Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

Need Exactly what the title says...I'm in the midst of upgrading my suspension and i have the Ingalls camber kit for the rear but not 100% which 2 arms they would replace...

I searched and pulled up a DIY but the link took me to a write up on a TL-S that only replaced one arm in the rear and the Ingalls kit comes with 2 Arms for each side so understand my confusion....

Any help would be appreciated and a picture or 2 of these already installed would be great

Thanks ahead of time...

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

the bottom two arms on each side...., that are roughly the same length as the replacement arms


and do you not have the instructions with those arms.... normally they got photos in the instructions

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

Bought them from an A'zine member and it only came with this sheet which doesn't help much...
http://www.ingallseng.com/Instructions/38720.pdf

There are 3 arms on the bottom of similar length on each side and I don't know which two arms I'm replacing or what direction they should be facing if it makes any difference...judging from the way they were designed i would say they have to be installed facing a certain direction...

Like i said in my 1st post, a simple picture would help me out alot with this...

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

it's the four arms that point out to the sides (two per side)

and as far as which way they go..., the wider bushings go on the body/inside mounts, (it's even in bold print in the instructions)

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

I'll take a look at it again but if i'm not mistaken, the bushings on the factory arms have different sized bushings but the ones on the ingalls kit are all the same size...

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

http://www.ingallseng.com/Instructions/38720.pdf



Lower center link = #11
Lower rear link = # 12

There are only three lower links on our suspension per side. You are not replacing the forward most link. Its pretty self explanatory especially since three of the five links do not share the same joints/bushing style as the two in the Ingalls kit.

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

actually 5 if you consider the top links too

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Thats what I said in my post.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

sorry to thread jack but I'm in the middle of building a suspension kit and I have purchased the ingalls upper control arms with adjustable ball joints and a wicked tuning camber kit (part number 6) in the diagram.

I thought that is everything I'd need but after stumbling across this I am now unsure if I need to purchase these also.

I am aiming for 1 finger gap in the rear if that helps

thanks in advance

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Its only one or the other. I assume what you purchased is the adjustable rear upper control arm?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

this is what i bought

http://cgi.ebay.ca/REAR-CAMBER-KIT-9...item5d2d15a8f6

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

This is the kit (or at least it was similar to this one) i saw a write up on in the DIY section. This kit seems to adj camber too but the fan favorite is the ingalls kit. Instead of it replacing the 1 upper tie rod arm in the rear it replaces the 2 lower arms on each side in the rear.

Not sure which design is better but the ingalls kit and design seem to be the fan favorite on this site and its also listed on HeelToe in the "Tried and True" section. I went with the ingalls kit myself...

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

i want to go that route but if I can get away without it I'd like to not spend another 200. but the kit I got does not change toe.. so when u lower the rear... how far out of spec does the toe get??

and can I get it to stock without the ingalls kit? if not I will buy the kit. but daym that means I wasted 100 on the camber kit i do have.

sanya916

would this fit the 03 cls..? just wondering it says 01-02...

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

yep

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

I highly doubt your toe will be out of spec.

sanya916

ow okay cool cuz i am too wanna upgrade to better suspension and i wanted to have same either 1 finger gap or no figer gap..

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

I still recommend the Ingalls SmartArm kit though.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

ok so would you guys agree with me when I say that I don't need the ingalls suspension arms and should not suffer in any way shape or form?

I called my local parts place... JRPonline and they too said I should be fine and that the toe can most likely be minutely tweaked anyways with factory suspension parts if it needs to be.

BUt he went on to add that the toe should not suffer anyways since the car is not damaged and is in spec and the camber should be the only thing that moves which is what the kit does anyways.

is he right?

guys thank you all for your super fast replies and knowledge. you've saved me some much unneeded anxiety and I thank you all for it

AnthraciteTypeS

I am in a similar situation.. I am currently dropped on h&r race (4001?) springs.. 1.75 f and 1.5 r.. I have noticed the inside rear tires wearing more than the rest of the tire. I know I need a camber kit to fix this. Would I be cool just getting the same one as you progression or should I go for the Ingalls? As I understand it the Ingalls lets you adjust camber and toe while other brands only let you adjust camber. What I dont understand is that I thought I read that toe was adjustable with stock components.. Going down lower on Tein Basics in the spring so I need to get this straightened out before I buy new tires

rush

iTrader: (1)

speaking from EXpirence ! if you like buying tires then dont install them oderwise if your droped you nned them asap ill give you 2-3 months max on the front tires .
read up

http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/176

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

btw i ended up getting rid of the Tein Basic's and picking up the Tein SS kit for less then what i paid for the Basic's. Will post pix of the new drop and of the ingalls rear camber kit and install once i get a chance to finish it. Waiting for this storm to blow over...

