Jay6speed

Hey,

I am looking at coilovers and pretty much have it narrowed down to the TEIN SS system. But, I was looking at tirerack.com, and saw the H&R Coilover system.

Does anyone have this setup? Or has anyone heard anything about it....

They are around the same price, so I just wanted to check....

Thanks.

Sebo

its been asked before:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...light=H%26R%2A

not many answers as most don't have experience with them.. some people have used just the H&R springs. TEINs are the most popular around there... i'll be purchasing some tanabes though.

Jay6speed

thanks for the link.....

jiggaman

i just placed an order for tanabes, i'll let you know what i think when they are on

Jay6speed

how much did you pay??

they are adjustable right??

jiggaman

they are height adjustable, no damping adjustments though

LannyM

Tanabes are height adjustable, but do not have any adjustment for damping. They are, from a specification standpoint, more like Tein Basic then SS.

They do have much lower spring rates the the Teins, and as such, would be a better choice if ride quality is your #1 concern.

jiggaman

i really hope that I am happy with the tanabes, seeing how ride quality is my # 1 right now i think i will, the konis i have are adjustable and i never changed them once..

Jay6speed

i'm sorry......i'm dumb.....

height adjustment vs. damping.......what's the difference....

thanks.....

goowakjai

I'll let you know about the H&R coilovers. I'm getting them put in next week. They are height adjustable, not dampening adjustable. I believe the only height and dampening adjustable coilovers are Tein.

goowakjai

jay6speed: "height adjustment" is the ability to adjust your coilovers to your desired drop. "dampening adjustment" is the ability to adjut the coilovers rebound/stiffness, which affects ride quality. Not the best explanation, but I hope it helps

kaikai114

give Buddy Club Racing Spec Coilovers a glimpse too while you're searching

Jay6speed

thank you, that helped.....

CobaltForge

Don't let MrHeelToe hear this. He'll tell you that dampening can alter ride quality but it's more of a tool to fine-tune your ride quality. The biggest factor that will affect your ride quality is the spring rate. Like most have mentioned on this thread, the softer spring rates of the Tanabe Sustec Pro S0-C Type II coilovers will give you ride quality closer than stock vs. the Tein Basic. But then again, ride quality is very subjective, what I might consider "close to stock" someone else may consider "harsh".

Not to sound like an *ss, but Teins are not the only dampening adjustable coilovers. Buddyclub and Tanabes do offer dampening adjustment options, albeit they can sometimes be more expensive than Teins' options with dampening adjustment (SS and Flex).

LannyM

True, there are other damping adjustable coils for the TSX, but the Tanabes are not one of them. BC, D2 and Zeal are some that come to mind.

Tanabe does have an adjustable (like SS) and even a complete unit (like FLEX), but no fitment for the CL9 as of yet for either one of them.....

CobaltForge

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

See it is comments like this that rub me funny. If ride is a #1 concern that does not make the Tanabes better. Both the the Tanabe and Basic/SS from Tein ride excellent!

The ride on the SS/Basic is within spitting distance of stock, as are the Tanabes.

If anything I would question the perfromance capacity of the Tanabes, being they are softer.


If you want a good soft ride, go with the Tanabes. If you want a good slightly firmer than stock ride, go with Tein. But 'ride is a primary concern' does not automatically mean Tanabes are better. It depends on the ride the customer wants! Because even though the Tanabes are softer, and ride is important to me, I would be pissed if I got a system that was the same or softer than stock. Some people want a sporty ride.


Marcus

joerockt

And the Tein's deleiver a perfect mix of sport and comfort IMO.

goowakjai

i stand corrected twice

CobaltForge

After taking the Tanabes out on some canyon running this past weekend, I'm highly dissappointed in their performance quality. Don't get me wrong, they're great coilovers for daily driving and comfort, but for performance, they just seem as if they weren't developed for that.

peter_bigblock

So, am I right that it's spring height that lowers a car? And the spring rate and shock damping/valving are what most affect ride quality and "sportiness"?

LannyM

Suspension design has ALWAYS boiled down to the "ride vs. handling" debate. Especially when it comes to sports sedans, manufacturers go to great lengths, spending thousands of dollars and hours trying to come up with the perfect compromise.

