lbotez

http://www.autonews.com/article/2016...IL05/160419943

Hard to believe...

lbotez

glad I got my rental car, and I like it. My other Acura, 2002 TL, probably doesn't have side airbags, and had the airbag work done twice. What a nightmare!

fsmith

Uh-oh. Here comes the rest of it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/04/bu...ag-recall.html

TampaRLX-SH

Dunno yet if the RLX is on the list...yet.

But this wave of recalls includes the Flintstone's-mobile.

ceb

I posted this on the RDX forum earlier today:

https://acurazine.com/forums/second-.../#post15745186

TampaRLX-SH

Massive Takata Airbag Recall: Everything You Need to Know ? News ? Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog

AFFECTED VEHICLES:

Acura: 2002–2003, 2009–2014 TL; 2003 CL; 2003–2006 MDX; 2005–2012 Acura RL; 2007–2016 RDX; 2010–2013 ZDX; 2013–2016 ILX

lbotez

Pretty sure that's the previous recall.... they are still compiling the list...

R. White

Rlx ?

TampaRLX-SH

No. Not yet anyway. FWIW my tech tells me the RLX does not have Takata airbags. I have not been able to verify that with any parts / manufacturer reference. But should I find that type of evidence, I will post it.

The link I posted above to the Car & Driver does include the current models up to the latest expansion. Why I posted that link is that it is a living C&D Blog and is updated daily for those who wish to monitor additions to the recall. Further it includes legislative and manufacturer actions / reactions. Scroll through that list of entries,,,,it is huge.

What caught my eye is the latest NHTSA decision that will likely recall all ammonium nitrate airbags:

"UPDATE 5/6/2016, 12:30 p.m.: Senators Richard Blumenthal (D-Conn.) and Edward Markey (D-Mass.) have demanded that NHTSA release the entire list of car models with ammonium-nitrate propellant."

Does anyone know if ammonium nitrate was exclusive to Takata? Per Wikipedia "SRS airbag suppliers include Autoliv, Daicel, Takata , TRW and KSS."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag

George Knighton

It's becoming more difficult finding desirable rental cars around DC, because the Honda and Acura dealers are still providing rental cars to owners who are nervous about continuing to drive their cars until the airbag can be refitted.

ceb

Yes, Takata is the only manufacturer using ammonium nitrate.

TampaRLX-SH

That should be good news, if that is even possible in this mess. How did you determine this? I still have yet to verify the RLX does not have Takata airbags.

I spoke with the person who purchased my RL. He was just scheduled for the airbag replacement in June. He has chosen not to take a rental as his wife works from home and one car serves them fine. When they asked to purchase my RL the first thing she said was 'I am glad it is not on that airbag recall list.

Although it only had 58K miles when I sold it, being 10 years old, in Florida heat and humility (now in Dallas) I would be uncomfortable. I think I would have kept it in my garage and toyed with a few loaners. Each time I drive a rental and am out of my own car for travel, I ever more appreciate my car afterwards.

TampaRLX-SH

Crap. Just minutes later I stumble on this:

Toyota, Nissan join Honda in Takata air bag snub

"•Honda. Three existing models — the 2016 Honda CR-V, 2016 Acura RDX and 2016 Acura RLX — have Takata inflators. The CR-V has one on the driver's-side airbag, while both Acura models have Takata passenger-side inflators."

Malibu Flyer

So you are Ok as long as no one rides in the passenger seat.

I need to go put my VIN into the website. It seems strange that the drivers side air bag is different than the passenger side. Also, strange that they don't reference the 2014 or 2015 RLXs since the interior design seems identical to the 2016s. I'm not going to complain that I have a 2014 model, although the air bag "advantage" pales in comparison to the 2014 infotainment system.

TampaRLX-SH

Although the RLX is not part of the recall,,,,yet - it does raise more questions such as yours Malibu.

My guess (and hope) is that our cars were built after Honda and Takata knew of the problem and perhaps had already made new designs sans ammonium nitrate. But it does not clarify if they are not ammonia nitrate inflators or not. Or....the trickle of the ever expanding recall just has yet to hit the RLX.

So far the fatality stats have involved 2002 and earlier car models. And stats for pax side airbags is artificially low, as an operating car must have a driver (for now anyway) but not a pax. So that does not necessarily mean the pax side airbags are unaffected, they just have not deployed as much as driver bags. It skews the stats. There are vehicles of various manufacturers in the recall for pax airbags as well.

Considering the scope of this recall (largest in automotive history), the costs and inconveniece (leave your car on a dealer lot for 3-4 months - ah, no) and the anxiety for many, I find it typical bureaucracy that you cannot easily determine which manufacturer your car's airbags originated. And I find this as much as a NHTSA and Fed failing as Takata, Honda and affected car manufacturers. If the Feds are going to create consumer anxiety in the guise of consumer protection they can easily mandate information is made available to the consumer, even if the response solution cannot be instantaneous. Lack of information causes more fear and anxiety than does reality.

There is no reason, at this point the driving public cannot go to the NHTSA website and get the following details:

1. The airbag manufacturer used for all makes and models. If multiple suppliers per model, they DO know which VINS map to which airbag installation.

