Is it just me??
05-09-2008, 07:08 AM
#1
Is it just me??
Good morning everyone,
I was just wondering if its just me but it seems that the love for the 2nd generation of TSX is starting to bloom
I remember at first, most were bashing Honda/Acura for the poor design, the increased size jthis and that....but as people get to see it more and more, get a chance to test drive it, I notice most peope are starting to get used to it and are appreciating the new generation. I know that the "front grill" still need to be improved and additional choice in engine choice are a must...but I think if a Diesel or V6 (with SH-AWD) were available right away and a different grill, this car would be a major success!
We are almost there and I think that the only thing that will not occur will be the new grill design going away soon as its coming out on the new TL as well.
I am happy I put my name down on PWP with body kit!!
Anyway, just wanted to share what I have been noticing as I read all the various posting and how people are coming around to it...
I was just wondering if its just me but it seems that the love for the 2nd generation of TSX is starting to bloom
I remember at first, most were bashing Honda/Acura for the poor design, the increased size jthis and that....but as people get to see it more and more, get a chance to test drive it, I notice most peope are starting to get used to it and are appreciating the new generation. I know that the "front grill" still need to be improved and additional choice in engine choice are a must...but I think if a Diesel or V6 (with SH-AWD) were available right away and a different grill, this car would be a major success!We are almost there and I think that the only thing that will not occur will be the new grill design going away soon as its coming out on the new TL as well.
I am happy I put my name down on PWP with body kit!!
Anyway, just wanted to share what I have been noticing as I read all the various posting and how people are coming around to it...
05-09-2008, 07:59 AM
#3
Senior Moderator
Not just you.
While I have no plans to buy one, more power could bring me into the fold.
Couldn't agree more. And with rumors of the TL being a great looking car with a drive train to back it up. And the TSX likely getting a V6. things are definitely looking up!.
While I have no plans to buy one, more power could bring me into the fold.
but I think if a Diesel or V6 (with SH-AWD) were available right away and a different grill, this car would be a major success!
05-09-2008, 08:04 AM
#4
dom...I am not sure if the TL will win the love of all the people when it come out. The current model is pretty hard to improve on and I was holding off until the 09 TL came out too to make up my mind but decided to go for the TSX after all. I really didn't need more power, the current improvement will suffice for me, and the new TL...well, its not for me. Some say its a beautiful car, from what I seen, I am not that confident..
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05-09-2008, 09:20 AM
#8
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by 09TSX
I have not seen the car in the flesh, you are right but I did see something (and not that chopped TSX from car and driver....
05-09-2008, 09:36 AM
#9
LuvMyTSX....I think most people have been really good at keeping this under wrap, not sure why and how, but they have. I did have the chance to see a few things on the TL but not sure I like what I saw. I am sure that it will look better in person but I didn't get excited and said...Gotta have this! I must say that when the current generation of TL came out, it was love at first sight for me, alhough I always felt the car was bigger than what I needed.
05-09-2008, 10:01 AM
#10
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Originally Posted by LuvMyTSX
I'm honestly very surprised that there hasn't been some kind of leak of the TL. I know the dealers had their dealer meeting and saw the new TL. I just find it hard to believe that even one person hasn't leaked anything yet.
05-09-2008, 10:02 AM
#11
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Originally Posted by 09TSX
LuvMyTSX....I think most people have been really good at keeping this under wrap, not sure why and how, but they have. I did have the chance to see a few things on the TL but not sure I like what I saw. I am sure that it will look better in person but I didn't get excited and said...Gotta have this! I must say that when the current generation of TL came out, it was love at first sight for me, alhough I always felt the car was bigger than what I needed.
05-09-2008, 10:05 AM
#12
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by prballard
A sales manager that saw the 09 TL told me they made them give them their cell phones at the door just in case someone decided to sneak a pic.
05-09-2008, 10:14 AM
#13
Make a hole, coming thru!
Back to the topic ... I feel the love, and appreciate that many nay-sayers were reacting to 2nd hand and 3rd hand information. Now that the car is out, many reviews (or "first drives") are available, TOV has dyno'ed it, and members here are driving it (and even buying it 
), clearly it's not the ugly duckling some thought it was. There are clearly many improvements inside and out. I think many of us are adapting to new, and more, information. It's a familiar tune....
And some of the chief complaints seem to arise from what it's not, rather than what is there (the "element" being a notable exception which divides people).
