New suspension... Need advice on noise.
08-21-2023, 11:50 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
New suspension... Need advice on noise.
Hey guys, 242k mile 2001 TL. I went through and replaced:
All new Struts with Gabriel Ultra Quickstruts front and rear.
New front suspension (Delphi Upper Control Arms, Moog Lower Control Arms, Delphi Lower Balljoints, New NSK Hub Bearings, New Front Hubs, New Delphi Inner and Outer Tie-Rods, new Delphi sway bar endlinks and sway bar bushings and even new Delphi strut rod bushings, and yes, I put them in properly with the big sides of the bushing facing the frame) with the only parts I reused are the strut forks and knuckles after I fully cleaned them up. I even bought new Acura hardware and only had one inner lower control arm bushing have the bolt siezed where I had to cut it out. The rest all broke free. I even put on new BA steering rack tie-rod neoprene boots on while I was there.
For the rear I replaced the lower back control arms (adjusting bolt was corroded to the bushings) and the upper arm with the balljoints (came out easy and decided all balljoints where going to be replaced). I also did new Mevotech Supreme rear hubs. Found out the inner bearing race was rusted to the spindles, but the nifty inductive bolt heater I bought to try on the rusted bushing bolts actually worked AWESOME to get those races off the spindles. Like 30 seconds of heating and they just slide right off. Oh, I also did new Delphi sway bar end-links and bushings in back as well.
So, got it all done, got an alignment done and everything feels great, except for the fact that I need to allow the struts "break-in" a bit more. I only have about 350 miles on them and they are getting better and better (by that I mean softer and softer as to start they seemed to expose every single bump and crack in the pavement and now it is only the really bad ones you feel), but I have a few issues:
1) Old issue that existied before the new parts, is that when you hard accelerate from a stop it feeles like something is loose and moving and clunks, as if there is take-up in some part. With everything new I know there is nothing moving on all the new parts I replaced, but just wondering if it could be CV axles?
There is no noise on turns and no sounds, which would mean if they ARE the CV axles it would have to be the inner joint, right?
I do have brand new Cardone CV axles sitting in the box I can install, but when I did the front end work I didn't notice anything obvious with the existing ones (boots in place and no play that I could feel by hand, but I have no idea if the are 22 year old originals or not and even if so, they could be well worn at 242k miles), so maybe I should replace them???
2) New issue since the work was done, is that there is something of a soft clunk it would seem in the back passenger side only over the worst transitions. At first it was worse when I noticed the coil spring on that side was agaist the lower mount on the slope of the mount that keeps the spring in place (I was able to move the spring slightly when the car was jack up in that corner), but I also noticed that the Gabriel Quickstrut shocks do not have the rubber isolator that the stock shocks used on the lower mounts of the springs in back. They only use a thin rubber "coil" to go around the springs and I am concerned the noise is because the springs are able to move on the lower mounts without isolation. If so I can take the stock ones off the original springs and see about mounting them on the Quickstruts.
I did check everything else out and there is no play or movement in any of the control arms, the bushings are all solid and intact and with new rear hubs there is really nothing that has any play back there to allow a noise of any kind. Worst case is that the rear struts are going to require more time to break-in properly. Would suck if this is the way it will be permanently. I was used to the suspension being "Cadillac-like" as it was before I did all the work.
I have no idea what the suspension "feel" difference was between the Acura TL and the Honda Accord that is it's twin, as most of the parts are listed for both applications. Would really suck to need to buy OEM struts to get back the nice supple ride I was used to before. I did keep the stock struts so I can salvage the springs "just in case" I need to go that route.
Any and all input would be appreciated. I did new struts/shocks on my Lincoln MKS a few montsh ago and it only took about 300-400 miles or so to totally break in those struts/shocks and that car is riding like new, so I am hoping that a little more time/miles will allow the TL to ride as good as it used to. It definitly feels more "sporty" now as you get a LOT more feedback from the road, but it just seems a bit "too much" for my tastes.
