AP8ESQ

Greetings all - been off the forum for a while but now facing a dilemma and looking for some opinions. Currently have the 2014 Sport Hybrid with 66k miles. I have been looking at replacements (S6; E53; M550i) but for some reason keep being drawn back to the Sport Hybrid. I don’t really know why but the maintenance costs and potential nightmares with the engines in some of those are just downright terrifying. My 2014 has been absolutely flawless to date other than tires (1 set, a battery and regular maintenance) I would like to get into a 2020 before they either all disappear or get up there in miles. So the question is whether it is worthwhile? I found a couple that are on my radar and with the trade value I would be looking at about $30k in financing (while money is still cheap) so less than half the price of some of the competitors I have been shopping against. I see Dr. Bob (paging…) has reacquired a newer Sport Hybrid - so what do the rest of the small RLX community think?

Thanks in advance

hondamore

Let me preface my comments by saying that I'm also thrilled with my 2014 RLX Sport Hybrid and have had zero issues except for 12V battery replacements related to my car sitting inactive for long periods.

The downside to buying a 2020 RLX Sport Hybrid are:
1. You are buying older technology especially when it comes to the infotainment unit (this may be a positive or negative depending on how "techy" you are).
2. In a few years, Acura may introduce a new flagship sedan with their latest revolutionary power train offering. The big question here is, IF it will happen, WHEN it will happen and WHAT that new car will be like.
3. The world seems to be trending towards battery powered vehicles and since you seem to like to keep your cars for half a dozen or so years, you may find yourself driving a "dinosaur" six years from now. Then again, everyone driving a BEV now might just hate the current limitation in range and charging options and your timing of waiting 6 years might allow the battery technology to advance to the point where BEV vehicles are a lot more practical.
4. Getting parts for any RLX might become even more difficult in the future because of their rarity. This, of course, would be offset by the fact that their reliability means that you don't need parts very often (stay away from gravel roads or put 10 layers of PPF on your windshield).

As I see it, the benefits to buying a 2020 RLX Sport Hybrid are:
1. You will feel at home/comfortable immediately with all the controls exactly where you are used to them being.
2. You can likely be assured of the same trouble-free ownership experience as your current RLX.
3. You will continue to enjoy the quiet, smooth ride while still being able to enjoy the exceptional acceleration and handling if you choose to push things a bit and have some fun.
4. Your passengers will continue to enjoy the roominess of the RLX - that amount of space in the back seat is getting more and more rare.
5. You will continue to enjoy your car without others looking at you like you are flaunting your standing in society (ie continue to enjoy the stealth wealth that the RLX provides). It is the nicest car you can drive without looking like you're a "rich prick" or someone who is trying to look like a "rich prick".
6. You will continue to enjoy the exclusivity of the RLX Sport Hybrid (the "unicorn factor").
7. You will save a small fortune in purchase price AND servicing costs compared to the luxury German brands.

I can't speak from personal experience, but friends who drive any of the luxury German brands seem to spend a lot of time and an awful lot of money at the service centre. I think that you get treated better (ie. you get treated like a "rich prick") at the German brand service centres, but you also pay through the nose for the right to look down your nose at those servicing your vehicle.

That's my two cents. Good luck with your decision.

AP8ESQ

Thanks for the insight. I don’t care much about the tech - honestly I dont use really anything other than bluetooth for the phone and the nav has always gotten me where I want to go. Also don’t care about my image - I know what I am and where I stand in society (hint: not high at all!) and can do without the maintenance costs of the germans. I had an E550 before and $400.00 for an oil change/ annual service is ridiculous (and that was 6 years ago…). I think the biggest thing is the potential time bomb of the newer twin turbo supercharged mild hybrid engines that are showing up in all the competitors. I love the interior design of the S6 and the exterior is appropriately understated to fit my lifestyle but potential issues abound which can cost serious money to repair.

