Current TSX incentives at the dealer?
02-21-2012, 03:19 PM
#41
or, they pay $4000 down and $300 a month for the car. my car even used, is still 4 months old.
The purchase option at the end of the lease is $18,279.60. Might be a better deal for someone not looking to drop another $2k on a lease.
Taxes in NY are between 8% - 9% depending on the county.
Also, with leases, many people aren't looking to buy the car afterwards.
The purchase option at the end of the lease is $18,279.60. Might be a better deal for someone not looking to drop another $2k on a lease.
Taxes in NY are between 8% - 9% depending on the county.
Also, with leases, many people aren't looking to buy the car afterwards.
The dealer is counting on the customer buying by monthly payments and "low cap cost reduction" rather than by total cost of ownership. Anyway that you want to dice or slice it, that $10350 is costing you 13% over the next three years. That isn't really your fault because the dealers are masters of deception and flim-flam and you and I are just noobs at this game.
How we, as a society, let car dealers get away with this is beyond me. This is the second most costly purchase (aside from a hous) that we will ever make and the regulations are virtually non-existent. Hell, the sale of a toothbrush is more regulated than cars.
02-21-2012, 03:19 PM
#42
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Bought to go pick up my new 2012 TSX today from a south florida acura dealership. The were running a lease special 289 a month no money down no hidden fees 10k miles a year for 36 months. I beat them up on the price a little and im ending up with 12000 miles a year possibly with free tint and pinstripe (OOWEEE lol) for 300 flat a month including tax. I think this is a great deal. just wanted to share
02-21-2012, 03:27 PM
#43
Bought to go pick up my new 2012 TSX today from a south florida acura dealership. The were running a lease special 289 a month no money down no hidden fees 10k miles a year for 36 months. I beat them up on the price a little and im ending up with 12000 miles a year possibly with free tint and pinstripe (OOWEEE lol) for 300 flat a month including tax. I think this is a great deal. just wanted to share
02-21-2012, 03:33 PM
#44
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lol sorry im not very good at the whole car buying thing (i brought my dad, im 23) but all i know its its a lease for 36 months 12000 miles a year and my payment is 300 flat (including taxes) there were also no aquisition fees or bullshit like that. pure sign and drive. so tonight i will just sign my papers pay nothing and begin to pay 300 a month.. if that helps in anyway? but i believe the msrp was around 28k or so.
02-21-2012, 03:42 PM
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Not sure if your talking about my deal. If so, I put $0 down and got $4,000 in a check back on my wifes trade!
dbrez89...Post up the other info. You guys are proving CEB's point lol. That the delership is getting you to only see price paid per month. Not the big picture!
dbrez89...Post up the other info. You guys are proving CEB's point lol. That the delership is getting you to only see price paid per month. Not the big picture!
02-21-2012, 03:46 PM
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i dont know the other info but i dont see how the dealership is getting me.... its a lease with absolutely 0 money down, no other fees. my orginal payment was going to be 320ish a month with 0 money down no other fees and all that but now its 300.... why do you think the dealer is gettin me? there is no trade-in im litteraly paying nothing up front except for my 300 a month from here on in
02-21-2012, 03:51 PM
#47
Not sure if your talking about my deal. If so, I put $0 down and got $4,000 in a check back on my wifes trade!
dbrez89...Post up the other info. You guys are proving CEB's point lol. That the delership is getting you to only see price paid per month. Not the big picture!
dbrez89...Post up the other info. You guys are proving CEB's point lol. That the delership is getting you to only see price paid per month. Not the big picture!
The salesman's only goal is to move cars and to make the most money possible for the dealership. They come up with all sorts of immovative ways of doing that. Now they have a 39 month lease. Same 30k miles but now with 3 extra payments. Nobody really cares because its still only $300 a month.
02-21-2012, 03:56 PM
#49
lol sorry im not very good at the whole car buying thing (i brought my dad, im 23) but all i know its its a lease for 36 months 12000 miles a year and my payment is 300 flat (including taxes) there were also no aquisition fees or bullshit like that. pure sign and drive. so tonight i will just sign my papers pay nothing and begin to pay 300 a month.. if that helps in anyway? but i believe the msrp was around 28k or so.
02-21-2012, 04:29 PM
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Sounds like a good deal. Yet just have your dad look at the other figures as well. See how much the car will end up costing you in the end. Say you love the car and want to buy it at lease end. Say you get tired of it after two years. Just see how much you can get out of it for at that time. If you purchased the car for to much you could be SOL in the end.
