JAH Bless

If so, at what mileage and what did you replace it with?

Reason i'm asking is i think i'm starting to experience some slipping. I want to get some feedback from other members so that i can be prepared for the cost of replacement. Or maybe go ahead an purchase the replacement parts in anticipation of my current clutch sh!ttin the bed. Thanks in advance for the responses.

djbonsu

iTrader: (3)

how many miles do you have?? and what yr is your TL??....65k on my 05 6MT and no slippage or problems as of yet bro. im the second owner.

gauravp123

2006 AC TL

ROYAL BLUE PEARL

54,000+ miles

the same, single, one and ONLY owner

no clutch issues, no slippage etc

MY CLUTCH WILL NEVER DIE BECAUSE ROYAL BLUE PEARL OWNS ALL

Tripnbeats

I got an 05 in 05 brand new changed mine at 79k miles...i didnt have to the tech said i had about 30% life left.....but since the frame was down and the the car was being serviced i said do it anyway. i paid some and some was under warranty

JAH Bless

Guess i'm f*cked then, cuz i'm SSM..lol

It's an '04 with 57k and small change and i'm the second owner....I dont drive hard, but every once in a while, i'm at a red light and i get the urge....so i run thru the gears a little aggressivley. Yesterday, when i grabbed third, it felt like it was slipping. There wasnt that engagement that gives you that pulling feeling...it was more like a stalled rxn...maybe i'm just buggin. But i dont know how the car was driven before i got it and i do agree that it seems kind of premature for the clutch to be going, but not impossible

Krazylegs

Have you heard about the 3rd gear recall from Acura. If you bring the car in for the 3rd gear issue, it will be verry inexpensive to get the clutch replaced at that time.

Tripnbeats

krazy is 100% correct. a hellllllllll of a lot cheaper. 90% of the labor cost is taking the tranny down and putting it up. the clutch n flywheel take like an hour to install

JAH Bless

I have, but my third gear has never "popped out" or been a p.i.t.a. to go into gear, so how exactly will the recall help me. I was under the impression the recall replaced the third gear syncros or something along those lines...not the clutch...holla back, cuz if i'm mistaken i will HAPPILY make an appointment!

HEK

33K on my '05 NBP and no issues, I switched to GM's Synchromesh at about 15k and did the Comptech short shifter mod at about the same time..

SouthernBoy

I have an '04 manual TL with just over 56,000 miles on it (original clutch, of course). Last Sunday, I had to get into it in 2nd and 3rd gear going around someone. My shift to 3rd resulted in a little wheel spin, so no.. there is absolutely no indication of any sort of abnormal wear with mine. I expect to get at least 200,000+ miles out of the clutch; if I keep the car that long.

Krazylegs

In the TSB they have to remove the transmission to get to the 3rd gear issue. This leaves replacing the clutch take 0 labor time. The 3rd gear issue is a design flaw that is in all of our TL's. I would tell them that it is a problem and see if you get luckey.

1995hoo

Never had a problem with the clutch, never had a third gear problem either. I have a 2004 TL and I just hit 46,000 miles yesterday (yes....it's low....I have two cars, there was also a full month in 2006 where I barely drove at all due to a trip for work, and most of my vacations in the past four years have required flying to my destinations).

1fsthatch

moms 04 tl has 28,693 now thats low

JAH Bless

I've read your other posts SoutherBoy, and your clutch skills appear to be lightyears ahead of mine. Now i can drive a stick, but i get the impression that you are the grandaddy of manual driving...and i mean that with all due respect

let me also be clear, i DO NOT have any of the historical issues with the 3rd gear, so i'm not sure how having the dealer address the 3rd gear TSB will result in a new clutch for me. I understand that if they are already "in there" then it's close to no additional labor to install a new clutch, but i'd have to have my car in there for the TSB first, and i dont see that happening unless i starts to display the "third gear problem" symptoms. I also had the dealer do a drain and fill with the GM fluid at the B2 service.

Let me also clarify that what i experienced yesterday wasn't an egregious display of impending clutch failure, it just didnt "grab" like it should have. So i want to prepare myself for replacement. I just wanted to get some feedback on what people have paid for a replacement and if they went OEM vs. Aftermarket (which brands).

That being said, i appreciate the responses so far...so keep them sh!ts comin! Good Lookin Out!

Mike 06 TL

It's very easy to tell if your clutch is slipping.