All new Struts with Gabriel Ultra Quickstruts front and rear.
New front suspension (Delphi Upper Control Arms, Moog Lower Control Arms, Delphi Lower Balljoints, New NSK Hub Bearings, New Front Hubs, New Delphi Inner and Outer Tie-Rods, new Delphi sway bar endlinks and sway bar bushings and even new Delphi strut rod bushings, and yes, I put them in properly with the big sides of the bushing facing the frame) with the only parts I reused are the strut forks and knuckles after I fully cleaned them up. I even bought new Acura hardware and only had one inner lower control arm bushing have the bolt siezed where I had to cut it out. The rest all broke free. I even put on new BA steering rack tie-rod neoprene boots on while I was there.
For the rear I replaced the lower back control arms (adjusting bolt was corroded to the bushings) and the upper arm with the balljoints (came out easy and decided all balljoints where going to be replaced). I also did new Mevotech Supreme rear hubs. Found out the inner bearing race was rusted to the spindles, but the nifty inductive bolt heater I bought to try on the rusted bushing bolts actually worked AWESOME to get those races off the spindles. Like 30 seconds of heating and they just slide right off. Oh, I also did new Delphi sway bar end-links and bushings in back as well.
So, got it all done, got an alignment done and everything feels great, except for the fact that I need to allow the struts "break-in" a bit more. I only have about 350 miles on them and they are getting better and better (by that I mean softer and softer as to start they seemed to expose every single bump and crack in the pavement and now it is only the really bad ones you feel), but I have a few issues:
1) Old issue that existied before the new parts, is that when you hard accelerate from a stop it feeles like something is loose and moving and clunks, as if there is take-up in some part. With everything new I know there is nothing moving on all the new parts I replaced, but just wondering if it could be CV axles?
There is no noise on turns and no sounds, which would mean if they ARE the CV axles it would have to be the inner joint, right?
I do have brand new Cardone CV axles sitting in the box I can install, but when I did the front end work I didn't notice anything obvious with the existing ones (boots in place and no play that I could feel by hand, but I have no idea if the are 22 year old originals or not and even if so, they could be well worn at 242k miles), so maybe I should replace them???
2) New issue since the work was done, is that there is something of a soft clunk it would seem in the back passenger side only over the worst transitions. At first it was worse when I noticed the coil spring on that side was agaist the lower mount on the slope of the mount that keeps the spring in place (I was able to move the spring slightly when the car was jack up in that corner), but I also noticed that the Gabriel Quickstrut shocks do not have the rubber isolator that the stock shocks used on the lower mounts of the springs in back. They only use a thin rubber "coil" to go around the springs and I am concerned the noise is because the springs are able to move on the lower mounts without isolation. If so I can take the stock ones off the original springs and see about mounting them on the Quickstruts.
I did check everything else out and there is no play or movement in any of the control arms, the bushings are all solid and intact and with new rear hubs there is really nothing that has any play back there to allow a noise of any kind. Worst case is that the rear struts are going to require more time to break-in properly. Would suck if this is the way it will be permanently. I was used to the suspension being "Cadillac-like" as it was before I did all the work.
I have no idea what the suspension "feel" difference was between the Acura TL and the Honda Accord that is it's twin, as most of the parts are listed for both applications. Would really suck to need to buy OEM struts to get back the nice supple ride I was used to before. I did keep the stock struts so I can salvage the springs "just in case" I need to go that route.
Any and all input would be appreciated. I did new struts/shocks on my Lincoln MKS a few montsh ago and it only took about 300-400 miles or so to totally break in those struts/shocks and that car is riding like new, so I am hoping that a little more time/miles will allow the TL to ride as good as it used to. It definitly feels more "sporty" now as you get a LOT more feedback from the road, but it just seems a bit "too much" for my tastes.
