The Judge

I am guesssing everyone is going with 205/60/16 right, with an obvious 5x115 bolt pattern and what kind of tires are you putting on them, I guess some are going with OEM tires but in MTL it seems that I shouldn't risk it.

So what prices have you guys gotten on them, I am getting steelies for $55 each and a choice between Nokian H2 for $150 or GT Radials for $100 CDN.

Like to hear some prices.....

moda_way

Um, I'm doing stock 215/50 R17s. Blizzak WS-50

$134 USD @ tirerack

Viking

This should probably be in Tires, Wheels and suspensions:

bolt pattern = 5x114.3mm

I use www.tirerack.com

I am also using stock OEM wheels with Blizzak WS-50 in 215/50/17s

iTimmy

I am running 215/60R16's on 02 Acura TL wheels, painted gloss black(the original finish was getting ugly). For tires I am running prototype Nokian Hakkapeliitta 4 with the Eco stud 4 system - though they may be available to the public this year. In any case I sell most every major brand and there is no substitute for a Nokian snow tire, they are peerless.

I am a HUGE Bridgestone/Firestone dealer and love the Bridgestone line-up, except there snows. The Blizzak's are a poor value, the multicell compound that makes them so good is only on the first half of the tread, after that its a regular all season tread compound, and you lose a TON of winter grip. So as we joke in the biz, why buy half of a snow tire when you can buy a whole snow tire from someone else? I will admit that they are good for that first half, but after that it leaves a lot to be desired. As where the Nokian snow and all-weather tires retain over 80% of there original traction when they are 1/4 life left.

The Nokian Hakkapeliitta 2 is a killer value and the tire to get in there line(assuming you can't get 4's or you don't want studded) the RSi's are little better in winter conditions, but they don't last as long and handle like shit in the dry. The Hak. 2's may make more noise but they are much easier to live with on the days between the snow, compared to the RSi.

If your going to pay $55 for steelies look into getting a used set of OE Acura wheels from a CL or TL, I got mine for $200 for the set from a local salvage yard. They fit perfect, require no hubrings and use the original lugnuts and are lighter and look much better.

moda_way

You've caught my interest. What would be your asking price for a 215/50 17 set (both Hak 2s and 4s) if they come in that size?

iTimmy

I have no interest in selling over the forums, and nokian really discourages it(they will pull the line from anyone caught doing it) so go here http://www.nokiantires.com/newsite/map.cfm and contact a local dealer in your area, typically nokian dealers are among the finest tire dealers.

By not selling or trying to sell things online I feel it makes my statements more credible because I have nothing to gain other then seeing folks safe and happy. If you have any questions before you go or after you go I would be more then happy to help you with them to the best of my ability. As for the sizes I will look into them when I get to work tomorrow.

moda_way

Well, not exactly the answer I was hoping for, but would it make a difference if there is not a place within any reasonable distance to Cincinnati?

I'm not looking for you to quote me a price within the forum, but I would be looking to do business outside of here. I'll PM you with a way you can contact me in a more private fashion.

Thanks.

iTimmy

The only tires suitable for winter driving in the OE size is the WR, which is Nokian's answer to a true all weather tire. Even though this tire is designed to be driven year round, it will out perform most snow tires on the market. Its not the best handling tire out there and it does make more noise then a touring tire, but it is the only safe tire for all four season's so there had to be compromises made. It is one of the most progressive tires I have ever driven on, it almost feels like it has a ridiculous slip angle like an old bias ply tire, they are just so fun to push past their limits.

curls

I gotta say, the Nokian Hak 2's on my wife's Protege5 are AWESOME winter tires. That car is like a tank on snow and ice now.

The Finn's really know their snow tires.

~Eric

TSX Hokie

I was impressed with my Dunlop Winter Sport M3 tires last winter. They were quieter and had better dry and wet grip than the OEM Michelins, and performed well in snow and ice. They are marketed as a 'performance' winter tire, so obviously don't expect Blizzak performance in the snow. However, SW VA only gets a couple feet of snow a year, so I didn't want to deal with the noise, cost, and poor dry grip associated with dedicated snow tires.

ryanhook

Seeing as you're a Nokian dealer (and seem to have experience driving on them) what tire in their lineup do you recommend for someone looking for a winter tire that will hold up to lots of freeway driving? I know the WRs are phenominal all-weather tires and their H speed rating makes them ideal, but is there a dedicated winter tire in the Nokian line that I could consider too? My biggest complaint about winter tires is that they don't provide the wear and stability (speed rating) required for the 75% of the time that I'd be on dry to wet freeways in the winter versus the 25% of the time that I may experience snow or ice and be travelling at lesser speeds.