), clearly it's not the ugly duckling some thought it was. There are clearly many improvements inside and out. I think many of us are adapting to new, and more, information. It's a familiar tune.... And some of the chief complaints seem to arise from what it's not, rather than what is there (the "element" being a notable exception which divides people).
05-09-2008, 10:18 AM
#14
davidspalding...Great point! It is nice to see that people are now starting to come around to the New TSX and hopefully sales will also pick up. I think Acura/Honda will not invest further development if they felt the model didn't survive. If this generation picks up and sales are as good as the previous generation was (especially earlier on), hopefully they'll fund further development and add goodies to this baby
05-09-2008, 12:02 PM
#15
> 100K Mile Club Member
I think looks are always something that can "grow on you". I think folks are becoming more comfortable with the look. I for one have always felt ok about the design. While there are a few elements (no pun intended) I would like to see change, there are others that I think are spot on.
People's opinions on how the car drives and the performance numbers are not going to change. This is where I have a problem. Now, if they come out with a V6 and SH-AWD I would be likely to look hard at the car with a body kit (as that addresses some of my exterior issues). But at this moment I don't understand why anyone with a 1st gen would trade for this car. It has nothing more to offer than a few amenities (which is what Acura is good at).
People's opinions on how the car drives and the performance numbers are not going to change. This is where I have a problem. Now, if they come out with a V6 and SH-AWD I would be likely to look hard at the car with a body kit (as that addresses some of my exterior issues). But at this moment I don't understand why anyone with a 1st gen would trade for this car. It has nothing more to offer than a few amenities (which is what Acura is good at).
05-09-2008, 12:04 PM
#16
CLS 6MT Navi
I never was interested in the TSX, had a loaner G1 and it was okay but I preferred my CLS. But now the new TSX is getting some of my attention because I want a new Acura, (prefer a coupe but oh well) smaller car, better mpg, and lots of tech goodies like DVD-A. Was shopping a used RL but I really want a smaller car. Not crazy about the styling and some entry level aspects but overall it has lots to offer if you want smaller than the new bigger TL, or RL.
I actually prefer the styling of the G1, sleeker, more refined and less gimmmicky.
I actually prefer the styling of the G1, sleeker, more refined and less gimmmicky.
05-09-2008, 12:32 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by 123456SPEED
I never was interested in the TSX, had a loaner G1 and it was okay but I preferred my CLS. But now the new TSX is getting some of my attention because I want a new Acura, (prefer a coupe but oh well) smaller car, better mpg, and lots of tech goodies like DVD-A. Was shopping a used RL but I really want a smaller car. Not crazy about the styling and some entry level aspects but overall it has lots to offer if you want smaller than the new bigger TL, or RL.
I actually prefer the styling of the G1, sleeker, more refined and less gimmmicky.
I actually prefer the styling of the G1, sleeker, more refined and less gimmmicky.
I'm so glad we bought the wifes 07 tsx. Just sucks because I'm not really interested in the 09 tsx for myself...but I too want a smaller car than my CL-S.
05-09-2008, 12:52 PM
#18
Make a hole, coming thru!
Originally Posted by TSXinTN
But at this moment I don't understand why anyone with a 1st gen would trade for this car. It has nothing more to offer than a few amenities (which is what Acura is good at).
It's perfectly valid to personally really want a turbo, or V6, or AWD, but don't ignore what HAS changed to make your argument. It doesn't hold.
Originally Posted by 123456speed
I actually prefer the styling of the G1, sleeker, more refined and less gimmmicky.
05-09-2008, 01:11 PM
#19
well, for me, being an 06 automatic owner, I did notice an improvement significant enough (while drive it in sport mode) to make me want to upgrade. That and the fact the car provides a bit more interior room. I know the car hasn't changed that drastically and I am happy it didn't. It just chnaged enough for me to justify having another one I will admit that I am not an extremely spirited driver so the electric power steering does not negatively affect my decision....I know several people don't prefer this 'feel' and at first, I was one of those. After driving it a few times, I have gottent to enjoy it and sure comes in at low speed as I have never liked how stiff the steering felt at low speed, almost as if there was no power steering Is this car enough to compete with the BMW and Audi...No, not a chance when it comes to handling and performance. However, I dislike the inetrior of both these cars and I find the TSX is a good comprimise between luxuary and sportiness. Its all subjective....I know....