08-22-2023, 02:03 AM
#2
Burning Brakes
my experience with most aftermarket axles has been that the rebuilder focuses on functionality over precision & performance. Every aftermarket I have installed worked, but in comparison to brand new set of oem axles, there was a lot of noticeable stuff such as:
- aftermarket: gave a feeling of "slack" as you first start to move the car forward due to the reused joint being worn or out of limit (a new oem joint shows zero slack when you articulate the joint by hand)
- aftermarket: some vibration at highway speeds
- oem: a much more solid feeling drivetrain as accelerating out of curved turns in road (prob more of point 1 above).
08-22-2023, 07:12 AM
#3
Senior Moderator
1) could be motor mounts
08-22-2023, 10:00 AM
#4
Instructor
Thread Starter
I forgot to mention that I replaced both transmission mouns when I did the front end work. I bought a set of aftermarket motor mounts and figured I would put them in when I did the timing chain/waterpump.
In looking at the set I have, they included the proper rear mount, but a different front mount from what is in the car. Rockauto shows the proper mount that is already in the car so I ordered up one of them to match what is there.
I will do the engine mounts later this week. I did a partial test on the existing engine mounts, just the vacuum test, and they hold vacuum, but I understand that is not the defnitive indicator if the mount is good or not. Just so I know for certain I will do the FSM diagnostics later today and see if the mounts are good or not. But, at 242k miles I figure I will be swapping them out regardless.
In regards to aftermarket axles, yeah I figure the OEM are much higher quality than anything aftermarket. If the engine mounts don't fix the "clunk" I will end up swapping in the aftermarket ones just to confirm that the axles ARE the problem. The aftermarkets are brand new, not remanufactured, so I am hoping they are at least solid.
Are there any known "quality" aftermarket ones?
The OEM ones have the little rubber "dampers" in the middle of the shaft, so you can tell they are OEM. I have not seen a single aftermarket one have those.
In looking at the set I have, they included the proper rear mount, but a different front mount from what is in the car. Rockauto shows the proper mount that is already in the car so I ordered up one of them to match what is there.
I will do the engine mounts later this week. I did a partial test on the existing engine mounts, just the vacuum test, and they hold vacuum, but I understand that is not the defnitive indicator if the mount is good or not. Just so I know for certain I will do the FSM diagnostics later today and see if the mounts are good or not. But, at 242k miles I figure I will be swapping them out regardless.
In regards to aftermarket axles, yeah I figure the OEM are much higher quality than anything aftermarket. If the engine mounts don't fix the "clunk" I will end up swapping in the aftermarket ones just to confirm that the axles ARE the problem. The aftermarkets are brand new, not remanufactured, so I am hoping they are at least solid.
Are there any known "quality" aftermarket ones?
The OEM ones have the little rubber "dampers" in the middle of the shaft, so you can tell they are OEM. I have not seen a single aftermarket one have those.
08-22-2023, 09:53 PM
#5
Instructor
Thread Starter
I did the FSM procedure for testing the engine mounts and they failed a few of the tests.
The mounts may hold a vacuum, but the do not change the way the engine idles. The solenoid and the ECM control of it both pass the testing, so that is all good, so I just need to replace both the front and rear mounts. I will do that along with the mount on the passenger side of the engine.
I will be quite happy if changing them gets rid of the clunk and excess movement. That was also validate that the CV axles are good as well. After doing a ton of research it would seem as if the ONLY good ones are the OEM first, then you have RAxles coming in a close second and another viable option. The Cardone "new" axles I have on hand seem to be "if you have no other choice, they are better than most of the remaining options" type of parts to have around to use on a temporary basis until you can source better ones... And even at that it would seem you are rolling the dice if you get a set that won't introoduce vibration or fail after a short period of time.
The mounts may hold a vacuum, but the do not change the way the engine idles. The solenoid and the ECM control of it both pass the testing, so that is all good, so I just need to replace both the front and rear mounts. I will do that along with the mount on the passenger side of the engine.