Go find a decent size hill and drive up in a higher gear than you normally would (i.e. put it in 5th or 6th gear where normally you would be in 3rd or 4th.) The revs will be somewhere under 2000 rpm. Next, put the accelerator to the floor. You should only slightly accelerate with the revs climbing slowly. If the rpms flash up quickly and you don't go anywhere then you'll know the clutch is slipping.

I went through clutches on just about all the mustangs I've owned previously (too much power after mods for POS stock clutches) and that method would predict clutch failure about 5-10K miles ahead of actual failure.

BTW, I have 52K miles on my TL and it will still chirp 3rd so no issues here. About 40K miles of that has been highway so the clutch has not really seen much action.

JAH Bless

are you chirping third with the Traction control off? SouthernBoy said his was easily chirpin third as well....i'm lucky if i chirp second....wonder if my tires have anything to do with that tho (yokohama H4s)...

mmade22

Exactly what I was gonna say. That is the right way to test the clutch without harming anything. Good looking out! I have a rock solid car (knock on wood) 85k and no issues at all. The clutch always grabbed high but no slipping. Test it out like Mike said and that will answer all your questions

SouthernBoy

When I turn off my VSA then go WOT from launch, first gear will smoke the tires until I either let off the gas or shift. Second will spin some and third will spin a little.

Last Sunday (the day I related above) I had not turned the VSA off.

SouthernBoy

Thanks for the kind words. Perhaps I have just had more time to learn and refine a technique than yourself. And no disrespect taken for the "grandaddy" thing.

Several people have given a couple of good and simple ways to test whether or not you might be experiencing the onset of clutch slip. When I do the hill test, I generally use 3rd gear for the testing portion because it allows the engine to get up into its peak torque curve sooner. If the hill is more steep and/or shorter, I use 2nd gear for the same reason. What you want to do is get the engine turning between 4000 and 5000 RPM since it hits its peak torque at 5000 RPM. If you begin your test at 3-3500 RPM, that's fine as long as the engine has a little time to build up power. As has been mentioned, if slip starts to occur, you will notice the engine spinning up faster than normal. If you suspect this to be the case, get the engine up to around 4-4500 RPM without WOT, then go full bore and watch the tach.

There is another test, but I do not recommend it; especially for a front drive modern car. But here it is. Accelerate up to around 4000 RPM in 4th gear and hold the engine at that speed. Then go full throttle and about a second later, depress the clutch and release it very quickly while your right foot stays full on the throttle. If the clutch is working normally, as soon as it comes back out, it will pull the engine down to the road speed you are traveling. If it is starting to slip, you'll know it. But as I said, I DO NOT recommend doing this on a modern front drive car. They are just not strong enough to take much of this kind of abuse.

Mike 06 TL

Ditto here.

I run with VSA off all the time on local roads where I don't get much above 50mph. As soon as I hit the highway VSA comes back on. I feel it's actually pretty dangerous running around locally with VSA on. If you happen to mistakenly pull out in front of someone and need to get on the gas in a hurry VSA kills you because the tires break loose in first so easy. Also it sucks the life out of the car on hard shifts. But on the highway at 80mph it can save you're butt in a hurry should you get the car out of shape.

itschnobigdeal

My 04 has no slipping issues whatsoever, and it's got 73xxx on it. Though, it does chirp into third sometimes under heavy accel... is this something that can be fixed under a recall or if I take it into the dealer will I pay an arm and a leg to get that resolved?

The Dougler

iTrader: (1)

05 with 76km and original clutch, seeing 200k should not be unreasonable.

PoochaKannInc

04 with 64k. Haven't noted any slipping issues thus far.

Although I'm almost curious to try the "hill method" to see what happens.

SouthernBoy

A little off the wall, tongue in cheek there, eh? You are kidding.. right?

mn2trance

'05 with around 51K miles on it and my clutch still feels strong.

And quick question. When you guys put the car into gear to park and the engine is off, do you press on the clutch and put it into gear or just put it into gear after the car is off? I used to do the latter, but now do the former. I wanted to make sure I'm doing it right and not making my clutch worse by doing it wrong.

vincethe1

you chirped 3rd while shifting and not even trying to? wow that mush of been one hard shift with a high rpm clutch drop....it's hard for even a new clutch on a TL to do that when you're trying.

SouthernBoy

No, actually it wasn't either.

