SSK

FYI,
LA Auto show website lists:
2003 Acura CL
2002 Acura NSX

in their "debuts" page:

http://www.laautoshow.com/debut.asp

cedric_fl

http://www.autonews.com/page.cms?pageId=114
We'll see.

chrism7855

if you go and read about how Acura has to consider changing from fwd to rwd and if they would be using a smaller version of the RL. If they do use the RL frame, you have to consider how much more weight this will add. meaning they are going to really have to increase the horse power just to keep the performance they have now. So, i guess the debate of when the new TL is going to arrive is over... we should be seeing a new design in 2003 as a 2004 model. meaning new TL Type-S will not be around till 2004 as a 2005 model. So this give us TL-s owners another good 2 years before we may be shown up by the next generations. I can live with that. Only wish i would of bought my car a little sooner then just 2 months ago. Now, time to drive the hell out of it before the new Type-S arrives. For you guys who cant make it to the LA auto show...for the unveiliing of the new CL, ill have plenty of pics when i go.

AC

This could be a good thing guys. IMO, I don't think Acura will change the engine as there really isn't a need to. The TypeS engine is powerful, responsive, but maybe just change the gearing a bit closer in 4th like 1:1. Also, it would help the "kinda boring styling" of the exterior. I think I read that a common complaint was the too "Accordish" styling, I guess I can see it as my brother first said, "man your car looks a lot like the Accord in its shape" then I said, "well damn, same chassis, go figure". The interior IMO is fine too, so maybe the exterior will get major surgery. I agree with Webologist, it's tough to compete with just "good" in this tough market.

acuraguynj

I think you mean the 2002 TLs, right? 6 weeks is not that far away and we are right up on the 2002 model year.

crmsnidol

http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=29250

is300eater

I think, if anything, they'll change the CL first, then the TL another year later. Besides... I don't know about you guys... but whenever I see one of those Legends/Legend Coupes (the later models) they still look good to me. And I'll still like my TL-S a couple of years from now. To be honest, like someone elses reply I read above... I plan on getting a more expensiver car the next time around... As much as I love my TL-S, I don't plan on keepin' it forever. A car IS an investment... but it's not like it's a house or something...

vandy786

You're very right about the Legends man. In fact, when I am out of college, I will try to have one in my driveway. I feel the same about the TL-S. Some designs sink in very well with me and I can't ever imagine getting bored of them as long as the engine runs. Sure I'll get other newer cars but I would like to keep a Legend and the TL-S in my driveway for a long time.

thephantom

2002 TL came out in March 2001. Supposedly, the 2003 TL will be out in Feb.-March of 2003. That's what I was told.

asiankidd

merry x-mas

Crzy Acura

You done?

asiankidd

indeed

tea elle

I agree completely. But, I traded in my '94 Legend Coupe for the TL. As much as I miss that car in a few ways, the TL-S is a far superior driving machine. The Legend had a more substantial feel on high speed long distance runs, and that was its edge. I miss the programmable, tilt/telescope steering wheel.

On another subject, I drove the six speed CLS at the test facility a few months ago. It was very fast!

AzNTL

Does it have the same amount of hp and torque or it is different?

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Wow, this topic is still going?? I actually heard that the '04 TL-S is going to be released on Feb.14, 2002 (yes, 2 years early and on Valentine's Day) and there's going to be a special run on Red ones. It's going to have 380.69hp and the new SMGII transmission from the BMWs (Acura bought BMW), and b/c of this they decided to not release a manual. And it has been confirmed.... I heard it from my father's brother's sister's cousin's former roomate who works in a Home Depot that's next to an Acura Dealer. He talked to the oil change guy and this is what he told him. Plus, I read it on 4 different websites, including www.everythingyoureadonlineistrue.tv and my own (and I didn't add it, so that's weird and makes it true). Basically I'm going to sell my TL-S in Jan. and get that one instead......

daverman

I thought it would come out on April 1st, but I guess Acura is eager to get it on the streets.

BTW, I heard it came with a free salad shooter. Got to get one!

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

LOL

totallymondotl

Tell me it's not true...is it really available in the "martha stewart trim package"....hand made doilies, flowered burlap head liners, prozac storage areas....angry,self absorbed,arrogant black pastel crimson electric exterior!
Oh, the humanity!!

AzNTL

Do u guys know whats going to be different for the 03 model? and when is it going to be release?

bloo_tls02

Check it out fellas....not bad eh??!!

daverman

Are you serious or joking? That's an 02 model, isn't it?

city001

what acura needs to do next is make the cl/tl a lil more small in length... and with weight distribution closer to 50/50

that will cut some weight ..

city

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

The '03 model should not have many, if any changes and should be released anywhere from April to Oct. of '02. The '04 TL is going to be the new one and will be out sometime in '03. The '04 TL is what all of the speculation in this topic is about.....

bloo_tls02

They said that they dont want to make any drastic changes to the car b/c of this guy in PA who just bought his car in May. They are trying to take his feelings into consideration

iatacs19

it's about time for a refresh.

my advice would be, don't worry about it. go out for a drive and get away from the screen!!

tea elle

I don't know the exact numbers for the Legend, but the TLS is much quicker off the line, significantly better 0-60 time, vastly smoother shifts with the five speed on the TLS and better responsiveness (torque) throughout the power band (if thats the right term).

Also, handling, cornering, ride comfort are all much better in the TLS. Hell, we're talking about essentially ten years of technology between the 94 Legend and the 02 TLS when we remember that the Legend changed in '91 and remained very similar until its last year in '95. By '94 the Legend had some dramatic improvements to its transmission, and horse power went up from 200 to 235. But other than that, the car was almost the same as it had been in '91, so thats why I say "ten years of technology". I owned both a '91 Legend sedan and a '94 Coupe, so I'm speaking from vast personal driving experience.