2. Of the above, which airbags were made with ammonium nitrate? (If indeed Takata is the only ammonia nitrate user) It is possible recent year Takata bags began transitioning away from that propellant an may be out of scope. Takata testified in 2014 it suspected ammonium notrate, but when testifying again in 2015 they were STILL using it.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2015...ate-in-airbags

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/20/bu...of-crisis.html

These geniuses have also determined that temperature swings affect the volatility of the propellant, not alone heat & humidity exposure. So you snow belt folks, rest easy. EXCEPT, when you get in your 30F cold car, what do you do? You turn on the HEAT to 70F. What is that?.... a temperature swing. Same for hot climates and AC use.

Since the Feds are expanding the recall based on ammoium nitrate bags, they should better define how the consumer can determine if they are affected and decide how they wish to proceed. But the politicians are more motivated in kicking up dust to draw attention to themselves then public service. In fact, they add to public anxiety.

If we can order a $1 thingy for any make model and year from car part providers, there is NO reason we cannot go to NHTSA's website or other and enter make, model, year or VIN and see which airbags are in my car AND do any of my car's airbags have ammonium nitrate inflators? That data is ALREADY obtainable. But manufacturers prefer not to expose that info until mandated and the Feds would likely turn it into another healthcare.org fiasco.

So the RLX is not recalled...yet. But we should be able to determine that likely hood before the slow turning wheels of this process build more distrust of both manufacturing and supposed protective agency.

This draws parallel to the Flint water crisis. Fed & Water agency: We know you are being poisoned. We do not know yet how much you are poisoned. We know very little poison can permanently damage your health and your offspring. We do not know yet how much poison it will take to kill you. So until we do, go ahead and keep drinking the water.

pgeorg

The part numbers for the driver's and passenger's airbags are the same for the 2014 and 2016 RLX SH.......

Malibu Flyer

I guess we will eventually get to the bottom of the issue but news such as this doesn't give me much comfort.

George Knighton

American Honda is spending $1.6 millions...per day(!!!)...on rental vehicles.

0_0

lbotez

ouch!

hadokenuh

Yet, people are still not happy with their rentals and how Honda has been treating them lol

R. White

The paperwork indicates that Acura is paying $30 per day for the rental we have. The local Enterprise location is having trouble getting cars.

fsmith

At $30/day, that's about 50,000 cars that have taken up the rental offer. Are these rentals only being offered for Acuras, or for all Hondas? If all Hondas, that's a pretty small percentage of recalled cars. Even if only Acuras, it's a small percentage. I guess most people just don't bother. On the other hand, 50,000 rentals taken out of the normal rental market sounds like a lot.

R. White

Today, the Acura dealer called to report that they had received some parts and they would send a flat bed truck to pick up the TL.

It was actually nice to have a big Hyundai SUV for a month for Spring cleaning. I hope the RLX is not next though !

R. White

With the fees and taxes added, the rental cost was $43 per day.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

I would think that at a corporate level none of the manufacturers are paying out of pocket for the rentals since it was a supplier issue. I would think the supplier would likely get the tab in the end, providing they don't go Chapter 11 first. That to me is the biggest threat to the auto industry since it is one supplier that is providing the part(s).

TampaRLX-SH

Partly, but much of this falls under liability to the consumer. Insurance of the manufacturer and parts supplier initially picks up the bill, then they mitigate collections from the parties involved with years of lawsuits, further inflating the cost. But ultimately WE will pay for it all. It may come in the form of higher sticker prices, some made up tacked on fee or a lien on your bank account (and several generations of your offspring).

George Knighton

Exactly.

I don't have any idea that Honda are getting the money back.

The dealers are paying for the rentals directly and being re-imbursed quickly, according to mine. Their money's coming from Honda.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Tampa you are right that ultimately the consumer pays the bill in the form of higher prices, just like all the free stuff politicians like to talk about people getting ultimately comes from higher taxes in all areas. If you think about how much of a dollar going through the entire money supply, ends up getting taxed over and over again and it makes me crazy. Just to buy anything at all and consider how much every component cost and the taxes paid in every step of the manufacturing and transportation of that product and I think the figure is like greater than 90% of it being related to covering taxes of all sorts starting with the raw material extraction to the delivery and use of any product at the end user level. If my figure is wrong it isn't by much as I remember reading that factoid somewhere but it was years ago and my memory is not what it used to be. Sorry for the run-on sentence.

TampaRLX-SH

Toyota just announced a 1.6 million vehicle recall for Takata PASSENGER SIDE airbags. So now it is creeping towards all Takata airbags and not just driver side.

I see this part of the trickle to phase in all Takata bags to the recalls. Right now Toyota's recall affects 2006 - 2011 vehicles, but I bet it will continue to newer vehicles over time.

This debacle must be welcomed by VW to take the spotlight of Diesel-gate.

TampaRLX-SH

Midday Honda announced and expansion of the Takata recall by 2.2 million.

June 6 we should know if our VIN is impacted. It specifies pax side airbags. I think it may be the RLX's time.

"Honda is recalling 4.5 million cars in the U.S. for defective Takata passenger-side frontal airbags, including 2700 motorcycles."

Honda Expanding Takata Airbag Recall by 2.2 Million Cars - News - Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog

ceb

Here's a great timelime and summary of the Takata airbag debacle.


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/featur...air-bag-crisis

fsmith

Wife's 2014 TL had its driver's side Takata airbag inflator replaced today, so I guess they are beginning to catch up on replacements. Did not have a rental.