I will be quite happy if changing them gets rid of the clunk and excess movement. That was also validate that the CV axles are good as well. After doing a ton of research it would seem as if the ONLY good ones are the OEM first, then you have RAxles coming in a close second and another viable option. The Cardone "new" axles I have on hand seem to be "if you have no other choice, they are better than most of the remaining options" type of parts to have around to use on a temporary basis until you can source better ones... And even at that it would seem you are rolling the dice if you get a set that won't introoduce vibration or fail after a short period of time.
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whitetiger5 (08-23-2023)
08-23-2023, 06:42 PM
#6
Instructor
Thread Starter
Well, I got in the new front engine mount, only because the "set" I bought didn't have that design included, it had two that looked like the back mount, but with opposite rubber tops. The one I was "missing" in the set is the one that is rounded on the top with 4 bolted areas, two on each side.
Considering that I don't really trust a lot of aftermarket parts, I decided to "test" the mounts pneumatic connections and low and behold all three mounts failed.
The newest mount had a slow leak around the bottom "plate" and the other two were so severe they never even allowed vacuum to build.
So, considering they are simple pneumatic parts, I decided to "test" the newest mount and used some soapy water and used some air pressure and sure enough it was leaking out of the bottom plate periphery. So, I rinsed off the soapy water, let it dry, then used Ultra Black RTV and sealed the periphery. After about an hour I put some mild vacuum to it to "suck in" some RTV into the areas that were the worst and then just let it sit.
On the other two, it not only leaked in the same area, but also at the "nipple" for the vacuum connection. The newest mount had that nipple soldered in and the older ones it was obvious were just pressed in. So those not only got the RTV around the periphery, but also around the nipple as well. Again, I used some mild vacuum and then resealed the nipple areas with extra RTV.
I will let them all sit for 24 hours and then test them again. I am expecting them all to hold vacuum at that point.
Also, since I just spent an hour testing and cleaning, I figured I would mention that the shift solenoids sold on Amazon are mostly refurbs, not brand new units. On all 4 I bought they all had sand/grit/dirt in the o-rings still as well as in the orifices. They all tested at 16.0-16.2 ohms via the meter, but upon using a 12v source and actuating them only 3 worked properly, with the 4th being somewhat restricted and have a low "thunk" sound upon actuation instead of a solid "CLICK" like the rest had... after using compressed air and actuating it some dirt came out and that solenoid works as it should as well now.
When I pulled the o-rings off the solenoids to clean everything I only lost a couple due to ripping. And that solenoid was NOT OEM as far as I could tell, as it had a much larger screen area at the tip and numbers stamped into the coil cap along with slightly different construction.
The dual linear solenoid I ordered actually DID look brand new in all respects. The coils ohmed out at 5.6 ohms for both and everything is "as new" so I am hoping that works as well. The only construction criticism I have is they used plastic end-plugs for the bores vs metal ones like the OEM unit. We will see how the transmission reacts in a couple days when I swap them all in. I have been having an intermittent issue when the transmission gets heat soaked, so I hoping it is just a matter of a flakey solenoid.
Considering that I don't really trust a lot of aftermarket parts, I decided to "test" the mounts pneumatic connections and low and behold all three mounts failed.
The newest mount had a slow leak around the bottom "plate" and the other two were so severe they never even allowed vacuum to build.
So, considering they are simple pneumatic parts, I decided to "test" the newest mount and used some soapy water and used some air pressure and sure enough it was leaking out of the bottom plate periphery. So, I rinsed off the soapy water, let it dry, then used Ultra Black RTV and sealed the periphery. After about an hour I put some mild vacuum to it to "suck in" some RTV into the areas that were the worst and then just let it sit.
On the other two, it not only leaked in the same area, but also at the "nipple" for the vacuum connection. The newest mount had that nipple soldered in and the older ones it was obvious were just pressed in. So those not only got the RTV around the periphery, but also around the nipple as well. Again, I used some mild vacuum and then resealed the nipple areas with extra RTV.
I will let them all sit for 24 hours and then test them again. I am expecting them all to hold vacuum at that point.
