vladfrenkel

Hi
Been wondering, did some has changed their engine oil from mineral to synthetic on their RL.
Got 2008 RL in my possesion, and as my 1997 Honda Accord I owned long time ago, I believe it uses mineral oil.

Anyway, as my "other" cars, I've owned BMW 325I and BMW X5 - both been operated on synthetic, which provided (with BMW at least oil service life from 10-14 k mi) which was very convinient. I also had Volvo 850 on Mobil 1, and I've changed it every 7.5-8k which was convinient as well.

LukeaTron

FYI, mineral oil is not what you think it is.

vladfrenkel

Hmm, I believe I've never mentioned what I think about mineral oils.
Ok, In my understanding Mineral Oils is peteroleum based oils - isn't it correct.

In BMW Castrol Syntetic was used.

Oops forgot to mentioned, at one point I've switched to Synthetic on HOnda Accord 1997 as well (I believe to AMSOIL brand)

larrynimmo

use the oil that comes with the car for the first 8k to aid in break-in...then go with synthetic...it will improve lubication of the internal engine components.

vladfrenkel

Thanks a lot,
Yep, this was my plan. Any particular type/brand for oil and filter you'd recommend?

fstshrk

This is a heated and often debated topic.

I prefer Mobil 1, others use Amsoil, etc.

If it is rated with the appropriate certification, I think it will be good.

Doesn't Honda recommend 0W20 which is hard to find?

SodaLuvr

Stick with conventional oil. Synthetic does not always extend your service interval as it is still subject to contamination from fuel, blow-by, etc that conventional oil is. GM used synthetic oil in the Corvette only because it allowed them to eliminate the oil cooler from the design as synthetic oil is able to withstand the high oil temperatures that are experienced during track events. The service intervals are not longer for the Corvette compared to other GM vehicles that use conventional.

The reason why BMW and MB are able to go much longer in between services is mainly because of the sump size. BMW sumps are at least 7.5 quarts in the I6 models and MB is usually in the 8 quart range. In comparison, the RL holds 4.5 quarts.

The RL uses the Maintenance Minder to determine service intervals. It's a good system, and I would follow it. Most users average 5-7k between a service.

NJ06RL

Been using synthetic for the last 20k miles. Changed from the Acura supplied stuff 6k miles after I bought the car. Been happy with synthetic - I just use the weight and viscosity recommended in the manual but I really don't discriminate on any brand. Have used Valvoline, Mobil 1 and will use Quaker State for my next oil change - all synthetic.

kirbyflorida

Thee are countless cars out there that have over 300,000 miles using conventional oil, just change at 4000 or less. If you have a turbo or race, use synthetic for the higher temps, otherwise, wasting money.

larrynimmo

Synthetic oils offer advantages that min oil can't. Sythetic oil is more slippery than mineral oil...it clings to surfaces more providing lubrication even (if and when pressure drops) The most significant advantage is that Synthetic oil is much more resillant to carbonizing. All oils will turn to hard carbon when subject to sufficient heat. Even with liquid cooling in our engines, there are areas of the head (exhaust ports, exhaust valve stems) to naturally approach temperatures needed to carbonize. It is my opinion from experience that you can double your mileage between oil changes by using a full synthetic oil. While i generally use mobile 1, all synthetics have superior qualities when compared to mineral oil. Even with synthetic, even under the very best of conditions(garage kept, dust free air, moderate temps), you really shouldn't go over 15k per oil change.

vladfrenkel

Well said. My philosophy, that is should not depend on an actual Mileage, but rather amount of cold starts. 3 times a year to change the oil in the year would be sufficient. I've used car bible as my source in the past...: Engine oil bible

LukeaTron

Mineral oil is byproduct of gasoline distillation. It is a clear, odorless liquid that is rarely used as a mechanical lubricant except in some specific industrial applications where electrical conductivity or potential exposure to food items are an issue. You can buy it in the drug store and it will make you poop copiously if consumed. It's also a good moisturizer for your skin. Personally, I find it works very well for getting all sorts of petroleum products off your hands without needing to remove a few layers in the process.

