I agree 100% with your assessment and have so stated it many times. Regarding value, have you even considered the M35??

 

No, I did not consider the M35. If I was going to get a v6, I would get the RL for sure.

I just WANT that big freakin' v8 in the M45.

 

I guess my thread title was a little misleading. I was really trying to see what we wanted in 2006 that could be implemented in the cars we own now. This wasn't meant for prospective owners to compare an RL to the M45. I have my car and I am kind of stuck with it for a while (48 months to be exact!). So I was hoping for some tweaks here and there to improve the driving experience.

That is why I listed things like upgrades to the XM Radio interface, better tires, and improved shifting in the 30-40 mph range. These are things Acura could do for the most part.

Anyawy, had to get this off my chest. Guess I am the only ones who wants to see the XM interface work better, so the rest of you guys back to the RL/M45 comparo. :-)

 

Actually, most of this thread has been about improvements that COULD be implemented in '06, and it eventually turned into what people wanted that COULD NOT be implemented, and then took a small turn to the M45 comparo.

Things like the V8 or RWD will most likely not be implemented at all until the next generation, and that is doubtful.

But all the things I want that would sway me to buy the RL, it COULD be implemented in '06. Cmon Acura, just put ALL the goodies in the car that you have! Don't be scurred!

 

No Matter what Acura does for the RL, people will always want more. Bottom line the car is a great value hands down. It does not need a V8. It has plenty of power if you know how to utilize it. To me AWD is better than rear wheel drive. Especially Honda's version.
As for wheels, yes, they should have 18" wheels as standard, but there are 18" wheels out there as an option and there more than likely be a different wheel design for 06 since they will be utilizing Michellins PAX run flat system.
Also note, the back up camera for the Japanese version is also an add on feature after the fact. You can add this yourself via a third party application now.

What you shoud do is read Qatar's thread about going from the RL to the M45 back to the RL. He does a good job pointing out both strong and week points on each.

PS Understand the target audience for the RL. It is not for the younger sport minded market like the TL. The comments given right now on this board seem to be mainly from a younger crowd than what Acura originally targeted for the car. Reason is simple, given the recent discounts Acura has given the RL it has become more attainable to a wider age range of clientel.

 

Just what is the target audience for the RL? Whatever it was supposed to be, in reality it is much SMALLER than Acura anticipated. October trough Deccember sales were good and more or less MSRP. Much of that can be explained by the many die-hard Acura fans who postponed buying in anticipation of the new RL debut. Those who waited and those who buy Acura regardless jumped early. However sales slowed considerably in January thru March. I became interested in March and began my usual thorough research and immediately was struck by the overpriced sticker on the RL. No way could I consider the RL a typical "best-bang-for-the-buck" Acura vehicle (even at today's prices; thus even more so back in March).

Clearly I was not alone, as sales plunged steep discounts began. We can only speculate what sales would have been if Acura hadn't discounted prices. There is NO way Acura expected to have to steeply discount the RL so soon, especially in light of the way sales for the new MDX and TL remained steady (no way an MDX or a TL could be bought at Invoice the first year!!).

So here we are discussing ways to enahnce the RL - and clearly, based on sales performance vs. expectations some enhancements are necessary. We all have a slightly different wish list, but the fact remains that many of us shoppers do indeed have list of highly desired features this very expensive "flagship" sedan lacks

 

No one is going to argue that Acura "overpriced" the new RL from the previous year. The $50,000 price tag was a gamble that they took which obviously didn't work in their favor. However, if you want to look at the January-March numbers, all car companies have suffered the first half of this year. Not only Acura. Also the money factors were not favorable for many to go into the RL. The lease rates were high, etc.
However if you do look at the options that the RL has, in many ways it does superceed what a lot of the competition is offering. Yes The M class comes close in many ways, but to comparitively priced M35 AWD fully loaded, you are still above what an RL will go for even at MSRP. Sure, we don't have the back up camera or ventilated seats that the M has, but we also have other options such as XM traffic, a navigation system that you can use while driving, a superior AWD system etc.
No one car will have everything we will ever want on it. It just won't happen. Even the TL as successfull as it has been, does not have "everything". The difference is Acura wanted to attack that market segment and priced the TL just right. Where as the RL was not.