Also, since I just spent an hour testing and cleaning, I figured I would mention that the shift solenoids sold on Amazon are mostly refurbs, not brand new units. On all 4 I bought they all had sand/grit/dirt in the o-rings still as well as in the orifices. They all tested at 16.0-16.2 ohms via the meter, but upon using a 12v source and actuating them only 3 worked properly, with the 4th being somewhat restricted and have a low "thunk" sound upon actuation instead of a solid "CLICK" like the rest had... after using compressed air and actuating it some dirt came out and that solenoid works as it should as well now.
When I pulled the o-rings off the solenoids to clean everything I only lost a couple due to ripping. And that solenoid was NOT OEM as far as I could tell, as it had a much larger screen area at the tip and numbers stamped into the coil cap along with slightly different construction.
The dual linear solenoid I ordered actually DID look brand new in all respects. The coils ohmed out at 5.6 ohms for both and everything is "as new" so I am hoping that works as well. The only construction criticism I have is they used plastic end-plugs for the bores vs metal ones like the OEM unit. We will see how the transmission reacts in a couple days when I swap them all in. I have been having an intermittent issue when the transmission gets heat soaked, so I hoping it is just a matter of a flakey solenoid.
08-23-2023, 07:10 PM
#7
Instructor
Thread Starter
I forgot to mention, I did test the shift solenoids pneumatically and all 4 actually all do perform as they should. I forgot to mention that above.
In regards to the dual linear solenoid, Outside of testing it in-car I have no idea how I would be able to test it properly outside of it actuating, which it does.
In regards to the dual linear solenoid, Outside of testing it in-car I have no idea how I would be able to test it properly outside of it actuating, which it does.
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08-23-2023, 08:37 PM
#8
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
08-23-2023, 09:02 PM
#9
Instructor
Thread Starter
But, I talked to three people that stated the Anchor, Westar and Beck/Arnley mounts all suffer from the same issues... They all have had them be leaky straight out of the box, or flat out not work pneumatically.
So, I just believe it is "par for the course" with aftermarket engine mounts of this design. You want to be able to install them "out of the box" then you are stuck buying OEM. For the small amount of effort needed to "seal" the aftermarket ones, it is worth the discount as long as they work well for dampening the vibrations of the running engine.
Another thing I will add about my setup, I installed all new "dogbone" exhaust hangers this afternoon. The original ones were far too soft after 22 years and with the suspension changes I was concerned about the excessive movement causing more issues (I already had the flex pipe section replaced a couple years ago, so that is actually in great ocndition still and with all the movement I didn't want to wear it out prematurely), so considering the exact same hangers that are OEM are less than $1.50 each I figured I would replace all 5 in the back. Took all of 5 minutes to swap out all of them using WD40 on the old ones and a exhaust hanger pliers to get them off, then more WD40 on teh new ones and put them on.
The result is a BIG difference in solidity and "feel" on the road... The swaying and bouncing around exhaust was most certainly noticeable to me. I had a weird low thump every now and then over larger bumps in the road that is totally gone now.
I am hoping the new struts get more "compliant" in teh next thousand miles, otherwise I may be forced to buy another set of the struts themselves and just strip the quickstruts of thier bearings/mounts and rebuild them with the stock springs I still have on hand.
Does anyone have any input in regards to how good the Monroe struts are for this application? In particular I am looking at the "low pressure gas charge" versions that are supposed to be identical to the OEM ones.
I would really hate to have to spend the money on OEM struts if I can help it.
But, again, I am hoping the Gabriel Ultra Qucikstruts end up mellowing out. For most who want a "sport" suspension it is great, lots of road feedback. Personally I just want "floaty softness" when I drive more than sporty feedback. It was like taht prior to the passenger front strut leaking, so I was hoping to get back to that.
Again, any input is appreciated.
08-24-2023, 05:04 PM
#10
Instructor
Thread Starter
decided to post a follow-up on the engine mounts.