I will admit that I am not an extremely spirited driver so the electric power steering does not negatively affect my decision....I know several people don't prefer this 'feel' and at first, I was one of those. After driving it a few times, I have gottent to enjoy it and sure comes in at low speed as I have never liked how stiff the steering felt at low speed, almost as if there was no power steering Is this car enough to compete with the BMW and Audi...No, not a chance when it comes to handling and performance. However, I dislike the inetrior of both these cars and I find the TSX is a good comprimise between luxuary and sportiness. Its all subjective....I know....
05-09-2008, 01:20 PM
#20
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The diesel is a definite possibility with today's fuel prices.
VW will also be bringing one here this fall (again), but it's the new common-rail technology. 50ish mpg.
The TSX diesel is supposedly going to be out early next year, roughly 40 mpg in city driving.
VW will also be bringing one here this fall (again), but it's the new common-rail technology. 50ish mpg.
The TSX diesel is supposedly going to be out early next year, roughly 40 mpg in city driving.
05-09-2008, 01:24 PM
#21
Originally Posted by prballard
A sales manager that saw the 09 TL told me they made them give them their cell phones at the door just in case someone decided to sneak a pic.
05-09-2008, 01:27 PM
#22
Originally Posted by TSXinTN
I don't understand why anyone with a 1st gen would trade for this car. It has nothing more to offer than a few amenities (which is what Acura is good at).
05-09-2008, 01:27 PM
#23
Here is a question for you guys that know more about Diesel....Is the cost of maintenance more expensive with a Diesel? Things such as oil change, type of oil used etc... Here, Diesel is not necessarely cheaper than gasoline so sure, you getter mile per gallon but will other costs make the diesel still significantly more worth it? I assume todays diesel are much more quieter too.
05-09-2008, 01:28 PM
#24
> 100K Mile Club Member
Originally Posted by davidspalding
You're proving my point, actually. By ignoring the ECU re-tuning (vtec kick in, add'l torque), the new steering,... what else is new performance wise? ... you're making the car out to just be new looks with new amenities. It's not. The TOV dyno test makes this very clear.
It's perfectly valid to personally really want a turbo, or V6, or AWD, but don't ignore what HAS changed to make your argument. It doesn't hold.
It's perfectly valid to personally really want a turbo, or V6, or AWD, but don't ignore what HAS changed to make your argument. It doesn't hold.
Again my
05-09-2008, 01:29 PM
#25
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by 123456SPEED
and less gimmmicky.
How in the world was the first gen gimmicky? Can't wait for the explanation on this one.
IMO gimmicky is real time weather and traffic and USB ports and paddle shifters and one touch sunroof
well not that one but you get my point.
05-09-2008, 01:30 PM
#26
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Colin
They saw more than just the TL, they also saw prototypes of the next two releases after the TL. Everyone is sworn to secrecy and I'm not supposed to talk about this beyond the fact that a special meeting was held and a select few (including our GM) saw some exciting stuff.
My PM box is always open for you.
05-09-2008, 01:31 PM
#27
> 100K Mile Club Member
Originally Posted by Colin
Not to single you out, but I'm curious, what car did you come from before the TSX?
05-09-2008, 01:32 PM
#28
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by davidspalding
You're proving my point, actually. By ignoring the ECU re-tuning (vtec kick in, add'l torque), the new steering,... what else is new performance wise? ... you're making the car out to just be new looks with new amenities. It's not. The TOV dyno test makes this very clear.
Until I test drive one I can't say those things are insignificant but I can tell you it does look and sound that way. Especially if you're Joe Smith who doesn't even know what a dyno is.
05-09-2008, 01:33 PM
#29
> 100K Mile Club Member
Originally Posted by dom
How in the world was the first gen gimmicky? Can't wait for the explanation on this one.
IMO gimmicky is real time weather and traffic and USB ports and paddle shifters and one touch sunroof well not that one but you get my point.
IMO gimmicky is real time weather and traffic and USB ports and paddle shifters and one touch sunroof
well not that one but you get my point.
05-09-2008, 02:11 PM
#32
Originally Posted by TSXinTN
'98 Civic...before that '87 Accord.