From the factory, the TSX strikes a great balance between the two. I don't think there is a large market of people who WANT the ride quality to deteriorate. There are people who will ACCEPT a stiffer ride in exchange for better handling or reduced ride height.

So when you say people want a "sporty ride", what you really mean is they want better handling. Most of them do NOT want a bouncy ride, a harsh ride, a bumpy ride.

So I stand by my original position. The Tanabes are the softest coilovers available for the TSX, and they make a good choice for someone who puts a priority on ride. But certainly, as I have stated many times in the past, Tein coilovers, all three of them, provide a great handling gain without being harsh, as a racing damper such as a Type RA would. But at the same time, where some people find even the stock TSX suspension too stiff, they would be unpleased with my FLEXes, which are much firmer than stock.

You'll note, also, that most of the posts where people are concerned about their ride quality come from the Northeast and the Midwest, where winter weather creates frost heave and potholes, and the roads generally suck. You people from Cali, Texas, Florida, etc. you don't really get it. You guys could drive around in go kart and find the ride quality acceptable.

jiggaman

hmmmm, these last couple of posts by mr. heeltoe and cobalt have me kind of bummed out. i ordered the tanabes and they are coming in this week. i live in the Northeast where there are alot of roads that are pretty beat up. so i'm just sick of my koni and pro kit set up. on smooth roads the konis and pro kit are great but other than that i get pretty beat up after driving my car for a couple hours.

thats what had me going with the tanabes, but now I'm concerned that when i get the tanabes i'll find them almost too mushy for driving and that I'll desire more performance out of them. i dont know what the hell to do now.

JTso

iTrader: (2)

Well, if you have to deal with bad roads but desire good performance, it's not easy to find a setup to accomplish both well. However, here's an idea... Imaging using a set of Tein Flex but with the lower rate springs like the Basic and SS. Then install an EDFC to adjust the damper when you need peformance.

LannyM

That would be a sweet setup for people in the Northeast; the "New England" option . I believe that they'll even let you order it that way; they gave me the option when I talked to them about spring rates, but I decided to stick with the 14k/8k.

AlterZgo

Something that no one has really mentioned during this discussion is suspension travel.

IMO, suspension travel and preventing your car from bottoming out has the greatest effect on overall ride quality. This is why some cars w/ stiff spring rates ride better than cars w/ soft spring rates. The stiffer your car is sprung the less likely it will bottom out.

Now, granted over small/mid size bumps where your suspension is not fully compressed, the softer spring rate car will ride better. However, when you go over medium to large bumps that fully compress the suspension, the car that is stiffly sprung may ride better. Why? Because when your suspension reaches its max compression, the spring rate is essentially infinity. There is no more suspension travel and the harshness is completely transmitted to your body.

OTOH, a suspension like the Tein Flex w/ very high spring rates AND w/ the capability of maintaining full suspension travel w/ significant lowering, will be much less likely to bottom out. 14K springs that are not bottomed out will feel MUCH softer than 8K springs that are bottomed out.

So how often do you bottom out? Very often if lowered. I'm taking a guess, but I'd say if you're lowered 1.5", you may have only about 3" of suspension travel available. It doesn't take much to bottom out 3" of suspension travel on a 3400 lb car carrying about 1000 lbs of weight per front wheel w/ spring rates of 8K/450 lb/in springs. There is a TON of compression energy generated when you hit a bump going 50 mph.

Ride quality is not dependent on any 1 variable. You must consider ALL the various parameters and how they interact w/ each other.

LannyM

Spring height has a LOT to do with the overall ride height. And when you use a shorter spring on the long factory strut, you are increasing the likelihood that the strut rod itself will come into contact with the bump stop (bottoming out the strut).

By switching to a shorter strut body, such as those found on a coilover, or by using the Neuspeed Koni strut, which has a shorter strut rod than the standard Koni Yellow, you reduce this possibility.

Now, because you have lowered the car with shorter springs, lets say for example 1.5", you have effectively removed 1.5" of wheel gap, but also 1.5" of suspension travel. Because of the reduced travel, the spring must be stiffer in order to keep from hitting the bump stop all the time.

