UW RL

How much should I expect to pay for a 2006 RL with ASPEC and backup camera?

They are selling the ASPEC package for 7K. Any suggestions?

aplato

I just bought my RL with Tech Package from Hinshaw's in Fife (down near Tacoma). They gave me a GREAT deal and the guy I worked with was truly top notch. It was without a doubt one of the best car buying experiences I have ever had.

My sales guy was Mike O'Brien. Call him up and tell him Andrew from Portland sent you. He'll get you a good deal.

Here is their contact page: http://www.hinshawsacura.com/en_US/

UW RL

approx how much did you pay for your RL if you don't mind sharing? Why did you decide to buy the car in WA if you could pay no tax for Oregon?

aplato

I paid just under 48K for a RL with tech package. They also got me into a very nice lease deal.

If you live in Oregon, you can buy in WA and still don't have to pay sales tax. WA dealers are allowed to sell cars to OR residents tax free. You have to prove residency in Oregon, that's all. I got all the dealerships in WA and OR bidding for my business. Mike at Hinshaws made me the best deal and was the easiest to to work with.

Mike is a good guy, call him up. He'll give you a good deal.

What ever you do - stay away from any Dick Hannah dealership in WA or OR. Those guys are criminals.

UW RL

Thanks for the reply. That's about 4k below MSRP.. Good job! I will surely keep Mike in mind. How did you ask for bids, internet?

Javadog

I just paid 42500 for a Black/Ebony non-tech at Lynnwood, they matched an internet offer from Hinshaws. Bellevue isn't as motivated to show their hand, but they want to sell cars too. The tech pkg is great, but i couldn't live with the "no option" run-flat tires. Very expensive to replace and limited service centers, do some research on the net. I added chrome OEM wheels in the deal, then traded back for the ASpec wheels and Perelli P Zero's and ASpec suspension only, no body kit. The susp. upgrade drops the car about 1". Looks very good!! Do some research on Lynnwoods Ebay site for pricing on the extras, you'll be surprised at the difference in the price you'll pay. Granted it was cash after the sale, but do the math, you're money ahead. I had their service dept. install a backup camera, wood steering and shift knob, the suspension, wheels, tires and all mats and liners. All covered on the manufacters warranty. Additional 4300 incl. tax and install. I've owned a variety of "sport luxury" cars from MB to BMW. Currently my toy is an 05 911S. As great a car it is, it isn't practical for daily driving and hauling family and friends. I still have a 03TL-S also. It's for sale. Advice: if you like to feel the road and a tight car do the suspension, I was pleasantly surprised at the difference. Short of the Porsches' road grip (but 75K) it's the most confident and accurate feeling car I've owned. Given the moment in time we all spend alot of money for, you won't be disappointed. Granted alot of people knock it's bottom end torque,, but keep the RPM's up (it's a V-TEC family car) and use the manual during those rare moments on the road, I guarantee it'll thrill and surprise you. The AWD will save your butt like only high end exotic suspensions do. Wet roads like we have in the NW, NO SWEAT.
Have fun, drive responsibly, and cherish those moments you pay alot to play for.

UW RL

wow.. that's a very good price. Thanks for your post, man. I wonder if Bellevue will match anything, because I live in Bellevue. By the way, any rumors with 2007 RLs?

UW RL

also, how does one get a quote from internet? Carsdirect.com? Can you tell me the step by step process? Thanks so much!

Javadog

Good morning UW TL, I used Carsdirect but they're alot of internet contact sites. APLATO's post had good info about Hinshaws. The price I quoted didn't include the OEM chrome wheels, bottom line was 42500+1500 with the wheels, financed. I then traded back the chrome wheels for credit towards the additional items I mentioned in my post. I was surprised Lynnwood Acura worked this out so willingly, so KUDO's to the Lynnwood experience. Remember, it doesn't matter where you buy an Acura, I've experienced great customer service from all their dealers and Bellevue also has a great reputation. Not everyone has glowing stories but alot depends on your savy as a consumer. Have fun !!

aplato

I used Edmunds. I also got 6 dealerships emailing me and fighting over the deal. Hinshaws made me the best offer and made the deal.