After 24 hours for the RTV to cure for the bottom plates, I decided to hook them up to a tester and apply some vacuum... wouldn't you know it, all three wouldn't hold a vacuum of 20 inches for 5 minutes. The newest mount of the three was only down to about 15 inches, so it was the best of the lot, but I was disassppinted non-the-less.
The next test for all three was a water submersion test with pressure applied. All three leaked at the larger "compression seal" around the outside of the mounts in the middle. I figured as much and after blowing the water off them (I used pressure to not only see the leaks, but also to be sure no water got inside the mounts) and allowing them to dry outside in teh heat of the day for an hour, I proceeded to RTV each mount in teh area they were leaking. I applied a small vacuum to suck in some RTV and then built it back up before smoothing it all out. They are all sealed permanently and I have zero doubt they will all hold vacuum properly by tomorrow.
After 24 hours for the RTV to cure for the bottom plates, I decided to hook them up to a tester and apply some vacuum... wouldn't you know it, all three wouldn't hold a vacuum of 20 inches for 5 minutes. The newest mount of the three was only down to about 15 inches, so it was the best of the lot, but I was disassppinted non-the-less.
The next test for all three was a water submersion test with pressure applied. All three leaked at the larger "compression seal" around the outside of the mounts in the middle. I figured as much and after blowing the water off them (I used pressure to not only see the leaks, but also to be sure no water got inside the mounts) and allowing them to dry outside in teh heat of the day for an hour, I proceeded to RTV each mount in teh area they were leaking. I applied a small vacuum to suck in some RTV and then built it back up before smoothing it all out. They are all sealed permanently and I have zero doubt they will all hold vacuum properly by tomorrow.
08-25-2023, 02:16 AM
#11
Instructor
Thread Starter
my experience with most aftermarket axles has been that the rebuilder focuses on functionality over precision & performance. Every aftermarket I have installed worked, but in comparison to brand new set of oem axles, there was a lot of noticeable stuff such as:
- aftermarket: gave a feeling of "slack" as you first start to move the car forward due to the reused joint being worn or out of limit (a new oem joint shows zero slack when you articulate the joint by hand)
- aftermarket: some vibration at highway speeds
- oem: a much more solid feeling drivetrain as accelerating out of curved turns in road (prob more of point 1 above).
Is that a "thing" with CV axles, pulling higher mileage ones apart and cleaning them up and regreasing them to keep them "alive" as long as possible?
I normally have not had to deal with any CV axles that have had higher mileage on them.
If it is something that is worthwhile to do, I have no problem pulling the axles and doing just that. I have oetiker pliers and I have the skills to undo oetiker clamps and reuse them properly, so it wouldn't be that big of a deal to accomplish. Unless messing with the boots becomes an issue because of the age/mileage and I should really replace the boots at the same time?
In looking into the Gabriel quickstruts, it would seem as if the springs used are spec'd for the Accord according to one source and if so I should probably remove them, pull them apart and rebuild them using the stock springs I still have on hand. Looks like the shocks are identical between the Accord/TL/TL-S with the springs being the big differentiating factor. Personally, if the springs are the biggest factor in how well it rides I have zero issue going that route. I did notice with the way the Gabriel Ultra-Struts come built the front end seems to be lower than the back and thus it has a raked appearance, when with the stock springs/struts it was very level front to rear. Also, I made sure I got the proper rear quickstruts and not the ones for the TL-S, so they are proper for my base-model TL. Personally I jsut think they are setup for an Accord and swapping the springs should bring it back to "normal".
But, again, any and all input on that would be appreciated.
08-25-2023, 06:44 PM
#12
Instructor
Thread Starter
Follow-up:
I replaced the front engine mount as well as the side engine mount. Both were gone (ie, broken) so they were, most certainly the source of the issues.
With the new mounts (and, yes, the sealing endeavor worked just fine as the new front mount now holds 25 inches of vacuum for over and hour without any sort of loss) there is no longer any sort of clunk and everything is solid as can be. There is no excessive vibration from the engine in the car and I now am experiencing a bit of torque steer at WOT at low speeds because the engine is no longer boucing all over the place...
