oil consumption problems
12-23-2005, 01:52 PM
#1
Cruisin'
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2005
Age: 43
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
oil consumption problems
i have a 2005 tsx and have been noticing that my oil is dissapearing. i am at 4000 mi into my oil change and was about 1.5 quarts low. that's alot of oil for a brand new car driven normally. i just don't want this to lead to a problem later on after my warranty. so i took it to my dealer and they are doing a oil consumption study on it. i have to bring it back to them every 500 miles....that is the only downfall. do you think its possible to have them pay for my mileage to the dealer and back home?
12-24-2005, 08:10 AM
#2
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
I don`t believe so. And at 1qt every 2500 miles they`ll tell you everything is within spec.
I`m a little above spec. Lately I`ve been doing in the areas of 600-1000 miles per qt.
I`m a little above spec. Lately I`ve been doing in the areas of 600-1000 miles per qt.
12-25-2005, 03:07 AM
#6
C'mon, man! Row yer own.
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: WDMIA
Age: 57
Posts: 1,210
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I recently installed the oil catch "can" modification and I'll say I'm really surprised at the amount of oil collected in that reservoir. I'm going keep the oil that comes out and measure how much at my next change (installed the catch can right after changing the oil so it should tell me how much per 5k miles).
Owners with that mod have posted different results with it in terms of how much oil gets collected, leading me to believe that there's some variance in how much oil gets blown into the intake by the PCV valve. That, I'm guessing, is your culprit. 1qt every 1k miles is a LOT, though. You almost don't have to change your oil, just the filter.
Owners with that mod have posted different results with it in terms of how much oil gets collected, leading me to believe that there's some variance in how much oil gets blown into the intake by the PCV valve. That, I'm guessing, is your culprit. 1qt every 1k miles is a LOT, though. You almost don't have to change your oil, just the filter.
12-26-2005, 10:25 AM
#7
Cruisin'
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2005
Age: 43
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
if it comes down to replacing the block, that will kill the value of the car. if i decide to sell the car in the future, people will wonder why the block was changed. I have always looked away from cars that don't have the original motor.
Trending Topics
12-26-2005, 11:24 AM
#8
Originally Posted by batboyvaj
if it comes down to replacing the block, that will kill the value of the car. if i decide to sell the car in the future, people will wonder why the block was changed. I have always looked away from cars that don't have the original motor.
12-26-2005, 01:25 PM
#9
Pro
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 669
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Without knowing how the engine was broke-in and your driving style during and after the break-in period, it's hard to say if you have a problem. I would wait until you have over 10-15K miles and then judge whether you still have this problem. The old rule on 4-bangers is "how you use them at the begining dictates how long you get to use them until the end." 
P.S. I agree with JTso. Besides, you just got one of the best rides out there. Enjoy it while you have it and don't worry about something that's years down the road. Also you just dropped $30k on your new ride, don't be such a cheap shit. Pay-to-play.
P.S. I agree with JTso. Besides, you just got one of the best rides out there. Enjoy it while you have it and don't worry about something that's years down the road. Also you just dropped $30k on your new ride, don't be such a cheap shit. Pay-to-play.
12-27-2005, 02:30 PM
#10
Someone stole "My Garage"
My used 2004 had 72,000km on it when I bought it. No signs of abuse at all, etc...
3000km into my new purchase, I noticed i was down about 2 liters of oil. Since then, it's been drinking 1L every 1000km like CLOCKWORK. No matter what the driving style (100% city, aggressive, passive, old-man, and even on a PURE highway trip for 1000km's). It burns it like clockwork.
Ive been dealing with the operations manager at my dealership after going above the advisors and above the service manager, and in January I am 99.99% likely to get a complete teardown and rebuild (rings, valve seals, hone the cylinders, spec the block and head). They don't know for sure why its burning oil, so they started with the oil consumption test, and after about 3000 km's worth of that, they decided to do a compression and leakdown test, which they say Honda Canada took as proof that they need to put the patient on the table and have a little look into what the internal problem could be.... likely rebuilding while it's apart anyhow.
I'm satisfied that they're taking the problem seriously, although a non-oil burning car in the first place would have made me happier.