I have no idea how the prices compare across their line, so could you possibly provide a rough estimate of the differences in prices too (doesn't matter what currency it's in, I just need an idea)?

iTimmy

In a situation like yours I would suggest the Nokian WR as a snow tire, it does meet the requirements to be labeled as a snow tire(the mountain snow flake symbol is on the tire) and it does outperform most full snow tires in the snow. Yet its stable at high speeds and will last longer then a conventional snow tire. The nokian snow tires will do better in winter, but will wear faster and the RSi and the older Hak. Q sway a lot at high speeds. I even noticed that my hak. 4's got a little squirley above 75mph, though that is typical of studded tires. The only other Nokian that would remain stable at higher speeds would be an unstudded Nokian Hak. 2 but they don't handle like the WR's do.

Retail on the 215/50R17 WR in North America is $159.95, just to give you a rough idea of what they would cost.

ryanhook

Thanks for the reply!

excited

I tend to like Michelin tires. I could not get the X-Ice for the TSX but did chose the Pilot Alpin PA2 http://www.michelinman.ca/catalog/ti...etype=2&tire=6

It will go on this wheel http://www.motegiracing.com/wheels/d...yle=2023&desc=

Michelins have never failed me.

Excited

excited

Here is the first picture of my 2006 Acura TSX It is the only part I have so far. LOL

Tintin

hey the judge, i notice in your post that you live in montreal. i am looking at purchasing this car, however the only reason why i did not get it yet is for the fear that i would regret it in our winters. i am more and more thinking that an AWD car in montreal is a must, can you please tell me what you think of the TSX in our winters...
Thanks

excited

Tinton, I am going from an 4x4 on demand Ford Escape to the TSX. The reality is that except for the very odd occasion the Escape always operated in FWD.

I am counting on good snow tires, front wheel drive good traction and the traction control to give me quality traction. I know I will have to be a little more careful, but I don't expect any problems.

ps I live in Montreal for two winters, including the ice storm winter

Excited

Tintin

same, and 2 winters ago i totalled my GLX VR6, and since that day till now i havent purchased a new car. The time has come now for me to look for one, and to be honest my fav cars are TSX, murano, 05' pathfinder. but since gas prices is a huge factor of my decision, the TSX is one i am leaning on the most, however i am scared to regret this decision in winter!

excited

Having not gone through a winter yet in a TSX as it just arrives in December I can't give any first hand opinions. I know that when I used to own front wheel drive Honda's when I lived in Toronto years ago, that they were great in the snow with just all weather tires and no traction control. I'm counting on snow tires and TC to make it more than safe in the snow.

Fuel economy was also a consideration for my TSX purchase. It is only get worse and maybe much worse in the future for gas prices.

Good luck in your choice.

Excited

Tintin

i totally agree with you!
a 4x4 would be a 'dream' car for me, but i cannot afford it, and for some really odd reason i want a car with navigation, and the TSX has a nice big screen, and seems like the cheapest car (in Canada atleast) that you can get navigation as an option.
45k is the final price i got for a TSX with navi/auto, tax included! for an '05.

i am trying to find a demo/used with low clicks, tuff though due to navi.

Rumour has it that gas prices should fall back down, what do you think?

excited

They will go down and up, but the trend will be up overall until they find a viable alternative energy source which won't be for a few years yet.

Excited

ckya

hankook W300 Ice Bear

excited

The need for winter tires may not be far off. They are calling for snow in Alberta Saskatchewan and Manitoba tonight. Fortunately the forecast for snow here has been removed, but we will have below freezing temperatures the next few nights. It's suppose to warm up later in the week thank goodness, it's too early for golf season to end.

Excited

MTLer

I was looking into the nokians and found a local dealer who is selling the RSI in 205/60/R16 for 165$cad

He has the WR for 175$ same size. I wouldnt mind getting either of these but i don't think i can afford them...

iTimmy

Get an unstudded Hak 2, its better all around then the studless RSI - and the same price.

They also have a private labeled tire called the Nordman model number is 1, it is the old Hak. 1 tread pattern that is much less money and a great tire. They are also coming out with a Nokian W and it is the old Hak. NRW, which came out before the WR did it was the original all weather tire, and it is priced much lower then the WR. I haven't looked in a while to see if they are available in your sizes, but its worth a shot!

sauceman

I want to give them a shot. I've been driving with Pilot Alpins for the past 3-4 winters, and I really loved it's stability at speed over dry surfaces, and also it's ability to evacuate slush, but very iffy over ice and not good traction over snow says I gotta try something else. Maybe the WR's studded?

At any rate, I'll check over here for them, only one dealer in my city for Nokians, but if they're much too high compared to what you say I'll pay you a visit...

iTimmy

That sounds like a good plan, however, the WR's are not available studded because they are an all weather tire, and a damn good one at that, but they are designed to be left on year round - though they manage to outperform most full snow tires.

sauceman

All weather? Oh. How much mileage can I expect out of them, and how are they in wet snow/slush and ice?

narci

In the process of trying to figure out my winter tire situation.