I still need to replace the rear engine mount, but I am MUCH less concerned since it did pass the test as far as being solid and still serviceable (it lifted the car by that mount location by itself as I was jacking the engine to get the front and side mounts out/in, so I would consider that a sign it is in good shape), so I will probably do that before winter when I finsih some smaller maintenance items.
Also, I can verify that aftermarket A/B linear solenoids are mostly trash... Just put in a NMN Precision "new" unit and it ends up throwing a code within a half hour of driving consistently. It most certainly is a new unit, but it obviously is not calibrated as well as the OEM units and the computer throws a code for it (P1751 to be exact). I already swapped the aftermarket Shift Solenoid "B" back to a "known good" OEM unit and it most certainly works as it should, so the new A/B Linear dual solenoid has to be the cullprit.
I replaced the front engine mount as well as the side engine mount. Both were gone (ie, broken) so they were, most certainly the source of the issues.
With the new mounts (and, yes, the sealing endeavor worked just fine as the new front mount now holds 25 inches of vacuum for over and hour without any sort of loss) there is no longer any sort of clunk and everything is solid as can be. There is no excessive vibration from the engine in the car and I now am experiencing a bit of torque steer at WOT at low speeds because the engine is no longer boucing all over the place...
I still need to replace the rear engine mount, but I am MUCH less concerned since it did pass the test as far as being solid and still serviceable (it lifted the car by that mount location by itself as I was jacking the engine to get the front and side mounts out/in, so I would consider that a sign it is in good shape), so I will probably do that before winter when I finsih some smaller maintenance items.
Also, I can verify that aftermarket A/B linear solenoids are mostly trash... Just put in a NMN Precision "new" unit and it ends up throwing a code within a half hour of driving consistently. It most certainly is a new unit, but it obviously is not calibrated as well as the OEM units and the computer throws a code for it (P1751 to be exact). I already swapped the aftermarket Shift Solenoid "B" back to a "known good" OEM unit and it most certainly works as it should, so the new A/B Linear dual solenoid has to be the cullprit.
08-27-2023, 08:00 PM
#13
Instructor
Thread Starter
Update on the Gabriel Ultra shocks and struts:
After about a week I can say they designed these more for the Type-S than the Premium. After about 1200 miles the ride is still more "stiff" than I expect. I also noticed the car sits a bit lower than before. Like a full 1"+ drop in front and about 3/4" in back. They settled much lower than I expected. I mean you do NOT need to buy lowering springs if you go with these, as they also ride stiffer.
I will be swapping in my stock springs sometime this week and will repost if the ride is still as stiff. I know the OEM Acura springs are more progressive than the Honda Accord versions. I already know the shocks are teh same between the Acura TL and the Honda Accord with the springs being the big difference between the two. I am hoping the Gabriel Ultra shocks/struts with the stock springs will get me back to the original ride height and ride quality.
I will say I do notice a small noise when you hard accelerate from a stop. I would pretty much blame something like upper control arm bushings, but all of those parts are brand new. I mean I even put in new strut rod bushings, so everything in the front is new., control arms, ball joints, etc. Even sway bar bushings and end-links, so I just cannot figure out where any sort of noise is coming from. Again it only happens when you hard accelerate from a stop. I still have the stock cv axles, but there was no play or anything in them.
After about a week I can say they designed these more for the Type-S than the Premium. After about 1200 miles the ride is still more "stiff" than I expect. I also noticed the car sits a bit lower than before. Like a full 1"+ drop in front and about 3/4" in back. They settled much lower than I expected. I mean you do NOT need to buy lowering springs if you go with these, as they also ride stiffer.
I will be swapping in my stock springs sometime this week and will repost if the ride is still as stiff. I know the OEM Acura springs are more progressive than the Honda Accord versions. I already know the shocks are teh same between the Acura TL and the Honda Accord with the springs being the big difference between the two. I am hoping the Gabriel Ultra shocks/struts with the stock springs will get me back to the original ride height and ride quality.