I guess it comes down to either looking at the glass half full or half empty. We all have our wish lists. Nothing wrong with that. But I think that to assume for 06 Acura is going to throw every possible option we ever wanted in the next year car doesn't seem likely. Yes they want to attract more buyers but they also don't want to alienate the existing RL owners. There is a fine line that all car companies must draw. I just hope many won't be too dissapointed if a lot of what they want is not available for the following year.

 

Absolutely NOT true!!

M35x w/ Journey, Navi, and XM Radio has an MSRP of $48,310. Note that this is $1360 less than the RL's MSRP and includes a proven reliable AWD system along with virtually everything the RL offers and then some. Oh and the M35x is an '06 whereas the RL is an '05.

 

Actually as a car shopper I don't have to buy if what I want is not available next year. I may or may not wait for the '06 RL (I'm guessing late September); however if I do and the ommisions are not addressed then I won't buy one - hence no disappointment.

 

Packages and Options

DVD Navigation System

Incl.

Journey Package

$2750

Technology Package w/ XM® Satellite Radio

$4200

XM® Satellite Radio

Incl.

Base MSRP $43,140.00
Total Packages, Options, & Accessories $6,950.00
Destination & Handling $610.00

Total Configured MSRP† $50,700.00

If you want to Have a comparitive price then you need to price out the M35AWD accordingly. The way you had it, did not include many items the RL has. Even at this point the RL has a few things and for argument sake the M has some over the RL.

Also you only get two months free of XM radio with Infiniti as opposed to 1 year with Acura. as well as 1 year Onstar.

And the model year is not a big deal since both cars are based on their own independent introduction dates.

 

Base '05 RL has an MSRP of $49,670. Which items did I leave out?? Your M35x (not sure why you felt compelled to exceed the RLs equipment list??) according to Edmunds has an MSRP of $50,160. So for a mere $490 more your M35x has a superior sound system, Lane Departure Warning System, Intelligent Laser Cruise Control, and many other features the RL lacks. My configuration is much closer to the RL and much cheaper.

By the way when trade in time (or resale) comes along sometime in say 2009, lets see if the model year matters then. One thing this dialog has aptly demonstrated - the Original MSRP of the RL was too high; hence the current steep discounts.

 

Ok. THis is funny, but I'm game.

According to your pricing, you dont have DVD audio 5.1 surround sound capabilitites. ok. Not a BIG deal but still a difference. (in Price) The reason I chose the Technology package was the two options Enhanced cruise control and lane departure system. Substitute that with XM real time traffic, Onstar that the RL has.
Overall I'll retract my previous statement that the M is more than the RL MSRP wise but will say they are roughly the same OK.

Now as far as resale value is concerned, Acura has far exceeded Infiniti on Resale Value. Resale is not only about model year but also many other aspects. I will not go into the 2009 argument with you but I wonder what the resale value of the M was last year? Or any other infiniti. Acura has a good track record in this department. Where as Infiniti is still trying to establish themselves. Honda's overall hold value more than Nissan.

And yes, Like I said, no one will argue the pricing from Acura on the RL. However the steep price drop you are seeing and what I have personally seen on mine is due to A. An incentive given by Acura on Lease deals only, a better money factor than in previous months and competition in General. But I would also like to add that the Mercedes E class is also being discounted quite considerably. As well as most other cars except the two newest. THe GS and the M. They have only been out for like 3 months.

But I will end this debate, A good one I must say by reiterrating the value that Hondas hold over Nissans.Especially when it comes to resale. So when 2009 comes along we can see how much that M is worth as opposed to the RL.

 

Hey I haven't bought anything yet, so who knows what 2009 may bring. However there is no such thing as a perfect car; thus all car purchases are a compromise between the buyers needs, wants, and budget. The more it costs then the fewer the compromises should be however. And for my needs and wants the RL as currently configured seems overpriced (again my needs, wants, and perceptions). Of course I haven't bought an M, GS, etc yet either.

 

Choose the iPod just like any other source. It should interface with the display and show all the proper things (artist, song, etc). Use the controller to interface with the iPod while it is active to replace the iPod touch wheel.

 

Uh, not of lately. Most of Infiniti's new models are excelling in resale value (G35, FX) and I'm sure the M will do quite well. And you can't compare past generations to each other. And if you think the last gen. M resale was bad...take a look at the last gen RL!