3000km into my new purchase, I noticed i was down about 2 liters of oil. Since then, it's been drinking 1L every 1000km like CLOCKWORK. No matter what the driving style (100% city, aggressive, passive, old-man, and even on a PURE highway trip for 1000km's). It burns it like clockwork.
Ive been dealing with the operations manager at my dealership after going above the advisors and above the service manager, and in January I am 99.99% likely to get a complete teardown and rebuild (rings, valve seals, hone the cylinders, spec the block and head). They don't know for sure why its burning oil, so they started with the oil consumption test, and after about 3000 km's worth of that, they decided to do a compression and leakdown test, which they say Honda Canada took as proof that they need to put the patient on the table and have a little look into what the internal problem could be.... likely rebuilding while it's apart anyhow.
I'm satisfied that they're taking the problem seriously, although a non-oil burning car in the first place would have made me happier.
12-27-2005, 05:04 PM
#11
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Originally Posted by curls
My used 2004 had 72,000km on it when I bought it. No signs of abuse at all, etc...
3000km into my new purchase, I noticed i was down about 2 liters of oil. Since then, it's been drinking 1L every 1000km like CLOCKWORK. No matter what the driving style (100% city, aggressive, passive, old-man, and even on a PURE highway trip for 1000km's). It burns it like clockwork.
Ive been dealing with the operations manager at my dealership after going above the advisors and above the service manager, and in January I am 99.99% likely to get a complete teardown and rebuild (rings, valve seals, hone the cylinders, spec the block and head). They don't know for sure why its burning oil, so they started with the oil consumption test, and after about 3000 km's worth of that, they decided to do a compression and leakdown test, which they say Honda Canada took as proof that they need to put the patient on the table and have a little look into what the internal problem could be.... likely rebuilding while it's apart anyhow.
I'm satisfied that they're taking the problem seriously, although a non-oil burning car in the first place would have made me happier.
3000km into my new purchase, I noticed i was down about 2 liters of oil. Since then, it's been drinking 1L every 1000km like CLOCKWORK. No matter what the driving style (100% city, aggressive, passive, old-man, and even on a PURE highway trip for 1000km's). It burns it like clockwork.
Ive been dealing with the operations manager at my dealership after going above the advisors and above the service manager, and in January I am 99.99% likely to get a complete teardown and rebuild (rings, valve seals, hone the cylinders, spec the block and head). They don't know for sure why its burning oil, so they started with the oil consumption test, and after about 3000 km's worth of that, they decided to do a compression and leakdown test, which they say Honda Canada took as proof that they need to put the patient on the table and have a little look into what the internal problem could be.... likely rebuilding while it's apart anyhow.
I'm satisfied that they're taking the problem seriously, although a non-oil burning car in the first place would have made me happier.
12-27-2005, 09:52 PM
#12
Advanced
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey Sauceman. When did you first start noticing this oil consumption rate of 1 quart for every thousand miles. How did the car perform in terms of oil consumption when it only had 10,000 to 20,000 miles on the odometer. I know, I know, it is a long time ago 
Was there a mileage point that you passed when you noticed a definite increase in the consumption? Thanks.
Was there a mileage point that you passed when you noticed a definite increase in the consumption? Thanks.
12-28-2005, 12:08 AM
#13
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by sauceman
Curls, can you keep this whole deal as documented as possible, because I have the exact same issues as you do, and if Honda resolves your problem I'd try and give it a shot myself. Just that it's sort of a long shot at 213,000km
If I find out what the CAUSE of the oil consumption is, I'll def. let everyone including yourself know - maybe you can look into getting the part replaced yourself or through my good friend and mechanic buddy in Limoges, about 30 minutes from the ON/QC border on the 417.
Like I said - I'll keep you posted for sure!
12-28-2005, 09:18 AM
#14
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Carlos, I've gone down to 1/1000 pretty recently. However, my chronic high oil consumption dates back to around the same time last year, that is, around 120,000km on the odo.
curls, my ace of spades is that I consequently had my catalytic converter replaced at the expense of Honda, as offered by Honda. By the looks of it, the cat (and both o2sensors) was only symptomatic of deeper problems stemming back to then.