I think the issue of Acura coming out with a new flagship is a little concerning but I am not really on board with the current interior design direction (phone charger in the middle of the console?) but would like to see the new MDX digital cockpit in something along the lines of an RLX. However, that is about the only “cool” feature (aside from carplay) that I would want.

hondamore

Totally unrelated to your reply, but in re-reading my post, it could come across as saying that all German luxury car drivers are snobs. This is not at all what I meant to say. My point was that the Acura RLX Sport Hybrid is not viewed by the masses as a vehicle for the elite but is still, for the most part, viewed as a "really nice Honda" and Honda is synonymous with affordable, safe, reliable vehicles. Those two facts combine to place the RLX smack in the middle of the affordable, reliable, sensible, luxury car category regardless of the level of fit and finish or performance that Acura produces. In fact, the RLX's lack of "cache" or "prestige" or "stature" is in large part responsible for the poor sales numbers which has been discussed on this forum ad nauseam. The average person is more impressed by a $30,000 Mercedes C-class than a $60,000 Acura RLX Sport Hybrid, mostly because of the long history of making vehicles for the Uber-rich that Mercedes has enjoyed and exploited over the years. The benefit of Acura's lack of snob appeal, is that owners wishing to drive a very nice car with excellent amenities and excellent performance, can do so without fear of being judged by society as being elitist. That is what I meant as stealth wealth.

Just a point I thought that I should clarify.

AP8ESQ

I’m with ya and it didn’t come off like that. Personally, in building a few cars in my due diligence (540; E450) I am shocked that a 60k BMW or MB come with leatherette seats unless you pay to upgrade to leather. Seems to me that “snob” or not that just doesn’t make a lot of sense for that type of money - but then again some people are just dead set on having the badge as opposed to their money. I think I’ll take the RLX fully loaded any day and let the masses continue to not know what it is…

mrgold35

The 18-20 RLX hybrids didn't have any updated/upgrades during those model years. Just a different Kelley Blue Book value only between the model years. I would test drive an +18 RLX hybrid to see if the updated tech and suspension is what you want for X amount of years. The suspensions is really luxury car soft compared to the sporty powertrain and exterior styling. My MDX hybrid has a more sporty suspension with the different IDS modes and electronic dampers. You can't beat the RLX ride if you like to cruise with the extra noise isolation, quiet powertrain, and Krell audio system.

AP8ESQ

Thanks - ironically enough one of the two I have my eyes on is the same color as your wife’s. I just wish they made a fathom blue with black interior. I remember they made a similar combo in the 2005-06 RL but I couldn’t afford it at the time. How’s the maintenance on keeping the red clean? I would likely ceramic or graphite coat the 20 if I pick it up (current one is ceramic coated so pretty easy to keep clean-ish with the silver paint).

mrgold35

I had a very hard time finding a RLX hybrid in the red/ebony. I could only find 2018 models in that color combo when I was looking back in the fall of 2019. I'm planning to keep our 18 RLX for around 10 yrs/150,000 miles. Decided to go all out and put XPEL Ultimate PPF on the entire painted surface along with Ceramic Pro on the PPF, windows, and interior. I also added Exoshield PPF to the front windshield to help with chips and pitting. I purchased the RLX CPO in Dec/19 and it had A LOT of spiderweb swirl marks in the paint from either the dealership or mechanical car wash. The red look extremely nice now with the color correction and PPF to lock in the shine. Clean-up is extremely easy in around 30 mins with my hose mounted foam cannon and micro fiber wash mitt and microfiber drying towels (always home washed).

Accessories for the RLX are probably in very limited supplies or on a very long back order. I would work into the deal accessories you want like spare tire kit, splash guards, or rear spoiler (if buying from an Acura dealership). Those things will be gone forever pretty soon.

rlx015

Hope to help with my couple of pennies considering I recently acquired '18 RLX SH and had 06 RL for 10 years before that.
While I opened the option of german cars, I fairly quickly dismissed it because of the maintenance... IMHO in the US you are looked at as rich not what car you have, but what car can you maintain (LOL)

When I got my '18 RLX SH, there was a total of around 60 on the market (used/certified/new) - (source: Autotrader/CarGurus) ... so right now, those numbers are less than half (Autotrader has 24, CarGurus 18 total) ... therefore, you must act quick whichever year to elect to get.
The best is to test drive it and compare it to your car... paid-off car is always better than a loan but does your current car give you what the new one will... if the upgrade is worth enough I'd say go for it... If it's too similar, keep that in mind...