Yes I shifted faster than normal and yes the clutch was released quite a bit more quickly than normal and yes I went full throttle on the release and yes the engine was problem turning in the 5000+ RPM range when I hit third. But it wasn't what I would consider a "hard" shift as in one I would use during a drag race which for me would be a speed shift (hope you know the difference between speed shifting and power shifting).

Mostly I suspect the reason is due to two things: tires and a generally strong running TL. The tires I have are Michelin Pilot Sport A/S in the OEM size. They are great for cornering but not all that good for straight line performance. I saw the same thing happen on my last car (2002 Altima SE which I had modded) when I went from the stock EL42's to the Pilots. They just don't have a lot of grab under hard acceleration.

vincethe1

i would kind of have to disagree with that...because 1st the TL has this thing that softens sudden clutch drops...so that will cause the clutch to heat up a little and possibly start slipping. (my 06 TL at 6000 miles, in 6th gear on the highway couldn't hold it like that, and now it's at over 30000 miles and the clutch is still good).

the 2nd thing, the front wheel drive cvs (axles) are generally stronger than the rwd counterparts, but they mess up way faster simply because when you turn with throttle if really kills them, but in a straight line they're pretty solid.




and a note to all the ppl trying to test their clutch, there is a far better and easier way to do it, get your car in a gear that would be at 4000-5000 rpm for the engine. Floor it and then press on the brakes at the same time, see if you can keep the engines revs there...if the start climbing and your car starts slowing down you know you have a serious problem...and you're gonna need to change your clutch soon enough....remember, you don't have to hold the car at full throttle and brakes for long, 1 or 2 seconds is enough, just to see if your clutch holds the full load of your engine.

the best tip for long clutch life is...do not slip. if you wanna drive fast, let the cluthch out completely, then floor the car all you wantm it does 0 damage to the clutch that way.

sharp218

Don't drive with your foot on the clutch either. Even a slight amount of pressure can cause significant premature wear over time.

SouthernBoy

Yes I know about the "softens sudden clutch drops" but for my TL, it is almost non-existent and virtually not noticeable. As for FWD components being stronger than those of a RWD (talking serious machinery here), I must respectfully disagree with your statement. There is no way my TL, from the shifter to the transmission to the rest of the drive train, could stand up to the actions I put through my '66 Chevelle and I would imagine the same could be said for modern Mustangs and Corvettes.

You braking tested at WOT is excellent and I have used that one myself. I tend to due this in 2nd or 3rd gear because of the speed at which I would be traveling in a higher gear, but 4th would be a very good choice.

As for a long clutch life, yes.. you want to minimize the frictional losses as much as possible. Full engagement with a healthy clutch is not going to diminish its life when going WOT (this is how I do things when I want to get a little squirrelly). Launching at 4000 RPM under full throttle at lights on a regular basis is a recipe for a shorter life as is power shifting and improper downshifting.

We are pretty much on the same page with all of this. I really enjoy my TL and look foward to driving it every chance I get. And it's an '04 manual. I have to have my "TL moments" on the weekends just to relax and enjoy the scenery in my part of Virginia (really is quite beautiful and made for a manual gearbox).

SouthernBoy

Yep, this is true.

People who rest their left foot on the clutch are engaging the release bearing first. This will significantly shortens its life, so this is not something you want to do.

vincethe1

i have to agree...we are on the same page about this, i have read your statements about the manual transmission and your advice, and it's absolutely true.

when i was comparing fwd components to rwd ones however i ment in the same class (not for the power and torque of a large v8)....an example would be TL vs the BMW 3-series or the infiniti G35, MB C-class, ect. it would be hard to beleive they have stronger drivetrains, it's just that the cv joints go way easier due to power being transmitted through flexing joints...never a good thing.

SouthernBoy

[QUOTE=vincethe1]i have to agree...we are on the same page about this, i have read your statements about the manual transmission and your advice, and it's absolutely true.

when i was comparing fwd components to rwd ones however i ment in the same class (not for the power and torque of a large v8)....an example would be TL vs the BMW 3-series or the infiniti G35, MB C-class, ect. it would be hard to beleive they have stronger drivetrains, it's just that the cv joints go way easier due to power being transmitted through flexing joints...never a good thing.[/QUOTE]

You're right about comparing oranges to apples from my example.. I should have done a better job of explaining my position. Perhaps the two weakest links in a FWD car (from what I understand) is the transaxle and the CV joints. Frankly, I don't really know enough about FWD configuration to offer any sort of a qualified statement here. I do have an understanding of how they work and, of course, simple physics will dictate their lack of traction compared to a RWD setup.