I remember this argument when I bought my CL-S. "It's an Acura, it'll have good resale" everyone said. Bullshit. I got lucky since my car was totaled and they gave me a great price for it. But resale SUCKS.

And with these DEEP DISCOUNTS for the RL, the resale will suffer (I found listings on ebay for current gen. RL's, asking $43-44k. I hear people getting NEW RL's for $43-44k. Resale for the RL will SUCK!!).

 

msu79gt82, if you are not already an Infiniti salesman, you should consider a career change and become one. If you love the M, just go buy one. The RL buyers on this site looked at both cars and chose the RL for their own reasons. By the same token, the prospective buyers that you seem to be pushing away from the RL and toward the Infiniti, will also make up their own minds based on their own personal reasons. I drove both cars and there was absolutely no doubt at all that the RL was the better car.
By the way, this thread is supposed to be about feature changes for the 06 RL - I would definitely make the 18 inch wheels and Pirelli PZeroNero M&S tires standard equipment. Other than that, the list of extras others have mentioned, I would classify as neat but not necessary.

 

Hondamore, VERY WELL SAID!

 

The reason the M was brougth up is because I brought it up to put into context that I am undecided between the M45 sport and RL, and I'll probably wait until the '06s are avaialbe to see what additions are made before buying, so I do see a relevance between what was discussed and "What features/improvements do you want in '06 RL".

I like the toys in the M better than the toys in the current RL, and I like the M driving dynamics better. I like the RL interior better, awd, and the value is much better. If Acura ups the "toy" count in '06 by adding at least some of the stuff many of us posted previously, that would make my decision much more difficult, but may even sway my decision towards the RL.

 

If you haven't already read this thread. This should answer some questions for you.

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=601

This topic has been covered extensively here and on FreshAlloy.com and other forums. Might I suggest researching it a bit more. This is an Acura board. the majority of the posts here will be pro Acura. If you are having trouble deciding the only person to help you out in making the best decision for you is you. Every board, will have differing opinions and it just becomes more confusing
but to address your statement on the M here is my brief opinion (for what it's worth)

The toy count is about equal on both. Each car has about the same amount of toys, just depends what options you like more. I test drove the Sport version of the M and found the ride to be jarring. the 19"s look good but don't feel great.

Remember one thing, the more toys one thing has, the more problems that comes with it.

To keep in line with the topic of this thread, i think it would be nice to see 18" wheels as standard. I think the 17"s are a bit conservative for the car. Anything above that would sacrifice the ride too much.



Good luck with your decision.

 

I didn't bring it up! I answered a question! I am an undecided buyer; who is here trying to make a decision. As a current MDX owner (two MDXs by the way) and a former TL-S owner, I know a little bit about Acuras!! I like much about the RL; however as I have said many times it costs too much for what it is; as prices con't to drop I may still get one, IF (and its a big IF) I can overcome its very real shortcomings WHICH IS THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD and to which I believe I have added some useful contributions to!

BTW, new review: http://www.motorage.com/motorage/art....jsp?id=170450

 

The FX has not done too well on the resale end. infiniti screwed that one up on the first year release, manufacturing more vehicles than what the market demanded, hence holding back 04 (next year)shipments for almost 4 months from the tageted release because the 03's weren't selling.

The G series has done the best for them, but even their flagship has suffered.

As far as resale on specific models it does go in trends. Your CL-S might not be this months due to year, color, options etc. flavor but that can always change and also it depends on finding the right buyer.

Overall Honda's as a rule tend to hold their value.

In regards to the current used RL pricing, it is still too early to tell how the resale value is going to be. 06 will help dictate that as well as the market trend. The RL seems to be picking up some steam as of late. I think once all the options are out in the market for a while people will stop buying into the hype and start seeing the over all value. A lot of people always want the latest car out there, even if it doesn't really fit the bill for them. time will tell on this topic.

 

Yep, I've owned two MDXs and a TL-S. I joined www.acura-tl.com back in Mar '01 just because this IS an Acura Forum. I'm also a top poster over at www.acuramdx.org and a lurking member of "acura_world" - I like Acuras! However, while I am very much pro-Acura and especially pro-MDX I will never play the game of implying Acura is perfect and without fault. Problems, issues, and shortcomings must be acknowledged and discussed as well. It does this forum no good to sugar coat any Acura and readily dismiss real competition, even admitting that the comtetition may be better sometimes.