The non-synthetic motor oil is commonly referred to as conventional oil or sometimes dyno oil. Mineral oil is something all together different.

vladfrenkel

Wiki gives it the following description (from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oil :
"American Petroleum Institute
Motor oil used for motor vehicle engines is commonly called engine oil in American Petroleum Institute (API) documentation. Engine oil is used for the lubrication, cooling, and cleaning of internal combustion engines. Motor oil may be composed of a lubricant base stock only in the case of non-detergent oil, or a lubricant base stock plus additives to improve the oil's detergency, extreme pressure performance, and ability to inhibit corrosion of engine parts. Lubricant base stocks are categorized into five groups by the API. Group I base stocks are composed of fractionally distilled petroleum which is further refined with solvent extraction processes to improve certain properties such as oxidation resistance and to remove wax. Group II base stocks are composed of fractionally distilled petroleum that has been hydrocracked to further refine and purify it. Group III base stocks have similar characteristics to Group II base stocks, except that Group III base stocks have higher viscosity indexes. Group III base stocks are produced by further hydrocracking of Group II base stocks, or of hydroisomerized slack wax, (a byproduct of the dewaxing process). Group IV base stock are polyalphaolefins (PAOs). Group V is a catch-all group for any base stock not described by Groups I to IV. Examples of group V base stocks include polyol esters, polyalkylene glycols (PAG oils), and perfluoropolyalkylethers (PFPAEs). Groups I and II are commonly referred to as mineral oils, group III is typically referred to as synthetic (except in Germany and Japan, where they must not be called synthetic) and group IV is a synthetic oil. Group V base oils are so diverse that there is no catch-all description."

LukeaTron

Fair enough. I have to wonder what region of the world that article is written from. I suspect it is not from America as I've never heard of motor oil referred to as mineral oil until now. I think to most, the term mineral oil implies the clear stuff you find in the drug store. Maybe it's just a regional colloquialism I'm not aware of.

scottj

Well, if we're being fussy, shouldn't that be "dino" oil, as in dinosaur?

geronimomoe

I agree that using synthetic doesn't always extend your service interval, when you compare OCI in the same exact car. However, it does give you superior cold start protection, due to it's low pour point and don't forget, most wear of the engine occurs at startup, when the oil is still in the oil pan, not doing it's job lubricating the components. So the sooner the oil gets up into the motor, the less wear there is....


Agreed.

gcook

acura of pleasanton uses a synthetic, so I just go with that.

LukeaTron

LOL. Good catch.

vladfrenkel

I do not believe Acura of Serramonte does

SodaLuvr

That description is very general. Some Group II oils will be of a higher quality than others. Same with Group III. Also, tests have also shown that a good Group III product can outperform a PAO under most conditions, mainly due to additive solubility issues with PAO. This is not to say that PAO does not have its advantages, but Group III can often be just as good, sometimes better.

Agreed, however most of us do not live in a climate where it would matter. The differences between synthetics and conventionals in this area (of the same grade) will really show under extremely cold climates, say, under 0F. If you are above 0, the differences are likely to be negligible. In fact, GM recommends 0w-30 for a number of their vehicles in temperatures under 0F.

It does have superior film strength, but the differences aren't as significant as you may believe. High quality base stocks are used in modern conventional oils, so they are now able to withstand more heat than before.

larrynimmo

if you regularly change your oil ahead of schedule...dino oil is fine...if you are always pushing your mileage...go with synthetic.

geronimomoe

If you're living in the lower half of the lower 48, in general I'd agree with that, with the exception of extremely hot states like Nevada, Arizona, parts of Texas, etc, where I'd say synthetic is worth it and also if you're in the northern half, I'd still say that it's worth it as well.

I've done oil changes in the garage when the outside temp is in the 20F or so and the conventional oil comes out like molasses.

I'll never forget starting my car after I got back from college, during winter break. The car had been sitting for roughly 1-2 weeks without anyone even starting it. It was in an unheated garage. At startup, it sounded like metal grinding against metal, albeit for a short 1 or 2 seconds, before the oil got to the parts that needed the lubrication, but nonetheless, there was definitely wear going on there. Temp was below freezing but not below 0F..

RL06tech

My babies start mobil one as soon as the first oil change is due. Synthetic IS NOT necessary. However, since oil intevals are now much longer and I'm a "spirited driver", I feel more comfortable having the additional safety factor that synthetic offers.

Tha ABomb

A little off topic, hope no one minds:

Should I use 5W30, 10W30, or some other weight? I bought a Chilton's manual for my car, and it has a chart that shows the useful temperature range of 5W30 vs 10W30 and the 5W30 only covers a really low temperature range, while the 10W30 covers a much larger range that extends up to higher temperatures and includes most of the 5W30 range. My RL spends all of its time in the southeast, so cold temperatures aren't much of a problem. On the other hand, it seems like 5W30 is a much more commonly used oil.

kirbyflorida

Acura calls for 5-20, I would definitely use that.

BradleyDichter

There is a Mobil 1 0W-20 Advanced Fuel Economy formulation besides the usual 5W-20 Mobil 1 full synthetic. see http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/..._1_0W-20.aspx#

and specifically the Savings Calculator.

gdevine

Acura of Stockton uses Mobil 1 unless you ask for dino oil. I've only used Mobil 1 and go strickly by the MID for intervals.