So there might be just enough of an argument to have them accept the fact that there could be a problem with early production blocks (my car's vin is 00134, and I know that curls' is even slightly lower), and because I got my mileage so high, so early, there wasn't much documentation then about the problem, so we had to wait until now.
Another thing I find interesting, is if there is going to be a risk of a problem with early production blocks, they would need these to study them, and I would assume that they would want to examine not only one block.
So I'm all ears on how it goes with your car curls.
curls, my ace of spades is that I consequently had my catalytic converter replaced at the expense of Honda, as offered by Honda. By the looks of it, the cat (and both o2sensors) was only symptomatic of deeper problems stemming back to then.
So there might be just enough of an argument to have them accept the fact that there could be a problem with early production blocks (my car's vin is 00134, and I know that curls' is even slightly lower), and because I got my mileage so high, so early, there wasn't much documentation then about the problem, so we had to wait until now.
Another thing I find interesting, is if there is going to be a risk of a problem with early production blocks, they would need these to study them, and I would assume that they would want to examine not only one block.
So I'm all ears on how it goes with your car curls.
12-28-2005, 10:26 AM
#15
Cruisin'
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2005
Age: 43
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
lemon
can't you guys lemon your car yet? if it has been out of service for longer than 30 days, i think you can lemon out your car. also if it might impair the use or value of a car you may have a case. a $30,000 honda should be trouble free. my old civic doesn't burn this much oil with 170,000 mi
12-28-2005, 11:37 AM
#16
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by sauceman
Carlos, I've gone down to 1/1000 pretty recently. However, my chronic high oil consumption dates back to around the same time last year, that is, around 120,000km on the odo.
curls, my ace of spades is that I consequently had my catalytic converter replaced at the expense of Honda, as offered by Honda. By the looks of it, the cat (and both o2sensors) was only symptomatic of deeper problems stemming back to then.
So there might be just enough of an argument to have them accept the fact that there could be a problem with early production blocks (my car's vin is 00134, and I know that curls' is even slightly lower), and because I got my mileage so high, so early, there wasn't much documentation then about the problem, so we had to wait until now.
Another thing I find interesting, is if there is going to be a risk of a problem with early production blocks, they would need these to study them, and I would assume that they would want to examine not only one block.
So I'm all ears on how it goes with your car curls.
curls, my ace of spades is that I consequently had my catalytic converter replaced at the expense of Honda, as offered by Honda. By the looks of it, the cat (and both o2sensors) was only symptomatic of deeper problems stemming back to then.
So there might be just enough of an argument to have them accept the fact that there could be a problem with early production blocks (my car's vin is 00134, and I know that curls' is even slightly lower), and because I got my mileage so high, so early, there wasn't much documentation then about the problem, so we had to wait until now.
Another thing I find interesting, is if there is going to be a risk of a problem with early production blocks, they would need these to study them, and I would assume that they would want to examine not only one block.
So I'm all ears on how it goes with your car curls.
VERY interesting thoughts though and I'm definately going to mention that to the Operations Manager, that your low VIN is experiencing the same problems, too.
Just curious - what led you to get the Cat replaced? Poor power? Failed emissions test? If the latter, I might get my 2006 test early (summer instead of December) just in case they will warranty the cat only to 100K km's!
How often are you in the Ottawa area?
12-29-2005, 07:32 AM
#17
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Originally Posted by curls
I'm 102 less than you (VIN 00032 -- Canadian anyhow).
VERY interesting thoughts though and I'm definately going to mention that to the Operations Manager, that your low VIN is experiencing the same problems, too.
Just curious - what led you to get the Cat replaced? Poor power? Failed emissions test? If the latter, I might get my 2006 test early (summer instead of December) just in case they will warranty the cat only to 100K km's!
How often are you in the Ottawa area?
VERY interesting thoughts though and I'm definately going to mention that to the Operations Manager, that your low VIN is experiencing the same problems, too.
Just curious - what led you to get the Cat replaced? Poor power? Failed emissions test? If the latter, I might get my 2006 test early (summer instead of December) just in case they will warranty the cat only to 100K km's!
How often are you in the Ottawa area?