02-21-2012, 04:32 PM
#51
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My lease
Looking at my lease agreement these are my numbers;
This is for a 2010 base I-4.
MSRP 30,170
Sale price 26,436
down payment 2360.40
monthly 234.21 @ 36 months, 12k miles per year.
You may want to call me old school, but I tell the dealer from the get go,what is the price of your car before anything else, please dont try to back door me on price with a monthly payment. I may not be as savvy as some here, but I feel good that if I stick to my plan; of what is the price?, what are the finance terms?; APR, money factor(if a leased), length of contract, and then finally my monthly payment. I hope that the rest will fall into place, if not they earned their money, and which is fine. I just dont want to be taken to the cleaners. I don't have Mitt Romney kind of money to throw out there.
This is for a 2010 base I-4.
MSRP 30,170
Sale price 26,436
down payment 2360.40
monthly 234.21 @ 36 months, 12k miles per year.
You may want to call me old school, but I tell the dealer from the get go,what is the price of your car before anything else, please dont try to back door me on price with a monthly payment. I may not be as savvy as some here, but I feel good that if I stick to my plan; of what is the price?, what are the finance terms?; APR, money factor(if a leased), length of contract, and then finally my monthly payment. I hope that the rest will fall into place, if not they earned their money, and which is fine. I just dont want to be taken to the cleaners. I don't have Mitt Romney kind of money to throw out there.
02-21-2012, 04:35 PM
#52
I think he is trying to get out of his lease, but that ain't gonna happen with those numbers.
I see that many people have gotten wise to the dealer shell game.
Quite simply, dealers are very adept at making any numbers work. A savvy consumer works only with the total amount and a customer who wants to lease is a candidate for a scam unless they are careful.
We often see the questions "I'm getting a xyz car for $199 a month for 36 months with $1000 up front. Is that a good deal" but the information is meaningless.
The only thing that is important is the total cost of the car (including all fees but minus taxes) to give you a comparison.
Only once the total cost is established can you figure out if a leasing rate is a "good deal."
Let me give you an example.
A 2012 tech TSX can be had in Maryland for about $30k including freight and dealer processing charges. The same car is about $200 more in VA because of higher dealer fees and about $100 cheaper in WV because of lower fees.
So, a purchase is quite straightforward. Add the taxes and DMV fees and plug that number, along with the interest rate and length of loan, into the auto loan calculator at bankrate.com (or your other favorite calculator.) That'll give you your monthly payments and the total amount of interest you'll be paying.
Leases are so much trickier. They've come up with fancy confusing names for common terms and the dealer can play with the residual, the money factor and the capitalization cost, cap cost reduction and other stuff like miles per year . To figure out what a lease costs, you need to add the total payments, the upfront stuff, any costs to return the car and the residual. The total of all that is the actual total cost (including tax) of the car.
In theory, it shouldn't be more than the total negotiated cost of the car (if you were buying the car) plus the "money factor." The money factor is a fancy name for interest, just like capitalized cost is a snazzy term for "negotiated price" while "capitalized cost reduction" is merely a down payment.
To get an APR from money factor, merely multiply it by 2400. The result should be near the interest rate you would qualify for if you were buying the car.
So, before you ask "is $xyz a month a good deal" do the math beforehand and ask "is a total out the door before taxes and DMV fees of $XYZ for this car a good deal?" You can do the math for the monthly payments yourself.
Why before taxes and DMV fees? Because everyone's taxes are different. Some states have no sales tax but have a very high registration fee
I see that many people have gotten wise to the dealer shell game.
Quite simply, dealers are very adept at making any numbers work. A savvy consumer works only with the total amount and a customer who wants to lease is a candidate for a scam unless they are careful.
We often see the questions "I'm getting a xyz car for $199 a month for 36 months with $1000 up front. Is that a good deal" but the information is meaningless.
The only thing that is important is the total cost of the car (including all fees but minus taxes) to give you a comparison.
Only once the total cost is established can you figure out if a leasing rate is a "good deal."
Let me give you an example.
A 2012 tech TSX can be had in Maryland for about $30k including freight and dealer processing charges. The same car is about $200 more in VA because of higher dealer fees and about $100 cheaper in WV because of lower fees.
So, a purchase is quite straightforward. Add the taxes and DMV fees and plug that number, along with the interest rate and length of loan, into the auto loan calculator at bankrate.com (or your other favorite calculator.) That'll give you your monthly payments and the total amount of interest you'll be paying.
