Mike Crap

This week I took my 2006 RL with 37,000 miles to the local Acura dealer to resolve a vibration (buzz?) in my accelerator pedal / steering wheel that occurs between 1,500 and 2,000 RPM. The vibration is most noticeable in 5th gear. After leaving my car for the day at the dealer, I was told to come and get my car as there was nothing they could do about the issue. The dealer told me that the vibration was the torque converter locking up and that it was a "normal characteristic of the vehicle"

Is this a "normal characteristic" other RL owners are experiencing??

Thanks in advance,

Mike

Jackzilla

Mike, this does seem to be a characteristic of the car. I also own an '06 (24K mi.) which has this same vibration (more like a harsh roughness in the power flow) that occurs at almost exactly 55 mph (1500 - 1600 rpm) and disappears completely at 57-58 mph. I think it's more related to the spark advance mapping because it feels like the engine is lugging (but not pinging) more than like the torque converter is chattering on lock-up. It disappears instantly if you kick-down to fourth gear at 55mph -- under this condition the torque converter is still locked-up, so there is no chatter but the higher rpm's take the engine out of the lugging range.

The last time I had my car serviced, I had a loaner '09 TL (fwd only) and noticed the same characteristic at about 55mph (1500-1600rpm)-- so it seems to be a slight engine lugging as you accelerate moderately through this speed. Under harder acceleration - passing quickly through this range it's practically unnoticeable.

Also, it seems to be less noticeable as the car warms up -- mine is worst when first starting off with a cold engine.

Hope this helps.

TampaRLX-SH

My former 05 5AT TL and to a lesser degree my 06 RL both do this have a slight buzz at that speed / rpm. To me it was more like an engine & exhaust growl with a slight buzz or vibration in the steering wheel.

On the RL it was much less noticeable, although the RL is much smoother, quieter and refined than the TL. The TL just was coarser, typically has a morning tire flat spot vibration and a louder exhaust note, so it seemed more an issue to me on the TL.

Almost every AT Acura I drive exhibits this, including an MDX loaner I drove.

I never thought it was an issue as much as a characteristic from shifting early at low(er) rpms. I assumed it was due to the tranny logic being programmed to upshift for economy.

I too have noticed it mostly in the morning on my drive to work, cruising down a roadway of 50mph.

Mike Crap

Jackzilla,

It sounds like I have an "enhanced" version of the vibration/buzz that you experience in your '06 RL. In 5th gear, my vibration starts at around 50 mph and ends around 65 mph. Not surprisingly, I find myself speeding on the highway to avoid the vibration / buzz felt in the steering wheel and accelerator pedal. My wife has also indicated that the vibration can be felt in the passenger seat floorboard/firewall. The "lugging" that you mentioned was what I thought may be the issue before taking my car to the dealer. Plug wires? EGR port? (was this only a Gen 1 RL issue?) Over the years I have had a CRX, Accord, Prelude, Legend, and drive many rental cars as I travel for my job. I have never experienced a vehicle that vibrates like my RL. At this point I am disappointed that vibration is a "normal characteristic" of the most expensive Honda product I have purchased to-date. As the vibration that occurs in my RL occurs in a differnt range than your RL, I wonder what level of vibration is deemed "normal" and what would be considered "unacceptable" for a $50,000 luxury vehicle?

Thank you for your input.

Mike Crap

When the vibration is felt at 50mph, at what speed does the vibration stop? As Jackzilla indicated, I beleive the vibration is a "lagging" issue vs. an issue with the lock-up of the torque coverter (as indicated by Acura Techline).

Regards,

Mike

Jackzilla

Having a vibration, as you describe, over such a wide range suggests something is actually out of balance, rather than a "lugging issue". My RL, as I indicated, has this roughness only around 55-57 mph and it is essentially unnoticeable to any passengers. Moreover, IT IS an acceleration issue -- it completely disappears at a steady 55 mph with or without cruise control.

Over the range you describe I would suspect an out-of-round tire or out of balance wheel (out of round tires are not unknown -- they balance normally, but can cause real vibrations (resonances) in certain speed ranges. A good tire shop should be able to determine if you have an out-of-round tire. Another possibility is a damaged or out-of-balance drive shaft (or half-shaft for that matter -- these have balancers on them). I've never heard of it on an RL, but it can happen. Was not all that uncommon on Detroit cars with one-piece drive shafts.

Wheels/tires would be my first suspects.
Jack

dwest1023

I believe there is now a TSB about this issue. I will double check and update.

robarsan

I've haven't experienced the vibration at any speed. So much for the "normal characteristic" explanation.

TampaRLX-SH

It is difficult to depict noise and sensations in text. But between 50-55mph under constant velocity, both my TL and RL exibit what I would consider a buzz or growl. I would not call it a vibration as I do not feel any tremble in the car or the pedal. I do feel it in the steering wheel but ever so slightly on the RL. It seems to have an audible component which made me think it was exhaust. I assumed it was the tranny since the rpms are low, approx 1500rpm. It did remind me of driving a manual tranny in gear too high for the rpms.

In my situation, I find it completely acceptable characteristic of the car. The RL is so smooth in almost all driving conditions, it would have been unnoticed otherwise in any other car. In my TL it did feel more like the tranny lugging at low rpms. No shudder, just a sensation that made me anticipate it was about to downshift.

Blazing GT

I also feel the same...."vibration" in the pedal and steering wheel at a crusing speed in teh 50s. Very annoying.