A stiffer spring requires more damping force to control it, which is the second reason that the factory struts don't fare that well in this type of application. I've liked the Neuspeed Koni/Comptech 110-155 combo, and would say that it only marginally increases ride stiffness, while providing increased roll control and providing a nice stance. The Tanabes certainly offer much of the same characteristics, but neither setup is ideal if your ultimate goal is sports-car like handling. But (and this is for jiggaman) I wouldn't want to spend two hours at a clip in my FLEX equipped car on bad roads. Frankly, I wouldn't even like spending two hours in my wife's Ody on bad roads......

Cobalt; what suspension were you coming from?

CobaltForge

Lanny, I went from stock to A-Spec, and now to the Tanabes.

To people reading my posts praising the Tanabes for ride quality should NOT be discouraged. As Lanny said, they will be some of the most comfortable coilovers available for the TSX.

However, I find that the more and more I drive my car, I'm beginning to learn that I'm a performance-oriented individual. Basically, I think that the Tein Flex would be a better fit for me.

jiggaman

are the tanabes softer than the A-Spec? also are the tanabes atleast more performance oriented than stock? i would assume they have to be

LannyM

I'm really curious to hear Cobalt's take on this; I have no experience with Tanabes but from a spring rate standpoint, they are quite a bit stiffer.

Stock - 280F/175R
A-SPEC - 308F/193R
Comptech 110-155 - 315F/170R
Tanabe Sustec - 447F/224R

jiggaman

i think i'll be happy with the tanabes, i just want a more comfortable ride again without the wheel gap. it's not like i have many oppurtunites to push my car to the limits anyways.

TSX.Fury

yes, defintly...

You will notice a difference between stock and the Tanabe's. It is a performance increase, just not as great as other coilovers.

amadeus303

iTrader: (2)

This is what I basically keep coming back to --- you "Westerners" just don't understand what we go through in the snow belt Hell hath no fury like the pot holes (or shall I call them road craters?) of the Northeast after a season of snowplowing, salt spreading, and road cracking.

CobaltForge

I felt that the Tanabes rode SOFTER than the A-Spec. For some reason, the A-Spec felt "harsh" to me. But then again, results may vary per person.

As far as performance-oriented, yes, the Tanabe coilovers gave me better performance due to lower ride height, but I had some rubbing issues (with 3 other people in the car) while canyon running. I need to try the same roads again with 3 less passengers in the car and see if I still experience rubbing issues. But just a quick note, on freeways and just regular driving, I wasn't experiencing any rubbing issues whatsoever.

My bottomline review? If you're looking for awesome day-to-day comfort and don't mind sacrificing a little bit of performance, then the Tanabes are the route to go. If you're more performance-oriented (as I'm becoming), then I would say go with the Teins.

CobaltForge

Can't say that I've experienced that, so we are lucky out here in the West Coast.

jiggaman

i wonder if there will be a performance increase vs. my pro kit/ koni setup. for the simple fact that the tanabes are not a mix matched setup

LannyM

When I had the A-Specs, I thought they helped out quite a bit in the handling department without adding much ride penalty. Some people even feel they ride softer than stock. But, like you said, this just goes to show you how personal this stuff is.

As far as the rubbing goes, the rear rates on the Tanabes are pretty low considering the amount of possible drop. If someone decides to drop these down a lot; say 1.7" or more, there's not a lot of support to keep the car from coming down and rubbing.

CobaltForge

I actually have more of a "raked" look for my car. So it's about an even drop throughout the car. The problem I had with rubbing actually came from the front wheel wells. After my little run, I pulled over to feel each wheel well. The top screw of each front wheel well felt as it I had taken a file and scraped it. So definitely the issue was with the fronts. I think that if I'm planning on going on more runs and or tracking this car, I'll definitely need something better.

Lanny, what do you think about the Buddyclub? Also, do you happen to know what the difference is between the N and the D versions?

kaikai114

Buddy Clubs!

Last time I drove Cobalt's car with Tanabes, I really appreciated the ride comfort compared with my BC's. It's something that you will certainly appreciate daily when commuting. Coblt, Why don't we head over to that mountain near ur house again and drive ur car and my car back to back. I'll have my shocks at stiffest settings. Now that I have the RSB, we should be able to clearly find out the difference.

Also, I never thought I'd be saying this, but I actually enjoy the car at the stiffest setting than at the softest. I've always been a comfort-oriented guy, but with the BC's, the ride is actually more "solid" at stiff setting than at soft setting. Now I really know what people are talking about when they say stiffer doesnt mean harsher

KC