I had to replace mine at 14xxxx because the ECU threw a CEL for the cat. The reason is unclear though. It could have been caused by oil consumption, which my dealership and I feel was probably the main cause, but it could also have been because I had to drive around with a faulty o2 sensor for about 8000km before being able to have it replaced. Then again, the faulty sensor could be because of the oil as well.
We don't have emissions tests in Quebec.
BTW, my bro lives in Casselman which I believe is next village right beside Limoges right, so if need be, I can go in your region anytime.
12-29-2005, 07:36 AM
#18
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Originally Posted by batboyvaj
can't you guys lemon your car yet? if it has been out of service for longer than 30 days, i think you can lemon out your car. also if it might impair the use or value of a car you may have a case. a $30,000 honda should be trouble free. my old civic doesn't burn this much oil with 170,000 mi
Clearly this is not the case for us, as Honda Canada has always been very cooperative with both of us for our own issues.
12-29-2005, 07:39 AM
#19
Driver/Detailer
If you can prove at the EPA testing facility that new TSXs are consuming oil and not passing emissions requirements, you might be able to "force" Acura to fixing engines that are passing too much oil into the cat!
12-29-2005, 11:35 AM
#20
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by sauceman
Your cat is warrantied to 130,000km.
I had to replace mine at 14xxxx because the ECU threw a CEL for the cat. The reason is unclear though. It could have been caused by oil consumption, which my dealership and I feel was probably the main cause, but it could also have been because I had to drive around with a faulty o2 sensor for about 8000km before being able to have it replaced. Then again, the faulty sensor could be because of the oil as well.
We don't have emissions tests in Quebec.
BTW, my bro lives in Casselman which I believe is next village right beside Limoges right, so if need be, I can go in your region anytime.
I had to replace mine at 14xxxx because the ECU threw a CEL for the cat. The reason is unclear though. It could have been caused by oil consumption, which my dealership and I feel was probably the main cause, but it could also have been because I had to drive around with a faulty o2 sensor for about 8000km before being able to have it replaced. Then again, the faulty sensor could be because of the oil as well.
We don't have emissions tests in Quebec.
BTW, my bro lives in Casselman which I believe is next village right beside Limoges right, so if need be, I can go in your region anytime.
And yeah, Casselman isn't too far from Limoges from what I remember (Do you get to Casselman via the 417?).
Lucky bastards -- no e-tests.
Cheers man!
12-29-2005, 11:43 AM
#21
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Originally Posted by curls
And yeah, Casselman isn't too far from Limoges from what I remember (Do you get to Casselman via the 417?).
01-04-2006, 09:56 AM
#22
Someone stole "My Garage"
Sauceman:
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates. LOL....
And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates.
LOL....And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
01-04-2006, 09:59 AM
#23
Team Owner
Originally Posted by curls
Sauceman:
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates. LOL....
And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates.
LOL....And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
01-04-2006, 11:10 AM
#26
Team Owner
Originally Posted by joerockt
I have just over 14K miles on my TSX and strangely (to me) I've noticed that I havent lost any oil since I changed at 10K...
j/k Actually I'm at 15,600K and I haven't had to add oil to mine since the 10K mi. service. Lucky or good break-in.
01-04-2006, 11:31 AM
#27
Just dial 1911
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Age: 49
Posts: 12,144
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally Posted by jlukja
Stop driving like a granny and hit vtec once in a while.
j/k Actually I'm at 15,600K and I haven't had to add oil to mine since the 10K mi. service. Lucky or good break-in.
j/k Actually I'm at 15,600K and I haven't had to add oil to mine since the 10K mi. service. Lucky or good break-in.
I think thats what it might be! I'll run it up a few times tonight for ya
01-09-2006, 11:34 AM
#28
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Windsor-Quebec corridor
Age: 47
Posts: 7,709
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
4 Posts
Originally Posted by curls
Sauceman:
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates. LOL....
And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
If you're following my rant thread in the main discussion forum, you'll be pleased to hear that they are taking the car this coming Monday, for 4-5 days, and fixing it (after they figure out exactly whats wrong). Loaner or rental (my choice) provided.
I'll be asking to be contacted every hour to get updates.
LOL....And of course, I'll keep you updated with the results in hopes of fixing the problem you have w/ burning oil, too!
