neuronbob

The TL is the best-handling FWD sedan of its type on the market, hands down. But with A-Spec, stickier rubber, and SH-AWD, the RL truly hauls. And there's no torque steer.

100% agree. When did we start considering mid-6's for 0-60 slow? The RL is no slouch. The 0-60 time is only a second worse than the TL. Once the tranny computer has adjusted to your driving style, and you've learned to allow for the RL's drive-by-wire, the acceleration feels similar to the TL to me. I've owned both and can admit this without reservation.

I am anxious to see whether there's more low-end torque feel in the 2009 RL. Ugly or not, if it hauls too, (and has decent marketing), it could sell.

dragonlord

I guess we're all looking forward to the 2009 line-up. For the RL, I would love to see CF in the cabin instead of wood. For the TL- about 325 HP AND SH-AWD!

Bob have you modded your RL enough to compete against me again?

jwaters943

Carbon Fiber in a $50k luxury sedan looks out of place IMO. Maybe on a performace vehicle like a Porsche, but not the RL.

Grey wood and/or aluminum (e.g. silver) trim is about as "sporty" as I like my luxury cars. Just my $0.02.

fatogre

Seems like all RL owners here lives in Michigan.

I'm a Michigan State grad, but now live in sunny Los Angeles!

GO SPARTANS! GO GREEN! GO WHITE!

GoHawks

I used to see 4-6 RLs a day when I lived in the Chicago 'burbs before moving here last August. Not I see maybe 1 or 2 a week.

I do see quite a few TLs though.

geronimomoe

Suspect you can get an 08 TL for 3K more... If you can stretch, go for the 08 TL, there's a $2000 incentive on the car right now. So a base 08 TL would invoice for roughly $29.7K, including destination..

F.Rizzo

I take HUGE issue with this statement. I have never been on a board with so many "kool-aid" drinkers (as I put it) that seemingly have blinders on to any outside input. Any statements made contrary to "the RL is the best car at everything in the world" (or slightly short of that) are quite often met by dog pile gang up attacks calling you crazy or the like or lengthy unfathomable reasoning (unless it's a Lexus).

Honestly, so much so that it makes me reconsider purchasing a RL. Seriously, the "kids" at the Chrysler 300 forums are more respectful of other cars and opinions most of the time. I just dont think like a lot of you guys do. I like cars. Almost all cars have redeeming features to me.

Again I point to this article: http://forums.thecarlounge.net/zerothread?id=3177228

The RL is not even in the same class as the TL for performance driving (they even tested the RDX). I've driven all the cars in the test and there is no way that a RL could keep up with the 6MT G35 - and the TL is faster than that.

The RL is a great car, and so is the TL - I love them both, but they are completely different animals. There is no need to justify your purchase (or your TL trade in)
here. We all like Acuras...lets group hug.

GoHawks

I disagree. Most here know the RL's weaknesses. Heck we've lamented about a bunch of things. No V8, better low-end torque, anonymous styling (Acura fixed that didn't they? ), no cooled seats, smallish back seat, etc.

Most here also admit that the RL is not the kind of car (as it stands today) that can rightfully be called a flagship vehicle when it has to be compared against other flagship vehicles (S Class, 7 Series, etc.)

Kool-Aid drinkers would be making direct comparisons between those cars and the RL and actually trying to make a case for the RL.

Most also admit that the TL is a quicker car. But as soon as someone states that they feel the RL has better handling because of SH-AWD, they're all Kool-Aid drinkers? Or that fit and finish is better on the RL over the TL we're being subjective? If you can't see the differences in workmanship in the RL vs. the TL, then I would argue that you are drinking the Kool-Aid.

Yes, the TL is an excellent vehicle. I was actually very complimentary of the loaner I had, but it doesn't compare to the RL. Period.

Unless of cours your only measuring stick is 0-60 times and the fact that it's $10K cheaper.

SpicyMikey

They're different cars for different markets. Why are we even comparing them? They're both very good cars.