I will say I do notice a small noise when you hard accelerate from a stop. I would pretty much blame something like upper control arm bushings, but all of those parts are brand new. I mean I even put in new strut rod bushings, so everything in the front is new., control arms, ball joints, etc. Even sway bar bushings and end-links, so I just cannot figure out where any sort of noise is coming from. Again it only happens when you hard accelerate from a stop. I still have the stock cv axles, but there was no play or anything in them.
08-28-2023, 05:21 AM
#14
Instructor
Thread Starter
Oh, I also forgot to mention, withthe engine mounts done and everything else tight, I get a bit of torque steer when hard accelerating at times, as well as the ability to break the tires free, even on dry pavement when gunning it from a dead stop. Not bad for a car with the mileage it has.
I also have Vredestein Quatrac Pro tires on it in the Type-S size of 215/50R-17 on 17x7 wheels, so there is plenty of contact patch and sidewall stiffness.
I also have Vredestein Quatrac Pro tires on it in the Type-S size of 215/50R-17 on 17x7 wheels, so there is plenty of contact patch and sidewall stiffness.
09-17-2023, 07:21 PM
#15
Instructor
Thread Starter
I figured I would follow up here...
Got the transmission swapped, did the rear engine mount, tightened down ALL the front cradle and subframe bolts. No more clicking or other noises.
Car feels totally solid, basically like new. I have a neighbor with a 2006 42k mile TL and he stated mine is actually tighter feeling than his is at this point. We will be tightening the same bolts on his setup in a week or two.
I figure since the front is done I will get the rear end in the air and do the same to the rear cradle.
Got the transmission swapped, did the rear engine mount, tightened down ALL the front cradle and subframe bolts. No more clicking or other noises.
Car feels totally solid, basically like new. I have a neighbor with a 2006 42k mile TL and he stated mine is actually tighter feeling than his is at this point. We will be tightening the same bolts on his setup in a week or two.
I figure since the front is done I will get the rear end in the air and do the same to the rear cradle.
09-17-2023, 08:00 PM
#16
Instructor
Thread Starter
Well the rear subframe bolts also tightened a little bit as well.
Totally got rid of a noise I would have sworn was the rear seat belts rattling. No noises at all, even under rough roads.
Also, I forgot to mention I ended up returning the Gabriel Quickstruts. They are complete garbage. The front springs sagged and the drivers side ended up being almost an inch lower than the passenger side after less than a month. The ride was firm and harsh.
I ended up going with Monroe OESpectrum struts all around. I reused the stock springs and used Mevotech Supreme/Westech spring seats and Mevotech Supreme mounts all around. I even redid the OEM spring insulators. I reused the stock bellows as they were all still serviceable and a MUCH better design than the aftermarket bellows are. The OESpectrum struts were the "low-pressure gas charged" units. I ended up using a Lisle 20400 tool to hold the shaft while tightening, and it worked great.
The ride quality is identical to stock original OEM. Pulling into my driveway, which has a steep gutter at the end, is a non-issue. With the Gabriel Quickstruts it was a jarring event.
Totally got rid of a noise I would have sworn was the rear seat belts rattling. No noises at all, even under rough roads.
Also, I forgot to mention I ended up returning the Gabriel Quickstruts. They are complete garbage. The front springs sagged and the drivers side ended up being almost an inch lower than the passenger side after less than a month. The ride was firm and harsh.
I ended up going with Monroe OESpectrum struts all around. I reused the stock springs and used Mevotech Supreme/Westech spring seats and Mevotech Supreme mounts all around. I even redid the OEM spring insulators. I reused the stock bellows as they were all still serviceable and a MUCH better design than the aftermarket bellows are. The OESpectrum struts were the "low-pressure gas charged" units. I ended up using a Lisle 20400 tool to hold the shaft while tightening, and it worked great.
The ride quality is identical to stock original OEM. Pulling into my driveway, which has a steep gutter at the end, is a non-issue. With the Gabriel Quickstruts it was a jarring event.
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