gas than needed while letting out the clutch and it would take off. Next time I would try to hold back on the gas and it would bog down. I have not stalled it as I just push the clutch back in and do it again.

My biggest problem is going to my other car which is an automatic and my left leg is flopping around looking for the clutch.:wow:

achadha100

Your right first gear is pretty tough I stalled as soon as i took the car out for a test drive. Since then been pretty smooth except for 1st to 2nd gear it has not been smooth something doesn't seem right. If I go from neutral to 2nd or 3rd to 2nd it is very smooth getting crunchiness from 1st to 2nd others getting the same?

danno

First gear is tricky when on a slope. Going from 1st to 2nd, it seems like you have to wait for the revs to come down to smooth the transfer to 2nd

pgould

I agree w/Danno - taking off while going uphill can take a bit of getting used to. I stalled twice trying to get up a downtown Seattle hill on my first day with the car (luckily the engine starts right back up quickly ), but have been slowly getting better. Otherwise, I love the clutch - pedal travel is really short compared to other cars I've driven and it seems to pair well with the short-throw shifter. Just takes practice.

Bitium

Where have you been??? haven't seen you here in a long time.....so you couldn't wait ahh....already driving a 2004 6MT...I wish i was in the states.

vtechbrain

On the contrary I would rather be in Germany with my TL so I could take REVENGE. When I was there in the 80's I drove a beat up passat that wouldn't go faster than 85, it was pathetic. I'd give anything to take my new wheels on the autobahn to kick some German ass!

jyg tl 3

ypour self out of the high speed lane

lakeman

At 2200 miles, and 1 month, I have pertty much mastered the clutch and shifter. ( It took me a little longer than partagas.) The only time I have trouble is when I get in hurry and let the clutch out too fast, trying to take off or on a very steep hill. The primary reason I have stalled it is that I can't hear the engine. I find that if I watch the tach or take it easy it is fine. Also you can rev up to about 2K (as RAdams noted) and launch very quickly, no problem. The clutch has a very precision feel to it. It works great when you treat it as such. It is a learning experience, not an ongoing issue.

jzinckgra

I've noticed this too. Is this part of the learning curve or is it the VSA and drive -by-wire- throttle. Does the VSA intentionally cause the motor to bog a little so one doesn't spin the tires? If I turn the the VSA off, will the bog go away? I can't get the clutch/gas thing right quite yet, but it's only been a couple days.

NBP04TL4ME

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one. I've been driving manual transmissions for 15 or so years and felt like a novice test driving the TL. I figured it would take a little practice but was a little un-nerved, by the fact that I would either stall or spin the tires from launch.

Joe5.0

Mine finally feels "broken in" at 7k miles, so I would say give it some time to lossen up. And if you think going from a civic to your TL is strange, try going from a mustang gt with a aftermarket clutch. The shifter & clutch feel so much higher effort, but no lower quality than my CL-S6. I actually prefer my mustang's clutch because it is very progressive and easy to launch smoothly. I'm sure the extra tq helps from bogging it too.

vandy786

Lucky bastard!

lakeman

JonDeutsch,

I know this thread was about the TL clutch, but there is some other “gems” from the Edmunds test that struck me. For one this review had the HPT tires. Many of us have said that summer rubber makes a big difference. First the braking. The braking distances that C&D had were bad, but look at what the HPT tires do: Quote “a trio of stopping distances (from 60 mph) of less than 116 feet confirmed our initial positive impressions of the TL's binders.” (compare to Edmunds test of the 2001 911 Turbo –you know how I love Porsche comparisons – quote “Sixty-to-0 mph braking is likewise impressive, with a short distance of 117 feet” ) Score 1 for TL

Now for the real gem – the handling. I have always felt that skid pad was more of a tire test than anything, but a slalom tests the tires, the chassis set up, and the ability of the car to change direction quickly. It also shows up poorly when there is excessive over or under steer. I have been saying this car handles very well and is not a heavy, unresponsive car WITH GOOD STICKY RUBBER.
Look at the results: Quote “We found these Bridgestone Potenzas grippy and, combined with the solid chassis and precise steering, they allowed the TL to weave through the 600-foot slalom in a very quick 6.1 seconds — an average speed of 67.5 mph. This makes the TL one of the fastest cars we've ever taken through the cones” Score 2 for the TL.