I also made sure to conduct all negotiations via email. That way I was always in control. When one dealership (not the one I bought from) started pressuring me to come in and meet with them, I refused. I told them the deal had to be in place and ready. When I come in all I should do is confirm that the car is what I want and sign the paperwork. Don't negotiate at the dealership. The crummier places will try to get you in and wear you down.

Fortunately, most Acura dealers are not like that. But there are some. Dick Hannah in Portland was like that. But that didn't surprise me. Dick Hannah is a horrible company. The tormented my wife about 5 years ago when she wanted to get a Passat. Every person I have ever known who bought a car from a Dick Hannah dealership described the experience as brutal and horrible. Their sales practices are absolutely awful.

But, I was fortunate. My Internet experience was very good. And Hinshaws really did offer one of the best car buying experiences I have ever had. And I've bought 3 Mercedes in my life (all very pleasant as well).

Maxy

As a case in point, I just bought a VW Jetta TDI DSG--very much in demand right now (diesel, biodiesel compatible, 50MPG, state-of-the-art transmission, fun to drive, very safe). Most dealers were asking MSRP; a few would go as low as $500 below MSRP, and Dick Hannah wanted MSRP+$5,000 (on a $25K car). Fortunately, my interaction with them was limited to email and telephone. While I would doubt that few would pay that, the mere fact that they had the audacity to begin negotiations at such a ridiculous price says something about the scruples of this dealership.

aplato

No surprise there. They jerked my wife around for a week. They would agree to a price on the phone. But when you got there, they would change the price, then start with the high-pressure tactics. Finally after an hour or two of their bullshit, we walked out on them. They had the absolute audacity to follow us to our car, yelling at my wife and I about how they wanted to make a deal. It was comical.

Since that experience, I've done my part to spread the word to everybody - NEVER BUY A CAR FROM A DICK HANNAH DEALERSHIP.

odium

Hi,

I don't know how I came upon this site, but it got my interested:

aplato, when you were dealing with dealerships through email, what guarantee was there that the price in the email would be the price on the paperwork when you got there? Is there a legal guarantee that comes through the email communication?

I am interested in using this for my next car purchase so I don't have to deal with the hassle of sitting in the dealership for a long time haggling...

Rpappi

my father paid 49,600 with tech at Acura of Fife

aplato

There is no legal guarantee. They could change the price when you get there and do all sorts of nasty stuff. The trick is to determine what is a fair deal and then present that to the dealerships as what you want. You have to run the numbers on this stuff and do your research.

I used this web site: http://www.leaseguide.com/calc.htm\
To determine payments.

I used this site: http://www.leasecompare.com/
To get an idea about lease rates. I was leasing, so I wanted to see what the range of money factors were. My research showed that a money factor of .00230 was good for right now. A lot of dealerships were pushing .00415 and .00380, thus driving the cost of the lease up.

And I used this site: http://www.edmunds.com (Edmunds)
http://autos.msn.com (MSN autos)
To determine the invoice price on the car.

Once you know invoice, MSRP, rates and have a calculator, you can start running scenarios. Its all about math. No matter what a dealership says to you ALL car purchases boil down to pure mathematics.

I knew that if I put $X down, and had a rate of Y, that an offer of Z was reasonable. I made sure that I left a few dollars of profit in the dealership's hand. If a dealer makes $500 to $1000 off my deal - I think they're doing okay. I know there are hold-backs and other incentives for them to move cars. So $500 to $1000 over invoice is a VERY fair offer. An Acura RL with Tech package invoices at $47,288. An offer of $47,900 would be fair. And offer of $45,900 would not.

Dealers that didn't take my offer, I knew were just greedy. And whenever one of them pressured me into coming into the dealership to "work out the details" I knew they weren't serious about selling a car. I also knew that if one offered me a good money factor, but their payments were out of line or their residual was funny, I knew they were up to something.

However, and this is important. Don't be a dreamer. Don't assume there is some "magical" deal out there that will get you into a $50K car for $350 a month with zero down. If you are going to negotiate over the Internet, be serious about what you can do. Don't come to the table with nothing and expect some dealership to find some special deal for you. They need to make money. They aren't going to sell you a car that invoices at $47,500 for $41,000. Any dealer that does that is dumb and would quickly go out of business. They might sell it to you for $47,100 or $46,900 if they are desperate to get it off the lot. But, be realistic.