Leases are so much trickier. They've come up with fancy confusing names for common terms and the dealer can play with the residual, the money factor and the capitalization cost, cap cost reduction and other stuff like miles per year . To figure out what a lease costs, you need to add the total payments, the upfront stuff, any costs to return the car and the residual. The total of all that is the actual total cost (including tax) of the car.
In theory, it shouldn't be more than the total negotiated cost of the car (if you were buying the car) plus the "money factor." The money factor is a fancy name for interest, just like capitalized cost is a snazzy term for "negotiated price" while "capitalized cost reduction" is merely a down payment.
To get an APR from money factor, merely multiply it by 2400. The result should be near the interest rate you would qualify for if you were buying the car.
So, before you ask "is $xyz a month a good deal" do the math beforehand and ask "is a total out the door before taxes and DMV fees of $XYZ for this car a good deal?" You can do the math for the monthly payments yourself.
Why before taxes and DMV fees? Because everyone's taxes are different. Some states have no sales tax but have a very high registration fee
I completely agree: the first words out of the salesman's mouth when I went to pohanka acura recently was "how much do you want your monthly payment to be". I mean..seriously, are the vast majority of car buyers out there so gullible that they only care about the 'monthly payment'. What about total price/taxes/fees/surchages/etc.
I told the guy I was not a 'payment' buyer..he quickly changed his tune and directed me to the sales manager to discuss pricing (out the door including everything - not monthly).
Word of advice to all car shoppers: DO NOT buy a car based on monthly payment..you will be robbed blind and bent over while the dealership employees are high fiving each other
02-21-2012, 05:33 PM
#54
Intermediate
The end of lease buy price was 16,780 and some change.
With a quick look at autotrader, 3 yr old TSX's range from high 18's to low 20's with the wide range of miles. From past experience on used cars the avg padding dealers put on a used car is about $3500.00 So the buy out price seems ok. BUT, my boss told me I could negotiate the end of lease buy price. He said if you turn it in, and you have taken good care of the car and the miles are in check, the bank will ask the turn-in dealer if they would like to buy it. There price of course is way below the price set in the lease. But if not the bank will send the car to auction. I really wish I had a way to get the Manhiem auction reports. Most of the mid Atlantic dealers get their off lease inventory from them. Hell even access to NADA black books would give us a better position when negotiating with the stealership.
With a quick look at autotrader, 3 yr old TSX's range from high 18's to low 20's with the wide range of miles. From past experience on used cars the avg padding dealers put on a used car is about $3500.00 So the buy out price seems ok. BUT, my boss told me I could negotiate the end of lease buy price. He said if you turn it in, and you have taken good care of the car and the miles are in check, the bank will ask the turn-in dealer if they would like to buy it. There price of course is way below the price set in the lease. But if not the bank will send the car to auction. I really wish I had a way to get the Manhiem auction reports. Most of the mid Atlantic dealers get their off lease inventory from them. Hell even access to NADA black books would give us a better position when negotiating with the stealership.
02-21-2012, 07:20 PM
#55
The end of lease buy price was 16,780 and some change.
With a quick look at autotrader, 3 yr old TSX's range from high 18's to low 20's with the wide range of miles. From past experience on used cars the avg padding dealers put on a used car is about $3500.00 So the buy out price seems ok. BUT, my boss told me I could negotiate the end of lease buy price. He said if you turn it in, and you have taken good care of the car and the miles are in check, the bank will ask the turn-in dealer if they would like to buy it. There price of course is way below the price set in the lease. But if not the bank will send the car to auction. I really wish I had a way to get the Manhiem auction reports. Most of the mid Atlantic dealers get their off lease inventory from them. Hell even access to NADA black books would give us a better position when negotiating with the stealership.
With a quick look at autotrader, 3 yr old TSX's range from high 18's to low 20's with the wide range of miles. From past experience on used cars the avg padding dealers put on a used car is about $3500.00 So the buy out price seems ok. BUT, my boss told me I could negotiate the end of lease buy price. He said if you turn it in, and you have taken good care of the car and the miles are in check, the bank will ask the turn-in dealer if they would like to buy it. There price of course is way below the price set in the lease. But if not the bank will send the car to auction. I really wish I had a way to get the Manhiem auction reports. Most of the mid Atlantic dealers get their off lease inventory from them. Hell even access to NADA black books would give us a better position when negotiating with the stealership.