While not a fan of FWD cars in general, I must admit that they have come a very long way in the past 30 years. The best of the ones I have owned or driven have been my '96 Ford Contour SE, my 2000 Contour SVT (incredible handling machine), and my '04 TL. I very much enjoy my TL (just got back from an errant/TL moment run in it a few minutes ago).

I will have to admit that when all is said and done, in terms of driving satisfaction, vehicle quality, feature-laden accoutrements, appearance, and general feel, my '04 TL is probably the best car I have owned. There have been others that have been quicker, better handlers, and just more bad-ass. But my TL, when considering the entire picture, is the best of the lot. The fact that it still puts a smile on my face when I drive it and the fact that one of the joys at the end of a day's work is driving my TL home is testament to this.

Enjoy the remaining part of your weekend, my friend. I have enjoyed our discourse.

itschnobigdeal

Uh, no I am not. If I accelerate hard in 2nd gear (not even redline it) and shift quickly into 3rd, almost every time it will grind a little going into 3rd. Also if I downshift into 3rd at a similar speed (higher rpm's) it will also grind a bit going in. I've heard that this is a common issue with our cars and wonder if it can be fixed under recall...? I've heard that rumor a few times. I have an extended warrenty that covers all transmission components minus the clutch. So I can get that problem fixed under warrenty, especially since it was documented as having that problem when I bought the car from the dealer. However I would rather not go through the warrenty process and have it fixed under recall. What about that is tounge-in-cheek, and why would I be kidding?

SouthernBoy

Clearly we had a miscommunication in your original post about this. I read it to be that you were bugged that your car "chirped" when shifting to 3rd gear under hard acceleration. This means breaking traction, not grinding in third. If your TL is chirping the tires when hitting third in these conditions, be happy... all is well.

If, on the other hand, what you meant was grinding in this kind of situation, then yes, there is probably a problem... unless it occurs rarely.

Hope this clears up any misunderstanding.

itschnobigdeal

^^^^^^^^ Oh crap... After reading back to what I wrote I meant the transmission chirps (grinds) shifting into 3rd, not my tires! Lol I can see now why you wrote that... We weren't on the same page and that's my fault. ha, sorry about that. I still have the same questions about my issue though.

Edit: I've just always called the 3rd gear grind thing the "3rd gear chirp" that's why I wrote that...

It only does it rarely because rarely do I push the car that hard. It would do it regularly though if I always screamed through the gears...

Cheers!

SouthernBoy

Now for your comments at the start of your post here. What you are describing sounds like one or a combination of three possibilities. 1) You are not fully depressing the clutch between shifts or you are and it is still making slight contact with the disk. 2) Your 3rd gear synchronizers are worn and are not fully matching shaft speeds for the shift. 3) The blocker rings are damaged or failing to mate properly.

If your problem is along the same lines as that covered by the current TSB, you should be covered and not charged for the fix. If you are hesitant about taking your car into a dealer for the repairs (I can understand that), why not first try doing a drain and fill with the GMSFM fluid (part #12377916)?

Good luck to you.

SouthernBoy

We're cool.

The fact that it only does it rarely and then only when you get on it hard tells me it could be slightly worn synchros or maybe you're not fully depressing the clutch during the shift. Does happen. If normal driving does not produce any of this and your 3rd gear shifts are smooth and flawless with no undue resistance, grinding, or unusual feel, then perhaps it is the fact that you are not completely depressing the clutch pedal on those hard shifts.. or maybe letting it out a little too early. Again, this does happen.

itschnobigdeal

It's not #1, I've tested that... As for the other two, yeah it's probably one of them. I'm not too hesitant bringing it in to a dealer... But I think I'm going to wait as long as the problem doesn't get worse, until my warrenty is almost up. It's a 4 year 48000 mile warrenty, and I'd rather get new parts in right at the end as compared to now while I'm still under warrenty for a long time. I might try the fluid change though, thanks for the info! BTW the one dealer I did call (bloomington acura) said they've maybe seen one or two 6mt tl's in for service ever and there are no recalls... douchebags. lol

SouthernBoy

Yeah, I don't think there is a recall on this.. just a TSB. Do try the GMSFM fluid change out. It has really been a great product for people on this site who have had similar problems. I put it in mine three years ago even though I never had any sort of problem with my 6MT. It has been completely flawless in 56,106 miles of operation.