Nice Link, itz kinda like alignment for dummies

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for the clarification on which arms to replace. After looking over it again i know i must've been tired because you were right. There's only 2 arms that have similar bushings on each end...

I understand no one wants to be the ginea-pig in these kind of situations but if there's one thing that I've learned over the years from modifying and working on cars is that certain things you have to see and try for yourself. All you can do is research and make your best educated guess.

Another thing is i try not to take advice from ppl that haven't actually done the things they speak of. Just because a guy is a mechanic or works at your local autoparts store doesn't deem him a certified pro at modifying ur CL. I'm sure he has the basic knowledge but certain cars have specific needs. I've done my fair share of research on this particular topic with this particular car because every car is different IMHO. I've noticed that a good percentage of the ppl with camber kits on their CL have the ingalls setup. Yea both adj camber but 1 of the 2 setups is tried, true and proven to work. Idk about you guys but i don't mind spending a extra few bucks for piece of mind.

With that said...why don't you try finding someone on this forum that has a similar style camber kit and ask them what they think of it compared to the ingalls. Everyone with the ingalls setup seems to be pretty satisfied...well those that have the rear kit anyway...

Just my

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

will the toe go off spec if you lower the cl 1.5 or so inches in the rear?

or is the toe not effected by the lowering process?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

technically those arms that adjust shrink which would pull the bottom of the wheel in to adjust the camber... therefore if i do it with this kit it will add on to the top of the negative camber and the wheel is then further out.??

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

and when you are capable of actually doing your own alignment on your own car, much appreciated because it is a whole lot easier to get too also, being on the very bottom

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Hes right. You already have a kit, use it.

If you haven't yet purchased a kit, Id suggest the Ingalls kit. As Fries said, its much easier to adjust because its right there.

The stock components can adjust toe slightly. The Ingalls kit has a much broader range of adjustment.

Good choice, never been a fan of the basics.

NP.

This is going to be hard to explain, but Ill try my best.

No matter what, when you drop the car you will have negative camber. To correct that, the kit you have will push the top of the wheel outward to get it back within spec. The Ingalls kit on the other hand will pull the bottom of the wheel inward to bring it with in spec.



Another big thing that I thought about before I bought the Ingalls kit was the other kits that replace the upper control arm replace the ball joint as well. If that ball joint fails, where do you get a replacement?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

well the ball joint has lasted 10 years on my car now.. so if I can get 10 years outta that arm. I'll have no problem getting another down the road if it fails...

I will be impressed something aftermarket with moving components is still running good.

but the reason I got this kit is cause I thought the ball joint that is there which IS 10 years old probably needs replacing anyways so... w/e

only cost 100 to my door which is 110$ less than the ingalls kit.. so I saved myself almost 2 tanks of gas


thanks again for all the light you all shed on this topic... much appreciated

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Just keep in mind most aftermarket ball joint boots are not the same quality as OEM, or something like Moog.

Bonez21

iTrader: (3)

Hmm...so what happens if you use both kits? I know it would be overkill but if one pulls in the top and the ingalls pulls in the bottom, would the wheel still get pushed out? My guess is that it would be more inclined to hit/rub up against something...?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

the camber kit with the tie rod like I have pushes the top of the wheel out... does not pull it in. fyi

AnthraciteTypeS

So which kit did you end up going with? And does anyone have a link to the Ingalls kit that you're referring to?

AnthraciteTypeS

On ebay for much cheaper, but is this the kit I'd need in the rear (#38720?) I'm on Tein Basics

http://www.ingallseng.com/38720-smar...-bushings.html

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Thats overkill and will be a pain in the ass to get into spec.

When in the shortest setting, I bet the arm is shorter then the stock arm, therefore its pulling the top of the wheel in, but that would be way out of spec. When you adjust it to within spec, that arm will end up being longer then the OEM arm.

Yes, you need 2 sets, one per side.

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

through SPC (which also happens to be local to me too

but i will say though, it is not normally rear ball joints that go out though, because the don't have nearly as much weight on them (engine)(most of the time), but also they don't see turning knuckles, and the side load associated with trying to actually steer the car)

but then you could run wider wheels, with a lower off set, because you be pulling the wheel inwards away from the quarter panel
BUT
you might actually through it geometry SO FAR out of whack, that the suspension actually binds up, and limits the achievable travel (there is some give in the other rubber bushings)