For comparison I looked up other cars that Edmunds had tested in the 600 ft slalom in the past.

Acura TSX 62.5
BMW 330i 63.6
2001 911 Turbo 65.2
Porsche Boxter 66.0
2003 Infiniti G35 Sedan 66.4
Mercedes Benz SL500 67.1
2004 TL HPT 67.5

The TL bested not only the TSX and 330i, but some of the really high dollar performance machines- Porsches included. If you can handle the torque steer (or whatever it is called) this car is one of the quickest, best handling machines out there. I rest my case.

partagas

I am coming from a 330i stick. This clutch is easier and much lighter. My wife and kid find it much easier. Also, I posted after my Mulholland Dr. and various canyon runs that it handled that stuff better than the GS430 and more securely than the G35 and I wouldn't be surprised if the numbers were as good as the 330i. It's just not as easy to romp through the corners as the 330i.

My problem is, I've gotta stop driving it, 2100 mi in 3 weeks. Crap, gotta drive the MDX, truck or 330i for a while. Much of this driving is highway and it racks up miles quickly. It's by far the best rough highway flyer of the half dozen cars I've mentioned, hence all the miles.

erikmoeser

Yes, notchy from 1 to 2 when cold but that should go away when warm. 2 to 3 is smooth even when cold. 5 to 6 takes effort when cold but that eases up too.

vothsc

The last decent manual I drove was a Mustang GT and that was 18 years ago so this should be a leaning experience when mine comes in in about a week. I just hope i don't stall it leaving the dealership.

RAdams

I think part of the "problem" for me, at least, is that this is the first car that I have owned that has drive-by-wire throttle. As such, the gas pedal is artificially "weighted" since there is no throttle cable or return spring on the throttle body opening to add mechanical "weight". I initially found myself being a little too aggressive on the gas because it's so much "lighter" than my other car, but even in the last couple of days I've noticed that the time needed to acclimate from one car to another is shortening dramatically.

JonDeutsch

Lakeman,

Let's take this over to the Edmunds thread... see you there!
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=69870

Bitium

I was thinking more along the lines of been in the states so I could buy it and bring it here.

Woud love to drive it here...is so much more fun specially when you drive through the swiss alps and austrian villages.

jmichaelp

Sounds like how shifting is going for me. Still haven't gotten it to be completely smooth every time...

JonDeutsch

So, for some, 1st gear is still a struggle?

Yeesh... I'm surprised that made it past Acura testing. Aren't you?

Does anyone who has a 6MT wish they went for the 5AT due to the 1st gear struggle?

Jon

erikmoeser

For some 1st gear is a struggle...but I am adapted and have no trouble with it, although because of the lack of engine sound feedback it pays to look at the tach when taking off from rest to be sure you are at least north of 1000 before letting out the clutch...and feed more gas as you pass through the "slip" stage. It helps to have the stereo off, but it sounds so good I probably won't do that! I am wondering what I will hear from the pipes if anything once spring comes and I can roll the window down.

GoBig

yup...first gear is a little struggle, but after a while you learn to feather the throttle while letting out the clutch.

...this is the best car for the money (and more money) hands down!!!

mischa

what 6M driver would take an auto over this this slick shiftin, short throwing masterpiece (maybe not masterpiece, but smooth and quick)?

KevinB

I will tell you the drive-by-wire is NOT part of the problem. I have a 2000 Acura NSX-T which is drive by wire and I never had any of the problems people are mentioning with the TL. While I never stalled the TL, I also found it to be one of the more difficult I've driven. My wife had a terrible time with it on her test drive. I don't believe the VSA has any effect on this either. It should not come into play on launch. I think part of the issue is that the car has more power than most and thus requires a heavier duty clutch which has a different feel. For me, I think the problem is the clutch starts engaging early but doesn't fully engage until fairly late. I've owned a number of manual transmission cars and have always gotten used to them fairly quickly. I'm sure the TL will be the same (otherwise I would not have ordered one).