 

msu79gt82,

Maybe I am misundertanding your thoughts here, but you are talking like the RL is still selling for 50,000.00.
The current market price for the RL, mid to low 40's with the options it has, it is an overall better value than other cars in it's class.

Yes we could always use more toys but it's pretty loaded anyways. I know there will be some safety additions added for 06 but i don't think we are going to see a slew of toys added. maybe for 07 but I don't think for 06.

 

That reply was intended for mrdeeno, in regards to the M topic he brought up.

I agree, its good to talk about the shortcomings of any car, but there comes a point when we need to ralize we are just becoming repetitive. There will always be something better. Even if we are talking about the Rolls Royce Phantom, there would be issues. it's just the nature of the beast.

 

msu79gt82, if you peruse your posting history, regardless of the topic being discussed, you seem to pop in with the same comment regarding the M35 being a better value than the RL. As ck37 said, with the pricing that is currently being negotiated for the RL, such is no longer the case. Either way, you've made your point. The pricing of the M35 and M45 was set by Infiniti to make it a cheaper alternative to the RL, GS and the germans. Acura deliberately set the price of the RL higher than it should have been to try to have it act as a flagship and elevate the Acura brand name. We get it. We heard you the first 20 times. Prospective RL buyers get it. They can read a price tag. What this forum is trying to do is let prospective RL buyers know that deals much lower than MSRP are out there which negates that advantage for the M35 anad M45. I dare say that if you truly believed that the M35x was a better value, you would own one by now. I just find it interesting that you have no idea what the 0-60 or quarter mile times for the M35x are, nor its handling characteristics, yet you constantly refer to it as the RL's "much better priced" equivalent. Having driven both extensively, there is absolutely no comparison. The SH-AWD is for real and it makes the RL in a different league than the lower MSRP M35x.
I was just kidding about you being an Infiniti salesman and I realize that you are just a prospective buyer that is trying to decide between the two cars. I was in exactly the same position as you 6 months ago. I had such a bad experience dealing with the jerks at the local Acura dealers that I went with cheque in hand to the Infiniti dealer to buy either an M45 or M35x. After driving both, I bought an RL without any regrets. The interiors of the M's look cheap in comparison and I just plain didn't like the styling of the M's. I can see where, being from Texas, that the lack of cooled seats in the U.S. version of the RL can be a deal breaker for you, so I hope that it is added for '06 so you can finally buy the car that you really want deep down inside - the Acura RL.

 

Where and how pray tell did you decide that you know just what I do KNOW and do NOT KNOW about these cars?????????????

Its time for some folks to stay on topic.

 

Is that selective history checks? A careful look at my RL history (I assume thats what you looked at and not TL?) will indeed show many posts involving RL comparos - thats one reason why I am here. But if you check threads like the Reviews Archives (as one example) you will see that I have contributed much valuable information regarding the RL to this forum.

 

Ok, what are the 0 - 60 and quarter mile times for the M35x?? How are its lap times relative to the M35?? How does it compare in interior noise to the RL??
As far as staying on topic, this is an Acura RL forum and not an Infiniti M35/45 forum. I mentioned that I hope that cooled seats are added to the Acura RL next year for you folks in Texas - we love them up here in Canada.

 

The "staying on topic" remark was in regard to this THREAD, not the whole Forum

The entire point of this THREAD is the RLs shortcomings, which by the way was NOT started by me; however it is clearly indicative of why comparos are justified and needed.

 

Look at your RL post history and see how many of your posts mention the M35/35x, the M45, or your FX35 and/or are critical of the RL. I can understand that you are torn between the two cars, but prospective Infiniti buyers are able to visit Infiniti forums to gather information about those products. I beleive we should focus our discussions (positive and negative) on the Acura RL.
Regarding the '06 RL, I hope that they don't make any changes that would keep it from dominating the M35x like it does now.

 

I'm flattered you value my post history so much I do not have the time to review the 167 posts I have in the RL Forum; however I did take a quick look at the previous 50 (one page worth). What I found was well over half were directly related to the RL ALONE w/o reference to any other vehicle. I also noticed that the vast majority of my M posts were in the context of direct comparos to the RL or an answer to someone else's question AS WAS THE CASE IN THIS THREAD.