I can tell you that my 06 RL was still driving just fine, did 2nd timing belt, no issues, and made a move to '18 RLX SH ... I foresee the next 5 years be very challenging to find even a similar car to RLX SH... electrification wise, it will not become mainstream for a fairly long time - that is a fact... So I am leaning towards recommending getting the newer RLX SH but definitely keep timing in mind: you may need to compromise to get '18 or '19 if 2020 is not available or too expensive. I would say count in getting Acura Care warranty for 18 or 19 when the time is right so you are covered

neuronbob

I got sucked back into the 2020 RLX SH after piddling around in a TLX for a few years, then a fabulous manual Accord sedan.

If you want CarPlay/Android Auto, that's no longer an issue with the Grom VLine...and it even has wireless CarPlay!

For me, the biggest difference between the 2014 and the 2018-20 is that all 18-20 SHs are Advance package...so 360 degree cameras. Let me tell you...I didn't know how much I needed the 360 degree cameras until I started using them. Ride quality is a bit softer than the 2014, as well, and the trigger point for torque vectoring is a bit higher (ie you need more loud pedal and more steering angle to feel it kick in). The 18-20 also come with automatic high beams, which I think are really useful. Overall, I think it's worth the upgrade, AND if you can find a 2020, you get the best year of all given all the fixes of the previous years are built in.

I got into an essentially new "used" SH for $43k, so the deal I got was part of the reason I pounced, instead of my original plan of waiting for the TLX Type S. I'm not sorry I didn't wait.

jdpdata

I'll chime in that GROM VLINE2 has remedied all of Acura's Infotainment shortfall for me. The car is near perfect now with it installed. With Wireless Android Auto now working with VL2, I find it more enjoyable using the RLX for shorter trips without having to plug-in USB cable. Start the car, within 30 secs WAA is started every single time without a hitch.

As others have mentioned, if you want '18-20 RLX-SH, better hurry up. Very few are still available across the US. You may have to settle for color you don't want and may have to buy from another state. I was lucky to find a locally available 2020 RLX-SH with only 4100 miles last October. Didn't like the white color but for I grabbed it quick as the asking price was too good to pass up. Good luck with the search!

AP8ESQ

Thanks all for the input. At this point I am leaning towards making the move. Both the ones I am looking at are 2020 in the 5k mile range on the clock. One is available at an Acura dealer in NJ and the other (priced ridiculously low - 43k) is at a mercedes dealer in Boston so either would just be a half day trip to document and drive off the lot. What’s the deal with acura care - can I tack that onto the car even if not purchased at an Acura dealer? The other is CPO (I think) so I do not know if it would be necessary on that one.

Like JP - I am a little hesitant with the colors (one is red, the other black) and I would much rather a modern steel over ebony but at this point one of those may not hit the market while mileages are still acceptably (to me) low. The other option is just to keep my 2014 and hope something else is released in the next few years.

I did look at the TLX Type S as well but it just didn’t do it for me for the price. Just felt “undermarket” in the interior but that could be the last 5 years in a RLX…

jdpdata

You can buy Acura Care at anytime before your factory warranty expires at 48mos/50K miles. I just purchase Acura Care for our 2017 MDX this morning from Curry's Acura. That's the dealer in NY that most people on here recommends. Their quote is at least 50% lower than any local dealers around me in SoCal. You can buy Acura Care from any Acura Dealer, doesn't have to be your local selling dealer.