Yes, you can generally negotiate the buyout price at the end of the lease. The dealer and Honda will weigh their chances of getting a higher price against a sure thing.
Manheim information is available. It is much easier to price out an Acura than most other cars because there are fewer variables - one option, miles and condition as opposed to a zillion options on most other cars.
Start asking around for a Manheim contact a few months before lease end.
02-21-2012, 07:23 PM
#56
Well said!
I completely agree: the first words out of the salesman's mouth when I went to pohanka acura recently was "how much do you want your monthly payment to be". I mean..seriously, are the vast majority of car buyers out there so gullible that they only care about the 'monthly payment'. What about total price/taxes/fees/surchages/etc.
I told the guy I was not a 'payment' buyer..he quickly changed his tune and directed me to the sales manager to discuss pricing (out the door including everything - not monthly).
Word of advice to all car shoppers: DO NOT buy a car based on monthly payment..you will be robbed blind and bent over while the dealership employees are high fiving each other
I completely agree: the first words out of the salesman's mouth when I went to pohanka acura recently was "how much do you want your monthly payment to be". I mean..seriously, are the vast majority of car buyers out there so gullible that they only care about the 'monthly payment'. What about total price/taxes/fees/surchages/etc.
I told the guy I was not a 'payment' buyer..he quickly changed his tune and directed me to the sales manager to discuss pricing (out the door including everything - not monthly).
Word of advice to all car shoppers: DO NOT buy a car based on monthly payment..you will be robbed blind and bent over while the dealership employees are high fiving each other
Did you ever go to Omar at Pohanka or did you ever get a car elsewhere?
02-21-2012, 07:39 PM
#57
maybe you or me are missing each other's points. My point is in a lease, and only a lease, you care about down payment and monthly cost as you are turning the car in at the end of the commitment. if you are worried about buying it afterwards, look at the residual and compare it to what three year old cars are going for now. my "purchase" price is lower than what three year old TSXs are going for at this point.
02-21-2012, 07:50 PM
#58
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Yeah, but your trying to have someone take over your lease. So your trying to get out of it early. Your not looking to just turn the car in at lease end.
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
02-21-2012, 08:02 PM
#59
Yeah, but your trying to have someone take over your lease. So your trying to get out of it early. Your not looking to just turn the car in at lease end.
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
Why bother even negotiating when a full MSRP lease is only a few dollars a month more?
02-21-2012, 08:56 PM
#60
The acura dealers seem like they really want to deal on the cars...but I didn't talk bottom line pricing, so the 'deals' might not be as good as I expect. I will wait a few more months and look for more honda to dealer incentves before pulling the trigger. The lease on my BMW ends in early may 2012.
Last edited by mihink; 02-21-2012 at 08:59 PM.
02-21-2012, 09:27 PM
#61
never went back to pohanka..will be test driving a few more cars(brands) before buying.
The acura dealers seem like they really want to deal on the cars...but I didn't talk bottom line pricing, so the 'deals' might not be as good as I expect. I will wait a few more months and look for more honda to dealer incentves before pulling the trigger. The lease on my BMW ends in early may 2012.
The acura dealers seem like they really want to deal on the cars...but I didn't talk bottom line pricing, so the 'deals' might not be as good as I expect. I will wait a few more months and look for more honda to dealer incentves before pulling the trigger. The lease on my BMW ends in early may 2012.
02-21-2012, 10:18 PM
#62
Yeah, but your trying to have someone take over your lease. So your trying to get out of it early. Your not looking to just turn the car in at lease end.
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
So why would someone take over your lease on a used car. When they could just lease a brand new one for the same payment with nothing down and negotiate the terms a little further?
I live in Louisville. Our prices are a bit cheaper on cars than NY though!
02-22-2012, 04:42 AM
#63
02-22-2012, 08:48 AM
#64
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How so? I just got my SPECIAL EDITION for $30 more than yours with no money paid to them. $0, zip, nadda.
You want $1,750 up front and $290 a month. Yes I'm paying $30 more a month. Yet $30 a month for 36 months is only $1,080.00 So I save $670 going with the SE new over your deal, and have better terms at the end of the lease!
Not being rude, goodluck with your sale, but it's hard to "sell" a lease take over.
You want $1,750 up front and $290 a month. Yes I'm paying $30 more a month. Yet $30 a month for 36 months is only $1,080.00 So I save $670 going with the SE new over your deal, and have better terms at the end of the lease!
Not being rude, goodluck with your sale, but it's hard to "sell" a lease take over.
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