TampaRLX-SH

Because I made simple comparisons of my experience between 2 Acura products with time, mileage and dealership elements being the same. Somehow it morphed into one car being better than the other, which was not the original intent. I like the TL, and still do.

But the defenders of the autouniverse took it an ran with it.

I won't explain further, else I will be accused of lengthy reasoning.

dragonlord

Let's put this puppy to bed and go to something else.

ellover009

I have a 97RL not the newer ones, I have tried a 2007 TL when I had to get my car get a factory recall and get a wheel speed sensor checked. I liked the styling of the TL a lot, got a lot of compliments at work that day, and I did like the XM radio, specially listening to the comedy station. Remember this is coming from someone driving a 1997 model not the new stuff.
Acceleration was faster on the TL, but it felt like I really had to plant the foot down to get the TL to move how I wanted it to go, whereas I press the RL halfway down and the engine starts pulling the chariot making haste, TL just feel too light to feel comfortable pushing it as fast as the RL. Loved the XM but the audio system on the TL was not on par with the RL, lacked some bass, detail, just did not feel the same. Seats felt stiffer on the TL, it was OK.
I am eventually gonna update my vehicle, have been looking at the 2006+, have not had a chance to test drive the newer RL (not the 09, looks like an overpriced camry). Perfect RL would be the same current RL with the rear styling of the TL.

fatogre

Just so everyone knows the results of my purchase decision.....I bought the TL, just based on the fact that it has less miles, and it's newer.

However, here is what happened. I bought the TL at CarMax, which comes with a 5 day return policy (no questions asked/fees). About 2 days later, I found a used TL Type-S at a local dealer that had less miles, and 1 year newer (2007). I negotiated the price to only 1K more that the 2006 TL (no Type-S).

I paid $30,250 OUT THE DOOR, for a 2007 TL Type-S with 23K miles on it. I'm really happy with it.

What do you think about the price/deal?

For your enjoyment, here are some picture I just took.

spiike

Very interesting post. I guess people will usually justify their purchases so they dont have buyer's remorse. For the difference in price, I sure hope Acura fixed the rattling issues and refined some of the issues with the TL.

However, to me.. the RL (unless modified with a body kit) is still an old man's car... kinda like a buick.

AsianTL

Most people here are over 40 years of age, so you can call the RL the old man car.
I traded my 04 TL for the 07 RL because the RL's interior is the next level up from the TL's.

TampaRLX-SH

I always get a chuckle from youth who cast stones at their own future.

If maturity, mature taste and respect for it is to be despised, they are self loathing before they ever get there to experience it.

A simple comparison between two vehicles from my own personal experience turned into rock throwing contest. I like the TL...very much. But it was not the car for me. I had buyers remorse. I bought an RL. I love it. I have no buyer's remorse. My life, my money.

I shared my opinions as there are some here who have owned TLs and now RLs. No where did I say one car was the better choice for anyone except me and my wallet. Somehow my life experience and opinion rubs some egos. I do not think my life or opinion should mean crap to most people. But some people are quite shaken. *ducking from flying rocks*

But the mature thing to do would be to enjoy their choice and ride - and respect my choice and ride. But that would be so 'Buick' of a thing to do. Instead, somehow my choice and my expenditure insults them so they need to volley salvos. The pattern is obvious.

Ah, youth. And if I can be so bold to see patterns within a small sampling of Acura owners represented by these forums, there are some very wise, considerate and 'mature' (but never 'Buick'), owners here how are in their youth. I applaud them. For the others, enjoy the rock throwing contests. Hopefully your ego will grow less fragile than an Acura paint job.

neuronbob

And if you MUST know, I was 38 when I bought my RL, thus putting me solidly NOT in the "old" category. I'll be there (40) in three months, so I see my future very clearly.

TampaRLX-SH

And WHERE have you been all day? Perhaps waiting for the Early Bird Special to open at the Golden Corral???

I think we need to plan something special for Bob's BIG 4-0. I can see if Sam's Club has Ben-Gay in pallets.

neuronbob

No thanks, but I will take donations toward a used early C5 Corvette or a CTS-V.