As for the color, personally I'd pick Red over Black. I owned a black 2006 350Z for 6 mos. Couldn't stand all the swirl marks and water stains. Traded in for a 2006 4Runner, dark green color. Never again I will own a dark color car. Go with which ever is CPO'd so you can get 7/100K warranty. You won't need to worry about warranty for awhile with CPO. I say $43K is little high. Both Dr. Bob and I got our cars for around $43K many months ago. I got a bunch of accessories thrown into the deal too. Check out the "Owner's sign in" sub-forum for prices people paid for their RLX-SH. I know the Used car market is super hot right now, but still. This car is not very popular at all. Use that to your advantage. Good luck!

neuronbob

Go red! I’m surprised at how well it hides dirt compared to black. It’s not as dirt-hiding as silver, but shockingly good.

mrgold35

I have to put my 2 cents in and vote for red also:

AP8ESQ

Man you guys are a bunch of enablers. The black looks sinister but I think the red is winning out at this point… I am going to see if there is a deal to be made on that one tomorrow morning. The problem is the dealer has it listed for crazy money (62k). Basically, I will tell them I will pay no more than 45k plus tax and title (and they have to throw in the splash guards and transfer my spare tire kit from my current car to the new one). I already have the all weather mats so those are about the only accessories I want (unless they want to throw some ceramic tints in the mix…)

Thanks again

jdpdata

$45K +TTL is too much for a used 2020 RLX-SH imo. But if that includes CPO that's within the ballpark. I'd start negotiation at $42K+TTL and go up from there. Splash guard is nothing, they should be able to throw that in for free. Are you doing a trade-in as well? Figure that into your deal as well.

neuronbob

They want $62k (ie new car money) for a RLX with 5k miles on it? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL they'd better put down the crack pipe. No wonder it's one of the few left.

I'd start at $42k and aim for $43-4k. Even $45k is not too bad IMO.

AP8ESQ

That’s what I am thinking. I do not need or have to buy a newer car - I just want to before they all disappear. At the end of the day mine has 10 years left in it (easily) with no payments and minimal maintenance for at least 2 more years before the timing belt service. I have no problem putting my number on the table as a take it or leave it. If they take it - we have a deal, if not then thanks for your time and have a nice day.

At the end of the day, I am just as good with getting the black one for $15k less and spending a couple grand on paint correction; graphene or ceramic coating and wrapping the whole car if need be. Would still be saving money over making a bad deal just for the red because it is an “easier” color to take care of and a bit more pleasing to the eyes.

neuronbob

I saw that black one near you. That's probably the move as the price is already excellent.

The red one...Toss down $42k and if they say "no, we want $62k", say "seeya". Note: The picture of the clock screen indicates 11/14/2020...that may be how long it's been taking up floor space at that dealership. The trees are bare in those pics, too, so....it was fall when those pics were taken.

https://images.autotrader.com/border...3f68bdd166.jpg

Go get 'em!

jdpdata

I wouldn't even buy a brand new one for $62K. That's the biggest problem with this car. It's DOA with that asking price. But to get one at mid $40K, hellz ya.

hondamore

This has always been my approach to car purchase negotiations. If you clearly set a maximum price you are willing to pay in a non-adversarial way and are clearly willing to walk away from the car, the salesperson is now working for you because he/she doesn't get paid without a deal and the deal doesn't happen unless they can get their sales manager to sign off on your price. I find the usual initial reaction is laughter, followed by an attempt at cajoling you out of more money, then rejection, followed a few days or weeks later by a counter-offer close to the maximum price, followed a few weeks or months later with acceptance of the maximum price and the celebration and driving a new car.

Unfortunately, in this case, you may not have several weeks or months to wait. The ace up their sleeve that the dealership has at this time is the rarity of the car and the cessation of production. Your approach of reminding them you don't absolutely need a newer car and that you love your current RLX Sport Hybrid and are willing to drive it for another few years as it is basically the same car, is brilliant and should minimize that advantage. There will always be Sport Hybrids popping up on the used car market here and there over time. I like to use the phrase, "you need to sell it more than I need to buy it" to sum up those points.

Your timing of presenting an offer at the end of the month is perfect as the salesperson, sales manager and even the dealership owner love to pad the monthly sales report and get the nice commission or bonus that accompanies doing so. If things do drag out until the end of September and the padding of the quarterly sales report is fresh in their minds, then even better. Unfortunately, dragging things out that long in this instance greatly increases the likelihood of the car being scooped up by another sensible luxury car buyer.