I doubt it is the torque converter, because mine was replaced and i still have the same issue.

foam4me

I too have noticed this noise or vibration and believe that it comes from a harmonic vibration in the exhaust system, an earlier post said it occurred with the engine "lugging". This happens in a very narrow RPM range, more like 1500-1600 not the wide range you have experienced. Have you tried to drive the car in 'M' mode to try and separate RPM from road speed. If you still have the vibration at the same road speed but different RPM it may be a tire issue.

poppintec

mine is in the low 1500 1600 too not over a wide range tho..... at the end of the day its a honda though ya know

scottj

My '05 had a very noticable vibration right at 1500 rpm, didn't matter which gear. It was particularly irksome because that's right about 55 mph. The good news for me is that one of the flash updates they did to the computers got rid of most of it. I don't seem to notice it any more. Good luck with your issue.

Mike Crap

Good point. The vibration occurs in 5th gear between approximately 1,500-2,000 (50 mph-65mph). If I am in 5th gear in the 50-55 mph range I get the most vibration (lowest RPM after shift from 4th to 5th). Again, it is more like a "buzz" in the steering wheel, acc pedal, and I felt it the upper left floorboard near the firewall when I was riding in the passenger seat with the Acura tech. If I downshift to 4th or put the car in neutral at this speed (50-55), the vibration is 100% gone.

TampaRLX-SH

It sounds to me like the tranny logic is just trying to keep the rpms too low for fuel efficiency, and causing some lugging. This seems to translate into various perceptions of the symptom.

I have read a few posts that also mention the tranny logic was reflashed reducing the symptom.

In trying to eek out the best efficiency I think the tranny logic compromises smoothness in this rpm / speed band. Simply put, they seem to upshift into 5th gear too early, especially when acceleration is plateaued in the 50-55mph range to maintain constant velocity. That seems to be a sweet spot for most drivers, allowing this lugging sensation to be felt and heard in the car's chassis.

Sounds like another argument for a 6 speed, where the shift points are not likely to hit this sweet spot?

Mike Crap

This afternoon I called Acura Customer Service to determine if they could find any information on applying a flash update for the transmission to resolve the vibration issue. They indicated that there was no information for the 2006 RL. They did find a ECU/flash update for the 2005. The ACS Rep stated that as there is no indication from the Acura engineers that this update should be applied to the 2006, the dealer would most likely not be able to anything. The Rep suggested that I take my car to another dealership for a second opinion. Almost 200 miles round trip...

CFoote

Mike, this would make sense. Your '06 should already have that fix installed in it's current programming. The fix for the '05 would only be for cars that did not have the code already in it. That's the nice thing about getting a newer model year -- you have all the fixes from the factory (not the daeler) from the prior years

Mike Crap

As the Acura Techline indicated my issue was a "normal characteristic" of the RL, does your 2005 RL vibrate from 1,500 - 2,000 RPM?

Mike

Blue Rooster

I have also been experiencing this vibration on my 06 RL. It's seems to get worse when it's colder out and does not appear when manually shifting. I was just about ready to have the dealer check it out, but it seems like that may be a waste of my time.

This is definitely not a characteristic a 50K car should possessed. Especially at average highway speeds where you have to speed up or slow down not to be annoyed with it.

If anyone comes up with a solution, please let me know.

poppintec

i experience as well, I don't think the RL likes the cold weather the least bit

CFoote

Yes it does. I can feel the vibration through the steering wheel, but not on the gas pedal. It is annoying, but I've learned to deal with it. I've realized over the years that every model has its quirks, and unfortuantely this is one of them.

It has something to do with the torque converter and how it locks up, and I'm not sure it's something that can be fixed. My vibration is really around 1500rpm.

How many miles are on your RL? It's quite possible your torque converter is bad and needs to be replaced. There have been a number of people on this forum that have had them replaced. Be prepared though, it's about a $1700 job if you are out of warranty.

MDs1

My former 2007 TL 5AT had it and the 2008 RL has it too. The RL has only about 12000K miles on it now.

poppintec

will the vibration eventually lead to a larger problem?? or is it just a mere defect

CFoote

It isn't really a defect, it's just an annoyance. It won't lead to further problems.

poppintec

I mean It is upsetting to know that this expensive flagship would undergo this, but I am more concerned with having peace of mind and not thinking about something going wrong and killing my pockets, but every car does have its quirks.... I love my RL, wished it loved me back hehe

sqranks

I'm experiencing this vibration/buzzing issue at 1500-2000 RPM's.. Has anyone come up with a definitive answer/fix for this horrible issue? I also have the dreaded "whine". So I'm thinking that the defective bearing is/has gotten worse, thus causing the vibration... Any thoughts?? Or better yet.. HELPPP!

sqranks

Bump???

silver3.5

I believe my '02 RL have the same buzz/vibration at 1500-1900rpm and 35-40mph. You can feel the buzz at the steering wheel and floor pan. My old '95 Legend had this same issue; my friend's '04 TL has this also. I guess this buzz/vibration is a Honda characteristic!

sqranks

The vibration that I'm talking about is not normal.... It can't be..

amudd3891

Your 1500-200 rpm "whine" is this....
SYMPTOM
There is a whistle, a whine, a squeal, or a howl while
driving between 20 and 45 mph.
PROBABLE CAUSE
The propeller shaft center support bearing and seal are
faulty.
CORRECTIVE ACTION
Replace the propeller shaft assembly.
Be prepared for a pricey part though. The carbon drive shaft will set you back over $2k parts alone. I know because I just replaced mine.

amudd3891

Oh yea the Acura S/B # is 11-002

amudd3891

I found this problem to show more in cold start conditions.

CFoote

If your car is under warranty, go for a ride with the tech and try to duplicate the problem. My vibration at 1500rpm was the torque converter, which is an expensive part out of warranty (not to mention the labor).

Someone else suggested the Service Bulletin for the whine. Quite honestly, my car has occasional whine but I am always driving with the stereo on, so it doesn't really bother me.

Chris