TampaRLX-SH

Oh geez.... he's gonna start drooling again.

Get out the mop and hip boots gang.

plastikman

I was 32 when i bought my 06 RL, now I am 33, category does that put me in ? I vote for young whipper snapper category, if I dont say so myself . . . . . . well compared to you guys ( yes including you too Bob ! )

23109VC

I don't see the RL as an old guy car. I'm 35.... not old, but not "young" either.

I clearly have had a shift in my taste for cars as I have matured from just getting my license until today. When I got out of grad school at the age of 26, I wanted something fast, sporty, and luxury was the last thing on my mind.

Now, cars like an EVO or STi really don't appeal to me. If I had endless funds and was buying something solely to take to a track, maybe those cars would be in the running...but then I'd want to drive my "toy" car to work once in a while, and an EVO or STi just isn't the image i'm looking to convey. A boxster or a cayman would be okay... but is out of my price range for a "toy".

Cars like the TL type S are very nice in that they bridge the gap between a boy racer toy and a luxury sedan. it's not really one or the other entirely, but nicely in between. it isn't so ricey that it looks out of place in the business man's parking lot, but it's not "all luxury" and it would look cool parked at Starbucks on Sat night where the "kids" hang out.

The RL is clearly more of a mature car, but it doesn't look "old" to me. A big M/B S class or a LS Lexus looks more like an older guys car to me than the RL does. those two cars are darn nice, but when I see them, I dno't expect to see a 35 year old behind the wheel either.

I have test driven both the TL-S and the RL recently. I liked them both. To me, the TL felt lighter on it's feet, and was maybe a tad quicker. It felt sportier. Although the RL was a bit sluggish off the line, once it was going, if you punched it, it was plenty fast. the RL felt WAY nicer inside. Not a little nicer, but a LOT LOT LOT nicer. it felt an order of magnitude above the TL in terms of luxury and refinement. If someone picked me up in a TL I'd htink "nice car". if someone picked me up and I got into an RL I'd think "niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice car".

The RL felt larger, but what really suprised me was when I pushed the RL around a tight twisty road, it stuck. it handled nice. it did NOT feel tossable...it's not a boxster or an S2k. you aren't going to go canyon carving in an RL...where I think you could sort of pull that off in a TL...it is no S2000 either...but if you went onto a twisty road wtih lots of switchback turns, I thinkt he TL might zig zag a little better.... but if you're talking a cloverleaf...like a long sweeping turn...those awesome 360 degree onramps.... I think the RL would outdo the TL or TL-S b/c the SH-AWD would just do it's thing.

so they are very different cars, and they both have their ups and downs. the RL is very upscale and luxurious and CAN handle really well for certain conditions. the TL-S is more of a "do it all" car..it can hang out wih the ricers and sort of fit in, and it can hang wih the 3 series crowd and fit in too.

being 35 and stll wanting to go fast ... part of me wants the EVO performance, but with the RL image. Too bad the M5 is out of my price range, becasue THAT'S the car for me.

dragonlord

DANG! 40 already? I think Bill Knapps has a senior discount . Show up at Jay Hondafest and we'll celebrate.

gavine

I'll be 40 in three months too. Bought my 06 when I was 38. Looks like Bob and I are on the same page. The funny thing is that my wife drives a Buick (she's 38)....but it's the Enclave which is supposed to be turning the "old man" image at Buick around, if I may use that as an excuse.

4bearhug

I'll throw my $.02 into this discussion since I'm from the "Buick" generation. I bought a used 04 TL two years ago when I was 53. The attraction for me was strictly a styling issue. I really loved the styling of the TL and thought that I had found the right replacement for my 96 RL after 8 years. Unfortunately the other little annoyances like poor ride, road noise, fit/finish issues soon overwhelmed my love for the styling. I decided to go back to an RL even though I wasn't wild about the RL styling. I just traded the TL for an 05 RL this past week and I have to say that the difference in the two cars is striking. The TL is still a fine car, but the RL is clearly a big notch above it in quality of build, materials, ride, and fit/finish. Even though the RL has 71K on it, it's so much tigher than the TL was with 33K on it.