I guess all of that long-winded crap was just my way of saying good luck.

chaiwala

I used to have a 2016 RLX SH and now have a 2021 Lexus ES300h and I definitely prefer the ES300h over the RLX. Better tech and also fit and finish. Just my $0.02.

jdpdata

Two very different class of cars. 2016 RLX-SH should be compared to 2016 Lexus GS450h. I much prefer the Acura 7DCT to the Lexus CVT. For me personally, I had a 2015 Lexus GS350, I didn't want another Lexus. The new 2021 ES looks very nice, like a mini LS sedan. I always mixed them up.

rlx015

Couple of things I strongly advise you to verify and confirm:

1. Boston, Massachusets - State does not offer temporary license plates!!! This means if you are financing you will not be able to drive it off the lot because dealer won't release the car without it being registered - that is what I was told when I was on my way to MS to buy RLX SH... turned around and went home... If you are paying cash and coming with the trailer to take the car, that may be the only option you have if your heart is set on getting that RLX SH there... I assume this is the Boston one you were looking at?
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=305867254

Note: keep in mind, 2020 model with less than 6k miles gets the option to buy 8yr long Acura Care warranty last time I checked

2. Car and Driver reported that if you are buying a car in New Jersey, you must pay NJ taxes regardless if you are in-state OR out-of-state... meaning, if you are not from NJ, you may be stuck paying double the tax: in NJ and then your state you are from.
Here are the details:
https://www.caranddriver.com/researc...car-sales-tax/

Good luck!!!!!!! BTW if you are excited, you should be!!! 18-20 RLX SH is a heck of a car!!!

hondamore

In response to chaiwala.
Lexus do make a nice interior, but remember that you are comparing a 6 year old car to a new car. From a performance standpoint, the RLX Sport Hybrid will run circles around the ES300H. A quick search shows the 0-60 time for the ES300h to be between 7.8 to 8.1 seconds. Compared to the RLX Sport Hybrid's 4.8 - 5.2 seconds, the entire fun factor is taken away and passing on the highway suddenly becomes sketchy instead of effortless. Also take away the Super Handling AWD technology and the handling would be too "Camry-like" for my taste.

All of that said, some people put a premium on having the latest tech features in a car and the RLX is certainly not going to win that battle (although with the VGROM addition it can at least get in the ballpark).

mrgold35

It surprised me the first time I passed an 18 wheeler on a 2 lane road in the RLX soon after purchase. I started at 70-75 mph, floored it, and I was doing around 115 mph when I pass the semi. I'll take that over Carplay all day, every day.

rlx015

I second JDPData point out - these are two different car classes... not truly comparable.
One thing I did notice where Lexus is better is overall interior material quality when compared LS460 vs 18-20 RLX SH ... but the pricing on Lexus sky-high comparing main spec features etc.
Everything else IMHO RLX takes the cake

2020 RLX SH - AWD
`45k brand new roughly is the average price people pay
Specs:
v6 hybrid - 377hp
7 spd dual-clutch transmission
~5 sec to 60mph or less
Curb weight is 4,380 lbs
Three-zone AC


2021 Lexus ES 300H - FWD (no AWD option unless you have 250h)
300h ultra-luxury goes well into low $50k
Specs:
2.5 inline 4cyl hybrid - 215hp
CVT transmission
~ ? sec to 60mph or less
Curb weight is: 3,730 Lbs
Two-zone AC

jdpdata

We all know the RLX-SH has well over 400hp and probably 400+lbft torque. It's a beast on the highway. Always makes me grin ear-to-ear every time I pound that pedal. It's a great overall package for mid $40K. Nothing else out there right now can beat it for this price range.

neuronbob

Sport Mode is singularly entertaining in this car. I don’t use it often, but when I do….

psheu

I'm one of the first few upgraded from brand new 2016 advance SHAWD RLX (leased) to brand new 2020 advance SHAWD RLX (purchased). Best decision ever made. No cars out there that'll give the same satisfaction as the SH RLX.