G1 owners can move to a TL-S as many here have, or wait till the next TL arrives, or wait for a MMC. I can understand the disappointment, but please remember that there are some moving into the car that are going to be just as excited to move from their Civic as you were 5 years ago. IMHO, this community will be stronger if we allow them to enjoy their new purchases.
edit: FWIW, I disagree with your assertion that the steering is worse. It is light but, I love the faster ratio and cannot stand the slow steering on the '08. Just to illustrate that this is definitely a 'point of view' issue and not a 'statement of fact'
05-09-2008, 02:47 PM
#33
Colin....I agree with you. I remember how excited I was when I got my first TSX (coming from non japanese products) and I haven't looked back ever since. I think the TSX will offer a great experience for those acquiring their first TSX and to some of us, it will be enough to get us excited to get our second I think the other two models you were refeing earlier might bring out more 'sportiness' to the brand and positioning the TSX between the TL and the newer sportier (possibly) model that Acura might bring out. One has to wonder if it ain't something very similar to the sport4 concept that they might bring out. The TSX has been an AMAZING car and proof of this is how hard is it to improve upon it. I am glad I am getting the 09 despite some of the criticism about it. I understand some are disappointed in certain aspect but I think that once the initial disapointment wears off, the excitment will start again and we'll see more TSX owners trade their 1st gen for the second gen I see a trend already.....
PS..BTW, thanks for your great web site. It has helped me so much in being the first place where I could see the body kit on the 09 model and your reviews and videos are greatly appreciated...
I think the other two models you were refeing earlier might bring out more 'sportiness' to the brand and positioning the TSX between the TL and the newer sportier (possibly) model that Acura might bring out. One has to wonder if it ain't something very similar to the sport4 concept that they might bring out. The TSX has been an AMAZING car and proof of this is how hard is it to improve upon it. I am glad I am getting the 09 despite some of the criticism about it. I understand some are disappointed in certain aspect but I think that once the initial disapointment wears off, the excitment will start again and we'll see more TSX owners trade their 1st gen for the second gen I see a trend already.....PS..BTW, thanks for your great web site. It has helped me so much in being the first place where I could see the body kit on the 09 model and your reviews and videos are greatly appreciated...
05-09-2008, 02:47 PM
#34
Make a hole, coming thru!
Oooookay, so now we're saying the re-tuned engine and electric steering, and different sized steering wheel and so on are insignificant. Funny, but I've read 4-5 impressions from 1GEN owners driving the '09 and coming away with reports of improved power and handling. No I haven't test driven one, I'm busy packing for a move next week. Shall I? Shall I test drive one and come back and say 
, that my impression is also that they've improved more than just amenities? I won't take that bait.
The topic is, "are some people coming around and growing appreciative of the '09," and I have to admit I believe in the strength of a minority report. I've had a mild impression that it's essentially the same sporty four-banger, but with updated tech toys that correct 1GEN blunders. Hearing those who get to drive it saying that it feels zoomier is nice, but I wouldn't ascribe to the POV that it's unchanged from the 1GEN. Hell, the doors are reported sounding less hollow, isn't that enough to cheer about?
, that my impression is also that they've improved more than just amenities? I won't take that bait.The topic is, "are some people coming around and growing appreciative of the '09," and I have to admit I believe in the strength of a minority report. I've had a mild impression that it's essentially the same sporty four-banger, but with updated tech toys that correct 1GEN blunders. Hearing those who get to drive it saying that it feels zoomier is nice, but I wouldn't ascribe to the POV that it's unchanged from the 1GEN. Hell, the doors are reported sounding less hollow, isn't that enough to cheer about?
05-09-2008, 02:52 PM
#35
david...I am not sure I am able to figure out if you like the new TSX or not. English is not my first language so maybe its because I don't speak english very well....Are you for the new TSX or do you feel the old one is still better or just as good. just curious...
05-09-2008, 02:54 PM
#36
> 100K Mile Club Member
Originally Posted by Colin
I think that the TSX continues as the perfect upgrade path for current Civic or Accord buyers. Agree To me, this is the '09 car's purpose in life agree and in this respect it is a better car than the one it replaces. You lost me?
G1 owners can move to a TL-S as many here have, or wait till the next TL arrives, or wait for a MMC. No thanks I can understand the disappointment, but please remember that there are some moving into the car that are going to be just as excited to move from their Civic as you were 5 years ago. IMHO, this community will be stronger if we allow them to enjoy their new purchases. Never said I would not let them "enjoy" their purchases. This shouldn't mean that my opinion is null and void. Nor that I should have to keep my disappointment to myself.
edit: FWIW, I disagree with your assertion that the steering is worse. It is light but, I love the faster ratio and cannot stand the slow steering on the '08. Just to illustrate that this is definitely a 'point of view' issue and not a 'statement of fact' Loss of steering feel and addition of numbness is worse IMO. But I never said I was an expert on the subject. Therefore causing this to be a clear point of view and not a statement of fact.