When I got a dealership who made me a serious offer I had them fax me a purchase order that showed the price, options, downpayment, etc. that we had agreed to. I took this fax with me when I went to the dealership. In my hand was proof of the offer. If they changed the deal, I could slap that down and say "but you agreed to this."

In my case, the dealership was 100% on the level with me. There were no surprises, no "oh we forgot to tell you", no games. The price they quoted me was the price I got when I went to the dealership. And the woman in finance, who was very nice, did not change things or do any funny tricks.

Car buying is a painful process, but if you control the situation and know the facts, you can get a good deal. If you get emotional about it and make it a game, you'll end up losing. The dealerships have much more time and resources than you do.

Good dealerships want to move cars. And they know a savvy buyer when they see one. A good dealer will deal with a savvy buyer in a professional manner. A crummy dealer will take it as some kind of challenge and try to play games and act tough.

That much said, the Internet is absolutely the way to go for buying cars. And I had a very pleasant experience with Hinshaw's in Fife, WA.

legendaryCL98

hey guyz.. sorry to interrupt.. but just wanted u guyz to know we're having a seattle meet in august.. here is thread

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...=340766&page=1

hope u guyz can make it...

btw aplato.. thats a huge post.. haha..

Benush

Sorry for semi - hijacking this thread

Vik if I should have said this someplace else, I'm sorry

FIrst, aplato has great plans and tips, but I'd like to add a bit

BATNA - Best Alternative To a Negotiated Agreement. That means figure out your bottom line and be prepared to walk away if the dealership won't meet it. Very much like aplato's advise to avoid emotional buying. But, again as aplato said, no dealership will give you a vehcle for less than their cost unless they need to for their financial reasons.

Second - Vehicle cost -

Simply find the invoice (Edmunds, carsdirect, etc.),

go to Ebay and find the lowest cost for the accessories you want and add that to the total (don't add shipping costs)

call a service department to find out how much time to install each accessory (NOT how much money but how much time) - note that the total time is based upon a book that says it takes XX number of minutes to install floormats, ipod adapters, etc.. The shop tries to charge per hour but that can be negotiated via the sales department keeping you out of the frustrating loop. Mainly because it takes less time than reported in that book and you are not paying a top mechanic to install the accessories, but usually some one farther down the pay scale (sometimes that person is WAY down the pay scale but the shop still tries to charge top dollar)

multiply the total time by $40 per hour (thats the amount I use since it normally covers real wages, benefits and overhead)

subtract any incentives like the ciurrent $3K

Figure out how much profit you want to give the car dealership over and above the 3% of MSRP that they take in holdback. Keep in mind that you need to give "some" profit and that that profit will be split between the shop, the sales staff and anyone else in the loop. You notice that I am not giving you any specific amount. I'm a professional mediator handling everything from divorce to government disputes and I refuse to pay a salesperson more per hour than I make myself, but your thoughts on the matter are between you and your wallet.

How do you figure out that amount? Depends upon your self will and how much you think that the people who show you the bells and whistles are worth. Remember, everything is already paid for so all you are coming up with is additional dealership personell profit. The holdback covers keeping the lights on, the dealership doors open, usually some advertising and money in the owners pocket.

Anyway, take the figures, add and subtract and that is your BATNA

Now go to your bank, credit union, rich relative and get your finacial loan before you go any further. If you are planning on using Acura's lease offer then the previous information applies, but you need to watch to see if they find places to change the amount you are being charged. Remember you are negotiating a lease based on the amount you want to pay, not what they want to charge. Leases are also negotiable, but thats a whole different story - there were some great sites cited by others.

With money in hand and if you do not vary from your BATNA you should be able to make yourself a reasonable deal. I'm defining reasonable by "your" standards.