For a 16 inche tire, whats the proper size? I've gotten so far:

205-60/16

and

215-55/16


Do 15 inche rims fit?

iTimmy

They come with a 50k mile waranty, it really depends how you drive, if your easy on them you can expect up to 60k miles if your really hard on them closer to 25k miles. Fortunately Nokian is pretty good at pro-rating them towards a new set, as long as your alignment is in good shape and the tires have been rotated regularly.

When I say all-weather I do NOT mean its a normal all season tire, the WR is the only tire in north america that has the severe service emblem(so its safe to drive in winter), handles good, rides good and has a mileage waranty. In fact the old cooper snow that has been around for a long time didn't qualify for the mountain snow flake emblem, so cooper had to redesign their snow. Even though the Nokian WR is classified as a all weather tire, it still outperforms 90% of the full snows on the market and they still handle and ride great. Nokian also offers a 30 day test drive, so if you put the tires on and hate them, you can just have them removed and put something else back on there.

iTimmy

15" will not fit on the front.

Using 16's, you can use 205/60R16, 215/60R16 or 215/55R16 - and I would recommend them in that order.

HoRRo

hmmm....

215/60-16 .....5.1in .......13.1in ....26.2in ......82.2in ..............771 ..........2.7%

I thought those were not okay to put on our car?

Tireguy, I'm in the process of picking up some Nokians, I can either get RSI's for $140CDN/tire or Hakka2's for $171CDN/tire. Do you think the Hakka2's are worth the price diff of $142.60CDN (after taxes)

excited

Tireguy do you sell Michelins at your store? Nokian's did not make the tirerack list of snow tires http://www.tirerack.com/tires/survey...sp?type=W&VT=C, although that may be because it doesn't look like they sell that brand.

Excited

iTimmy

+/-3% is well with in the safe range. I actually ran 215/60R16 Hak4's last winter, with no trouble at all.

I would strongly recommend the hak2 over the RSI, the RSI's do not wear nearly as well and are very "squirley" at highway speeds.

iTimmy

Excited, I do sell michelin at my shop, however I try to keep it special order only. I deal with the suppliers who are easy to work with and Michelin tends to be a little difficult. Nokian will not sell via mailorder, you can advertise you sell them over the net, but you will notice very few places posting prices, the reason for this is Nokian will stop selling them to customers who do this. So even if someone is doing it, they won't be for long. Nokian has a philosophy that they want to be the best tire manufacturer in the world, not the biggest. Nokian is the only company I have ever seen that functions the way they do and they are flourishing, they do not advertise, they feel every dollar spent on advertising is a dollar not spent on R&D.

So that is the reason why they are not listed by tirerack.

HoRRo

*sniff sniff @ $$$ gone from other mods*, heh... Thanks Tireguy, for helping me with the decision, Hakka2's, here I come!

iTimmy

I may come across as being a little over cautious when it comes to winter time safety, but sadly I've seen family's in a lot of pain losing a loved one due to a winter time accident a few to many times. They always wonder what if I had snow tires during that storm..... It does not guaranty safety, but it does offer you a bit of comfort that you did everything you could have. I just don't like to take chances when people's safety is concerned, besides, my family drives on these roads too, and I don't want them to be hit by an unsafe - ill equipped - driver. If all of my rants and hypersensitivity towards winter time driving will prevent one accident or prevent one person from being injuried then its worth it to me.

ryanhook

I've got my choices narrowed down to the Nokian WR or the Michelin Pilot Alpin PA2. Prices around my part of the province are only about $15-$20 apart in price ($165-$180 a tire), with the Nokians being slightly less.

Both tires have got good reviews, I've just got to decide which makes the most sense for me.

MTLer

So the Hakka 2's are "studdable" not studded right? I would be better off getting those than the RSI you say? What you would you recommend? The RSI, the unstudded Hak 2 or the nordman 1. I want a dedicated winter tire not an all season. What tire size do you recommend for 16".

I will get some quotes on the hakka 2's and nordmans to help me make a better decision.

iTimmy

The Hakka 2's are available factory studded or unstudded, you can not have them studded at a later date. They require a special stud that can not be fed through a conventional stud gun, also after the tires are mounted and used even a little bit you can not have them studded. The hak. 2 maybe a little more then the RSI, but it will be worth it, trust me. Not only with winter traction, but the hak 2 lasts a lot longer(roughly twice as long), handles MUCH better in the dry at high speeds and offers more traction as it wears compared to the RSI. The nordman 1 is a great option if they are available in your size and money is tight, its probably the best kept secret in winter tires. The only other tire that will even rival the nordman 1 in winter conditions are some of the Blizzak's when new, but as the blizzak ages, its a different story. Its a Nokian Hakkapeliitta 1, built in a third world country with a slightly different tread compound.

The optimal size for 16" is 205/60R16 keep in mind if this is your first set of snow tires, the car will handle much differently, in particular at high speeds. Also they will be much louder, a benefit with 16's is that you get better fuel economy.