Something else I noticed; many of my M posts were in response to YOUR bashing and/or wrong information regarding the M. It was indeed enlightening. I am thru with this line of thought and vote we return to this threads topic which is discussing ways to improve the RL in '06.

PS: The majority of my M posts are in the dedicated RL vs. M Camparo thread where they belong and should be welcomed.

 

My point has been made, and I agree we should get on with other topics.

 

"The entire point of this THREAD is the RLs shortcomings.."

Not intending to get into the fray but I don't agree with the above. This thread appeared to directed, imho, to desired enhancements and additions for next year's model which is a lot different than a thread about what's wrong with a vehicle. Maybe its a glass half full/half empty kind of thing but it seems like most are just giving their thoughts about how to improve upon an already great vehicle. Its hard to find fault with the RL brings to the table but there is always room for improvement.

For me it would be pretty limited to adding auto rain sensors like in my MDX and perhaps a software tweak that would increase low end torque. I may be mistaken but these days I don't think engine changes are needed to accomplish such things as the engine is run by a computer and that computer can make adjustment that could increase the torque at certain stages. If that's close to being right then such changes could easily be made also aftermarket to 05s. Other than that and a few more XM channel presets there is not much out there to add that would really add meaningfully to the already great pleasure in driving the RL (although I also agree with hondamore on the upgrading to ultra-highperformance A/S tires as standard would be preferred over the stock touring tires).

 

1. A six-speed automatic;
2. The ability to determine routes offboard on my computer, which can then simply be loaded permanently into the onboard GPS Nav unit.
3. More trunk space;
4. Gas mileage in the 30+ mph range;
5. A properly designed sunroof that can be opened at speed without experiencing hurricane force winds inside the car (my '94 Honda has this, for pete's sake).

 

After having my car for a week, here are my thoughts,

1.Better tires if they stay with 17"s otherise 18" wheels standard
2.Back up camera after purchase option
3. Back up sensors standard
3.Passenger seat controls (no complaints from anyone yet, but it should be better)
4.Ah, The navigation system. Seems to be missing things my TL has. Zagat is a waste of space if you ask me. Also Traffic colors. It would be nice to put a mini- legend on the screen so you can see what color is what, or put captions to let you know what speeds the freeways are at. Consistantly jumping back and forth to the legend to see what color is what is a pain and to be honest a litte dangerous. Especially when driving on LA freeways.
6. Also the ability to scroll through XM channels via the steering wheel. Not presets only but all channels.

 

1. Better handsfree voice command recognition
2. 360 degree sonar to avoid bumps (on my Toyota Sienna)
3. rear camera for backing up (also on my Toyota Sienna)
4. V8 to compete with M45
5. option for Sirius
6. factory tinted windows

 

drugadman, sounds like Acura should add exterior air bags to your RL for when that Toyota Sienna is around. Just kidding. I'm quite confident that we will be seeing the back up camera available in the RL soon and I'm hoping that they offer it as an accessory to add to previous year models (although I'm not sure that I'd spend the money on it). Regarding the tinted windows, unfortunately, I believe that the degree of tint is too much of a personal preference thing and also may infringe upon local regulations, so I don't think we'll ever see that as a stock item (other than the faint factory tint that is currently available).

 

I noticed that we don't have pause or mute for the CD/MP3 player. I could not beleive this when I finally noticed it (had car 2 weeks!). I called Acura service direct and the woman said she was sure it had one but came back on the line and said 'sure enough there isn't a control for it;. I suggested she note to Honda Inc that even the cheapest players out there have that control and maybe Honda could/should incorporate this typically useful feature into the 06 RL.

 

push button starter

 

headerplus, there is a pause control in the new RL for your DVD-A and CD discs. Use the "preset" buttons. For example, if disc #4 is playing, to pause that disc's playback, just hit the "4" button. The disc will pause and the word "pause" will blink in the upper dash display (above the nav screen). To restart your selection, just hit the "4" button again. Same for discs 1-3 and 5-6, just hit the button that corresponds to the disc that's playing. Strangely, I could not find this feature in the owner's manual. If it really is not in there (and I just didn't miss it), it should be. Maybe that should be a request for 2006, put it in the manual.