Now the internet part. If you do a google of the acura dealerships you will find that most have a web site and if you look under contacts, you will usually find an "Internet Sales Rep". Many of them also have a current inventory so you can see if the color combination (you have to decide if you have a second or third color choice since you will be the one driving the car, not the sales staff) you want is in stock. Send them an email with your requirements and a maximum offer and a genuine offer to purchase immediately if they acept your offer -since you are the one who came up with your BATNA amount. Please have respect for them if they say yes and do not try to renegotiate. If you were happy with the amount in the first place and they jump at the offer then figure they were a) ready to sell [right time right place], b) you gave them as much profit as they needed to sell or c) you gave them more than they wanted, but YOU came up with the number, not them. If they say yes then be upfront and call to make the deal using all the fax / paper trail ideas that aplato suggested (I printed out every email and sent them copies of my copies so there was no misunderstanding). If they write back "no" then email back thanking them for the time and go on to the next dealership. If no one will accept your offer then either wait until 3 days before the end of the month and send out the email again (this time to all of them at the same time with a note saying you will buy from the first that repsonds with a yes) or raise your offer a hundred dollars or so and try again. eventually someone will say yes and you have your new toy.

As far as getting in to the dealership and them trying to change the deal, you should have a copy of your faxes/paperwork and not accept anything but what was agreed to. Again, you have the power to walk out, but you need to be able to do it if called to. Willpower and mental emotional strength

I only had one dealership try the "we need more money because the deal we gave you was not authorized properly" con job (Honda not Acura and a few years back). I said that that would not be a problem and my lawyer would be happy to work any details after I sued them for failure to act in good faith and fair dealing (Uniform Commercial Code - Article II). The look on the sales guys face was priceless. He went and got his boss and I in a polite manner repeated my statement. He went and got the sales manager who said that there was of course a big problem with their communication and of course they would honor the deal even though they were "taking a bath" by offering such a low price. If they want to try and make you feel guilty, then just imagine taking that extra money out of your wallet and burning it. Remember it is your money and if you are borrowing it, you need to pay back any extra you give them plus interest. For every $100 you give them you end up paying $25 in interest (just approximate figuring 7.5% and 6 years)

Bottom line. Be confident in your figures, come up with a price you are happy with and then go for it.

legendaryCL98

holy crap... this thread should be a "DIY" sticky.. lol..

u RL'ers rock awesome advice

CJams

my

When I was shopping for my TSX I drove all the way out to Bellevue with 2 checks in hand that added up to $30K. I wanted a 05 SSM TSX with nav for $30K out the door. My first stop was South center. They didn't want to play ball. My next stop was Hinshaws, but they must have sold too many cars that day and didn't feel like sending any salesman out ot great me after I walked around the lot for 10 minutes trying to open car doors. Went to Bellevue and talked to Matt. After handing him both checks he did the slimeball car salesman walk to his "Sales Manager" and came back with my checks and told me that the lowest they would go was like $31,500 (with a snobby cocky bellevue attitude no less). So I went back to Hinshaws (This was all within 2-3 days) and waited for salesman to come greet me, still no outside greeting so I went inside. Played the stupid little negotiating game and they wouldn't play ball. So I called up Lynnwood Acura and said, "I have 2 checks that amount to $30K and I want an 05 TSX with nav out the door. No financing needed! No test drive needed! No negotiating needed! Can you do it or not?" He said let me call you back. I got the call within 10 minutes and he said lets do it. So the next day I drove up and drove my baby home. 2 Days later Hinshaws called me back and asked if I still needed a car. I said no I got the one I wanted. He asked how much I paid and I told him that I gave them the same 2 checks I offered you a few days ago and they accepted it.\\

Just my

aplato

Going to the dealerships is a waste of time, honestly. The people they put out in the bullpen are desperate, young and cocky. They treat those guys like crap and push them to sell sell sell.

This is why its better to go through the fleet managers or Internet sales. They are usually sales veterans who have been promoted into their position. They service a different group and tend to be more cut and dry about the process.

Hey, great pic by the way of your car. That's at the boat ramp at Alki, right? Whenever I'm in Seattle (which is about twice a month) I like to head out there.

UW RL

exellent posts guys! I will surely use you guys' suggestions when I am buying my RL AND my wife's Audi Q7 at the same day!