Sorry about the long answer, but there are lots of people on this site (myself included) that will contest what I write, unless I am very specific.

sparky57

Boy, are some of your glasses half full out there! I DEMAND that Honda continue to improve the breed. After driving nothing but Hondas for 20 years, I haven't been disappointed yet.

Look, a four to five year product cycle has been standard Honda fare for decades. Prior to getting the TL, my wife and I cycled through a bunch of Preludes. We had a '84, an '88, a '92, and a '95 before also moving to an S2000. Here were those product life cycles:

83-87 Prelude
88-91 Prelude
92-96 Prelude
97-01 Prelude (RIP)

I would also prefer a slightly shorter and lighter (say 3200 lb) version. Going from driving the S2000 to the TL feels like I'm piloting a barge. My Navi is great but get the HVAC controls out of the damned computer! Give us freaks the typical precise-as-a-gun-bolt manual tranny as an option.

rw

1SICKLEX

If the new ES 300 (camry too) is a 2002 model that came out in 2001, the new TL will be a 2004 model out in 2003 if we follow the model cycle. When the new Accord comes out, the tl will follow right behind it.

If anything the TL will be LONGER becasue the Accord can't stop getting LONGER. 50/50 distribution, yeah.....

Look for the same features, the same low price, just a different (and hopefully more agressive) bodystlye......

is300eater

All this talk about the possilbe changes with the TL model... and the "cycles," Does any know what the "cycles" where with the Integra models before the RSX came out? I remember back in 1999, I was talking to someone with a GSR Integra, and we both agreed that the 2000 was going to go through a dramatic change since the last generation of Integras had been out, but it didn't until this year.... well, being replaced by RSX. I guess my point is... we can speculate all we want... but for all we know it could be another 3 to 4 years before Acura/Honda decide to completely change the TL model.

Karl_O

For all those who are worried that the new 2003/ 2004 (whatever it is) TL revision will be "better" than their current '99-02 TL version, think about this:

The new TL will be based (again) on the Honda global mid-size platform, right ? i.e., the 2003 Accord.

When Honda revamped the Civic last time, they went from double wishbone suspension all around to strut suspension up front, to make more room for the interior, without making the exterior longer. Struts take up less space than double A-arm designs.

If this is the direction Honda is taking (double A-arm to strut designs), then it may well be that the new global mid-size platform (Accord and TL) will also use struts in some form.

I expect there will be some BMW supporters who will reply that there's nothing wrong with struts, look at the M3. OK, fine, it works for BMW.... but give me a choice of suspension design, and I'll take double A-arms over struts any day for a street car.

-Karl

daverman

Just because the Civic got struts doesn't mean the Accord will too... that's only one model after all.

Webologist

Thanks for sharing your sources JuniorBean. I feel like I'm privy to inside information.

In all seriousness, the LA Auto Show site shows the 2003 CL debuting and they don't show a picture. I think Acura is pretty clever not preannouncing like Nissan does. Acura helps keep them honest too. If not for the TL-S, I'm sure the I35 would have been rated at the originally announced 260 HP. I'm guessing the CL will have pretty major changes beyond 6 Speed. I'm guessing this may be to take the wind out of the G35's sails the way the TL-S made the I35s appearance a non-event.

A 300 HP 6 Speed AWD CL with more aggressive tires and a more aggressive appearance would be pretty hard to beat and a great precursor for an updated TL-S... (pure speculation/wishful thinking)

I work in the software industry so constant changes are a way of life. You compete and evolve or you die. The more competition between now and when I buy my next car, the better my next car will be.

Mario

I'm not sure if the new CL will "take the wind" out of the G35. Since it's based on the Nissan Skyline Sedan, it's going to be a pretty amazing car. Hope the next round of TL/CL will abandon the econo-car (Accord) FWD platform. Wishful thinking?

Agree with you that the I35 is a dud when they finally introduced it, given it's still got that lame rear suspension and no sportshift.

Karl_O

I don't know what Acura will do with the TL/ Accord platform. But my best guess is that it will see some use of struts for the 2003/2004 redesign.

Why? Look at the new Civic -- struts. Look at the new RSX, based on the same platform as the Civic -- struts. Obviously Honda/Acura is not afraid of using the same suspension on it's luxury line as on the basic line.

Only time will tell... perhaps when we see the 2003 Accord, we'll have some more info to speculate about.

-Karl

daverman

You bet. Honda's move to a common platform is virtually irreversible, as it provides superior economy in design and manufacturing. Everyone's doing it to shave costs: Lexus/Toyota, Infiniti/Nissan, Jaguar/Ford. It's too good of a concept to pass up. Going back to an independent platform will raise the price of the car to pay for the extra R&D required.

What's with your fascination with struts? The RSX shares the Civic platform, and it inherited the same suspension system. No big surprise there! The TL/CL will continue to share the Accord platform, and unless the Accord gets struts too, the TL won't get em either.

Karl_O

No "fascination" with struts.

Just speculating -- since the Civic and Accord shared a similar suspension design for years (double A-arms), and now the Civic gets redesigned before the Accord, using struts, I just think it's likely that the Accord will follow suit.

My whole point was just for those who seem overly concerned that their 2002 TLs will be obsolete in a few months may not have so much to be concerned with: to me, comparing the new Civic with the previous generation, I like the exterior of the previous gen better, and the implementation of strut suspension seems to be a step backwards.

-Karl

samkws

03???? oh no!!!

i just got my 02 TL last month!!!