I guess the bottom line for me is the exterior styling doesn't really matter if you're sitting in the car and being bugged by road/tire noise and fit/finish issues. My perfect scenerio would be an RL with a TL body.

SpicyMikey

Totally agree 4bearhug. Anyone who says the RL isn't worth the extra money over a TL really don't know what they are talking about. The RL is a great value for it's price even if it doesn't LOOK like it. The most important perspective for me now is from inside looking out. Not the other way around.

vladfrenkel

To throw in my $0.02. After long consideration, comparing RL to TL (and BMW 335/525 - not 535 guys) have decided to buy RL after all, great quality/return for the money
Before I've owned BMW 325i/330xi/X5(2001) - and RL felt as an obvious choice (next) step to me (except 535I which would start considering similar package from 60-62K at least...)

BTW I'm 30 - and bought the car then I was 29.

Chuck091279

I purchased my RL when I was 28. What does that make me? The TL drives like a kids sedan - speedy and flashy (new type-s). The RL drives like a gentleman's car.

johnnykuz

Geez, I must be over the hill then. I'm 54 and bought my RL (used 2005) when I was 53. Prior to that, bought a new 2004 TL when I was 50.

I don't think of the RL as an old man's car or young man's car. It's big, fast, and comfortable and that's how I like 'em. I don't look to "carve canyons" or anything like that, but if you take the RL onto the twisty interstates like they have in mountains of WV and other southeastern states, you can drive it mighty fast, and have a lot of fun doing it. I've always loved big fast cars (like S class MB's, 7 series BMW's. etc) but after owning several, I'll stick with Acura.

vladfrenkel

For me - it is logical decision. Car drives and handles as close as possible to my previous cars (BMW's) As a matter of fact RL, in my opionion and drive test experience, based on handling/price/quality of materials definition is closest (in limited areas superior) Japanese competitor to BMW 525/528 certainly (again, based on my limited, but long term experience with certain cars -BMW's mostly)
Old man's car, I would not say so, unless 5 series BMW has the same image, in persons mind
In my experience what RL is lacking - is an overall image, and quality of service (been said before, sorry compared to my previous customer experience, handling customer complains is not that great...)

fatogre

I'm 28 years old, and I'm the guy who chose 2007 TL Type-S, over the 2005 RL.

I must say, I'm really enjoying the TL. Before the TL, I had 2 Camrys.

So, even though, I'm not that young anymore, this car makes me feel like I'm driving the car that I "should've" had when I was 21 yrs old.

I imagine, I'll keep the TL for about 2-4 years, then trade up to something like an RL.

BTW - I love acurazine. This is one of the few forums where I keep close tabs.

///M Roadster

I come from a long line of owning BMWs, and I do not remember seeing any thread where 5 series owners bicker against 3 series owners about what is better.

But when I think about it. When I used to drive 3 series, its built quality was superb and materials used were on par with 5 series. When I used to drive 5 series, its built quality was also superb but not necessary better than 3 series, just served a different purpose (bigger interior with more luxury options). If I have to choose between these two cars, it will come down to what I would need (small & nimble or larger & luxury) rather than which car is built better.

Now for TL. Not trying to talk smack on TLs. But from my personal experience, the overall sense of its quality was just not there. That is what is sad about it. I always liked TL's styling (I think it looks at least as good as RL, if not better). But TL felt like a bad attempt to lure in American buyers (also happens to be designed and built in America), "Awesome styling, good interior, lots of gadgets, quality last"...just like how so many other american cars lost their customers in the past.

The comparison between 3 series vs 5 series would be about what I need. But comparison between TL and RL comes down to built quality from my personal experience. And I hope Acura catches the drift soon and remember what made Legend and Integra so successful. They were built like rock with rock solid reliability, just served different purpose. Wait...I believe they were both built in Japan? Okay, let's not go there...