AP8ESQ

Well - called the dealer in Boston this afternoon and the car is sold. I also talked to the dealer in NJ beforehand and told them the number I would be willing to pay (max price out the door 45K less trade) and was told they couldn’t get close. I had a very productive discussion with the salesperson and directed her attention to the ad for the Boston one (before I knew it was sold) as an example of market price. She spoke to the sales manager and called me back that they could move downwards but not as far as would be necessary to make a deal. I thanked her and said if they are willing to compromise further to give me a call.

So for now I guess the upgrade is on hold until another low mileage example hits the market. Maybe I should just go put mine in sport and drop her to M1 at the first red light I encounter to soothe the fomo on that deal up in Boston.

Thanks for all the opinions/ advice.

jdpdata

Don't get too emotionally attached. Another deal with come along. Might not be the color or mileage you want, but this car is not popular at all. Someone will trade-in their RLX-SH for a TLX-S in a few months.

phile

^ id call that person a fool. the tlx-s doesn’t interest me at all. I’ve blown away a few regular TLX’s on the highway. The RLX is truly a sleeper.

jdpdata

Previous owner of my RLX-SH was such a fool. According to the salesman, he traded in his RLX-SH (my current car) only after 8mos of ownership and put on only 4100 miles for a ILX because he was annoyed it doesn't have a button to turn off engine idle stop. The car was in mint condition, not a scratch when I purchased it last Oct. He probably bought it at full sticker price of $62.9K back in Jan 2020. I bought it 8 mos later for $43.5K. Talk about taking a depreciation hit in the arse! But who knows, Covid was happening during the time. Maybe the dude died and his wife sold the car. Whatever the reason, I'm ecstatic to be owner of this car.

hondamore

Chin up AP8ESQ, good things come to those that wait. I think if you give the NJ dealer a call again in a week or two to "check in" to see how things are going and see if they can get closer to your number, that there still may be a deal to be made. Once they realize that you aren't going to budge on price (it may take a few more weeks and a few more "check in" calls), they may just bite the bullet and meet your price demands.

I am confident that a 2020 RLX Sport Hybrid is out there looking for you and destiny will bring you together. Good luck

neuronbob

NO WAY. Did he not understand what he was driving?

@AP8ESQ , sorry to hear! The NJ dealership is going to be sitting on that RLX-SH a long time, or until a sucker decides to pay what they are asking. I'll keep my CarGurus and AutoTempest RLX searches active for you.

AP8ESQ

Thanks - I run the searches nightly and throw in autotrader as well. Maybe something shows up that fits the parameters and maybe not at least I have the 2014 to have fun with in the interim!

rlx015

Something I forgot to add: if you are "hunting" for RLX SH, be ready to jump. Here is my brief personal experience of what I did... Found the car and it was in Ft Worth, TX (1050 miles away): called the dealer, it was still available, negotiated the price over the phone on the spot, completed dealer financing application (for the sake of assurance they will hold the car as I was coming from IL) and gave my deposit (dealer never charged any deposit after my application went through no problem). That was Wed at 11 am the morning... right after, found tickets - way for my wife and me to fly out to TX that afternoon. By 7 pm we were in Ft Worth, TX... spent a night, and in the morning (Thursday) went to the dealer. Completed paperwork, drove the car back to IL.
In this case, it was a 2018 certified RLX SH with 26k miles so I was confident it will be good on a test drive (as it was) and made a decision to buy it after the test drive.... if the car was not good, I was ready to forfeit about $500 for flight, hotel, food, but all factors made me assured risk was lesser and I should jump on it

mrgold35

Sound exactly like my experience and trip when picking up my 18 RLX hybrid from leaving my home in Albuquerque, NM, to purchase in Sacramento, CA, (flew into San Jose, one way car rental to Sacramento). This was before the RLX was discontinued, before COVID, every Acura dealership had 1-5 new/used RLXs on the lot. and RLX's were the "red headed step child" of Acura and all other luxury sedans.