Eric
01-09-2006, 10:15 PM
#30
Someone stole "My Garage"
All I know is that today I brought it in, they didnt open anything up, but ordered a new set of rings and a valve kit (seals and guides). They ordered a master gasket set but it was backordered, so I might get the car back until it comes in (they will know more tomorrow (Tuesday)).
Either way, they're doing both rings and valve seals/guides, but are definately looking for the ACTUAL cause of the problem. I will definately report back.
Either way, they're doing both rings and valve seals/guides, but are definately looking for the ACTUAL cause of the problem. I will definately report back.
01-09-2006, 11:16 PM
#31
Driver/Detailer
Sounds good. That's some major work there. They are going to have to pull the engine out and take the block apart. Haha, this would cost you thousands of dollars just for the labour!
01-10-2006, 06:04 AM
#32
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by aaronng
Sounds good. That's some major work there. They are going to have to pull the engine out and take the block apart. Haha, this would cost you thousands of dollars just for the labour!
01-10-2006, 06:21 AM
#33
Driver/Detailer
This is a job that you don't want to do... nor have someone non-Honda/Acura do either. How did you run in your engine? Maybe you should try a different run in method.
01-10-2006, 08:24 AM
#34
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by aaronng
This is a job that you don't want to do... nor have someone non-Honda/Acura do either. How did you run in your engine? Maybe you should try a different run in method.
However, the dealership I'm dealing with has been excellent thus far and I have confidence it'll be done correctly.
btw, the mechanic friend of mine rebuilt the engine in my '91 Teg a few years back and the thing ran like new. Not to mention, I learned a hell of a lot by helping.
As for the run-in method, I bought the TSX used, so I don't know how it was broken in by the previous owner. I plan to get a full diagnostic from the dealership mechanic and get his recommendations on the new run-in method before I drive away.
01-10-2006, 09:17 AM
#35
Driver/Detailer
Ahhh... I see, your mechanic friend is an Acura/Honda specialist then.
I used a moderate version of the mototune run in. After warming up thoroughly, I gave medium throttle up to 5000rpm, and let it decellerate back down on its own to 1000rpm. I did the same with 3/4 throttle up to 6000rpm and back down. Finally, full throttle up to 7000rpm and let it come back down. After that, it was running in as usual, no constant rpms, and abuse. And then an oil change after 600 miles, with the same Honda FEO mineral oil.
I used a moderate version of the mototune run in. After warming up thoroughly, I gave medium throttle up to 5000rpm, and let it decellerate back down on its own to 1000rpm. I did the same with 3/4 throttle up to 6000rpm and back down. Finally, full throttle up to 7000rpm and let it come back down. After that, it was running in as usual, no constant rpms, and abuse. And then an oil change after 600 miles, with the same Honda FEO mineral oil.
01-10-2006, 10:35 AM
#36
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by aaronng
Ahhh... I see, your mechanic friend is an Acura/Honda specialist then.
I used a moderate version of the mototune run in. After warming up thoroughly, I gave medium throttle up to 5000rpm, and let it decellerate back down on its own to 1000rpm. I did the same with 3/4 throttle up to 6000rpm and back down. Finally, full throttle up to 7000rpm and let it come back down. After that, it was running in as usual, no constant rpms, and abuse. And then an oil change after 600 miles, with the same Honda FEO mineral oil.
I used a moderate version of the mototune run in. After warming up thoroughly, I gave medium throttle up to 5000rpm, and let it decellerate back down on its own to 1000rpm. I did the same with 3/4 throttle up to 6000rpm and back down. Finally, full throttle up to 7000rpm and let it come back down. After that, it was running in as usual, no constant rpms, and abuse. And then an oil change after 600 miles, with the same Honda FEO mineral oil.
01-10-2006, 06:59 PM
#37
Driver/Detailer
Everyone was shocked when I told them how I run my engine in. But now my car accelerates harder than my friend's car which is the exact same model, year and tranny, but with a comptech icebox. By pulling harder, it means a big change as my butt dyno's resolution is only 5hp probably.
01-11-2006, 06:07 AM
#39
Someone stole "My Garage"
Originally Posted by moda_way
Curls, empty your PM inbox... I have all the part numbers and prices you requested, but I can't send them to you.