G1 owners can move to a TL-S as many here have, or wait till the next TL arrives, or wait for a MMC. No thanks I can understand the disappointment, but please remember that there are some moving into the car that are going to be just as excited to move from their Civic as you were 5 years ago. IMHO, this community will be stronger if we allow them to enjoy their new purchases.
Never said I would not let them "enjoy" their purchases. This shouldn't mean that my opinion is null and void. Nor that I should have to keep my disappointment to myself. edit: FWIW, I disagree with your assertion that the steering is worse. It is light but, I love the faster ratio and cannot stand the slow steering on the '08. Just to illustrate that this is definitely a 'point of view' issue and not a 'statement of fact' Loss of steering feel and addition of numbness is worse IMO. But I never said I was an expert on the subject. Therefore causing this to be a clear point of view and not a statement of fact.
05-09-2008, 02:55 PM
#37
Senior Moderator
I guess reading > you.
Where did I say it was insignificant? I said I can't say that without a test drive. I think thats more than fair. I can only comment on the optics at this point.
And since when is electric steering and a different steering wheel a significant change. You should probably come up with better examples to prove whatever point it is you're trying to make.
No idea what you're trying to say here. 
Where did I say it was insignificant? I said I can't say that without a test drive. I think thats more than fair. I can only comment on the optics at this point.
And since when is electric steering and a different steering wheel a significant change. You should probably come up with better examples to prove whatever point it is you're trying to make.
No I haven't test driven one, I'm busy packing for a move next week. Shall I? Shall I test drive one and come back and say , that my impression is also that they've improved more than just amenities? I won't take that bait.
05-09-2008, 02:56 PM
#38
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by 09TSX
david...I am not sure I am able to figure out if you like the new TSX or not. English is not my first language so maybe its because I don't speak english very well....Are you for the new TSX or do you feel the old one is still better or just as good. just curious...
lol, Its not you.
But I think he likes the 09.
05-09-2008, 03:43 PM
#40
Make a hole, coming thru!
Originally Posted by dom
I guess reading > you.
Where did I say it was insignificant? ... And since when is electric steering and a different steering wheel a significant change. You should probably come up with better examples to prove whatever point it is you're trying to make.
No idea what you're trying to say here.
Where did I say it was insignificant? ... And since when is electric steering and a different steering wheel a significant change. You should probably come up with better examples to prove whatever point it is you're trying to make.
No idea what you're trying to say here.
Uuummmm ... I was answering TSXinTN, not you. Hence your confusion...? [ 
]
Originally Posted by 09tsx
david...I am not sure I am able to figure out if you like the new TSX or not. English is not my first language so maybe its because I don't speak english very well....Are you for the new TSX or do you feel the old one is still better or just as good. just curious...
Well ... fair enough, put my money where my mouth is. I don't think either is "better" or "worse," nor am I "for" or "against" the new model. I prefer the exterior of the 1GEN, IMHO it's more subtle and understated. I definitely envy the engineering and comfort updates to the '09, though: ECU change, tighter turning ratio, improved base audio, one-touch moonroof controls, additional pockets (center console, left-side driver console), A2DP audio capability, optional shelf in glovebox. A few quibbles on the interior (single compartment armrest, loss of touchscreen, paddle shifting versus SSM on the stick), but in general I think '09 buyers are getting a nicer version of the TSX. I'm not clamoring for a test drive as I suspect it'll make me instantly a bit disappointed in my 2006 (vice "Wow, I still have the better car"), and possibly unrealistically compelled to go get a Hondata reflash and A-spec suspension -- just to ease my pain. But on the topic of the thread (ahem?) I'm like a few, I think I was skeptical of the new model, disappointed in what the previews disclosed, but now see it as a worthy update without being a whole new ball of wax. I'm totally in agreement with Colin (though I don't think I'll get a TL in the next decade), the '09 model is in general a moderate improvement and a worthwhile car for those not yet in a TSX. For those already in a TSX (1GEN), I think hte equation really depends upon personal taste -> are you already happy with performance but wishing your iPod would work with it, or are you unconcerned with the amenities and want more HP and improved traction control. Am i make more sense?
